[ANN] [banned mixer] - Bitcoin Mixer | BTC Tumbler | Anonymous | NO LOGS | NO JS

[CryptSafe]

You're down again, both versions - with clearnet showing the error "SSL handshake failed". Maybe you should first find reliable hosting + properly configure everything necessary and only then try to deal with this kind of business

Hello, I know. Unforeseen events are normal when you start something. I am working on the web to improve the service and some parts will be unstable some days. Don't worry, it will be online again soon. Be patient please. Thanks.

It is nice knowing you are working and trying to fix up things properly to avert unforseen circumstances which are not a good thing. Atleast this shows how serious you are in delivering Services to your clients.
Working on improvement is better than ignoring improvement just to cover up mistakes.

[1714232512]

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[1714232512]

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[n0nce]

NO JAVA - Thormixer works without JavaScript. No JavaScript = No Problems.

Are you aware of the fact that Java is not an abbreviation for JavaScript? You seem to use the terms interchangeably. May make users mistrust your understanding of technology.

NO Cloudflare - We not using Cloudflare or any other cloud-based solutions. *Temporarily activated for technical reasons since July 2023.

Not a good look; breaking big promises so quickly. How fast will you break your other promises, then? What if you need to suddenly activate JavaScript 'for technical reasons'? Or if you 'technically' need to start storing logs?

SSL Encryption - No unencrypted traffic.

The latest version of SSL is deprecated for 8 years now. I really hope you are using at least TLS v1.2 in 2023. Also, this encryption goes out of the window if you use Cloudflare. Again raises questions about the level of understanding and / or attention to detail of the service operator.

Lastly, since you are a taint proclaiming service, I had to add you to my [Blacklist] of unreliable, 'taint proclaiming' Bitcoin services / exchanges. The reasons why, are posted in that thread.

[Thormixer]

Are you aware of the fact that Java is not an abbreviation for JavaScript? You seem to use the terms interchangeably. May make users mistrust your understanding of technology.

The term JavaScript appears 4 times in this Bitcointalk thread and 5 times on the web. Java just one. Thanks to your understanding of technology for correcting this typo.

Not a good look; breaking big promises so quickly. How fast will you break your other promises, then? What if you need to suddenly activate JavaScript 'for technical reasons'? Or if you 'technically' need to start storing logs?

I have not broken any promise, you have omitted my last post:

I am working on the web to improve the service and some parts will be unstable some days. Don't worry, it will be online again soon. Be patient please. Thanks.

and you have preferred to test the web when it was not operational and was undergoing maintenance. There is no JavaScript or logs on the web.

The latest version of SSL is deprecated for 8 years now.[/url] I really hope you are using at least TLS v1.2 in 2023. Also, this encryption goes out of the window if you use Cloudflare. Again raises questions about the level of understanding and / or attention to detail of the service operator.

Once again I don't know where you get that data from, do a certificate test before speaking.

SSL Report: www.[banned mixer]
Protocols
TLS 1.3   Yes
TLS 1.2   Yes

Lastly, since you are a taint proclaiming service, I had to add you to my Blacklist

First, it is a blacklist in your opinion, for other people it would be a whitelist so thanks for including me.

Your list is opaque. If you are going to include me in your Blacklist Whitelist for Scoring, you should include more mixers (much older) from this forum. But Why aren't they on your list if you already know them?  I guess all you wanted is a link to your thread to give you visibility. And I recommend you include in your opaque and unreliable list all the mixers that uses scoring. Until you do, your whitelist is worthless.

Next time, Please wait until a website is not under maintenance to analyze it, so as not to confuse users as you say.

This is a first one for me, honestly. Are you trying to imply that users from the US or any country in the EU are not allowed to use your platform?

No, but US and EU users should be aware of the laws of their countries, this text is just a reminder of how the panorama is.  Even so, you are right and I still have to modify it a bit, give me time.

Are we going to see a Bitcoin Mixer performing KYC in the future to ascertain if a person is not from the US or EU?  

Sure we are going to see things like that and more, but not here

Are you going to block such transactions on grounds that they originate from a gambling site?

No, your transactions will not be blocked.

It is nice knowing you are working and trying to fix up things properly to avert unforseen circumstances which are not a good thing. Atleast this shows how serious you are in delivering Services to your clients. Working on improvement is better than ignoring improvement just to cover up mistakes.

I'm glad you're back online and hope you also took some  time to get some things mentioned by the members above fixed as I think all suggestions was for the growth of your work.

Hello, thanks you guys for your support, it is true that we have been online for a month and that some problems have arisen that have been solved and I am still working to try to improve this service.

[Obari]

It is nice knowing you are working and trying to fix up things properly to avert unforseen circumstances which are not a good thing. Atleast this shows how serious you are in delivering Services to your clients. Working on improvement is better than ignoring improvement just to cover up mistakes.

I'm glad you're back online and hope you also took some  time to get some things mentioned by the members above fixed as I think all suggestions was for the growth of your work.

Hello, thanks you guys for your support, it is true that we have been online for a month and that some problems have arisen that have been solved and I am still working to try to improve this service.

I understand  that it haven't been easy but it isn't really nice that you guys are starting up with alot of issues and I think you should keep the thread active and also take your time to put yourself and when you're back, it will be best that you get some users to help test what you have to offer through testnets.

Welcome and you should also know that  criticism is onething you must receive especially  when  introducing something new and has to do with money, don't feel bad and I see you're doing well with answering the questions and I already see some new changes and it seems you guys also took out time to attend to almost all the complains listed and I love the improvements.
Kudos.

[n0nce]

The term JavaScript appears 4 times in this Bitcointalk thread and 5 times on the web. Java just one. Thanks to your understanding of technology for correcting this typo.

If it's a typo, why do you continue calling TLS (which you are indeed using), SSL? To me, it still seems you are mixing terms up, but I agree that this is a subjective opinion and I cannot prove it as a fact. It's just the most likely explanation for me.

Not a good look; breaking big promises so quickly. How fast will you break your other promises, then? What if you need to suddenly activate JavaScript 'for technical reasons'? Or if you 'technically' need to start storing logs?

I have not broken any promise, you have omitted my last post:

I am working on the web to improve the service and some parts will be unstable some days. Don't worry, it will be online again soon. Be patient please. Thanks.

Are 'unstable' and 'starting to utilize Cloudflare' the same thing to you? For me, this qualifies as breaking promises. Websites don't automatically fall back to Cloudflare when they get unstable, if it has not been actively installed and configured by the operator.
You could just as well take the whole webpage offline, fix your bugs and bring it back, all without setting up Cloudflare, which you yourself state is a privacy issue.

and you have preferred to test the web when it was not operational and was undergoing maintenance. There is no JavaScript or logs on the web.

Why is it not offline if it's not operational?

The latest version of SSL is deprecated for 8 years now.[/url] I really hope you are using at least TLS v1.2 in 2023. Also, this encryption goes out of the window if you use Cloudflare. Again raises questions about the level of understanding and / or attention to detail of the service operator.

Once again I don't know where you get that data from, do a certificate test before speaking.

Just quoting your own words:

SSL Encryption - No unencrypted traffic.

So this somewhat confirms my assumption that you're not typo'ing but using some terms interchangeably when they're in fact not really interchangeable. But this is all relatively unimportant to me; the important bit is the fungibility / 'UTXO scoring' issue.

Your list is opaque. If you are going to include me in your Blacklist Whitelist for Scoring, you should include more mixers (much older) from this forum. But Why aren't they on your list if you already know them?

It's not complete, that is true. I warmly welcome you to add more taint proclaiming services as a reply in that thread, so I can add them to OP.

I guess all you wanted is a link to your thread to give you visibility.

With all due respect, I am a humble poster. I think my threads already get lots of visibility; much more than I could ever have hoped for, and I am very grateful that other people get value out of what I post.

And I recommend you include in your opaque and unreliable list all the mixers that use scoring for more than 6 years. Until you do, your whitelist is worthless.

It is unreasonable to ask someone to maintain a complete list of such services; hence why I cannot feasibly make a whitelist (of fungibility promoters), but have to create a blacklist instead, that displays who actively pushes for BTC taint and against fungibility.

As it is a blacklist, I do find it useful as a first indicator for users who want to quickly check whether a service that they're considering using, has already been 'community-flagged' as a taint promoter. It does not guarantee that any website not on the list is 'safe', though, as stated in OP:

This is merely a blacklist, not a whitelist; exchanges not on this list aren't guaranteed to be 'safe and reliable'.

Like I wrote before, please feel free to add more services who openly state that they 'filter' or 'score' UTXOs based on blockchain analysis. This would benefit everyone.

[Thormixer]

BIBLE Nº 2

Hello again, I already said in the thread that I'm going to use cloudflare temporarily (only difference since launch and it's temporary). The site works perfectly, it doesn't keep logs and it doesn't use JavaScript. You send any bitcoins and it returns clean coins to you

You can use TOR if you prefer: Tor Mirror: http://amwnnncglaw27kfomeiszq4eltwkktnkdzjg6kbtjwb2w3zgysatjead.onion
Or Clearnet: https://www.[banned mixer]

/].

[n0nce]

Hello again, I am working on the web, but I have taken time to read your second Bible, although the first included some lies, and your list is incomplete and unbiased. I already said in the thread that I'm going to use cloudflare temporarily (only difference since launch and it's temporary) the reasons are not your business, that's all, no need to make up conspiracies. The site works perfectly, it doesn't keep logs and it doesn't use JavaScript. You send any bitcoins and it returns clean coins to you sorry if that bothers you.

Not sure that you understand the severity of the issue of casually 'temporarily using Cloudflare'.
Not using JavaScript or not keeping logs is pointless, if users' traffic, i.e. plaintext transaction information is literally decrypted and cached on Cloudflare servers. It threatens the whole concept of your service as a mixing site.

[Kauyaz]

Not sure that you understand the severity of the issue of casually 'temporarily using Cloudflare'.
Not using JavaScript or not keeping logs is pointless, if users' traffic, i.e. plaintext transaction information is literally decrypted and cached on Cloudflare servers. It threatens the whole concept of your service as a mixing site.

As I have been able to read on their website, they don't do the mix process on their server, its a plus point, since these data will not be available to any third party.

Well, there are no mixers that don't use Cloudflare or a third-party service like Incapsula, Cloudbric or DDOS-GUARD... In other words, any provider has access to the data that you mention.

Many mixers, "almost all" have been using cloudflare for years, and the others use third-party services such as DDOS-GUARD, which amounts to the same thing, since they perform the same function. In that case there would be no solution for what you propose.

As for Cloudflare, it has strict policies on the privacy of its users. In general, Cloudflare affirms that it respects the privacy of user data and does not sell or share personal information with third parties, and has demonstrated this on many occasions, including in media cases.

However, it is important to note that no online service can guarantee absolute data security, and this applies to cloudflare, Incapsula as well as Cloudbric or DDOS-GUARD. All of them must follow the applicable laws and regulations in the jurisdictions where they operate. In this case, the user is the one who decides what to do and what extra measures to take when using these services, which are all the same in my opinion.

[LoyceV]

Lastly, since you are a taint proclaiming service, I had to add you to my Blacklist

First, it is a blacklist in your opinion, for other people it would be a whitelist so thanks for including me.

This explains why you ignored my post:

The platform runs a scoring procedure for each incoming coin so to check its reliability and purchase it for its reserves. The service liaises with crypto stock exchanges and controls the money inflow around the clock – if the algorithm detects a shortfall it blasts notification messages to investors and quickly tops up the reserves. Coins with dark history are never let in.

A mixer that promotes the taint BS and tells you Bitcoin isn't fungible? That's a first the second after Wasabi!

Allow me to quote myself on the subject of "taint":

I've seen several posts lately from people willing to treat Bitcoin as non-fungible because they believe some coins are "tainted".
I'd say this is a severe threat to Bitcoin, and I wouldn't be surprised if governments use this because they can't stop Bitcoin in any other way. If people believe Bitcoin is "tainted", they won't accept it anymore. "We" should really inform people not to fall for this.
Nobody would reject a dollar bill because it has previously been used in a crime, despite the fact that 85 to 90% contains traces of cocaine. Claiming Bitcoin isn't fungible is just plain stupid.

You're attacking Bitcoin's fungibility while trying to use it to make your service look good. That's like misleading users who don't understand the basics of fungibility.

Hello again, I am working on the web, but I have taken time to read your second Bible, although the first included some lies, and your list is incomplete and unbiased. I already said in the thread that I'm going to use cloudflare temporarily (only difference since launch and it's temporary) the reasons are not your business, that's all, no need to make up conspiracies.

The way a service responds to criticism tells you a lot about how they operate. In your case, it doesn't look good.

As for Cloudflare, it has strict policies on the privacy of its users.

That's cute. Here's the opinion of Bitcointalk's Administrator:

a man-in-the-middle in your HTTPS

Cloudflare is very probably an NSA honeypot

[Kauyaz]

I have to break a lance in favor of these guys since I see your interventions in this thread a bit unfair. They didn't ignore your post, as I see they replied to you and the user n0nce, who refer to the same thread that he owns. So I assume you both have similar personal interests. The scoring system will seem bad to you, but not to other users, since you deliver any bitcoin from any source and in exchange you receive a clean one with which you will not have problems anywhere. I understand that this bothers you, but it is not fooling anyone as you try to make it appear.

You're attacking Bitcoin's fungibility while trying to use it to make your service look good. That's like misleading users who don't understand the basics of fungibility.

Here it is blatantly noticeable that it is you who is trying to confuse users about the service. Users receive clean bitcoins with no Dark history, which is what the users want. That is not aligned with your way of thinking. I understand that this is what bothers you, but it is not something negative in my opinion, quite the opposite.

After reviewing this list and its comments, I have to say it seems very strange to me that this is the first mixer that you include. Missing from that list are many services that uses the same system.

And the most important thing is that I think you tries to make everyone believe that selecting coins is bad for users security and it is not true.

The way a service responds to criticism tells you a lot about how they operate. In your case, it doesn't look good.

The answers they have given to all users seem correct to me, they have been informative and polite throughout, Except for the comments of user n0nce who blatantly has a strange and intriguing interest in this thread. and I have to say that reading the answer he has given you has been fun and not annoying.

Also, I see that you repeat the same thing over and over again in your post, although they have already answered you regarding how it works. What inclines me to think that you have a hidden interest in harming this particular service.
I see that you are a legendary member, I understand that post farming is something natural in you.

I could not omit the fact that both you and the user n0nce participate in marketing campaigns for other services similar to this one, it can be seen in your signatures. And right now, you have the same advertising active in your firm. I want to say that you are users who are paid to make positive reviews and I suppose also negative ones, that would solve why there is no mixer except this one on your list.

[n0nce]

The scoring system will seem bad to you, but not to other users, since you deliver any bitcoin from any source and in exchange you receive a clean one ^{[emphasis mine]} with which you will not have problems anywhere.

That's neither the idea of mixing (1), nor is it how this mixer operates (2).

(1) Mixing usually refers to exchanging 'coins' (UTXOs.. let's call them coins) for other coins that are not linked to the ones you put into the mixer. A common use case for this: a certain Bitcoin transaction links a coin to your identity, e.g. by getting paid for a signature campaign. Both the sender (campaign manager) as well as potentially other users (in case that a public spreadsheet exists or people apply publicly with a Bitcoin address) now know this coin belongs to a certain forum user. By mixing this coin, someone can exchange this 'linked' coin for another, (or multiple smaller) unrelated coins of similar total value.

A mixer's job is not to exchange 'dirty' coins for 'clean' coins, at least if we assume that these terms refer to a coin (not) having been used for illegal activities.

(2) This mixer does absolutely not take 'Bitcoin from any source' like you claim, and that's the big issue here. It subjectively discriminates between coins and reserves the right to reject you from mixing. This makes them an unreliable business partner at the very least.

Here it is blatantly noticeable that it is you who is trying to confuse users about the service. Users receive clean bitcoins with no Dark history, which is what the users want.

Again, that's not what Thormixer aims to do - in fact, they deny you access to the service if your coins have a 'dark history' - whatever that even means, since there is no definition of this, anywhere.

After reviewing this list and its comments, I have to say it seems very strange to me that this is the first mixer that you include. Missing from that list are many services that uses the same system and are already widely known as mixer_money, webmixer, mixy, Mixerdream, Mixtura and many more.

Then, please do help me make the list more complete. Add those mixers along with a link to the source (ToS, FAQ, anything official) proving that they don't accept all coins equally, as a reply. I will check and add them to OP.

And the most important thing is that I think you tries to make everyone believe that selecting coins is bad for users security and it is not true.

Sorry, strawman. We claim it's bad for privacy, not for security. I hope it's easy to understand why we claim that. If not, read the starting post of [Blacklist] of unreliable, 'taint proclaiming' Bitcoin services / exchanges again.

I could not omit the fact that both you and the user n0nce participate in marketing campaigns for other services similar to this one, it can be seen in your signatures.

I am not advertising for a mixer right now, but even if I would, I'd only advertise / promote ones that align with the principles of Bitcoin and my own privacy standards.
There is no particular reason I 'picked out' Thormixer, it just popped up in this board when I visited it again after a while.
You can believe me or not; facts are facts though and in this case, it is a fact that Thormixer's policies don't align with Bitcoin core values.

I want to say that you are users who are paid to make positive reviews and I suppose also negative ones, that would solve why there is no mixer except this one on your list.

That is a bold assumption and absolutely incorrect. Actually, it's defamation.

I have never done any paid (positive or negative) review of anything. Instead, so far I did 2 reviews of devices that I paid full price for, out of my own pocket. I also chose not to provide an affiliate code, to make my reviews and recommendations completely unbiased.

I have sincerely searched your comments and you are not attacking with the arguments that you have used here any of the other mixers that use the exact same system that you are complaining about. Which leads me to think once again that I shouldn't trust your selective criteria since there are other factors involved.

Another (much more likely, don't you think?) explanation: people have limited time in a day and as we are not paid by anyone to review all Bitcoin services in existence, we can only focus on one or two things at a time, have a thorough look at them and move on.
Not that I need to prove this to anyone, but just to show that we already criticized other products before:

• Wasabi Wallet: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5405325.0
• Ledger Nano X: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5358741.0
• Ledger Nano S: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5370521.0
• Ledger Nano S Plus: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5376279.0
• ColdCard: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5033058.msg57911569#msg57911569
• Lightning Labs / LND: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5386437.0

[Kauyaz]

The scoring system will seem bad to you, but not to other users, since you deliver any bitcoin from any source and in exchange you receive a clean one ^{[emphasis mine]} with which you will not have problems anywhere.

That's neither the idea of mixing (1), nor is it how this mixer operates (2).

(1) Mixing usually refers to exchanging 'coins' (UTXOs.. let's call them coins) for other coins that are not linked to the ones you put into the mixer. A common use case for this: a certain Bitcoin transaction links a coin to your identity, e.g. by getting paid for a signature campaign. Both the sender (campaign manager) as well as potentially other users (in case that a public spreadsheet exists or people apply publicly with a Bitcoin address) now know this coin belongs to a certain forum user. By mixing this coin, someone can exchange this 'linked' coin for another, (or multiple smaller) unrelated coins of similar total value.

A mixer's job is not to exchange 'dirty' coins for 'clean' coins, at least if we assume that these terms refer to a coin (not) having been used for illegal activities.

Ok And that's how this mixer works and all the ones I named above, don't try to confuse users. What bothers you is coins with dark history being removed. I don't think you are interested in mixing bitcoins, I think you are interested in farming post like the previous user. You are also trying to confuse the users and it seems very serious to me that you are trying to make them believe that it is a technical or privacy problem when in reality it is your personal matter.

(2) This mixer does absolutely not take 'Bitcoin from any source' like you claim, and that's the big issue here. It subjectively discriminates between coins and reserves the right to reject you from mixing.

Now I have to say that it is true that you are lying and it is beginning to be repetitive. You don't know what the source of this mixer's coins is, and you don't know how the Scoring system you mention works, you just have a slight idea and are making assumptions. I think you have felt bad that your list is known to be impartial and that you omit to include other services that you know well and use this same system for years.

You confuse morality with a security or privacy issue. If you don't like something, don't use it, but don't tell others it's a problem just because you don't like it.

By the way I don't see any of the mixers mentioned yet in your list. Do you have time to spam here but I understand that making your list truthful is secondary to you. And I sincerely believe that you are already spamming this thread. Although after seeing your history of comments I see that it is something you do normally.

[LoyceV]

Users receive clean bitcoins with no Dark history

Says who? There is no consensus about what "clean" or "dirty" means. There are companies that sell this idea for a profit, and it's in their interest to convince people like you that their services have value. They don't even share their criteria. What if you discover after accepting it that a "clean" coin was used for bad things nobody knew about at the time? You can never be absolutely sure what happened in the past.
The "taint" BS is an attack on Bitcoin's fungibility, which means any Bitcoin user should oppose this as it's a threat to everything Bitcoin stands for. Bitcoin can't exist if some coins are worth less than others.
Start analyzing the history of dollar bills, and you'll find cocaine on almost all of them. Try to refuse them at a bank, and demand clean bills. See what happens.

[Thormixer]

Lastly, since you are a taint proclaiming service, I had to add you to my Blacklist of unreliable, 'taint proclaiming' Bitcoin services / exchanges.

A mixer's job is not to exchange 'dirty' coins for 'clean' coins, at least if we assume that these terms refer to a coin (not) having been used for illegal activities.

Your point of view about Bitcoin's fungibility is interesting, I cannot deny that it seems a necessity for you and other users. I will definitely go through your thread to give my opinion when I have time.

You have made me think of an option that fits what you have transmitted to me, thank you for this. And maybe build something without a scoring system as an option for all those users who want to use it. I cannot deny that many other users prefer the scoring system, but I think it would be a good idea to implement what you mention as an option and let each user decide.

[nioctib_100]

Lastly, since you are a taint proclaiming service, I had to add you to my Blacklist of unreliable, 'taint proclaiming' Bitcoin services / exchanges.

A mixer's job is not to exchange 'dirty' coins for 'clean' coins, at least if we assume that these terms refer to a coin (not) having been used for illegal activities.

Your point of view about Bitcoin's fungibility is interesting, I cannot deny that it seems a necessity for you and other users. I will definitely go through your thread to give my opinion when I have time.

You have made me think of an option that fits what you have transmitted to me, thank you for this. And maybe build something without a scoring system as an option for all those users who want to use it. I cannot deny that many other users prefer the scoring system, but I think it would be a good idea to implement what you mention as an option and let each user decide.

As long as it's stated clearly enough for any curious user to see, I personally think there's value in having some mixers that "clean" coins while having others that don't. It should be up to the user to choose — sure it's probably 100% best for privacy if the mixer is well known and doesn't "clean" coins, but there are certainly situations where the user 100% needs to not receive his own coins back.

I think we can all agree that it doesn't matter where a Bitcoin was before it was in your wallet, but your employer or government certainly might not understand that yet, and it's unfortunate, but sometimes you have to play in the bounds of the rules in which you live. As long as it's made clear, I think there's no huge need to change that feature of Thormixer.

[dkbit98]

I see that you are a legendary member, I understand that post farming is something natural in you.

I don't think you are interested in mixing bitcoins, I think you are interested in farming post like the previous user. You are also trying to confuse the users and it seems very serious to me that you are trying to make them believe that it is a technical or privacy problem when in reality it is your personal matter.

I think we have a new ''expert'' here who knows everything about account farming and mixing bitcoin  
That is probably the reason why he is a newbie account registered in forum few months ago and his only activity was in Mixing Services section.
Nobody in the right mind (except you) will defend and trust new mixer that showed up recently...but I understand that being an alt-account is something natural in you.

If you don't like something, don't use it, but don't tell others it's a problem just because you don't like it.

Let me give you some your own medicine.
If you don't like other people posts about this subject simple don't read them and don't comment on them  

As long as it's stated clearly enough for any curious user to see, I personally think there's value in having some mixers that "clean" coins while having others that don't. It should be up to the user to choose — sure it's probably 100% best for privacy if the mixer is well known and doesn't "clean" coins, but there are certainly situations where the user 100% needs to not receive his own coins back.

Problem is that there is no universal standard for ''clean'' coins.
Your version of clean, might not be the same as my version of clean, and both of them might not be the same as government version of clean coins.

[LoyceV]

I think we can all agree that it doesn't matter where a Bitcoin was before it was in your wallet, but your employer or government certainly might not understand that yet, and it's unfortunate, but sometimes you have to play in the bounds of the rules in which you live.

What makes you think your government will think Bitcoins coming from a mixer are better than your own Bitcoins?

Problem is that there is no universal standard for ''clean'' coins.

That's because it's impossible.

[CryptoHFs]

I think we can all agree that it doesn't matter where a Bitcoin was before it was in your wallet, but your employer or government certainly might not understand that yet, and it's unfortunate, but sometimes you have to play in the bounds of the rules in which you live.

What makes you think your government will think Bitcoins coming from a mixer are better than your own Bitcoins?

Problem is that there is no universal standard for ''clean'' coins.

That's because it's impossible.

Is there a real benefit for mixers?
There is not I guess because it's already known that you had this balance before and unless you proof it's gone you would still pay taxes for it.

I think that mixers is only good for other reasons but not the so promoted idea of tax runaway.

[CYBER_COWBOY]

Hello and good luck with your service.

But what does this really mean? I understand I giving you coins and you giving me another coins back with a fee of 4%.
But why would somebody want to mix their bitcoins? What if the coins I get is in bad standing? How can you see that you only accepting "clean" coins and not "bad" coins?
The only coins I own is coins I bought myself from an P2P exchange. Should I mix them? And if yes, why? It only giving me less BTC. Why is your BTC better then mine?
I paid for my coins with money I earned myself. How did you get your coins?

I understand that people that have stole BTC don't want to show that this BTC was going to a wallet they can be traced to, but for what other reasons? and how can I be sure I got "clean" BTC?
I am sure its a lot of other reasons, I don't try to be negative, but I don't really understand this service. My feeling is that you buying an imagine that your coins now is clean and fresh and not a real service.
But I'm sure I'm wrong, and that's why I'm asking so I can understand.

Don't misunderstand me, I am all for privacy. I am just asking what do I actually get here and how can I be so sure I get what I pay for and not just an imagine and less BTC?

[blue Snow]

But why would somebody want to mix their bitcoins?

there are various reasons why people want to mix their Bitcoin, but the average I know, they mix their Bitcoin just to hide their wealth. maybe the country is very strict toward the people for their wealth so that situation they won't government know what they have.

What if the coins I get is in bad standing?

There is a risk in every action, nothing is perfect. Maybe this imperfection is material for evaluation next, as I know it's not easy to make it clear in what customers want.