[CLOSED] Watch the thread for finaly payout info "Project #2"

[jddebug]

Tell you what, just pay based on historical average and keep whatever my share would be.

This "because this is what imsaguy wants" is a bunch of crap.

I asked why my btc payouts were pending BEFORE the website went down.  Its not like I made some number up knowing there was no way to verify the claim.  I didn't get my otc rating by lying and cheating.

Mine had been pending for longer than usual too. I KNOW I had 12BTC+ without a doubt. Was so high because had been pending for an extra day for some reason.

Please let us know what you think we would each get with the average historical hash rates. I think that would be more fair than a free for all because free is never really free from my experience.

[beaups]

Tell you what, just pay based on historical average and keep whatever my share would be.

This "because this is what imsaguy wants" is a bunch of crap.

I asked why my btc payouts were pending BEFORE the website went down.  Its not like I made some number up knowing there was no way to verify the claim.  I didn't get my otc rating by lying and cheating.

Mine had been pending for longer than usual too. I KNOW I had 12BTC+ without a doubt. Was so high because had been pending for an extra day for some reason.

Please let us know what you think we would each get with the average historical hash rates. I think that would be more fair than a free for all because free is never really free from my experience.

I think we were all in that situation

[jddebug]

New idea. People just claim what they think they arw owed. Then pay out based on that. If people over guess then we pay a percent. How does that sound? Sent from phone my internet is out at the house.

Ok, I'm game. 12.1 BTC I believe I'm low on that number but 99.9% sure I'm not high unless the pending was inaccurate.

[DeaDTerra]

New idea. People just claim what they think they arw owed. Then pay out based on that. If people over guess then we pay a percent. How does that sound? Sent from phone my internet is out at the house.

Ok, I'm game. 12.1 BTC I believe I'm low on that number but 99.9% sure I'm not high unless the pending was inaccurate.

I will claim 2.3, that's the latest I saw pending and that was about 12 hours before the servers were shutdown, so it might be higher.
//DeaDTerra

[nyana]

8.8 BTC pending

4.X BTC "worked"

6 hours later - offline - speed 10GH

[Tittiez]

.5BTC Owed here, thanks goat.

[localhost]

I don't really know how much I had pending... all I know is I was mining continuously at around 650-700MH/s (more in the 700 - 2x 5870). So, this, times the time between latest payout and server outage. Probably 0.5 to 1 BTC. If I take nyana's figures for 10 GH/s and convert for 700MH/s I get 0.89 BTC.

[beaups]

I would have been right around 2BTC

[vampire]

How are you going to match users in project2 to forum's nicks?

[Internet151]

I don't spend all day on the forums goat, so if any final decisions are made on how payouts are going to be done let me know via IM please.

Personally I think the best way to do it would to take an average of the last 7 days of user payout stats you have, and just pay everyone that value for the one day your missing data. Obviously not a perfect solution, but it seems better to me than the other ideas in here so far.

Ultimately I don't really care that much as long as some sort of payment comes my way, it doesn't have to be perfect people make mistakes and I'm not going to bust your balls over it. It's only one day worth of BTC and i'm saying this with 32 GH/s.


In regards to your earlier question a few pages back about mining here at 98% PPS, I think anything below 100% pps is cheating ignorant/lazy people (I'm looking at you deepbit).

[organofcorti]

I think anything below 100% pps is cheating ignorant/lazy people (I'm looking at you deepbit).

How does 100% pps work? The lower a fee a PPS pool has the more likely they are to go bankrupt and take all your cash. At 98%, if goat maintained 1700 btc in reserve at all times he'd only have a 1/1000 chance of eventual bankruptcy.  For a 1% fee, he'd need to maintain a 3500 btc reserve. Try to get by with a lower reserve, say 500 btc and the chance of eventual bankruptcy with a 2% fee rises to about 67%.

Even at a 10% fee, deepbit needs to maintain a reserve of 365 btc at all times.

So if someone is offering you 100% pps and can't explain why, be aware that if they're attempting to make money by pool hopping, that really isn't viable anymore. Also, be aware that you could lose coins. When a pool becomes bankrupt it will be sudden and you will probably lose whatever coins you were owed. If it was a very long block that caused the pool to become bankrupt, you could lose 10 or more blocks worth of coin.

[organofcorti]

I saw that. I also got an email from Burning Toad about ARS' close down today - you receive it too?

[jamesg]

On a somewhat related note ARS owes us over 58 BTC

Unfortunately, mining at a SMPPS pool with a negative buffer is rolling the dice and hoping that the buffer will turn positive. Add on top of that the problems that started to creep up with the pool and the operators absence, this was definitely a recipe for disaster.

Everything I said above though must be put on the miner and not the operator I'm afraid. Saying that ARS owes you 58 BTC is like hoping your fairy god mother comes down, sprinkles a little fairy dust and fixes all of your problems.

Please take responsibility here. You gambled on getting 100% PPS payout from a pool with a negative buffer and an absent operator and have now lost that bet.

[John (John K.)]

On a somewhat related note ARS owes us over 58 BTC

Unfortunately, mining at a SMPPS pool with a negative buffer is rolling the dice and hoping that the buffer will turn positive. Add on top of that the problems that started to creep up with the pool and the operators absence, this was definitely a recipe for disaster.

Everything I said above though must be put on the miner and not the operator I'm afraid. Saying that ARS owes you 58 BTC is like hoping your fairy god mother comes down, sprinkles a little fairy dust and fixes all of your problems.

Please take responsibility here. You gambled on getting 100% PPS payout from a pool with a negative buffer and an absent operator and have now lost that bet.

Actually, I'm fairly amazed at how long Eligius worked well with SMPPS. They have been in the negatives for some time, but the people never left(me included unfortunately), and it sprung back to the positives fairly fast enough to be reassuring. Why is that so? 

[organofcorti]

Actually, I'm fairly amazed at how long Eligius worked well with SMPPS. They have been in the negatives for some time, but the people never left(me included unfortunately), and it sprung back to the positives fairly fast enough to be reassuring. Why is that so? 

Why don't miners leave? Inertia, not understanding that maturity time variance is as bad as payout variance, and lack of strategic miners there. If I mined Eligius, I'd have a script set to mine elsewhere when the the buffer was negative.

[John (John K.)]

Actually, I'm fairly amazed at how long Eligius worked well with SMPPS. They have been in the negatives for some time, but the people never left(me included unfortunately), and it sprung back to the positives fairly fast enough to be reassuring. Why is that so? 

Why don't miners leave? Inertia, not understanding that maturity time variance is as bad as payout variance, and lack of strategic miners there. If I mined Eligius, I'd have a script set to mine elsewhere when the the buffer was negative.

Guess you nailed the points. However, I mostly prefer to mine in a place where the payouts are predictable in the short run, hence why I normally go for SMPPS/PPS type of pools. I've tried DGM at Eclipse once for 2 days; the payouts were lower then usual by a lot. Is there a type of payout method most close to PPS? Thanks

(I know it's off topic here, and I apologize for that, but it seems to be the best chance to ask  )

[jamesg]

Are you okay with the semantics now Giga?

Unpaid is something different from someone saying they are owed something.

Since you are asking me to take responsibility you must think that I am not taking responsibility in some way. Can you please explain yourself?

Owed implies you were wronged in some way hence placing the responsibility on the pool operator. I'm simply saying that your gamble didn't pay off.

Thank you.

You're welcome.  

[John (John K.)]

The way we are going to solve this is one of two ways.

1) Everyone tells me what they think they are owed by e-mail only! (I will ignore all PMs or messages in this thread!) I will e-mail you all and you respond with your BTC address and amount you think you are owed. If your BTC address is not on our list you get ignored. I will only pay the 138 BTC owed. If there are more claims for the coins than coins you will only get a percent.

If someone does not like this option we can do...

2) I give the coins to Maged as I'm sure there will be a scamming claim and he can sort it out. But since he has even less data than I do I doubt that will be very productive.


I have no intent to keep your coins and I'm sorry I ever did this as my margins were shockingly low. I have lost over $1000 on this project and that is not even counting time.

This will be over for me very soon one way or the other.

Thank you for you attention.

Well, seems fair enough. Is RG's compensation(did he give one?) included? If so, please give your email address.

[P4man]

I am not blaming him for the negative balance, I am blaming him for closing operations. By that local I could close this project before I pay everyone out. Absurd...

Hmm.. no. You offered a pay per share business, that means you owe everyone what you promised for the shares they submitted. Ars did not, they owe their miners what was effectively mined, not a dime more.

[imsaguy]

I am not blaming him for the negative balance, I am blaming him for closing operations. By that local I could close this project before I pay everyone out. Absurd...

Hmm.. no. You offered a pay per share business, that means you owe everyone what you promised for the shares they submitted. Ars did not, they owe their miners what was effectively mined, not a dime more.

But closing up shop, when they said they would giving warning is the issue I have with them. I mined there to help them cuz they said they would giving warning before they closed. They effectively did not do that.

I feel cheated and lied to.

To be clear,

I have over 58 BTC unpaid.
I am owed at least a month of ARS being operation before it is closed.

Couldn't we say the same about your pool?  We were/are owed and have btc unpaid.  It sucks being on the other side of the fence, doesn't it?