Russian Ministry wants to legalize Bitcoin mining in specific areas

[zasad@]

Another useless piece of news. We in Russia have already heard dozens of such proposals. For example, make the Irkutsk region a region for mining, where the price of electricity is less than 2 cents. If mining is legalized in Russia, then the same situation may happen as in Kazakhstan.

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[perfect999]

I don't see anything controversial in keeping everything in line with the law - someone sets up a crypto mining farm, negotiates the price of electricity and eventually pays taxes on what he earns. Anyone can try to mine to a minimum, to stay under the radar - but all the big mining farms anywhere in the world pay taxes, one way or another.

Right, there is nothing wrong with that. I'm even happy when I see a government that is trying to put things in order by working with cryptocurrency exchanges and companies so that things are in line with the law. It is better this way than seeing governments that are always fighting against cryptocurrency and trying to ban it and stop people from making use of it in their country. What the Russian government is doing is what they are expected and should do.

When there are things like this they are meant to come in and set it up the right way and also make sure that it is not in a way that it would be unfit for those involved in the business, they do their work by trying to create balance which is right.

[Lucius]

I’m not pointing out about “bans, and regulations”. I’m talking about absolute acceptance, publicly or secretly, and an actual nation-state mining Bitcoin for the benefit of themselves, directly or indirectly.

You live in a great illusion that Bitcoin will be accepted by absolutely all people or countries in the world, and an even bigger illusion is that China or Russia will do it - especially in the political system in power there, and the chances of that changing are minimal or almost non-existent. In terms of value, all mined Bitcoin, even if it is worth x10 more than today, is not enough to interest powerful powers like China or Russia. In addition, in less than 10 years, only 1% (210 000) of BTC will remain for mining, and then who will be interested in mining?

Because I believe Bitcoin’s true nature in international politics/geo-politics has not been truly discovered yet, nor has that been priced in.

Bitcoin is clearly defined as “A purely peer-to-peer version of electronic cash would allow online payments to be sent directly from one party to another without going through a financial institution." What does that have to do with geopolitics and some visions that don't make any sense?

[stompix]

Normally, Bitcoin mining is censorship resistant, I do not know how this will be taxed in a way the government of Russia will not make Bitcoin to becoming a centralized asset like making miners addresses compulsorily mandatory for submission for the government to track in a way the government can be able to tax Bitcoin miners in Russia. Or how is this done in countries like US, is Bitcoin mining taxed?

Bitcoin mining is a business, and it's taxed as a business, you have expenses, you have revenues, it's so simple to tax it neves ceases to amaze me why people ask these questions.
You're taxed at the value of the coins when you received a payout from a pool or if you're one lucky bastard from when you mine a block, luckily, if you are really bad at trading and you sell those coins one month later at a lower price you can file for a tax deduction as you've lost money.

If Russia starts mining Bitcoin, China will start mining Bitcoin again too, or did China truly “ban mining” within their country? The West have given warnings that they will ban Russia from using SWIFT, what does everyone believe Russia will do? They have made the narrative more obvious for a need of an open, permissionless, censorship-resistant, ledger/protocol for money.

And if the west doesn't want to deal with Russia?
You realize right now Russia would be just like a shop accepting Visa, Paypal, Monero, and Bitcoin, they can add used panties and discarded diapers as payment options if poeple DON'T want to deal with you they will not! Simple as this!

I’m not pointing out about “bans, and regulations”. I’m talking about absolute acceptance, publicly or secretly, and an actual nation-state mining Bitcoin for the benefit of themselves, directly or indirectly. Because I believe Bitcoin’s true nature in international politics/geo-politics has not been truly discovered yet, nor has that been priced in.

Benefits? If Russia would be mining all the coins they could get 16 billion a year from it, oil exports are 110 billion and gas 54 billion.
And that would be 100% hashrate, and of course not counting costs.
At December costs for gas, you could either get 1000kwh from burning gas or 275$ from selling it, that is enough to keep a 19pro running for !13 days making you 295$ if you would be able to convert all the energy with losses and you wouldn't have to actually buy that gear and ROI on it.

[willoweb]

This is the right way - checking in exceptional cases also gives the experience of understanding how it will be later on a countrywide scale. I think that the Republic of Tatarstan will be among the first regions, because it is serious about developing the limits of high technologies - there is even a satellite city of Innopolis. The place where, according to the idea, the Russian "silicon valley" should be formed. How it will be in reality - time will tell, but I think everything will work out in Russia!

[coolcoinz]

Last time I heard Russia was banning mining, then China banned it, then miners moved to Kazakhstan and had some problems there... Yet' after all this craze Bitcoin's hash rate is at all time high, which you can confirm here: https://www.blockchain.com/charts/hash-rate
Governments aren't stupid, they see there's money to be made here and since all attempts at banning it have failed and it's still growing, maybe the right approach is to simply allow it to flourish and profit from it. Russia with its high inflation could use some new tax payers in the form of big mining companies.

[stompix]

And if the west doesn't want to deal with Russia?
You realize right now Russia would be just like a shop accepting Visa, Paypal, Monero, and Bitcoin, they can add used panties and discarded diapers as payment options if poeple DON'T want to deal with you they will not! Simple as this!

Disconnecting Russia from SWIFT is a fiction, because after the Crimean events, Russia learned lessons and took care of import substitution of goods and services. For a state like Russia with its scientific base, creating an analogue of Swift is not a problem (especially since the Swift mechanism is not much more complicated than the mechanism of any of the messengers).

Yeah yeah, the powerful socialist workers of Russia will give it all to build better alternatives and have paved the way to escape the clutches of the European and American capitalists and their evil technologies.

Meanwhile, in the REAL world just a few days ago:
Aeroflot takes delivery of two Boeing 777s with retrofitted cabin

They are building everything on their own, except their planes, their cars, their phones, even their damn tractors as John Deeres has posted record sales for agricultural equipment in Russia. Oh did I mention caviar and vodka? They export 200mllion worth of hard liquor and import 1 billion! Not couting another 300m in beer.

Yeah, live in your fantasy world, don't forget to sell that SWIFT analog to North Korea, wonder why things haven't worked out in that case.

[kryptqnick]

The proposal to lower the bills for miners in the regions that produce more energy than they require seems like a good idea. As for the sell tax, which is proposed on mining, it would mean that taxes could be avoided by paying for things directly in Bitcoin, and also that trading would be basically impossible. However, I see that there's an alternative proposal to tax the income, not the selling. Clearly, Russia is actively figuring out how to best regulate cryptos, but the details have not been resolved yet, and different stakeholders have different opinions.
As for SWIFT that's been touched upon in the thread, unfortunately, a certain culprit (I'm looking at you, Germany) is strongly against it being a part of the sanctions package.

[jaberwock]

Normally, Bitcoin mining is censorship resistant, I do not know how this will be taxed in a way the government of Russia will not make Bitcoin to becoming a centralized asset like making miners addresses compulsorily mandatory for submission for the government to track in a way the government can be able to tax Bitcoin miners in Russia. Or how is this done in countries like US, is Bitcoin mining taxed?

Taxing on Bitcoin mining is nothing new at all , in fact every cryptocurrency mining can be taxed by the government. So there is nothing to be surprised about here . If the government decides that they would tax it in that country then they will go ahead and do that. And you as a cryptocurrency miner should as well try to comply and pay your taxes from the earnings you make from mining cryptocurrency in the country.

Cryptocurrency mining is a big business this time around and there are so many companies that are into mining cryptocurrency. It is no longer something that an individual can just start up for themselves and be doing it in their house because it requires heavy equipment. Currently, it is big companies that are setting up a mining farm, and it is quite easy for the government to locate where this mining farms are built.

[adzino]

I don't think they are doing this to create centralization. More like to keep power usage under control or something similar.

-snip-
Normally, Bitcoin mining is censorship resistant, I do not know how this will be taxed in a way the government of Russia will not make Bitcoin to becoming a centralized asset like making miners addresses compulsorily mandatory for submission for the government to track in a way the government can be able to tax Bitcoin miners in Russia. Or how is this done in countries like US, is Bitcoin mining taxed?

I doubt they will ask for miner addresses and other stuffs so they can track miners. Even if they ask for miners address, the miners can change their address or also mine using a different address and the government will never know. They will have to trust that their bitcoin miners will report their earnings to the Federal Taxation Service. Small mining business can go under the radar and hide, but big business won't be able to do that and will have to report their earnings.

[TelolettOm]

This is about Russian ministry to legalize Bitcoin mining in some specific areas in Russia.

It is good news to regulate this kind of Bitcoin mining legalization even only in several certain areas. But the next question is what about others? Still, banned or ilegal? ANd how if the mining activities in certain areas are growing very masively? Wil the regulation be revised again and again and they will change the news again like previously?
We know that the law and news about crypto industry in the country is sometimes confusing because they often legalize and but on the other hand soemtimes changing to be ilegal and spreadinf FUD.
Hopefully this will not happen again.

[zasad@]

Central Bank Chief Nabiullina Digs Heels in Over Russian Plan to Legalize Crypto
https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/central-bank-chief-nabiullina-digs-heels-in-over-russian-plan-to-legalize-crypto-1.1723556

"(Bloomberg) -- Top government officials failed to reach an agreement on how to regulate cryptocurrencies at a meeting Tuesday, according to people familiar with the talks, despite President Vladimir Putin’s request for them to find a compromise. "

[Obito]

If Russia starts mining Bitcoin, China will start mining Bitcoin again too, or did China truly “ban mining” within their country? The West have given warnings that they will ban Russia from using SWIFT, what does everyone believe Russia will do? They have made the narrative more obvious for a need of an open, permissionless, censorship-resistant, ledger/protocol for money.

China did stop mining although the one's owned by the government didn't really stop because China wants all the bitcoin for themselves, pretty sure that they're not going to simply let go of that opportunity, not to mention that China is known to lie in their announcements or take back what they've said immediately without the public knowing.

[Poker Player]

I think it would be more important that Russia ends up legalizing Bitcoin. Somewhere I read that it could be as legal tender, although without obligation to accept it as in El Salvador. If this were to happen, I think it would boost a mining industry in Russia, but let's wait for developments, it won't be long before we know more concretely.

[_act_]

I think it would be more important that Russia ends up legalizing Bitcoin. Somewhere I read that it could be as legal tender, although without obligation to accept it as in El Salvador. If this were to happen, I think it would boost a mining industry in Russia, but let's wait for developments, it won't be long before we know more concretely.

If Russia is accepting Bitcoin as a currency, that means it can be used for buying and selling and other things related to legal tender, but due to high Bitcoin transaction fee, this is not going to be possible and the banks and laws in Russia about this will make sure Bitcoin do not dominate or affect Russian local currency, most people will see Bitcoin as an asset rather than as a currency. There will be no law about it to make bitcoin a legal tender and not making it a compulsory means of payment but an alternative. I like the moves of Russian government towards achieving this.

[lixer]

Another useless piece of news. We in Russia have already heard dozens of such proposals. For example, make the Irkutsk region a region for mining, where the price of electricity is less than 2 cents. If mining is legalized in Russia, then the same situation may happen as in Kazakhstan.

And I remember this country is also the country that said to legalize bitcoin as a currency but I wonder if that was true or just a rumor to spread hype in btc and to make it more hype, they followed it up with this news after the so called legalization of btc so that it would look perfect.

Well, they cant legalize mining first if they do not legalize the btc first because that looks wrong but I wonder why they restrict some places because the title said allowed only is specific areas? Are btc mining really that dangerous to the environment? hmm... or maybe they do not want other countries to engage with it due to how hard mining was.

[Dunamisx]

The proposal aims to recognize crypto mining as a commercial activity and introduce taxes on its realized profits.

Yes, crypto mining can be recognized as a commercial activities and the issues of tax is also acceptable but what seems controversial is paying of task base on its realized profit which shouldn't, i also think of maybe channeling that to base on the power consumption and supply rate rather. I've red many articles talking about the financial challenges encountered by individual miners which could be challenging in deriving a financial means.

[Lucius]

This is the right way - checking in exceptional cases also gives the experience of understanding how it will be later on a countrywide scale. I think that the Republic of Tatarstan will be among the first regions, because it is serious about developing the limits of high technologies - there is even a satellite city of Innopolis. The place where, according to the idea, the Russian "silicon valley" should be formed. How it will be in reality - time will tell, but I think everything will work out in Russia!

I may have misunderstood some news from Russia, but isn't there already some version of Russian Silicon Valley there?As far as I know, this is Skolkovo, which is located near Moscow, and a lot of money has been invested there (they say about 6 billion euros so far) and it looks very impressive and modern, even though it is far from the American Silicon Valley.

For all those who think that Russia is a promised land for Bitcoin, maybe they should study a little better what is really happening in that country where people are still persecuted and killed just because they have different political opinions.

[stompix]

I may have misunderstood some news from Russia, but isn't there already some version of Russian Silicon Valley there?As far as I know, this is Skolkovo, which is located near Moscow, and a lot of money has been invested there (they say about 6 billion euros so far) and it looks very impressive and modern, even though it is far from the American Silicon Valley.

Russia has more Silicon Valleys than valleys

One is Zelenograd built somewhere in the 60, then they've built Akademgorodok, then after the fall of the Soviet Union every single oblast had to have a Silicon Valley with the purpose of embezzling as much money from the government as possible.
So if we go by Russia today we have :
Vladivostok Silicon Valley on ice: Russia wants to turn Far East island into research hub
Crimea Russia to launch Crimean ‘Silicon Valley’ by 2020 lol at the year
and of course Tomsk, Novosibirsk, San Peterburg, and the above-mentioned Innopolis for example, every year they came up with another pipedream, just go to their propaganda news channel for a laugh. Which reminds me, Crimea was also supposed to be : ‘Russian Las Vegas’ to open in Crimea next year,

The only one that could actually look like that is indeed Skolkovo but their major problem is that they're heavily dependent on foreign companies, that's while Silicon Valley thrived, they could sell their stuff to all over the world, you can't do that from a sanctioned country.

Btw, Russia planned back in 2017 a bitcoin city, no need to point out what happened to it, right? 

[Wind_FURY]

If Russia starts mining Bitcoin, China will start mining Bitcoin again too, or did China truly “ban mining” within their country? The West have given warnings that they will ban Russia from using SWIFT, what does everyone believe Russia will do? They have made the narrative more obvious for a need of an open, permissionless, censorship-resistant, ledger/protocol for money.

And if the west doesn't want to deal with Russia?
You realize right now Russia would be just like a shop accepting Visa, Paypal, Monero, and Bitcoin, they can add used panties and discarded diapers as payment options if poeple DON'T want to deal with you they will not! Simple as this!

That’s for another topic, and it is not as simple as “the West will stop dealing with Russia”. That’s laughable, Europe wants they’re heating during the winter, don’t they? But the point is, if Russia and China are banned from using SWIFT, what can they do? The narrative for a censorship-resistant protocol for money, or a settlement layer has only become more obvious.