ㅤ

[Symmetrick]

ㅤ

[1714687490]

1714687490

[1714687490]

1714687490

[1714687490]

1714687490

[joker_josue]

Was it to keep some historical record of these topics?

Either way, these topics don't bring anything to the forum, they might as well be deleted.

[Upgrade00]

It looks like a straight forward action to delete these posts. You didn't share the threads that were moved, but this should have been acted on.

Call it a tantrum, an inadequate reaction, or whatever you want, but after such a VOMIT MODERATION, I don’t want to do anything else here. Keep collecting garbage further, creating the illusion of moderation. That's all I wanted to say.

Do not worry about your accuracy too much; one accurate report is worth many inaccurate reports.

Adequately handled reports are a motivation to report more, but we would try to focus on the action and not the result.
If in thousands of reports you've only had a handful of issues, doesn't seem like a reason to quite sending out reports.

[Upgrade00]

<snip>

If you've always had perfect statistics of good reports then it means the system is working as it should. No system can be perfect or appease everyone at all times. The mods also do their best with what is available.

What annoys me the most is when you do something and it works, you do it again and it suddenly stops working. Why, because of what? Unknown, just because.

Human error. You factor it into anything that people act based on their discretion.
This error could be from the person handling the reports or the person making it.

[Welsh]

I processed a lot of the reports, and removed the threads, not just from this user though there was several others reported at the time, and not just this user. Probably handled 100-200 of the reports. However, I only removed those that did not have any replies at all, had not trust references directed towards the thread itself, i.e one's which basically offered no value whatsoever. I left some in the queue towards the end of the night, due to needing to attend to some real life things as well as further investigation on a few which had trust ratings which I would've looked at later if they were still in the queue.

Having said that, I wasn't the one to mark any of the reports bad. In fact, I left the one's which did have replies as a soft bad, by just leaving them unhandled, because I can see it from both points of view. The global moderator who handled these reports, must have thought they could've been significant to the history of the user, in some way I imagine.

Generally, we don't allow users to remove their own threads, and I guess this could potentially be abused, and whoever marked them bad could be thinking along those lines. However for me, since there was no replies or any trust references/flags left on the one's I handled, I thought they were insignificant enough to be removed. Maybe, whoever handled them had a different point of view to that, however it depends since the examples you've given all that activity from other users.  

Also, the user in question has clearly tried to hide his post history. Now, there's nothing stopping users from doing that I suppose, but they can't remove the threads themselves. I usually, weigh this up, and generally if the threads don't have any replies, and they've been inactive for years, and has no scam accusations or trust references left, I usually remove them.

Can someone explain to me the value of these posts:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3584928.msg36587529#msg36587529
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3585802.msg36588874#msg36588874
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4473798.msg40145465#msg40145465
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3523653.msg36582223#msg36582223
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3527283.msg36555924#msg36555924

These are the exact one's I was thinking about leaving as unhandled, as a soft bad. Since, technically many would agree they're spam, insignificant, but because other users have posted, there is some significance there. I imagine the moderator who handled these after me, thought along the same sort of line. Even though, an argument could be made that the posts that have replied themselves, are pretty bad quality in certain circumstances.

Here's some examples where keeping these around might be a good idea:
1. Users that want to research old projects that they had interest in
2. Scam report, multiple years after
3. Users who've asked substantial posts, when at a time the thread itself was substantial enough getting punished by the thread being removed. Since, technically most users wouldn't be bothered by this thread since they'll never stumble upon it, I think it feels a little harsh on the users losing posts because of it
4. Anything with replies from users generally isn't removed.

[lovesmayfamilis]

I am inclined to believe that some of the reports were bad since the author of the open topic was blmpnetwork itself. Since there were answers from other users on these topics, the moderators did not delete all the topics in their entirety.
But yes, I see that completely empty posts were also not deleted. Is it possible to assume that this is the fatigue of the moderators? I also sent a lot of reports yesterday, and they were all processed perfectly, but I can assume that the human factor, as Upgrade00 writes, still worked.

[sokani]

I had to go look at the user's profile. The user made 346 posts on bounty(altcoin) thread and deleted all posts. One may not know the motive for the user's action but it sure looks like spamming to me. Just as Upgrade00 said, you shouldn't feel discouraged about it as it might be human error, stay objective and keep doing good to the forum.

[LoyceV]

Can someone explain to me the value of these posts:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3584928.msg36587529#msg36587529
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3585802.msg36588874#msg36588874
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4473798.msg40145465#msg40145465
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3523653.msg36582223#msg36582223
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3527283.msg36555924#msg36555924

I see no value in those posts, but the topics are locked. My guess: a Mod locked the topic based on your report, and marked all reports that were in locked topics as bad. But that's just a guess.

Even though the posts don't really have value, reporting them doesn't have much value either. Nobody reads those topics.

[Welsh]

It might be that the global moderator determined that the user did try deleting or covering up their posts in an attempt to hide something, and that every post could potentially be worth something if there was ever a scam accusation launched. Although, for me personally the threads which have no active accusations, and no replies, I remove.

I repeat that the reports were sent just to empty posts, and not to delete the entire topic. Only on edited posts that I marked as a low quality post, point 1.

Yeah, I see that. Although, there were a few threads in there that you reported which had posts from other users that I left unhandled. I don't know how many, I just remember one or two. I left those unhandled at the time. However, I do believe you might've continued reporting after I had gone offline so may have not seen all examples. Generally, for a few of those examples I'd delete them. Some of them are reserve posts, which could be fairly useful to have around...maybe? Especially, if they've been quoted in the thread, with the existing content, since upon clicking on that quote it'd take you to the now edited post. Although, things like:

Delete

Usually get deleted. In fact I reported several of these types of post in that exact thread recently, all deleted. Some sections do tend to vary in how they handle certain situations though. Myself, and Mprep should be fairly consistent on most things, since I know they dealt with a ton of my reports back in my reporting days, and I got a feel for how they take action on certain reports. Obviously, there will be difference of opinion from time to time. For example, I've reported empty threads in the past, and they were always removed.

[Welsh]

Anyway, I've tried to offer some explanations, but ultimately I wasn't the one that marked them bad, and dealt with them like you probably expected. Hopefully, this doesn't put you off of reporting too much though, since it would be a huge miss. I know you're actively reporting elsewhere on the forum also; so it would be a big loss to those sections too. I don't think I've seen you quite as active on the altcoin sections recently, until yesterday. Where I was like Oh, Ratimov is back .

It's one of the reasons I left the below reports unhandled, one of them because the other replies might be worth reviewing, but the other because it did have replies. Therefore, I thought giving you a soft bad would be the better approach. Obviously, other moderators always have the ability to decide to take action though.

Yesterday there were 2. One of these threads contained about 8 edited replies and low-quality posts that were not related to the topic itself, for example: idiot, this is not an announcement, stop polluting the section with your spam.

Right, I believe these are the one's I was referring too. I do remember that the one thread had quite a lot of low quality replies, that might have needed deleting in themselves.  

The funny thing about this is that if I see that mprep is active and I send these reports again, on which someone has stuck BADs, then with a high degree of probability, all this garbage will be deleted, just like yesterday.

Yeah, it's one of the downfalls to having no hard rules, and allowing moderator discretion. I believe the system is better than hard rules most of the time though.

[Welsh]

In general, if you study the activity of this blmpnetwork, then it quickly becomes clear that it was an ordinary spammer obsessed with the topic of ICO, there were hundreds, even thousands of them on the forum in 2018. Did you pay attention to the number of threads he opened? Pay attention to the time between these topics, he created them almost every minute. He was not a scammer, he was an ordinary shiller who promoted the ICO here. There is no value or concealment of fraud in his posts, there are continuous announcements and questions about ico. Not surprising, why some users began to insult him, simply because he polluted the sections with his non-stop spam.

Yeah, I noticed. Although, unfortunately I couldn't find any archives which showed exactly what the threads were about, at least one's I checked. Since a lot of the scraping sites used today, weren't around or didn't scrape the content in time. I'm wondering how it went unnoticed for so long. I personally didn't see it at the time. Especially, considering the bumping system back then was like every other part of the forum if I remember correctly.

I mean, you don't create that many threads, that quickly, and not be considered a spammer. Generally, users make more ordinary posts, rather than threads since threads are generally more substantial when made. That's a huge amount of threads opened. Although, the curious part for me is why they decided to go back, throughout all their history, and edit every single post.

[joker_josue]

Although, the curious part for me is why they decided to go back, throughout all their history, and edit every single post.

He came to the forum after 2 years and sat on the forum for two whole days and edited all his posts.

Probably he is trying to erase his traces of what he said and did here on the forum.
But, if you forgot or don't know, there are several sites that scrape the forum and keep all this history, even if the posts are edited.


The problem is when moderation is based on the common sense of each moderator. And in turn, there are no criteria for reporting posts. Each one does it based on their common sense and their notion of what is of value or not.

I made a few reports, but still about 15% of the reports were not accepted. And I am aware that everything I reported was clearly spam or something that was not in the right place. How is this possible? I don't know...


I have to take the time to look at that list and understand what wasn't accepted... (where do I see that again?)

[Welsh]

Yes, in Russian locale. Now xandry has more work to do. But I understand that soon the low-quality posts will end there, since I have gone through almost all sections, and now I am preparing for new sections. I am looking at the marketplace, altcoin section, sections with announcements, there are a lot of garbage posts and topics, so I will have something to do full-scale.

I've made it a personal goal of mine to remove as much spam in the last few years within my sections that I can. I've finally been able to setup a workflow that helps moderation, and finally tackling some of the problematic issues in the Altcoin section, mainly my sections at the moment. I'm hoping to have done most of it by the end of the year, so everything is much more clean. I've probably removed over 10,000+ posts this year. I know there's a few other users reporting also, so I do think we'll eventually get on top of it, and only deal with current problems.

I'm hoping we can get the community back to reporting like they used too. I know the reasons why they've stopped, but hopefully that'll change in the future, and I know the Altcoin sections are some of the more criticized due to the amount of spam there. Hopefully, I can somewhat alleviate that opinion, and show there's a massive effort going on behind the scenes, which hopefully in return encourages users that their efforts are also not being wasted.

But, if you forgot or don't know, there are several sites that scrape the forum and keep all this history, even if the posts are edited.

Right, but a lot of them didn't scrape them or wasn't around at the time. I can't remember when each scraping website was operational, but ninjastic.space as an example doesn't have the original post, and only scraped the edited version.

The problem is when moderation is based on the common sense of each moderator. And in turn, there are no criteria for reporting posts. Each one does it based on their common sense and their notion of what is of value or not.

There's definitely criteria/guidelines that most moderators are aware of, but there is a element of discretion. theymos has made it quite clear in the past that he doesn't believe in set in stone rules, because they're easier to exploit or abuse, which I'd agree. Unfortunately, a trade off of that is sometimes we have situations like this where some moderators view things differently.

However, if anything this can encourage moderators to have a little talk about how to deal with these things in the future, and establish some sort of general view on it.

I made a few reports, but still about 15% of the reports were not accepted. And I am aware that everything I reported was clearly spam or something that was not in the right place. How is this possible? I don't know...

If you or anyone else needs some advise on reports, I'll try to help as much as possible so feel free to give me a message. I personally love to see more reporters actively reporting.

[hilariousandco]

Reporting posts from 2018 in dead threads that have already been locked really isn't necessary. Sometimes it seems like people are going out of their way to find stuff to report. Posts that have been edited shouldn't be removed anyway as someone can just edit their post and then report it to try make sure it's fully deleted and people can try cover their tracks this way. There probably should be some sort of statue of limitations on certain stuff because posts in dead threads from years ago really isn't an issue. If you want to report stuff there's thousands of posts made a day by shitposters so it's not like you'll ever run out of stuff to do.

[Lafu]

I know there's a few other users reporting also, so I do think we'll eventually get on top of it, and only deal with current problems.

i would be more active on reporting in the Altcoin section if i got the time for , but at the moment real life things comes first.
Even when i reporting and try to find this damn Fake Anns and Malware things i would be reporting other things also.
When i see something that should be reported i doing that in hope that it helps to get it cleaner.

[Aanuoluwatofunmi]

I want to believe when you send a report, some boards have upto two moderators while some may have one or even have it that the moderator is not active on the forum, whenever we report to the moderators, we have done our own part in creating a good and sanitized bitcointalk community, the moderators handles these reports and check on them and acted as appropriate, we are left with nothing to question their actions on our accuracy or the reported thread we make because they have the decision to take full responsibility of the required and necessary action over them, i will advise you keep reporting and be less concerned about the outcome on each of the reports made, because you have done your own part.

[LoyceV]

unfortunately I couldn't find any archives which showed exactly what the threads were about, at least one's I checked. Since a lot of the scraping sites used today, weren't around or didn't scrape the content in time.

It looks like I have hundreds of "edited" posts archived, but some of the oldest posts were scraped in time. He started editing his posts around the same time I was building my old posts archive.
I checked a few of his posts, and he just copied the same thing many times. It should have been deleted anyway.

I can't remember when each scraping website was operational, but ninjastic.space as an example doesn't have the original post, and only scraped the edited version.

TryNinja got those old posts from my archive, and has some of them too.

[joker_josue]

I made a few reports, but still about 15% of the reports were not accepted. And I am aware that everything I reported was clearly spam or something that was not in the right place. How is this possible? I don't know...

If you or anyone else needs some advise on reports, I'll try to help as much as possible so feel free to give me a message. I personally love to see more reporters actively reporting.

I have no doubt whatsoever that the moderators have guidelines to carry out their work in the best possible way.

Sometimes the problem is when you enter the field of personal opinion, which turns out to be very different for each one. Logically this is not something wrong, it can only sometimes generate strangeness in some situations. But I believe it's never anything very relevant, and it's something that can be easily endured.

Thank you for your willingness to clarify, believe that if you have any questions, I will contact you. Thanks.

What is the link to see the results of our reports?

[digaran]

I like how Welsh came in like Natasha to calm the angry beast, as I read the replies I could see the hulk shrinking.
Your reaction is what I had few years ago when I thought admin reduced my smerits because I was an outsider (foreigner), I did the same as you which I later regret it.

For a few weeks I can see less spam and garbage, though I don't visit altcoin forums at all, maybe once in a week, but other sections look cleaner and honestly I enjoy it.

I would like to thank you for all the efforts you have put to this thankless task, believe me, we all appreciate it.
But talking like that with moderators/ who have been here longer than you is not appropriate especially coming from someone like you. You both deserve more than this. 

Honestly, after so many years I get pissed when I see reports are marked as bad or I see my posts deleted but after a few minutes I calm myself by reasoning with my inner hulk and then move on. One thing I know, mods do their best to stay neutral and unbiased, so you should always approach such cases more  leniently than you already have, like posting here to notify the admin and other mods and post a more consulting oriented topic rather than a "fuck this I'm out". We would like pretty much to have people like you around. I hope you continue the support as it is towards the community than admins/ mods.
In other words, you are contributing to the forum as a whole not just to a part of it.

[digaran]

To be frank, I don't see any benefit to report years old topics/ posts as others pointed out. However if a topic is still active and has many pages with useful information for new readers, it is logical to clean the early pages even if the posts are years old, but reporting dead topics/ posts, is just a waste of your time unless the goal is something other than a clean up, it could be perceived as if you are trying to bump up the report count, and since there is no competition for more report counts here, your method seems inane no matter your intentions.

But as I said earlier, you should always use a more friendly tone and wait at least a day or two, to receive more feedback, you know? Like behaving in a way to put the responsibility of defending your case on others, that way if you were right, the community would have acted accordingly to prove your point, but now it is either the mod's fault or your's. You left no middle ground for us to stand.