(IDEAS?) What to do with auction proceeds for ScamKey victims

[YodasRedRocket]

hold on a second - who was being propped up by yogg? people were helping him - people were buying the card - people loaned him funds - yes, but not to keep the "Racket" going.

you just accused a ton of great people - "regular joe collectors"

I could be mistaken but didn’t some of his backers know he was whacked out on drugs, not delivering old ass orders, constantly borrowing $ & making excuses?  Is this someone you would tell the community to trust?  I’m not saying they intentionally did anything to scam anyone, I’m saying the warning signs were there.  I’ve spoken to OG’s that sold their cards long ago bc they lost confidence.  I’ve trusted the wrong people to believe me. 

maybe some of them? I dont know - do you? but you stated " everyone was giving personal loans to keep the racket going" that puts hookzup1, krogoth, myself, polymerbit and a few others I cant think of off the top of my head - and none of us did it to "keep the racket going"

I get you are pissed but your general statements are trashing everyone for no reason. No one on this thread is responsible for what yogg did - only  yogg is.

Agreed but the warning signs were there.  I don’t believe any of the people you mentioned intentionally kept the racket going… but the hype campaign was strong when there was fire coming in the woods.

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[owlcatz]

Negative trust for an argument? Come on man… we all grown ups here… I think 🤔 He didn’t rip you off or anything, that’s what I always thought the trust system was for.  You do what you say kinda thing or reporting scammers.  

Anyway, a poll with ranked choice voting & if 2 or 3 have significant votes, we divide the funds up. Maybe a portion can be distributed to people who lost premium or never received their items, to refund folks who didn’t want cygan’s, refund Cygan & personal loan folks etc.  The people will show the way… we gotta rip this bandaid off & move on ✌🏼

Reality check - There are literally zero ways to accurately track "Premium" losses here - Seriously, forget it. Premiums are what buyers attach to the product, yes I too paid many times over face for certain cards but how in the living f is anyone gonna prove that or even track it? It seriously boggles my mind, so drop that idea. The best these funds will cover is Cygan's losses out of pocket which should be #1 to me, and the others who never sought refunds from Cygan like myself... Sure many people bought cards on the forum so history can be looked up, but many many others did off-forum deals (PM etc etc) as well.

The fact that everyone freaked out and peeled every card they had as a result of only 2 specific sets known to have been swept PROVES this was NOT an orchestrated fraud from the beginning. NO other cards have been swept... So ... That leads to the question, why should anyone be reimbursed for funds that were never likely to be swept? (For the record, Yogg was a genius in terms of IQ, but came at the expense of social skills and other aspects of his life..  So... IMO, I KNOW if he had done this on purpose from day one, all funds would have gone woosh at once for ALL cards ...

@Hookzup, all your other cards still funded?  

And yes, if someone is going to falsely accuse me of being part of some kind of orchestrated fraud, I WILL INDEED leave them negative trust, or at least Neutral...  The trust system is not moderated, so anyone who doesn't like it can fuck off too afaic....

For the record, this "precious" guy (fitting lol) was nothing but whiny, skittish and impatient whenever I dealt with him and the fact I even TRIED to help him burns now as well when I had no control over a guy in France lol ... I've spent 9 years here combatting scams and scammers... Ever heard of the GAW mining scam? Yeah, go look back through 2014 of my posts. I spent half my life exposing Homero the GAW cloud mining fraudster along with @Suchmoon who called it first...

lastly, Yogg nearly literally fckn killed me that day when he went fuckin batshit insane - I have health issues too, so I'm sure you all saw the messages I sent him etc ffs? Does that look fun to you on a day off?

Have a good night, I got real work to do...

Boy I could post so many messages, as Yogg tried to steal the btc I sent for funding 3 history sets, until I raised hell. So if whiny, bitchy, and impatient is definitely a way to describe me when a company you personally vouched for over and over was withholding over 1k worth of btc of mine from me… yeah - that is correct.

Negative trust for an argument? Come on man… we all grown ups here… I think 🤔 He didn’t rip you off or anything, that’s what I always thought the trust system was for.  You do what you say kinda thing or reporting scammers.  

Anyway, a poll with ranked choice voting & if 2 or 3 have significant votes, we divide the funds up. Maybe a portion can be distributed to people who lost premium or never received their items, to refund folks who didn’t want cygan’s, refund Cygan & personal loan folks etc.  The people will show the way… we gotta rip this bandaid off & move on ✌🏼

Reality check - There are literally zero ways to accurately track "Premium" losses here - Seriously, forget it. Premiums are what buyers attach to the product, yes I too paid many times over face for certain cards but how in the living f is anyone gonna prove that or even track it? It seriously boggles my mind, so drop that idea. The best these funds will cover is Cygan's losses out of pocket which should be #1 to me, and the others who never sought refunds from Cygan like myself... Sure many people bought cards on the forum so history can be looked up, but many many others did off-forum deals (PM etc etc) as well.

The fact that everyone freaked out and peeled every card they had as a result of only 2 specific sets known to have been swept PROVES this was NOT an orchestrated fraud from the beginning. NO other cards have been swept... So ... That leads to the question, why should anyone be reimbursed for funds that were never likely to be swept? (For the record, Yogg was a genius in terms of IQ, but came at the expense of social skills and other aspects of his life..  So... IMO, I KNOW if he had done this on purpose from day one, all funds would have gone woosh at once for ALL cards ...

@Hookzup, all your other cards still funded?  

And yes, if someone is going to falsely accuse me of being part of some kind of orchestrated fraud, I WILL INDEED leave them negative trust, or at least Neutral...  The trust system is not moderated, so anyone who doesn't like it can fuck off too afaic....

For the record, this "precious" guy (fitting lol) was nothing but whiny, skittish and impatient whenever I dealt with him and the fact I even TRIED to help him burns now as well when I had no control over a guy in France lol ... I've spent 9 years here combatting scams and scammers... Ever heard of the GAW mining scam? Yeah, go look back through 2014 of my posts. I spent half my life exposing Homero the GAW cloud mining fraudster along with @Suchmoon who called it first...

lastly, Yogg nearly literally fckn killed me that day when he went fuckin batshit insane - I have health issues too, so I'm sure you all saw the messages I sent him etc ffs? Does that look fun to you on a day off?

Have a good night, I got real work to do...

Help me recover my $1000+ worth of btc funding that I sent specifically for funding my history sets of your affiliated company?? That’s what I’m whiny and impatient about?

That’s all true - but at least I got my funds. The post explaining all the made up difficulties that was promised never happened either. Only promised after I threatened to go public… I truly regret not going public (could’ve saved you guys and me some btc) but had no way of knowing about all the loans and owed products. I thought I was a one off case and not the norm. Either way - your reputation precedes itself. I don’t know what personal issues you have going on but acting out online and “blocking” “negative trust” and crying about it isn’t healthy. Hope you get the help you need. Cuz man - you are something else. When you have this constant drama surrounding you, plus flying off the handle at random shit all the time… bro - seek help. I am not the first second or tenth person you’ve done this to and I know I won’t be the last.

Again you have no fucking clue or any idea what the hell I went through so leave me the fuck alone stop accusing me of bullshit and just fuck off. Yes this is me when someone accuses me of being part of a scam when I have done literally nothing but try to help yog and the rest of you people, and now you attack me personally and accuse me of being part of the scam. Do you see why that burns me now? I guess not because you're not in my shoes obviously. You need the help because you cant get over it I've already moved past it but when someone's accuses me of scamming when I made zero and lost more than you it kind of burns my ass You get it yet? Fuck sakes you are thick

I don't know how much money you had up tied because all I was doing was trying to fix all the other fucking messes but he kept creating more behind my back so is that my fucking fault? Anyways now I'm fucking done for real now...

Edit. .. I am not and have never been affiliated with cold scam other than helping Patrick out. It was his company not mine. 🖕

[MoparMiningLLC]

Agreed but the warning signs were there.  I don’t believe any of the people you mentioned intentionally kept the racket going… but the hype campaign was strong when there was fire coming in the woods.

what warning signs? I knew nothing of any of those things - only that a few people were missing some cards and he was - from the posts people made - was addressing them.


and if you dont think of the ones I listed were intentionally doing it - maybe dont say "everyone"?

you been here what? less than a year? maybe a little over a year? and wanna trash everyone? take a step back. blame the guy who did the wrong - not everyone else.

[YodasRedRocket]

Agreed but the warning signs were there.  I don’t believe any of the people you mentioned intentionally kept the racket going… but the hype campaign was strong when there was fire coming in the woods.

what warning signs? I knew nothing of any of those things - only that a few people were missing some cards and he was - from the posts people made - was addressing them.


and if you dont think of the ones I listed were intentionally doing it - maybe dont say "everyone"?

you been here what? less than a year? maybe a little over a year? and wanna trash everyone? take a step back. blame the guy who did the wrong - not everyone else.

Everyone .. maybe I should have said “some”.  This isn’t about trashing people, this is about getting the fucking option to vote on the table & “some” folks constantly swatting that idea down in favor of a select “some” getting all the charity funds! 

Mopar, you’re a good dude & my fight isn’t with you.  I want a vote.  Others do too but don’t want to post because they’re anti-drama.  Doesn’t matter how long I’ve been on this forum.  All hobbies have the same scams & I’m a veteran in that regard ✌🏼

[YodasRedRocket]

Oh & my rookie ass alerted everyone to getting buttfucked within hours… beginners luck? 

[MoparMiningLLC]

yes "some" would be better. but unless you know some specifics of people knowingly doing so - I wouldnt even say "some"

and yes you did, you messaged me off the forums if I recall.

edit: and my time reference was simply to point out that you dont know many of the people here as well as some of us others. another reason why not to accuse anyone.

and I wasnt as vulgar as to say "your rookie ass"

[YodasRedRocket]

yes "some" would be better. but unless you know some specifics of people knowingly doing so - I wouldnt even say "some"

and yes you did, you messaged me off the forums if I recall.

edit: and my time reference was simply to point out that you dont know many of the people here as well as some of us others. another reason why not to accuse anyone.

and I wasnt as vulgar as to say "your rookie ass"

I posted on forum & reached out to everyone knew who held ColdCuntz as soon as I possibly could.

My idea for one of the ideas to vote on.

Original price of card reimbursed to anyone who was swept or peeled after warning with proof pic & research of sweep date.

That’s all I’m pushing for here.  This would help a lot of people, not just “some”. And any of those folks may be entitled to funds as well, let the people decide.

[MoparMiningLLC]

yes "some" would be better. but unless you know some specifics of people knowingly doing so - I wouldnt even say "some"

and yes you did, you messaged me off the forums if I recall.

edit: and my time reference was simply to point out that you dont know many of the people here as well as some of us others. another reason why not to accuse anyone.

and I wasnt as vulgar as to say "your rookie ass"

I posted on forum & reached out to everyone knew who held ColdCuntz as soon as I possibly could.

My idea for one of the ideas to vote on.

Original price of card reimbursed to anyone who was swept or peeled after warning with proof pic & research of sweep date.

That’s all I’m pushing for here.  This would help a lot of people, not just “some”. And any of those folks may be entitled to funds as well, let the people decide.

cost of card should be simple and only paid to those holding the card. someone has the database so could easily track the cards to make sure cards are not claimed multiple times by multiple people as well

[YodasRedRocket]

yes "some" would be better. but unless you know some specifics of people knowingly doing so - I wouldnt even say "some"

and yes you did, you messaged me off the forums if I recall.

edit: and my time reference was simply to point out that you dont know many of the people here as well as some of us others. another reason why not to accuse anyone.

and I wasnt as vulgar as to say "your rookie ass"

I posted on forum & reached out to everyone knew who held ColdCuntz as soon as I possibly could.

My idea for one of the ideas to vote on.

Original price of card reimbursed to anyone who was swept or peeled after warning with proof pic & research of sweep date.

That’s all I’m pushing for here.  This would help a lot of people, not just “some”. And any of those folks may be entitled to funds as well, let the people decide.

cost of card should be simple and only paid to those holding the card. someone has the database so could easily track the cards to make sure cards are not claimed multiple times by multiple people as well

Proof pics are easy.  And I’m only saying let this be considered.  And maybe not even the only option.  We had a lot of very generous donators.  Thanks again to everyone who chipped in & MJ & Smoothie for the assists ✌🏼

[ChiBitCTy]

Whole lot of thread here I didn’t read, but I agree premiums should absolutely not be included. There’s no way to gauge it and there’s not enough funds to even cover the losses of the base products/cygan payouts etc, let alone any potential premiums they may have had.

[krogothmanhattan]

Gentlemen......Yes there is a lot of hurt and pain from this shitshow but just cause people were working with Shitkey I dont think it makes them accomplaces to the crime committed.

       I too initially thru the pain and anger vented to Cygan and Owlz, but that was a wrong move as all they did was be a part of a company that its founder did what he did. I lost a lot not only in BTC but also in premium on my cards since I was the owner of the majority numbered 1 and 2 cards.

    Not only that, but my name was part of the idea and auction for the Goldkey halving sets. I also had some unique pieces that if I sold before this happened I couldve gotten a pretty nice chunk of BTC....but that is all gone and its water under the bridge for me otherwise I will only drive myself crazy thinking about it.  And yes I am hodling onto my cards as they are still collectables to me....just like the Alitin coins that sold as high as 0.2 BTC a few years after the theft...so these cards in time will be worth something as well.

       My hats off to Cygan for giving back BTC from his own pocket..and also to Owlz for helping out as well.
       Thanks to Yoga for letting us know of the sweep and everyone who assisted as well.

       Thanks to all for their inputs and again I mean no disrespect if I am rubbing people the wrong way.

      Thru the years, I loaned Dogg a few times cause I am a supporter of anything that is loadable..and most of the time he was always late but I always got paid back. Did I know he had other loans? No...and even if I did it was my choice and my hard earned money to use...again I am no whale..if anything I am a small shrimp in the scheme of things....yep working my ass off...sometimes 16 hr days...so yeah, that is hard earned money.
To add insult to injury, Dogg even set me up with a Trust shit post and attacked me to so call ruin me...later I find thru him that his depression was the cause of his paranoia etc etc....yet I chose to forgive and move even though he also shit talked about me to many members here....why? No fucken idea? I felt the cold shoulder from many members here and later I find why....But that is up to people to believe whatever came out of his mouth. Like they say...NO GOOD DEED EVER GOES UNPUNISHED.

     All I did was be a good friend in his time of need. And that's why when he asked for some money I didn't hesitate to show that I harbor no ill feelings for his actions in the past.

      Now that is out there for everyone to read and ponder....how about we start a poll....these are my two satoshi....please again correct me or add....I got no problem's going with the majority here as that's the right thing to do.

CHOICE A

     Choice A would be in this order

     Pay back swept people who refused Cygan's BTC and also anyone who sent BTC to SKamKey raffle .
     Pay back Cygan his BTC given out to make people whole.
     Any leftovers go to people who ordered cards and never received.
     Pay back peoples business loans given to SkamKey.
    

[minerjones]

while we are deciding what to do, does anyone have a definitive list of who and how much?
I know cygan started a list, but seems to not be complete.... 

[PreciousMetapsICT]

Gentlemen......Yes there is a lot of hurt and pain from this shitshow but just cause people were working with Shitkey I dont think it makes them accomplaces to the crime committed.

       I too initially thru the pain and anger vented to Cygan and Owlz, but that was a wrong move as all they did was be a part of a company that its founder did what he did. I lost a lot not only in BTC but also in premium on my cards since I was the owner of the majority numbered 1 and 2 cards.

    Not only that, but my name was part of the idea and auction for the Goldkey halving sets. I also had some unique pieces that if I sold before this happened I couldve gotten a pretty nice chunk of BTC....but that is all gone and its water under the bridge for me otherwise I will only drive myself crazy thinking about it.  And yes I am hodling onto my cards as they are still collectables to me....just like the Alitin coins that sold as high as 0.2 BTC a few years after the theft...so these cards in time will be worth something as well.

       My hats off to Cygan for giving back BTC from his own pocket..and also to Owlz for helping out as well.
       Thanks to Yoga for letting us know of the sweep and everyone who assisted as well.

       Thanks to all for their inputs and again I mean no disrespect if I am rubbing people the wrong way.

      Thru the years, I loaned Dogg a few times cause I am a supporter of anything that is loadable..and most of the time he was always late but I always got paid back. Did I know he had other loans? No...and even if I did it was my choice and my hard earned money to use...again I am no whale..if anything I am a small shrimp in the scheme of things....yep working my ass off...sometimes 16 hr days...so yeah, that is hard earned money.
To add insult to injury, Dogg even set me up with a Trust shit post and attacked me to so call ruin me...later I find thru him that his depression was the cause of his paranoia etc etc....yet I chose to forgive and move even though he also shit talked about me to many members here....why? No fucken idea? I felt the cold shoulder from many members here and later I find why....But that is up to people to believe whatever came out of his mouth. Like they say...NO GOOD DEED EVER GOES UNPUNISHED.

     All I did was be a good friend in his time of need. And that's why when he asked for some money I didn't hesitate to show that I harbor no ill feelings for his actions in the past.

      Now that is out there for everyone to read and ponder....how about we start a poll....these are my two satoshi....please again correct me or add....I got no problem's going with the majority here as that's the right thing to do.

CHOICE A

     Choice A would be in this order

     Pay back swept people who refused Cygan's BTC and also anyone who sent BTC to SKamKey raffle .
     Pay back Cygan his BTC given out to make people whole.
     Any leftovers go to people who ordered cards and never received.
     Pay back peoples business loans given to SkamKey.
    

My exact quote is -

“And my advice  is to actually know the people you get in business with and vouch for… as your name is forever tied to coldscam as well”

Not calling anyone accomplices, but people should acknowledge their roles in the scam  - and what steps they should do differently to help make it harder for the next scammer

[krogothmanhattan]

My exact quote is -

“And my advice  is to actually know the people you get in business with and vouch for… as your name is forever tied to coldscam as well”

Not calling anyone accomplices, but people should acknowledge their roles in the scam  - and what steps they should do differently to help make it harder for the next scammer

  Ahh my friend if it was only that easy....people get married and are in love yet they also end up betraying each other and sometimes yes even worse crimes like murder. Ever hear till death do us apart? I have been on this planet for over half a century now ...and have seen many things done by close friends and family that I would never thought possible.

   Life events change people who even themselves would not believe they were ever capable of doing certain deeds.

   The only way in our hobby to be 100% sure is to make your own keys and never depend on other reputation as that can change.

  Life has a funny way of testing people. So anytime I do or did buy anything loaded...that question is always in the back of my head...the possibility of losing my btc. The safest BTC I have are the coins I made and the ones on my paper wallets and Trezor.

  

[YodasRedRocket]

Whole lot of thread here I didn’t read, but I agree premiums should absolutely not be included. There’s no way to gauge it and there’s not enough funds to even cover the losses of the base products/cygan payouts etc, let alone any potential premiums they may have had.

There's not enough funds to fully cover anyone's losses.  Missing the point here Chi.  If the word premium is what is putting everyone off...  Ok, original cost of the stupid plastic cards?  That's what should be considered in a vote.  It would help a lot of people who were actually holders.  I fuckin swear... if that shit isn't on the list of options to vote for... this is all a fucking game of how can we get bits back in a few people's wallets & leave everybody else out in the cold!

Vote!  Have ALL options on the list to vote for!  Do Not leave out splitting up the funds for all the common man holders! 

[krogothmanhattan]

Whole lot of thread here I didn’t read, but I agree premiums should absolutely not be included. There’s no way to gauge it and there’s not enough funds to even cover the losses of the base products/cygan payouts etc, let alone any potential premiums they may have had.

There's not enough funds to fully cover anyone's losses.  Missing the point here Chi.  If the word premium is what is putting everyone off...  Ok, original cost of the stupid plastic cards?  That's what should be considered in a vote.  It would help a lot of people who were actually holders.  I fuckin swear... if that shit isn't on the list of options to vote for... this is all a fucking game of how can we get bits back in a few people's wallets & leave everybody else out in the cold!

Vote!  Have ALL options on the list to vote for!  Do Not leave out splitting up the funds for all the common man holders!  

   Noted Yoda....So along these lines for another choice?

    
       Choice B would be in this order

     Pay back swept people who refused Cygan's BTC and also anyone who sent BTC to SKamKey raffle .
     Pay back Cygan his BTC given out to make people whole.
     Any leftovers go to people who ordered cards and never received.
     Pay back what the original purchase price of any card owner

      Please tell me exactly is this how choice B would be and in what order? I have over 100 cards and would greatly benefit from this choice if it went thru and if there is any BTC left as well.


 SO an example of what the poll would look like....if there were only two choices then the following woud be given..

Choice A would be in this order

     Pay back swept people who refused Cygan's BTC and also anyone who sent BTC to SKamKey raffle .
     Pay back Cygan his BTC given out to make people whole.
     Any leftovers go to people who ordered cards and never received.
     Pay back peoples business loans given to SkamKey.
    
      Choice B would be in this order

     Pay back swept people who refused Cygan's BTC and also anyone who sent BTC to SKamKey raffle .
     Pay back Cygan his BTC given out to make people whole.
     Any leftovers go to people who ordered cards and never received.
     Pay back what the original purchase price of any card owner



     We should have more choices so awaiting more feedback....preferably choice A thru Choice D or up would be good. We are all open here so please post.

[minerjones]

while we are deciding what to do, does anyone have a definitive list of who and how much?
I know cygan started a list, but seems to not be complete.... 

Will there be any reserve for people who bought halving sets that are not part of the forum?

[krogothmanhattan]

while we are deciding what to do, does anyone have a definitive list of who and how much?
I know cygan started a list, but seems to not be complete.... 

Will there be any reserve for people who bought halving sets that are not part of the forum?

  Thats a very good point...I think there should be.  Perhaps Cygan can update us on how many were refunded and how many are still yet to be that can be refunded meaning people that are around and aware. And then we can set aside btc for that. Then the question is how long is that to be held?

[ChiBitCTy]

Whole lot of thread here I didn’t read, but I agree premiums should absolutely not be included. There’s no way to gauge it and there’s not enough funds to even cover the losses of the base products/cygan payouts etc, let alone any potential premiums they may have had.

There's not enough funds to fully cover anyone's losses.  Missing the point here Chi.  If the word premium is what is putting everyone off...  Ok, original cost of the stupid plastic cards?  That's what should be considered in a vote.  It would help a lot of people who were actually holders.  I fuckin swear... if that shit isn't on the list of options to vote for... this is all a fucking game of how can we get bits back in a few people's wallets & leave everybody else out in the cold!

Vote!  Have ALL options on the list to vote for!  Do Not leave out splitting up the funds for all the common man holders!  

I can read, I’m not missing any point. You’re misunderstanding what I’m saying. I said specifically there’s not close to enough money to cover everyone’s actual losses, which does not include “premiums”.

This is exactly how I feel, what I meant.:

“Pay back swept people who refused Cygan's BTC and also anyone who sent BTC to SKamKey raffle .
     Pay back Cygan his BTC given out to make people whole.
     Any leftovers go to people who ordered cards and never received.
     Pay back peoples business loans given to SkamKey”. -Krogo
    

[cygan]

✂️
Perhaps Cygan can update us on how many were refunded and how many are still yet to be that can be refunded meaning people that are around and aware.
✂️

so my thread with the refunds is 100% up to date and in the last few days two affected users have contacted me where again a refund would take place on my part