[CFNP] Mixin Safe - Decentralized Bitcoin Custody Solutions | Review Campaign

[NotATether]

Bitcointalk username: NotATether

(This review has been prepared a few days ago. It covers the Android app in landscape and portrait mode, funding the multisig wallet from Electrum.)

Review of Mixin Safe Wallet Messenger

TL;DR What is this program? It doubles as a messaging program and a cryptocurrency wallet that is supposed to make it easier for you to send crypto to contacts in your phonebook, assuming they also have Mixin Safe installed. This leads me to believe that this app wants to achieve mass adoption.

I am going to specifically cover the Android app. (Read below about PC and iOS apps.) This is going to be more comprehensive than most of my other reviews due to the sheer size of the program, nevertheless, let's get this under way.

Initialization

First of all, I could not install this on my iPhone as it was (barely!) too old. I heard stories of people getting their phones bricked after upgrading to a really later iOS so that's a no-thanks from me. So I borrowed an Android phone for this demonstration. I'm assuming the interface would be like-for-like with the Android build anyway.

This is the homepage which you can get to after you type in your phone number and stuff. Well, you might ask: "Why must I need a phone number to use a crypto wallet?" I can think of two possible reasons:

• It could be a semi-custodial wallet so it needs some way to identify users (they did say they are using a 2-of-3 multisig and hold one of the keys)
• It could be for the benefit of identifying to your contacts who is using the app so that they can send cryptocurrency to you

(Apparently, in retrospect, it could also be used for authentication too.)

All in all though, mandatory phone verification was actually something I expected to see only in exchange apps, so that was pretty weird.

Yes, images are blurry - it's not like I was taking these photos from an action camera, but you can just about see enough of the user interface and text to figure out that this is a) the homepage, and b) I have been immediately sent 4 messages by "Team Mixin" after creating the account. Side note though: Why send four messages, when you could include most of that information in one message, with a WWW link (that is not the homepage) where I can read more information?  That would be a better design.

Interface

As you can see in this image, there are three main buttons at the bottom. The one on the left is where you access your wallet - when you first open the app, there is no wallet created, so it nags you to create a wallet.

Here is a screenshot of the create wallet process since I forgot to take a photo of it on the camera:

As you can see, your wallet is not secured by a password or a seed phrase. Instead, it is using a PIN that is sent through Throttled Identity Protocol. (What the hell is Throttled Identity Protocol you ask? Read Appendix A.)

Anyway, the important part is to get an internet connection while you do this because it's going to connect with some servers during the process (using TLS and key hashing I hope).

Then you are asked to enter a PIN which will be your wallet password (where the phone number is your username I guess). But before you enter a dummy PIN, the app will actually stop you from using insecure PINs:

Code:

    private fun validatePin(): Boolean {
        val pin = binding.pin.code()
        if (pin == "123456") {
            toast(R.string.wallet_password_unsafe)
            return false
        }

        val numKind = arrayListOf<Char>()
        pin.forEach {
            if (!numKind.contains(it)) {
                numKind.add(it)
            }
        }
        if (numKind.size <= 2) {
            toast(R.string.wallet_password_unsafe)
            return false
        }

        return true
    }

(Ah yes, how I love having my Java skills in a time like this.)

So basically, you can't use the passwords:

"123456"
Any password that has only one or two digits, such as "111111" or "010101".

However according to this, I advise the developer to blacklist

- consecutive sequences of numbers (not just 123456, but also something like 234567)
- reversed number sequences (i.e. 654321)

In general, PINs are much less secure than passwords because the creative PINs of a particular length are much less than the creative ASCII passwords of an equivalent length. Developer should also add password support.

You must enter the PIN four times because Mixin really doesn't want you to forget the PIN. But I don't really find that effective, because all those entries are happening at one point in time. It is better to copy Telegram in this regard which displays a "Do you still remember your password?" notification where you can enter the password while logged in to see if you still remember it - and if not, change it immediately.

Here is a very uneventful screen while we wait for the TIP keys to be created from the passcode:

Periodically, you will be asked to enter this PIN at seemingly random times. Must be a protocol thing (See Appendix A).

Wallet

Now that we have created a Mixin wallet, we can access our assets and see the almost 40 OG coins and shitcoins listed in your portfolio!

(Click to expand images)

Making the list:

• Bitcoin
• Ethereum
• Litecoin
• BOTH BNB tokens
• Bitcoin Cash
• Monero
• Craig Wrong's coin (who shall not be named)
• Dash
• ZCash
• Solana
• Kusama (whatever that is)
• ETH Classic
• Decred
• Avalanche
• Cosmos
• Horizen
• Aptos (what?)
• Arweave (what?)
• Polkadot
• Filecoin
• Namecoin
• NEAR protocol
• Toncoin (read carefully: Toncoin not Tron)
• Tezos
• EOS
• Polygon (aka MATIC)
• XRP
• Mobilecoin (whatever that is)
• Akash Network (god these coins have weird names)
• Stellar Lumens
• Algorand
• Tron
• Dogecoin (says something about DOGE's usefulness being placed so down the list)
• Ravencoin
• Handshake (never heard of it)
• Siacoin (see above)
• Nervos CKByte (see above)

In addition, it supports most token chains such as ERC20, BEP20, BEP-2 (Binance is so messed up for having two different yet similarly sounding chains), TRC-20, TRC-10. Layer 2 networks such as Liquid, Lightning, etc. are not supported.

Coin receive addresses are generated when you click on the coin for the first time.

(Honestly I think half of these coins would be called securities by Gary Gensler and the other half his SEC agency would have no clue what to call them  )

You can send or receive coins from each address, but you have to add the address into the app in order to use it, so it may not be ideal if your addresses mainly consist of those from Coinpayments, Coinbase Commerce, BitPay, and exchange deposit addresses.

(Memo is a blockchain thing and is only required for such obscure coins like EOS and Stellar and can be safely turned off for almost everything else).

You can also send coins to other Mixin contacts, and hide coins that you will never use. For most people reading this, that's usually the bottom 90% of this list.

Transactions

Originally, I did not have this section included, but sending and receiving a transaction is required so here it goes.

Receiving transactions in particular is straightforward. There's a giant modal with address and QR code for each coin which you can just copy or send to another device to make a transaction. I have made a $30 transaction in BTC inside debbe87a68398075a2be41eb109f49bfc741c4e355f7bbbe42836d7f96dee05a to address bc1qdltcmdt7xlpm4c0p2gku9rdl74vthf5cjm8q24 (I don't know if you can verify addresses as being from Mixin, but here we go:)

I have two transactions listed here, because one is the RBF of another, and both are displayed here for some reason. Nevertheless, you can see that the more recent transaction has already been included in a block, while the older one should fall off over time as the blockchain nodes become full.

Sending coins is a bit of a hassle though, and actually has me a bit pissed (after all, you don't always deposit $30 to test a service). You are required to enter your PIN to add an address - not just when you are sending money. Why? Also, I got (supposedly) locked out for 24 hours trying to add an address with a label "Mr. X", despite remembering my PIN and entering it correctly. Or at least that's what the app claims happened, because after removing all the special characters and numbers/uppercase letters from the label, I was able to successfully add an address just a few minutes later. Anyways, its very inconsistent.

The actual error message says something like: "You will be locked out for 24 hours. 5 tries remaining" which I interpreted as being locked out now and after 5 more tries you get permanently locked out like a phone. Anyway, quite inaccurate message.

So now finally I can send the coins back to my address. But there is a massive, fixed 0.0004BTC "withdrawal fee" for bitcoin that feels more like tax (the 0.004BTC was not part of the measly 21 sats/vbyte transaction fee) and makes Ethereum look cheap by comparison (again, why? BRC20 congestion isn't as bad anymore). How come fees cannot be customized if this is a semi-custodial wallet?

Full documentation of the circus that is the current receiving process:

QR Scanner

Going back to the main menu, the button in the middle is for scanning QR codes. These could be addresses, transaction invoices, or things like logging in to the desktop client.

(Unfortunately, I forgot to link up the app with a desktop wallet, so that is why I could not review the desktop wallet. Sorry!)

Speaking of which, the desktop app, before you scan its code, is just a blank page with a QR code on it. I think, if its practical, there should be a second box below the QR code, displaying the contents of the QR code for you to type into the mobile app. That way, it can function on phones that have the camera disabled for security reasons (Edward Snowden), and possibly in the future, even hardware wallets that pick up on the protocol. (perhaps place a checksum at the end just like with bitcoin addresses). More on this below.

It seems that there is no support for linking hardware wallets with this app, which I think is a shame, because if would've been fantastic for hardware wallet holders to be able to use their devices along side an open-source multi-currency wallet.

"Bots"

For some reason, this is the name of the rightmost button on the main menu. It looks like this:

So this looks like we got ourselves the first two buttons (why?), a camera, and what is presumably a circle for each contact (for me, not wanting to add any contacts, I just see the circle for "Team Mixin").

I'm going to assume that the camera is for taking pictures to send to contacts? Because it really doesn't have a use for the wallet when the QR scanner exists.

Anyway, this is what you get when you open a contact:

And here is me adding random contacts and group chats (just to show that these features work as intended):

By the way, if you uninstall the app, it saves the wallet and stuff so that's nice. It also gives you the option to restore chat history from the local device or another device.

Full contents messages from "Team Mixin":

Welcome to Mixin Messenger,

This is the support bot, and ready to help whenever you need it. Some quick features list:

1. Everything, including text, audio, photo, and so on, is end-to-end encrypted with Signal protocol.
2. Mixin Messenger allows you to make end-to-end encrypted group audio call with up to 16 people.
3. The built-in wallet makes it easier to transfer many popular cryptocurrencies with your contacts.

Best,
Team Mixin

Mixin Messenger's Guidelines

Welcome to use Mixin Messenger and enjoy end-to-end encrypted chat featuring a full-cryptocurrency wallet.

Secure: decentralized wallet
Instant: Confirm finality less than 1 second
Free: No transfer fees
Easy to use: manage assets with a 6-digit pin, making transfers by contacts
Diverse: Support 36 public chains such as BTC, EOS, ETH, XMR, and more than 100,000 tokens.

Help documents

How to use Bots?
Please read How to use Bots on Mixin Messenger?
How to deposit?
Please read How to deposit?
How to use credit cards to buy USDT, USDC, and DAI?
You could add Mixin Wallet
How to trade cryptos?
Several third-party bots provide trading services, such as MixSwap (similer to 1inch), 4swap (similar to Uniswap), or ExinOne (connects with Binance and Huobi exchange, working as an intermediary agent).
Find people to talk with?
Welcome to join supergroups such as Mixin English, FOX.ONE English.
Mixin Network's public data
Please add Mixin Data and tap the bot icon to check.
More useful bots
Please add Mixin Bots that collects the frequently used app on Mixin Messenger.
Need help?
Please leave a message to Team Mixin, and the support team will help you.

It turns out the other two messages are duplicates of the first two messages quoted here, so they will not be reposted again.

Speaking of which, with all these services, I wonder how Mixin makes money?

Profile and Settings

One more time, lets go back to the main menu, and this time click on the top-right avatar. There, you can see your profile, with options to add a contact or start a new group chat (as well as to receive money by sharing a Mixin QR code).

Now when you click on the gear, you get taken to the settings page. Here are a bunch of settings which I think you will find self-explanatory:

(Click to expand images)

Multisig

Let's be honest, I expected the 2-of-3 multisignature to be: 2 keys held by the user and 1 by Mixin - trustedcoin does something like that for Electrum. (After all, you can't view private keys or seeds yourself). Nowhere in the app did I see any information about creating a multisig or using it in any capacity, which left me kind of disappointed as multisig was one of the things that was advertised on the website. Although later I did get a message from the developer which read that the multisig is actually used internally by Mixin servers when you send a transaction - so that's something, but it doesn't feel like a multisig in the sense that I have multiple devices and signatures hooked up to the wallet. An attacker can still wipe you out if they have your PIN.

Certainly, in a single-user wallet, I am not going to be adding people as co-signers for any kind of multisig wallet anyway. But the emergency recover feature looks cool - it's worth noting that I myself don't have a use case for it - though I have fears this might be abused like a password reset.

Some other people here are downloading multisig / auth apps for this purpose, but I decided not to go down that route. After all, if you want to distribute some of the keys to other wallets, it would be more economical to support the hardware and software wallet integrations instead. Maybe the desktop app supports it (I don't know), but Android doesn't seem to support it.

Edit: It seems that multisig is only available on desktop / web.

Verdict, and Thoughts

I cannot see myself using this wallet for BTC. But maybe the other coins have lower fees so I don't know. It certainly looks more reputable than some of the other wallets out there (Atomic FTW!). The procedure for adding addresses is cumbersome and downright annoying at times, there is no fee customizer (I have no idea why they are taking 0.004BTC if it's not for a transaction fee - If they are trying to do the TrustedCoin business model then that is way too much)

And above all there's no reason to have a mobile-only app when you can make the desktop app support mobile phone login with phone numbers of any SIM card in a telephone. It's not like the app is using the secure device storage for storing private keys anyway. And even if it is, AES-256-CBC is more than a match for storing the local private key.

I never store cryptocurrency on mobile phones for any reason, so I'd regard this as an important issue. But when we ignore the chatting features, camera, messaging, the whole bot ecosystem, etc., this is a solid wallet (again, with the exception of the "withdrawal fee") being used and protected by the decentralized TIP protocol. We just need assurances & proof that the node software being used for TIP cannot be compromised - something more than one crypto hacker would like to do.

And in the end, I think this is exactly what's needed - a wallet. Support for hardware wallets and Layer 2 networks would definitely help.

That is why I don't think it's a good idea to leave the Windows/Mac/Linux desktop application as a dud, it should be useful out of the box without the need for a mobile app. (Just TIP phone number log-in plus PIN and you should be all set.) Mass adoption can only happen when you facilitate it.

Appendix A: Throttled Identity Protocol (TIP)

I checked out the website and found that this solution is developed by none other than our resident Mixin boss, so I'll let the page do most of the talking.

TL;DR - using custom authentication servers, users can give a service provider something like an email address or some other unique identification for themselves, set a password, which is used with the username in a bunch of HMAC hashing to generate one of the parts of a multisignature key (m-of-n). Only after m of these are generated (which could be exact duplicates I guess??) can you create a signature that doubles as an "authentication success token" which is just a bunch of bytes you can use to derive a private key, a seed phrase, etc. from.

Throttled Identity Protocol
Throttled Identity Protocol (TIP) is a decentralized key derivation protocol, which allows people to obtain a strong secret key through a very simple passphrase, e.g. a six-digit PIN.
Mission and Overview
Along with the rising of Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies, the saying "not your keys, not your coins" has become well-known. That's true, very true and definitely true, that's the right and freedom Bitcoin has given people. Whoever can access the key can move the money, and nobody without the key is able to do that.
That said it's better to manage your own Bitcoin private key than let your coins lie in some centralized exchanges. However, it's admitted that key management requires superior skills, which most people lack. And the result is people who own their keys lose the coins permanently due to various accidents, and those who opened a Coinbase account years ago can still get back their assets easily.
The embarrassing result doesn't prove the security of centralized exchanges, yet exposes the drawbacks of key management. The key grants people the right to truly own their properties, but people lose money due to poor key management skills. People should not be blamed for that, it's the problem of the key itself.
Bitcoin gives people the right and freedom to own their properties, and people deserve the convenience to manage their keys. Current private key or mnemonic phrase designs are over-complicated for people to keep properly. Instead of fearing the corruption of centralized financial institutions, people become slaves of the private key.
It's what TIP strives to do. Let people truly own their coins with a six-digit PIN. This decentralized PIN is easy to remember for any person, doesn't require any special skills or hardware, and people can manage their coins with more confidence than ever.
Protocol Design
TIP involves three independent parties to make the protocol work. A decentralized signer network authenticates signing requests from the user, and throttles malicious attempts; A trusted account manager serves the user an identity seed, which typically authenticates the user by email or phone verification code; The user remembers a PIN and combines the identity seed from the account manager, then makes independent requests to enough signer network nodes, and finally derives their secret key.

Decentralized Network Setup
The decentralized signer network is launched cooperatively by many different entities. Specifically, those entities gather and reach a consensus to run some node software, those nodes interactively run a distributed key generation protocol. For TIP, the DKG is threshold Boneh-Lynn-Shacham (BLS) signatures.
Assuming n entities agree to launch the network, they generate an asymmetric key pair respectively and configure their node software to include all the entities' public keys in a deterministic order. Then they boot the nodes to run a t-of-n (where t=n * 2 / 3 + 1) DKG protocol to set up a collective public key P and private key shares si respectively.
After the DKG protocol finishes, all entities should share the public key P to ensure they hold the same one, keep their private key shares si cautiously, and should make professional backups.
Finally, all entities should boot their node software to accept throttled signing requests from users. And again, they should safeguard the node servers and defend against all malicious attacks.
This repository includes an implementation of the signer node software, for instructions please see the signer directory.
Throttled Secret Derivation
The network announces the configuration and signers list to the public or potential users and waits for signing requests. Each signer should throttle the requests based on the same restrictions.
        

• Identity. This is the base factor for all restrictions, the identity should be a valid BLS public key, and a user should use the same identity for all signers. The signer checks the request and verifies the request signature against the public key, and the signer must reduce the request quota of this identity for any invalid signature.
            
• Ephemeral. This parameter is a different random value for each signer but should remain unchanged for the same signer during the ephemeral grace period. If the ephemeral changes during the grace period, the signer must reduce the ephemeral requests quota of this identity.
            
• Nonce. For each signing request, the user should increase the nonce during the ephemeral grace period. If the nonce is invalid during the grace period, the signer must reduce the ephemeral requests quota of this identity.
          

After the signing request passes all throttle checks, the signer responds back a part of the t-of-n threshold BLS signature by signing the identity. Whenever the user collects t valid partials, they can recover the final collective signature and verify it with the collective public key.
The final collective signature is the seed to the secret key of the user. Then it's up to the user to use different algorithms to generate their private key for Bitcoin or other usages. It doesn't need any further requests to use this secret key, and in case of a loss, the user can recover it by making the same requests.
For details of the throttle restrictions, please see the keeper directory.
Threshold Identity Generation
The mission of TIP network is to let people truly own their coins by only remembering a 6-digit PIN, so they should not have the duty to store identity, ephemeral or nonce. They are capable of achieving this goal through the threshold identity generation process with the help from the trusted account manager.
        

• User authenticates themself with a trusted account manager through email or phone verification code, and the manager responds with the identity seed Si.
            
• User chooses a very slow hash function Hs, e.g. argon2id, and generates the identity I=Hs(PIN || Si).
            
• User generates a random ephemeral seed Se, and stores the seed on its device securely.
            
• For each signer i in the network with public key Pi, user generates the ephemeral ei=Hs(I || Se || Pi).
            
• User sends signing requests (I, ei, nonce, grace) to each signer i and gathers enough partial signatures, then recover the final collective signature.
            
• User must repeat the process every a while to refresh the ephemeral grace period.

The identity seed should prohibit all impersonation, the on-device random ephemeral seed should prevent the account manager collude with some signer, and the ephemeral grace period allows the user to recover its secret key when the device is lost.
Furthermore, the user can make their threshold identity generation more secure by cooperating with another user to combine their identity to increase the entropy especially when the account manager manages lots of identities.
And finally, the user can just back up his seeds like any traditional key management process, and this backup is considered more secure against loss or theft.
Network Evolution
Once the decentralized signer network is launched, its signers should remain constant, no new entity is permitted to join the signers or replace an old signer because the DKG protocol remains valid only when all shares remain unchanged. But people need the network to become stronger, and that requires more entities to join the network. So TIP allows network evolution.
Whenever a new entity is accepted to the network, either replacing an old signer or joining as a new one, an evolution happens. Indeed, an evolution starts a fresh DKG protocol in the same process as the previous evolution, but with different signers, thus resulting in absolutely different shares for each signer. It's noted that an entity leaving the network doesn't result in any evolution, because the remaining shares can still serve requests.
In a new evolution, all signers should reference the number and the hash of the signer list from the previous evolution. After a new evolution starts, the previous evolution still works. For each signer in the new evolution, if it is a signer of the previous evolution, it must maintain its availability to serve signing requests to the previous evolution, otherwise it should be punished.
Any user requests for the throttled secret derivation should include the evolution number to get the correct signature. And in any case of network changes, the user is assured of their key security due to various backups discussed in previous sections.
Incentive and Punishment
The code doesn't include any incentive or punishment for the entities running the signer node software. It's up to their consensus on their mission, either to serve their customers a better user experience, or charge a small key signing request fee, or they could make some tokens to do community development.
Security
All the cryptography libraries used in this repository are being developed and used by industry-leading institutions, notably the drand project and its league of entropy that includes Cloudflare, EPFL, Kudelski Security, Protocol Labs, Celo, UCL, and UIUC.
The code has been audited by Certik, and the audit report can be found at https://github.com/MixinNetwork/audits.
Contribution
The project doesn't accept feature requests and welcomes all security improvement contributions. Shall you find any security issues, please email security@mixin.one before any public disclosures or pull requests.
The core team highly values the contributions and provides at most a $100K bounty for any vulnerability report according to the severity.
Code and License
The TIP implementation https://github.com/MixinNetwork/tip is released under Apache 2.0 license.

Appendix B: Mixin Safe Web Wallet

Today on 2023-07-25, I decided to link my mobile wallet with the web wallet.

Things went predictably well enough at first:

OK, so as you can see, the integration had succeeded, and I was able to access the web interface, which looks like this:

Not bad, actually. Good user interface.

So I went to create a multisig Safe that everyone was talking about. Now the only options so far are Mornin Key, Ledger, and Bitcoin Core. As I do not own a Ledger and was unwilling to fiddle around with more apps on the phone, I just chose Bitcoin Core as I happen to have a node running. So after following the instructions in the Bitcoin Core guide:

I was baffled with the last screen, which asked me to pay money in order to create my first Safe. Maybe this was because I already had a wallet on the mobile app or something equivalent. But either way, I had already burned money in order to test the transaction deposit and withdraw feature, so I wasn't willing to send more money to Mixin to create the Safe.

My recommendation is to eliminate the Standard plan and merge it with the Free plan (or "No plan" as it is called on the website), because as it stands, if you don't buy a plan, you cannot create a safe, and network fees of Mixin presumably already go to the Mixin organization (right?) so the $2/month (apparently it's $2/year according to the quote in the OP - that's even worse from a financial perspective, and I strongly suggest making the prices on a monthly count in order to become profitable) will only generate a tiny amount of revenue for Mixin, and won't pay for much even if 1000 users signed up for the plan. It reminds me of those $0.99 and $1.99/month subscription plans for App Store apps that similarly struggle to pay the developer due to lack of users.

I also recommend Mixin team reads this: https://www.entrepreneur.com/money-finance/an-entrepreneurs-guide-to-startup-pricing-strategies/428342 and add more features to the higher two paid plans in order to incite users into buying those instead. Locking certain features to the paid plans works tremendously well in this case, as well as extending the premium features to include stuff in the mobile app. Some examples from other companies e.g. Twitter:

- Imposing a message size limit, multimedia size limit, or recent messages limit
- Limiting the number of group chats and contacts you can add
- Restricting the use of certain assets in wallets to paid plans
- Restricting the use of certain multisig software e.g. hardware wallets for creating the Safe to the paid plans
- Allow certain kinds of assets e.g. NFTs to be transferred to the Safe only in paid plans
- Remodel the highest plan to make it suitable for businesses - businesses have huge amounts of money and if you give them phone support, and a suite of features needed by businesses, it can generate you a ton of revenue, as in 5, 6, or even 7 digits monthly if the service gains traction. Also, advertise to businesses directly, as companies are notoriously bad at keeping people's crypto safe from hacks. This will give you some immediate revenue to start with.
- Or even (at the risk of making an unpopular suggestion) making the free plan ad-supported but vet the ads that you display just like Bitcointalk used to do.

A person who genuinely depends on your service - as opposed to the casual user who just wants a look around - will definitely subscribe to one of the paid plans. So if you develop more products and solutions that utilize Multisig and offer them to this paying class, they will be more likely to buy them.

There are probably more ways to make the premium plans more attractive and viable, which I encourage you to explore. But ultimately, being around people who make startups and all that, I just don't find the $2 pricing plan financially viable for you.

(But in the unlikely event that you decide to keep the current pricing [which I do not recommend for the reasons above], you should display the pricing modal in place of the dashboard when the user signs in, not when the user has almost finished creating a Safe.)

Appendix C: Using the safe with Bitcoin Core

(Or, how to shoot yourself in the foot with a BB gun)

2023-07-27, I decided to see what happens when you pay for the plan. As expected, the payment was processed, and there were actually some further instructions involving signing/verifying the safe from Bitcoin Core. Presumably to make sure the whole thing works.

Here I'd like to point out something wrong with the documentation - it assumes that Bitcoin Core decodescript RPC will return the multisig timelock script as the Segwit descriptor. However, this is not the case for some versions of Core, which return an address descriptor instead.

In the case where there is only one user added to the Safe, there's going to be the 2-of-3 multisig which looks like this:

Code:

wsh(thresh(2,pk(AAAA),s:pk(BBBB),sj:and_v(v:pk(CCCC),n:older(DDDD))))

The ASM output is always correct though. In my case, it's:

Code:

"asm": "02ec372c4b6d6a6fc0964e07dd48448bc84921469fbfdc4c522da90f3a6b954fe9 OP_CHECKSIG OP_SWAP 03d64177a393989c5ff9c8603df421e2890d03913f1e1e5e7948b63f7e136a57d1 OP_CHECKSIG OP_ADD OP_SWAP OP_SIZE OP_0NOTEQUAL OP_IF 02d84f36931c6138f1825a49c29f5c4d9af9524ca795e133b8cfc65a01acd77c9a OP_CHECKSIGVERIFY 432 OP_CHECKSEQUENCEVERIFY OP_0NOTEQUAL OP_ENDIF OP_ADD 2 OP_EQUAL"

The placeholders are:

AAAA is the first key (in my case, 02ec372c4b6d6a6fc0964e07dd48448bc84921469fbfdc4c522da90f3a6b954fe9)
BBBB is the second key (03d64177a393989c5ff9c8603df421e2890d03913f1e1e5e7948b63f7e136a57d1)
CCCC is the third key (02d84f36931c6138f1825a49c29f5c4d9af9524ca795e133b8cfc65a01acd77c9a)
DDDD is where you put the timelock value (432)

Once you've done that, you should pass the descriptor as input to bitcoin-cli getdescriptorinfo to get the full descriptor with checksum.

Hopefully this will help someone make the safe even if Bitcoin Core changes the output format. Then you can follow the rest of the steps as according to the guide.

When the Safe is created, you can make a deposit or a transaction. Depositing the transaction is very simple, but you have to deposit at least 0.0001BTC. Making a transaction is, as expected, much more involved, and any of the Safe members or the Owner (the person who owns the other wallet, be it Bitcoin Core, Ledger or something else) can approve or reject the transcaction. The owner must always approve the transaction.

When I had my only member account of the safe approve the transaction, it asked me to scan a QR code because these things must be approved via the mobile app by typing a PIN. The Owner, on the other hand, must make a partially signed order to make the final approval

If only.

For some reason, I have my private key, and the script wallet, and the PSBT decoded shows the correct set of keys, but the PSBT is not signing at all!

So, do not create safes with Bitcoin Core until the devs make the instructions fool-proof, or you could lose your coins.

[1714739048]

1714739048

[1714739048]

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[1714739048]

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[Husna QA]

Bitcointalk username: Husna QA

I started from the "user guide" link about the use of Mixin safe that the OP listed on the first page of the thread.
Several App guides exist on the "Get Started" page to use Mixin Safe.
The order of the guides I see is based on popularity statistics, so the guides will always be random if based on these categories.



My suggestion is for the user guide to be grouped in order based on each App so that new users can focus on guide material suitable for the application they will use.

Here are some steps that I did to try Mixin Safe:

- Mornin Key installation

In the account creation process, after getting the Mnemonic Phrase, I tried to screenshot it, and it worked. In my opinion, the developer (One Mornin Software Solutions Ltd) should use a feature to prevent taking screenshots of the seed phrase display on the Mornin key.



- Mixin Messenger Installation
https://mixin.one/messenger

The iOS version of Mixin Messenger and the MacOS version can be installed on my iPhone and MacBook, but when I wanted to install it on my Android smartphone, it turned out that the application was not available for my country (Indonesia).

   

Next, I tried registering for Mixin Messenger on my iPhone, but I encountered the problem of not getting the code to log in despite repeated attempts. Finally, I tried emailing kelly@mixin.one because some of the solutions listed on https://mixinmessenger.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360024114492 did not solve my problem. But I was still waiting for a reply from the Mixin team, and after a few hours, there was no reply (Email support is not responsive). I tried to contact Mixin through the chat feature, and there was a reply from Kelly. He provides several solutions as follows:



But from some of these solutions, the code problem has not been resolved, so Mixin will try to contact the SMS operator, and it takes about 3 days:


I can't access Mixin Safe with Mixin Messenger due to the above issues.
If there is already information from Mixin, I will try to update it here. ...

UPDATE I

After waiting a few days, I tried logging into Mixin Messenger again, and this time, the notification code finally appeared so I could open Mixin Messenger (I use a phone number from a cellular provider in Indonesia). Thank you, Mixin team, for your help.

 

- Test Login to https://safe.mixin.zone/login

After getting the QR code, I tried to scan it using Mixin Messenger; several points on the Request Authorization are all automatically active, 4 of which can be turned off.
I tried to deactivate some of the requested points.

Next is creating a PIN, then confirming several points on the Request Authorization by typing in the previously created PIN.

 

In the example above, when the four points for authorization are not active, it turns out that I cannot log in at all to Mixin Safe.
So I tried repeating the process by activating all the options. Here are the results:



- Test login to Mixin Messenger Desktop (MacOS)

After scanning the barcode that appears on Mixin Messenger Desktop and entering the PIN code, here are the results:



- Add Mixin Messenger Contacts

The Add Contact option on the Mixin messenger desktop is less than on the smartphone version:



Some of my contacts use Android smartphones, so they likely cannot use Mixin Messenger because it is unavailable in Indonesia. I tried to add the Mixin ID of one of the following users he listed in his post.



A little surprised when I opened My Contact, it turned out that one of my friend's contact numbers was already registered in Mixin, so it was automatically listed in the Mixin Messenger contact list.



- Set Emergency Contact

I tried looking for this feature but didn't find it on Mixin Messenger iOS, I don't know if it's on the Android version, or maybe I missed it.

- Create Mixin Safe using Mornin Key

After previously successfully logging in at https://safe.mixin.zone/, next I tried to create Mixin Safe using the Mornin Key:







 







I used the Bitcoin Lightning Network payment method for the Standard upgrade option in the Upgrade Plan process.

 

After the transaction was successful, it turned out that the create button did not appear either, so I refreshed the web browser, but apparently, my account was still not upgraded. Is this a bug?





I tried to chat with Mixin about this, and she promised to check with the dev team up tomorrow:


...


While waiting for confirmation about the problems with the BTC lightning network payment method, I tried to deposit from my Trezor wallet to my BTC address on Mixin Messenger.
As this was my first deposit, I tried using a small amount first, as instructed on the Mixin wallet. Bitcoin deposit on Mixin was successful after 3 confirmations:

   

https://btc3.trezor.io/tx/76ec5abc222982a0f245c51f88418939b52a8b19b58909d874d3f8f05655de18


UPDATE II

I tried to ask again about the issue of paying via BTC Lightning (using the Crypto option in the payment method):



While waiting for a solution from Mixin & Mixin Pay (the payment gateway provider), I tried to create a new safe; This time, I used MixPay+ Wallets using BTC as the payment method.

The process is relatively fast, and this time the Create button appears; Here are some screenshots of the process until the new safe can be active:

















   

   

   

- Deposit to Safe





The Deposit to Safe process is pretty straightforward, for testing I tried sending from two different wallets:

a. From Trezor Wallet 0.0001 BTC with a fee of 0.00001071 BTC



https://btc5.trezor.io/tx/74aa10df42a9292b4da08cbae04c137c7d479a6456a4c3fa16b359a1f8a902b5

b. From Mixin Wallet 0.0001 BTC and the fee is 0.00024BTC (Quite expensive if for small transactions)





- Send a Transaction

I try to send all the balance in Safe to the Mixin wallet. Here are some of the processes:























Mixin Team's feedback:



Thanks for the solution, 2 pUSD is already in my Mixin Wallet:



Since I have previously created another Safe, and the $2 per year upgrade plan only allows for 1 Safe, I cannot use it for now unless I upgrade to Elite or Prosperity.

Conclusion:

Overall, using Mixin messenger + Mornin Key is quite easy (I haven't tried using Ledger and Bitcoin Core).

Some of the issues I encountered, such as problems with accepting code for login & upgrade plan failure when using BTC lightning payment, finally got a pretty good solution from the Mixin team.

[Rockstarguy]

Bitcointalk username: Rockstarguy


My Review on mixin safe

Actually it wasn't easy for me to download morning key and mixin messenger. The first attempt to make to download the app I was asked to pay some certain amount of money from my ATM card and I made attempt severally but it didn't work, I keep repeating the process for a longtime. Later on I was able to download the app into my mobile phone for free which was very fast, at first it wasn't easy for me because I couldn't get access easily on how to download the app, I think the app should be made available in play store and apple store for people to be able to download it with no difficulty.



mornin key
Creating and activating the mornin key was very easy , I didn't have any issues even in my first time opening the app. From what I saw from the app I think mornin key is not bad when it comes to securing the seed phrase and other important data concerning mixin safe. Its search engine is accurate in search of public keys and username,  mornin key is cool to use for storage of private key and a public key.

mixin messenger
I activated my mixin messenger with a phone number which a verification number was sent to me as test, the verification number that was sent to me gave me access to the app. I was able to add some contacts in my contacts list , but I went through some challenges when activating  emergency contact that can make me retrieve my mobile number if it gets lost which I really want the mixin team to know that their is a need  for improvement.

Emergency contact


Activating the emergency contact to retrieve lost mobile,  in the process of doing this a code will be sent to the first member contact and the second member contact and if the code is not been use quickly it will expire and can't be used again and a code like this can't be generated again. I think even if the  time frame of using a verification code to activate emergency contact expires,  after sometime their should be more  chances of generating another code again to activate the emergency code, but with mixin messenger it only has just a chance to  gain a verification code to activate the emergency contact.

mixin wallet


I deposited some bitcoin worth of $13 in the mixin wallet and without any delay it reflected into the wallet, I also used the mixin wallet to send some amount of Bitcoin to activate my mix safe. After the first transaction I couldn't transfer the balance in the wallet because of the  high charge fee, about $11 of bitcoin is still in the wallet that can't be tampered.  I think the feel is really too high which can be a red flag for people not to fund much amount of Bitcoin.



Conclusion
Preparing the mornin key there was no issue,  everything went smoothly  and I don't see anything wrong about mornin key.  The security aspect of mornin key is excellent and it is doing a nice job by storing data and private key of user. I found the mixin  messenger a bit challenging though, it is challenging when activating members emergency contact,  no minimum limits of getting verification number to activate the emergency contact. Their should be more chances of receiving verification code even if the time expires .

The transaction fee charge is too high , I wish this can be look into by the team because it will scare people away from using the wallet,  because from my experience as Bitcoiner people always want to use a wallet that does not have high transaction fee.the least transaction fee is about $30 which is very high and many won't be able to afford this as transaction fee. This are my only challenges I came across,  but as for security and privacy the idea for money key is not a bad one.

[Bushdark]

Mixin Safe Review

Bitcointalk username: Bushdark

Preamble Stage
I quickly checked the Mixin Safe websites thinking that it was a new project but I noticed they had been in existence for few years now with there own app having more than 50k downloads which was quite interesting. I noticed that before I create the New Safe account, I  needed to pass through the preparatory stage first to enable me to get ready for the whole process and make it less navigating. I tried testing the 3 options but I find the Mornin key to be more friendly for mobile users since using Ledger or Bitcoin Core looks more advance requireing more of desktop.



Mornin Key
As part of the preparation stage, I quickly follow the link on the Mixin Safe website to download the Mornin Key on Play Store, I noticed that the app was not free costing close to a dollar. I decided to make use of the APK file which was a good option for me to use rather than paying for the Mornin Key app. I quickly created an account with password to prevent unauthorized access to my account. It has friendly and simple interface making it easier option than using Bitcoin Core to create a Mixin Safe account.



Mixin Messenger
Mixin Messenger is a cryptocurrency wallet that support different digital coins and enable users to receive and send coin to and fro. It has a simple interface that enables me to quick scan barcode, navigate to where cryptocurrency are listed to aid easier transaction and also have a room to browse the internet just like other advanced crypto wallets.

I was able to download the Mixin Crypto wallet using the link from the site that took me to Play Store making my experience to be quicky and smooth. I opened that app and I was able to create my own account using my name and a space for phone number was made me wondered why I have to input phone number to continue the registration since I don't like any means of personal data on a crypto wallet. Since there would be need for a number verification to continue the registration, I quickly look for a safe number to complete the verification of the wallet because I believe it's a decentralized wallet with higher security on privacy.

I created my password and I was able to login to my account without stress. I received a welcoming message from the Mixin Messenger  Bot about what the wallet is all about and it was more convincing knowing some of the guidelines and functions of the wallet. One can also create an end-to-end encrypted group, send pictures, videos with other amazing functions just like Whatsapp social media app. Mixin Messenger is a good wallet with a touch of social vibbing ability.



Adding Mixin Messenger Contacts
Adding contacts to the wallet was quite a big challenge because I had to look for people around me that are willing to download the wallet and create an account to add them. Later after the whole process, I knew that one can easily send funds to those on the contact list but I think sending fund should not require a wallet address again since the person is a close contact. I was able to convince friends that was interested to test the wallet and open an account to complete the whole process.


Adding contact using the person's Mixin ID or phone was okay or quicky going through my contacts to see those who are using Mixin is a thumb up for the project team since it enables me to quickly search for those that are using it without bothering to input there numbers.

I decided to also create a group chat adding a contact titled "Review" to see how it will look like. I tested some of the features like voice note, the keyboard and GIF and it was cool, but I could not see any emoji there and I hope the team will add that because it is one of the features I was hoping to test. I saw some GIF for birthda, Love and others although they are not much. Also the option of adding more is also there for those of us that will like to add our own. I also add pictures to check the photo quality if it will reduce the quality to save data but it was okay for me.



Signing in Maxin Safe
After I was done with the preparatory stage, downing the Mornin Key and the Mixin Messenger, Adding pin, creating contacts and setting an emergency contact, I went back the the Mixin Safe website to scan the barcode there using my Mixin Messenger on my mobile. After scanning, it redirected me to where I will created my New Safe to complete the registration. The process was completed after paying a fee of an upgraded plan and funding my account.


I used my system to complete the finally process which was bold enough with every contents in the website much more visible and comprehensive. I was directed to pay a fee upto $2 worth of Bitcoin but I decided to pay more because I don't want a situation where the price of Bitcoin may fluctuate and the worth of Bitcoin I paid is not up to $2 again.


I was surprised that after I paid and it was confirmed, I was asked to claim my remaining balance because the amount I paid was more than the exact fee. It was amazing showing that they have a refund policy on subscription.


I funded my account after I was able to subscribe to see how fast it was and if after multiple transactions what there fee would look like. Although after this review, I have plans of using Mixin Safe because it has a good structure and comprehensive interface.
I was able to find out that there fee is high and I hope the team will do something about it.

I normally get notifications from my Mixin Messenger on all my transactions and things I do on my New Safe account on there website. Using the app was quite an impressive adventure for me learning new things.


Experience
My experience so far was handsome although the initial stage was a pretty confusing when I was about opening a New Safe account. mixin Messenger and the use of Mornin Key was the best option for me because I also tried using Bitcoin Core with Mixin Messenger but I couldn't continue because of some minior error I made. Although that was for me why some persons may prefer Ledger, Bitcoin Core than Mornin Key. The app need some modification interms of network fee and adding more features. Paying more than the fee and getting a refund for excessive payment is amazing.


Conclusion
I think there should be a need for a video description of the steps one need to follow to get to the final stage. This will enhance those who do not know how to get about completing the final stage of creating a New Safe. I noticed there was no way I can reduced the network fee which made it fixed. There should be option to adjust network fee for those who might be ready to wait for a longer time for there transaction to be confirmed.

[AB de Royse777]

You should at least create a Mixin Safe, make a deposit and send a transaction to make a complete review. ..Click here for user guide..
- Prepare Owner Wallet:  Ledger, Bitcoin Core, Bitbox, Coldcard, Mornin key, etc.
- Prepare Members Wallet: Get Mixin Messenger
- Set Mixin Messenger PIN
- Add Mixin Messenger Contacts: Please ask all safe members to add each other as a contact in Mixin Messenger, including yourself.
- Set Emergency Contact: Please ask all safe members to set an emergency contact in Mixin Messenger, including yourself.
- Sign in Mixin Safe
- Write a constructive review that worth to receive 0.003 BTC of your experience using Mixin Safe.

I think there are no doubt that the above description explains that you need to use Mixin Safe service. Don't post a review without testing the service by yourself. If found you will be asked to refund the payment and you will be banned then tagged.

Someone PMed me this

Hey boss, I'm asking whether I should proceed to test putting some funds into my safe when the network fee is just too expensive? Is it okay if I don't test that or not?

It's just ridiculous even to ask.

Code:

Franctoshi
Rockstarguy
CryptSafe
examplens
Potato Chips
logfiles

You have two days to submit the reviews. Please don't miss the deadline.

Cheers,

[blue Snow]

Here my review,

I used IOS 16.5.1 with iPhone 13.

1. First, I have installed Mixin Safe version 0.40.2 which is already in my country.
Look like Mixin safe (android) not already on my country, so if someone here from Indonesia can not received any sms using Indonesia Phone number, Use online phone number such as online-sms.org. I used it and don't have problem so far.



2. Then after Installed Mixin Messenger, I prepare to install Mornin Key, but after I look that application is not free, I going to try TestFlight where I got to try it for free



Both are installed successfully on my phone. all going smoothly without a problem.


I am going through using a mixin-safe site website, where I can log in itu using my phone.

I open https://safe.mixin.zone/login and scan that code on my phone.



In my phone I got Request Authorized which can read all, then I must put my PIN to able login on the website on the PC.



I succesfull login mixn safe website on my PC.


The next step is I have to create a new safe



Select safes button, then write your custom name on the website like below:



Then click next, then I will through to my Mornin Key in my phone to scan the code below.



Here is the picture I scan from my phone:



Here the picture on my PC while I scan it on my phone:




I try to send 0.001 BTC from my own wallet (electrum, received 0.003 payment from the manager yesterday) to Mixin Messenger, here is the process picture below:



how good Mixin Messenger is because they used a bech32 address with a low fee.

After the deposit was confirmed, I received a message from the team mixin if I got 0.001 BTC received on my mixin wallet



All deposit into my wallet is going smoothly without any problem.


I have to upgrade the plan to continue:



I try using Mixin Pay and got a 0.00006 BTC QR Code for payment.



And done, I paid the payment using mixin pay from my phone.

I received new safe approval




I try deposit to safes, but a bit surprised that have a 0.00072 BTC fee, but it's ok, I sent it to my safes.



I received btc only a second, it is going smoothly and I don't have a problem with the deposit so far.




I try sending it back to my Electrum address,



And must approve by 1 threshold member on my phone.



I successfully made all transactions with multisig wallet. All good, I don't have problem, all transation (deposit and withdraw )I made from electrum > mixin > safes > and back again in my electrum.




I try to add contact my friend and send directly link to his phone number and also add my brother's number contact.



If someone here want to add my mixin messager ID, here my number: 41175777

About emergency contact, I don't find it on my phone, maybe because I used testflight or I missing something, I am not sure about it.


This is my 1st-time experience using the multi-sig wallet. Look like fun and interesting to continue this application. So far I don't have a problem with the application, all going smoothly and comfortably for me. But I have a suggestion to the team and developer, If they can make a fee transaction is less than 0.0007 I think will make people come here to try this application.

[TryNinja]

Bitcointalk username: TryNinja

I went through this without reading any other review or even doing too much research about the product so I could have a truly first impression. First thing is that going directly to the "Get Started" page without at least checking the "Technology" page was a nightmare and I was completely lost. I had no idea what exactly was an "Owner Wallet" or "Members Wallet", or even what the Mornin Key or the Mixin Messenger app were for. The following text will be my first impressions finding out what the heck is Mixin Safe:

What I would do is rename the "Technology" page to "How it works" or at least add a warning before the "Get Started" page indicating that one should probably read how the product works before (obviously, but I can usually learn things on-the-fly and this was a bit too much). I tried setting up everything before reading that page and I had more questions than answers:

"Do I need both Mornin Key and Mixin Messenger apps?".
"Which one will actually hold my 1/3 key? And for what do I need the other one?".

I was under the impression that the Mornin Key was my wallet for the owner key (1/3) and the Mixin Messenger was the wallet for my trusted counterparty (2/3).

Of course I later found out that the Mornin Key (owner) will hold the first 1/3 key and the second 1/3 key will actually be composed of as many users as I want through the Mixin Messenger app. "Oh, now it makes sense". Still, I wish this was better explained on that screen.

Even better, also add a small explanation on each step so people understand the basic concepts. On the first step: "Select the wallet that will control your owner's private key responsible for 1/3 of the vault"; Second step: "Your friends or trusted ones will be responsible for the second key through the mixin messenger app", etc... I think it would improve the user experience if there is a direct explanation about both apps and what they are needed for.

Some stuff from the FAQ should probably also be added next its related step itself. For example, on the "Set Emergency Contact" step, there is no explanation on what is that for (and not everybody will read the FAQ).


Now to the process itself...

First thing is that I tried doing everything on my phone as I'm traveling far away from home and I have no computer/laptop with me. I could NOT do that as I need to scan a QR code from the login page (with Mixin Messenger) and it's just not possible to scan a QR from a phone from the phone itself (I had both the apps and page open on the same phone). Maybe add an option so the user can paste his session/code directly (I noticed the QR points to some kind of unique UUID). A few days later I found a PC on a hotel I'm staying and here we are!

Logged in with my phone, went to "Safes", created a new safe... oh, so here is where they ask for my owner wallet (Mornin Key), cool! Scanned the QR with the Mornin Key app, created a new key for my sick-vault and clicked next.

Now to add the Mixin Messenger members responsible for the second 1/3 key! First thing I disliked is that you need a phone number to create an account at the Mixin Messenger (why not allow email-only registrations?). But well, at least I got a local sim on my trip I can use as a "throwaway"...

Anyways... I remembered of a service that allows me to rent a phone number, so I reinstalled the app on my phone and created a new account to test with 2 members (me and a fake one). Added him in a 2/2 vault, paid the $2 (loved how many coins you accept and how quick the payment is processed) and when redirected back the page wouldn't let me proceed because I still needed to upgrade my plan. Waited a bit and it just moved on. Signed the vault creation approval with my owner wallet (Mornin Key) and it's done! Now time to send some coins...

Sent just a little bit since I was scared I would lose access to the second signer (the one I used a SMS rent service for). 1 confirmation later and I could see the balance on the page.

Went to the New Transaction option and tried sending everything to a new address. Cool thing that I received a Mixin Messenger notification for every step (first the deposit and now the transaction approval request). Now this is where something odd happened. I scanned the approval QR code with the app and a bunch of random "receivers" showed up on the transaction. "EOS Mapping", " Calculator", "Mornin", "Mixin Logs", and a symbol I can't type. Who were those? And I was apparently sending them 0 safeBTC (what the heck is this?). Anyways, I accepted it (because why not?) and it seems like everything worked out. Now to the second signer...

I try to login to the second signer again and the SMS rent service logged me out. Got logged in again and the number was gone (). I spent some time thinking what I would do now that I couldn't login to the second signer. "Is my $$ gone?", well at least now we know why it's important to add an emergency contact and make sure you have access to your account. Still, I couldn't stop wondering how things would be different if I could have used an email address to register the account. Some more thinking and I found out you can actually reactivate an old number by paying a $3 fee, so this is what I did and it worked!

And now all I had to do was sign a last time with my Mornin Key (owner wallet). Boom, transaction sent! Interestingly enough, looks like I didn't get any fee deducted from the amount sent (do you guys cover that?).

The product reminds me of the Gnosis vault multisig (now called Safe.global?), that even Vitalik Butterin uses to safeguard his ETH: https://safe.global

Great to see this kind of service on Bitcoin's native chain (no sidechain with solidity-like contracts). I would definitely use it if I had 7-8 digits worth of BTC (assuming I could check everything is bullet proof and 100% legit). Less than that I honestly don't think I would pay $100/year, but that's me. After understanding the entire process and what each party needs to do (and with which app), it becomes quite simple. Still, I think the UI and UX when you start (before you login) could be more straightforward and more self explanatory as it takes a bit of time to get familiarized with the process. The dashboard UI itself is great and I had no problems with that.

Here is a screnshot of me approving the tx with the almost-lost second signer, in a Windows 7 computer that I found in my hotel.

[CryptSafe]

Bitcointalk username: CryptSafe
                                                                                   MY REVIEW
A brief review of my experience with the Mixin App

First and foremost I had to read through the instructions here on the mixin service board before proceeding. After this, I saw a link that I clicked directing me to the Mixin safe website then there I saw the link to download the mornin' key and the Mixin messenger app. The downloading and installation process was not too difficult but the second phase was a bit technical and it takes one with vast experience in crypto and wallet installation to know how to handle it. This phase was the scanning of app QR codes to gain access to your personal dashboard which was a bit technical too.





Mixin Customer Care Service and Mixin Chat
The customer care service was top-notch. The representative was very fast and actively responded to my concerns and the situation at hand. I will say that from my experience and little engagement with the care support, the mixin team and organization have a good communication structure and relationship with their users. The messenger chat is quite alright as there are lots of features such as the emojis and other options made available.The message delivery was very fast from both ends and has a double blue tick to show the sender that the receiver from the other end has seen the message sent to them.




Creating of Mixin App pin

After downloading the mixing app, I had to set my login password which requires a 6-digit number and up to a five times verification input process which I find too lengthy of a process. Possibly a three-time would be okay since one has written down the pin in a safe place.

Creating of Mixin safe

Before creating the mixin safe, I had to follow the process of scanning via the app QR code from the website using my mixin app to gain access to my mixin dashboard. After doing the scanning, I got a notification on my app to have successfully signed into mixin safe. The process was quite alright but if the developers or team could make it easier for one to log in manually through a password and user ID  that would be very nice because not everyone sometimes could be free to use the QR code option.
 


Linking my Mornin key  to my Mixin safe

After I had successfully created my Mixin safe account through the QR code scanning of my wallet, the next phase was for me to link my morning key to my Mixin safe for transaction approval. This I believe is done so as to protect the holder's fund if there be any unauthorized transaction taking place elsewhere without the holder's consent. This is a very good step and a nice idea by the mixin team to have come up with such a sophisticated method to protect users' funds.


  


Purchase of Upgrade Plan
The next phase was the purchase of my upgrade plan which I needed to start the process by making payments for the grade I want. I opted for the 2pUSD option because it was the first time I was trying it out and as such  I needed to test run so as not to encounter any difficulties if I do, I would not have any reasons to bother as the funds were little and I can try out with another fund. I started by clicking on the upgrade plan option and it took me to the next page where is saw a three-plan upgrade option and I opted for the 2pUSD plan. I clicked on it and I was taken to the next page which was the payment processors with lots of payment processors and crypto payment of choice. I opted for Bitcoin as that was the available one that I can make payments very fast.

 

I made a transfer of 0.000645 BTC ($18.79) into my mixin messenger app and from there i made the payment via QR code from my app direct to my mixin safe account for the upgrade for which i choose the scan option payment vendor. The process was quite easy but confirmation process on the  mixin pay safe took time (47 minutes) before it was confirmed which is not alright. If the process of confirmation can be narrowed down it would be nice.

 



Mixin pay deposit and withdrawal

The deposit and withdrawal process was not much stressful as the process was initially as the payment gate way is already been activated  as i already did. I made payment direct from my mixing app as it was there i had the funds kept  which made it much easier for me. It was an automatic payment process as i  scanned through the QR code on my mixin safe pay dashboard although the confirmation time still remains the same but the funds got to my wallet address with mixin pay and was confirmed. The withdrawal process was easy as i had to copy and paste my wallet address from my mixin messenger app to the website then I  approved the withdrawal then the next page popped up but i noticed it kept loading for a long time without any feedback or message.





Nevertheless, i noticed i recieved  a safeBTC on my mixin mesenger app wallet of 0.0001 safeBTC with no monetary value attached so i was wondering if it could be the withdrawal that i made from my mixin safe account.

 


I noticed as well that there is no transaction option for activities table which would have better categorized the nature of the transaction which was carried out on the mixin safe pay dashboard. From the overall look, the table looks more elaborate but would be okay if the transaction option such as deposit/withdrawal is added to it.
 

General Observations

1. The fee was too high which is not normal for a small amount of transaction.
2. Long time confirmation which is not convenient for transactions.
3. There was no other means of login except through QR codes which some times might not be convenient for
    users.
4. The payment gateway and process is far too time consuming and not convenient as it would scare away users
    who have no much knowledge on crypto and wallet installations.

Possible Recommendations

1. The high transaction fee should be looked into to minimize the cost of running a transaction.
2. The long time confirmation should be narrowed down so as to save much time when conducting a transaction.
3. Possibly, the team should device another means of access into ones mixin safe account other than scanning of  
    QR codes. Email address, user ID and password would be nice.
4. The team should look into a way of reducing the lengthy process involved in activating an account with mixin
    safe pay as no one would want to spend such amount of time ding such where there are other available
    options out there for them. It would be in the best interest for the team to do the needful as regards this
    opinion.

In all, the review exercise was a bit technical and requires one with patience, vast experience and knowledge to install and carry out the process.

[Franctoshi]

                                           My honest Review after using Mixin Safe.



                           This review tells my experience with using Mixin Safe, In terms of


1.Its Security.

2. And the wallet's overall Functionality.


 Wallet installation/ morning key :

The wallet is currently accessible in the play store & Apple Store with a provision of APK download.











Morning key :

Here I was asked to pay a few dollars to enable me to install the morning key app, having done that, this is where was provided with my


seed phrases that guarantee me full ownership or access to the wallet.




  




  





Phone number verification:

Hereafter the installation of the mixin messaging App, it required providing a phone to be able to access the wallet.


 Wallet pin creation:

In this pin creation stage,

 I was amazed to have seen that you have to pass 4 confirmation processes to ascertain you can remember your pin.
 





Supports Multi cryptocurrency :

The wallet currently supports tons of different cryptocurrencies/coins such as
BTC,  
ETH,
SOL,
BNB, etc.
Which allows users to be their bank and have total control of their funds seamlessly.
 etc.




                                                            Transaction

 

Deposit:

After the installation and setup of the wallet I had to deposit some amount of Bitcoin to test-run my new wallet,

the wallet uses a good bc1 address, and the deposit was successfully received.










Withdrawal:


I also had to withdraw immediately to ensure both deposits and withdrawals are working smoothly

and indeed the withdrawal was received in the destination wallet without any delays.

This ascertains that the wallet runs smoothly.





Touring my new wallet and Navigating its features:


1. I realized it has an option for a connected DAPPS feature where users can connect their wallets to other blockchain platforms.

2. Hidden assets feature

3. Receiving money with Mixin Id:

Users can send funds to fellow mixin users just by using using your mixin Id.



Mixin Messenger :


You can add people using their mixin id or phone numbers /contact if the person is using a mixin safe messenger /wallet.

Added some to text out his this works, It works perfectly just as other messaging apps do.




              
                                                                                             Observation,  Recommendation, and Conclusion



  2. Phone number verification :



Here is a stage I'm not too comfortable with as it overlooks privacy,  

which is Paramount in the crypto space and I suggest an alternative verification method be used to replace the phone method such as an

email verification method.




3. The multi-signature integration in the wallet makes requires multiple participants in the authorization of a transaction,  

and this feature or added layer of security makes it difficult for hackers to access one's wallet without proper approval from the

participants.  

[SmartGold01]

Bitcointalk username: SmartGold01

MY REVIEW
Review for MIXIN MESSENGER, MIXIN SAFE, MORNIN KEY...

AREAS OF REVIEW:
1. MIXIN MESSENGER
2. MIXIN SAFE
3. MORNIN KEY

Tools used:
1 Android device with 2GB Ram which I installed my Mixin Messenger
1 Android Device with 4GB Ram which I installed my Mornin Key
Reason for multiple device used: Mornin Key don't operate smoothly with lower version of both Android and IOS since it usually send an error message.

MIXIN MESSENGER: downloaded direct using the provided link from Mixin safe website:
The user interface and the appearance is humanly friendly to operate on just as some other social media apps are being used, since is stress free and it doesn't need one to be technically sound to have it set up for a normal operation and usage.

Connecting with users is somewhat a bit difficulty and differently to me while adding them to my contact list, unlike other social media where you don't need to face much difficulty connecting and adding people to your contact list.

Because basically it requires only those that has the Mixin ID to be associated with that has same mobile phone registered with on the Mixin platform. Left alone with the individual's username the search option won't work smoothly until you have to contact whom you want to add to give you the correct details used. I contacted few people from my local board to help me complete this process, succeeded adding up  about 3 contact's.



Mixin Messenger wallet: The Mixin messenger has an inbuilt wallet on it which has a default 40 different supported coins/tokens in different network. With such feature they could also be used as a wallet and not just a social chat app.

Deposit to the Mixin messenger wallet:
I used the Bitcoin receive option: I was able to deposit $2 worth of BTC into the wallet, as show on the image below: Along the process I realized the unconfirmed deposit was shown on my deposit history, unlike others which deposit only displays when they are fully confirmed both on the blockchain and also with the deposited wallet. Perhaps, even as the deposit was showing as an incoming transaction the balance was not directly and immediately reflecting on my wallet.



Mornin Key:
This is the security which would be used to protect the safe; its nearly impossible to withdraw the funds on the mixin safe without this key it's being bind with the Mixin safe
The Key is not free: Have to pay for the APP before I was able to download it from my Play store.



Mornin Key security:
It displays option either for me to allow it make use of my phone biometric or set in a new pin which could be used to execute transaction in the app.
PIN: It required for a six digit pin set up.
Phrase: It consist of 12 generated words. After the phrase generation user would be required to confirm the phrase in the next phase which is the a nice way to be sure that the phrase is securely backup.

Mixin Safe:
Steps required:
Security/Key: I choose Mornin Key
Owner's set-up: Choosed a custom name





Members: Used 3 over 2
Which I was able to reached out few individuals from my locality (Localboard), they helped me get a code from their mixin messenger in other to enable me verify them below my emergency contact list. I will cover their names for security purpose as they since they already used their forum name as mixin messenger username.



Funding my Safe: From my observation during the safe creation I witnessed only 2 network available which happens to be Bitcoin and litcoin. Along the line I had to choose Bitcoin. During the funding I was asked "allowed to deposit using Bitcoin network". I transferred Bitcoin from my external wallet to my safe address. I couldn't capture the time used for the deposit to appear on my safe as, the deposit was taken a bit longer time to move from my external wallet so, I left it to attend to other home chores coupled with my baby made me to have a divided attention of not recording how long it took to deposit.  

After some while I got a notification, when I checked back my mixin messenger that my safe has been funded. Blurred the sensitive part's



Fund withdrawal process:
Member 1 is myself (SmartGold01), I observed any of the member irrespective of which number they were being added and can approve the transaction first it must done accordingly, the only part which couldn't switched was the part where me being the safe creator will have to approve the final part of the transaction through my mornin Key.


In summary:
It took me quite some days in other for me to finish up this review, handling my daughter and husband coupled with family members who always come around and other activities are yet to be mentioned. From my experience basically, the safe is quite interesting as it has also added to my crypto knowledge in general, its as safe and a true replication of its name as it implies, those security measures are really worth it.

Suggestions: I would suggest when the upgrade is done on the safe as I can see that the mixin safe is on the beta version. The mixin team should try to render a free safe service, that's where users would try how it works, since the $2 might be lot of money to risk in some regions.
Also the Red warming at the top of the mixin safe website. If not for the sake of the review if I come across a site warning me about my deposit I might completely avoid it.

Additional payment option: Right now their are lot of network out their and every one have their preferred network of use, but the litecoin and Bitcoin network weren't enough for the safe deposit, addition for more choices should be implemented as quickly as possible so that one won't have to go through rigorous way to fund using the only available payment option to carry out their payment.

[Agbe]

Agbe Review on mixin safe

Introduction:
The home page of the website is simple and has a transparent background. The website has no registration link but it has sign in link. And I used the mixin messenger app to scan the code in the website to login. And the website can load faster in all browsers.

The process to some extent was complicated because of the use of different devices. And this made me to spend some physical cash both in transport and to borrow extra device to set up the Mixin Safe Wallet
All the processes will be breaking down for clear understanding.

Mixin Messenger App

The process of installation
The first thing I did was to install the mixin Messenger App in my Android phone and the app has 12.46mb which made the downloading very fast with good network. After the installation, I continued to insert my mobile phone number with the country code and I clicked the Captcha then the 4 digit OTP was sent to the number provided. And my wallet name was asked for you to continue the process. And a pop up message "Get a Net Wallet". Create a pin page appeared.

Setting up Pin

Six (6) digit pin was asked to set up and I used a very simple digit for the pin and the app rejected the pin and stated that, "the pin is too simple". So I have to used another complex digits for the pin and the pin confirmation was four times and finally the pin was successfully set. And a welcome message was send to me.

Mixin Messenger Wallet

The wallet home page is just like the Trust Wallet home page which has Receive and Send with other cryptocurrencies.
[img width=]https://www.talkimg.com/images/2023/07/25/Qzyhz.png[/img]

Mornin Key Installation Process

The whole problem is in the mornin key app installation. The app is not working in all the Android phone. I installed it in Techno Spark 6 Go 2020, but the app did not open. At first it shows pure white screen.

Then the second box is

And this means that the app is not compatible with all the Android phones. But the mixin Messenger App works with all the advance Androids but the mornin key app is not like that.
Installation
After the installation of the mornin key app in the upgraded version of Android Phone with 3gb and 62gb rom, I was asked to put my security passcode then "write down your 12 mnemonic phrase".

Problem I Faced Here
When the mnemonic phrase was given to me, I had two identical words as "Cupboard and Cupboard" so in the process of writing the phrase in the box, if I clicked one of the "Cupboard" the second one would be automatically highlighted so the confirmation of the mnemonic phrase was a tough time for me, and because of that I could not passed that stage. So I have to delete the first account and create new account and new mnemonic phrase and everything was successfully submitted.

.
After the installation of the mornin key app, I went to the main website of Mixin Safe and clicked on the login and scan the code as I said earlier in the introduction.

Hello Agbe

Mixin Safe Wallet
After scanning the Maxin Safe Bar Code from the laptop, the both devices were successfully login and the welcome page appeared and the home page of Mixin Safe shows the total balance and other features. But I can't scanned the code in my mobile phone.

The depositing process

I deposited 0.0000665 BTC and transaction fee was very high as of the time and I was warned but I still continue the process.

Conclusion

After all the installations of the two apps, I made a deposit.of 0.000037 was successfully entered and reflected in the mixin Messenger App wallet.

And the balance did not reflect in the mixin safe wallet.
And also I used three (3) device this process to be successful.
1. I installed the Mixin Messenger App in the first Android phone.
2. I installed the Mornin Key app in another Android phone because it didn't opened in the first Android phone.
3. I tried to scanned the code in the website from the second phone, and after login successful from the both phones, the phone that I scanned the code shows half screen, so I could not see all the information on the screen so I have to use laptop to rescan the code and I see the full screen.

Withdrawal
After depositing the amount of 0.000037 BTC, I tried to see if I can withdraw $1 but the transaction fee was much more higher than the total amount to be withdrewn  so I left it for the main time but will still participate in the site if the fee reduces.

Recommendations

First the process of opening mixin safe wallet is too cumbersome. Using the three softwares for the registration all in the name of security is not recommended by me. Assuming I am alone and there is no any other devices and no any other person is available to assist me then directly, I can't open the wallet. So that Process should be reviewed by the software developers.

Secondly the transaction or network fee is too much as a new company that needs visitors. I advise you to reduce the fee.

Thirdly, you have to work on the mornin key app because it is not working in most of the Android phone like the messenger which works almost in all.

Fourthly, I recommend on the customer care service attendance, their response is very fast and okay.
Finally, frankly speaking, the process is complex.

[logfiles]

Bitcointalk username: Logfiles


My review

1. Downloads and set up

Setting up the mixin safe using the mornin Key was my preferred option because;
→ There was no access to a ledger hardware wallet at the time of testing the service.
→ There was not enough resource and time to install and set up a full Bitcoin core node.

As a first timer, during the set-up process. I faced some hiccups due to the couple of apps I had to install. The instructions are not quite straight forward (You install the app or do something as per the guidelines, but you have no idea why you are even doing a particular step)

I suggest a proper documentation is made on how to set up the mixin safe, with easier to understand instructions in articles and videos for the newbies.

For example

Download & Install Mornin Key
Download & Install Mixin messenger

Yes, but what is their purpose to the mixin safe we are trying to set up?

Invite members
Follow the instructions on the Safe website and invite your members to install Mixin Messenger. Please also remind them to log into Mixin Safe Dashboard by scanning the QR code.

Maybe the hypertext link to the Mixin safe website should be inserted in the highlighted area so that it's a little more direct.


2. Mixin messenger

Downloading it and setting it up was pretty straight forward, but I had a challenge with one of my mobile network providers as I was not able to receive the SMS verification code.

→ Add more ways of verifying the phone number, like an automatic phone-call. Something similar to what is on WhatsApp.
→ How about a secondary email verification for those that don't want to use SMS verification or use their phone numbers for registering?

The Mixin messenger's guidelines probably have some error, which could be misleading
It says,

supports 36 public chains such as BTC, EOS, ETH, XMR and more than 100,000 tokens

Coinmarketcap and coingecko suggest that there are only about 10,000 tokens. Please correct that.

Fiat Currencies
Add more local fiat currencies around the world if you pick exchange rate data from platforms like Coinbase. Cryptocurrencies are now getting known world over. Currently, the APP supports only 15 of them.

Adding contacts
The QR Code scanner looks a little out of place, maybe another QR code scanner next to Mixin ID or Phone number search box would be great
 

Setting Emergency Contact
This was straight forward, easy steps to follow with clear instructions


3. Sign in Mixin Safe

Signing in using the QR code was easy, but I do wonder what happens if I have only one device? I was lucky to have 2 mobile phones and a laptop. What about someone with only one phone, how do they access the Mixin safe?

The Mixing safe could also do well with an option for dark mode  

Settings

Settings → General → Appearance

→ Again, very limited fiat currency options. This time only four!
→ Only 2 languages available. English and Simplified Chinese. You might need to work bringing in more Languages.

Setting up safe.
No hiccups at all, but we might need simple and detailed instructions that can help a layman understand what they are doing and why they are doing so.

I also put my computer to sleep, got back to it 8 hours later, and I just got right back into the safe's account minus any log in prompt/verification. I think security should be tightened in regard to the safe.

Pay To test

I used bitcoin as a payment option.

Under scan to pay, you should add more wallets, with emphasis on open source noncustodial wallets. For example, even with electrum, one can scan to pay.



Under payment method, you should also add an option to open in wallet like you see in sites such as bitrefill. Once you click on the button, the wallet installed in the device opens up automatically with the order details (address and amount to be spent)



I also saw somewhere that order expires in 48 hours. We know that sometimes Bitcoin transactions can take more than 48 hours to get confirmed if the fee paid is very low. What happens if the transaction gets confirmed after 48 hours? Does the service process an automatic refund?

On my test transaction, the order got confirmed, and I was redirected to the new safe page summary and also received a message on the mixin messenger about by subscription after which I proceeded to create the safe

Mysterious Recovery tab

Once I created the safe, A new tab appear (Recovery tab) With no explanation or few helpful notes in the tab, I was not exactly sure what its purpose was exactly for. I guess so many newbies will also be clueless about this.
It had some details about my safe and stuff like that, with a last transaction date from 2001! More confusion. And then when I reloaded the page, everything was gone, just like that.

Depositing

There is an error from receive deposit. Once I clicked on it, it instead redirected me to the page similar as where one is trying to withdraw from the safe.



I ended up depositing through Safes → Receive deposits (on clicking 3 dots) → Deposit address generated.
Once my deposit was confirmed, this is what I saw in my Recovery page.



I never set the lock time to 4 days, so I have no idea what happened. How one can modify the lock time, if it's even possible? What if I want 10 days or 30 days?

New Recovery
I wanted to see the guidelines, but the link took me no where. Please fix that.


I tried reading about safeBTC and I didn't understand anything. What is this?

safeBTC does the system return the asset certificate after the deposit of BTC and is required to transfer the asset certificate to obtain a Safe Network signature.

Anyway, I just did a new recovery by holder keys method and see what happens.
Once I approved, there was not much information about what was happening next. No transaction ID, No record about the receiving address, Not many details about the transaction/activity I had just carried out. No idea whether the Bitcoin is going to appear in my address or not. And if yes, approximately after how long?

In summary, this is how the page looked like




4. Conclusion

The idea behind the mixin safe is a great one, but the process involved in setting up the safe is tedious and does not have proper documentation. I suggest you invest a lot more in helpful articles and Tutorials, including Explainer videos.
If new users with less technical knowledge are going to use this platform. Ensure that process is precise and well to the point.
Most of the other suggestions are within my review.

Thanks for the opportunity to review your platform.

[MFahad]

MFAHAD REVIEW ABOUT SAFE MIXIN

First of all, I read all the necessary information about using Mixin Safe and its advantage and I believe that if those users who lost the recovery phase with a big fund are now regretting that if mixin safe was in our time, we would not have suffered such a great loss.
All I learned about Mixin Safe on their website is that the whole systems use three private key processes in which two keys will store by the user while one key will be stored by Mixin. Hardware wallet or mornin is used to save one key while family members who approve transactions store another while the third key will be stored by the mixin team and will be only unlocked when the address remains inactive for one whole year.


I opened the Mixin site on my desktop and there was a tutorial with an image of the setup Mixin safe. From this tutorial, I concluded that I have to use two other apps also(the Mixin app and Mornin app).

Mornin:
This app is used to keep up our privste key and also when we create safe and withdraw we have to sign in in this app too. I download apk file and intall it. at start i have given phrase key to save in safe place and this is all and nothing other to do. This app is quiet easy to use and no need of any mail or phonr number to register. we can also use ledger or other hardware for this purpose.

Mixin:
I search for the desktop app but unfortunately, It's not available yet for a desktop and I have to use a smartphone to download it. I used my smartphone to install it from Play Store.
after downloading I opened the app and it asked for a phone number, by putting in the phone number 4 Digit pin code arrived in 2-3 seconds. by entering the code Mixin app directed me to the main page.

Now first of all I set up a 6-digit pin and now my Mixin app is ready to give me a full view of crypto assets and other chat options. I was thinking that was enough for me and no need for using Mixin Safe but when I start Mixin Safe I recognize that I have to add family and friends contact who save the private keys. I added one Bitcointalk user and family member just by searching through uid. This process worked smoothly and I added contact in no time.

Some good features of Mixin Messenger:

This messenger gives us access to chat with friends with a lot of advanced features like sending audio voice, video, group chat, voice call, and many others.

This app has a built-in wallet with a lot of cryptocurrency available and almost all big tokens (BTC, ETH, BNN, SOL, APTOS, LTC, DASH, KSM, AVAX, Doge, Dot,NEAR AND MANY MORE). We could use this wallet for holding purposes but only the listed token will work. Sending non-listed tokens will result in loss.

We can send a token to our contact without any fee and also receive it from our friends and family just by giving them our public ID.

We could add emergency contact which will help us to log in to our Mixin account if we lost our access to phone number.

we can change the mobile phone number

we can change the text size, and theme, and the best one I like is the dark mode option available.

There are some limitations too in Mixin messenger like no email option, no desktop version for Windows and Linux, Group or channels option

Mixin Safe:
Now, it's time to check the main service. I opened the Safe.mixin.zone site on Laptop and clicked on sign option, scan the code through the mixin app, and Mixin safe opens in no time. this whole process works very smoothly without facing any issues.

Now it's time to create my first safe. As i already checked out the details of creating a safe therefore i faced no issue with it.  during creating a safe I have to sign in through mornin app which I tried without the internet but its not work which means that an internet connection is mandatory to connect with Safe.

I can select a maximum of 5 contacts for the mix-in sign in but all members should be in my contact list otherwise I cannot do it. I set only one(me) for fast but it's not secure. we have to select at least 2-3 family members for better security.

I purchased an upgrade plan using crypto. A lot of payment options are available too. I preferred trx as I was holding and the fee was also low and payment arrived as well as safe was created successfully in 15 seconds.


I have been given a BTC address and now it's time to deposit some BTC to checkout deposit and withdraw service.

The deposit function is very easy. Just clicked on Received deposit under my created safe and now I am able to scan the address and I deposited 0.00465(135$). Wonder to see that payment arrived after one confirmation which is I think very fast to track fund deposits.


The deposit is working smoothly and I have faced no issues. The speed of the deposit is very fast. Normally it arrives in our wallet after several confirmations but here it arrives after 1 confirmation.


Now it's time for checking withdraw function. I clicked on a new transaction and default safe was selected for the transaction. if we have more safe then we can also choose any safe for withdraw transaction here. after doing this process now we have to sign in through the Mixin app. This option is best to secure our funds. If anyone steals our private key cannot withdraw without our mixin signin' approval. There is a risk also if other added members are not able to sign in then we cannot withdraw our fund therefore adding members carefully. an automatic message arrive in my mixin app and will received by another member also which is best for security and awareness.



I purchased a 2$ plan where 1 transaction is free and for the second transaction, we have to buy a plan or credit for the transaction. I proceeded with the free transaction and last I have to sign in through mornin app. BTC arrived in my wallet without any issues very fast.


Conclusion:
I found the whole Mixin safe process very fast and secure and I will recommend it for every Btc and Ltc holder. This is a decentralized way to store our key and can access our fund even if we lose our key (which often happens after a long time). understanding this process is not easy and at first, it's looking a bit complicated process but after processing first then it becomes easy to be familiar with it. In a safe process, we have to sign in to different apps multiple times which is looking boring but best to secure our fund. customer support is online to help you if you face any difficulty in the process. Mixin Safe is still in the beta phase and I hope the team will overcome all drawbacks.

[Potato Chips]

Bitcointalk Username: Potato Chips

Preface and Mornin Key:

About the reviewer: Average user. Certainly not tech savvy levels but have been in the bitcoin space for a couple of years now. I will be using an old spare phone with second space feature + disposeable numbers

I started by checking the user guide mentioned on the OP. As I don’t have any of the wallets mentioned, I went with Mornin Key.

I used the following as my main guide
https://support.mixin.one/en/article/how-to-use-mornin-key-to-create-mixin-safe-1u1rf36/
https://safe.mixin.zone/start

I installed the apk because that was the easiest route for me. I must admit, I’ve never heard of Mornin Key before so when I saw “Prepare Owner Wallet”, I was expecting a typical crypto wallet but it did not look like one. After some quick digging, it appears it’s a password manager that could store private keys and act as a signer (cmiiw).

Mixin Messenger:

(Note: this bit is more of a help center feedback but I thought I’d include this here to not break the flow).

Next up is installing Mixin Messenger. Because there is a category called “Mixin Messenger” in the help center, ofc I’d view it! Unfortunately, there are only two articles and one of them is broken, see: https://archive.is/gEhRR

On Installing Mixin Messenger article, they forgot to mention a mobile app is still needed for desktop apps which was indicated here: https://mixin.one/messenger

Their help center is obviously bare bones - lots of stuff are missing, the guides aren’t beginner friendly/not as fluid, and there could be typos. I can only guess it’s because it’s pretty much at its first stage when it comes to work progress hence I would suggest indicating such as a precaution and perhaps try to redirect people to your live chat to compensate.

Moving on to the actual app:

I noticed the app relies on phone numbers a lot – registration and emergency contact – which honestly, I’m not a fan of. Emails are just better as they’re a lot more flexible. For instance, it’s pretty easy to setup one email dedicated for a single or couple of services so it’s easier to jump ships when something goes south ++ we could secure our email account with totp/hardware 2FA as a lot of providers have this.

After registration, next step is to invite members. The process is pretty straightforward but I thought to just try and key-in the user’s Mixin ID and it went fine. I tried to add my contact to “emergency contact” and had the following confirmation:



Okay, makes sense! I tried to still hit “confirm” just to see what happens and was surprised it asked me for a code but of course, no code was sent because we weren’t mutual contacts yet. Moving on, I went to my 2nd account, added the other as my contact, set it as my emergency contact, got the code and process done!

I looked into mixin messenger’s settings and was glad options for users to improve privacy and shoo nasty internet strangers were there. I didn’t like how auto-download media/documents was enabled by default though. I know malwares are unlikely on these type of files but I’d play it safe have it disabled.

Mixin Safe

According from the guide, I should now be able to make a safe! Contrary to previous steps, the article cover this one step-by-step so it was easy to follow. Hopefully, the same fashion will be applied for the rest as well! It also helped that the UI is beginner friendly. I think an average user could go through the steps just fine even without a guide article. Plus points for adding a progress section the right!

It’s nothing too big but I noticed in order to open my safe, I have to always tap the three-dotted button and hit “view”



Quality of life suggestion: double (or single?) clicking the safe should also allow us to view our safe.

Gotta say, one address per safe is certainly a drawback since it’s better for privacy to use as many.

As for the last step, I was able to withdraw pretty smoothly. I did not even needed a guide, the website was great. One thing though, I noticed some strange profiles when I was trying to approve my transaction. It would be nice if they’re more professional looking.



Ending Note, thoughts?

The setup wasn't really convenient however self help guides and in-app guides should help alleviate. Perhaps, using a wallet you're already familiar with would also make a difference e.g. for ledger users.

I also think the whole product/service could be better explained in lay man terms.

[AB de Royse777]

Batch#1 deadline has passed. You all did excellent job. Received all reviews except the review from examplens who received an extension until 31/07 with Batch#2

Code:

Unknown Op
TheSpiral
electronicash
iwantmyhomepaidwithbtc2
Jateng
SamReomo
Latviand
Avirunes
Faisal2202
LDL
Eternad
Gianluca95
ScamViruS
jamyr

Please don't miss the deadline which is 31/07 23:59 UTC.

Batch#3 payment/reward will be sent in two days.

 

[dothebeats]

As was discussed in PM.

Bitcointalk rank: Legendary
Lifetime earned merit: 1334
Bech32 address: bc1qzc5vkzjkd958rw9fv8gftjkhu8q4z5gt4n66ke

[ScamViruS]

Bitcointalk Username: ScamViruS


Installation of Mornin Keys

I was trying to download and install Mornin keys application from google play store, that time I see in google play store this application is not free it is a paid application. Since I don't have the payment option to pay in google play store, so I chose the second option and then I downloaded and installed the apk application of mornin key which was added in the mixin safe website. After installation everything went smoothly, then I was asked to add a 6 digit password, after adding the password I saw my mnemonic phrase. I copied the password and mnemonic phrase and saved it in a safe place.
 
Installation of Mixin Messenger

I easily downloaded Mixin messenger from google play store and installed it on my phone. But while setting the phone number created problem, because the 4 digit code was not sending to my number in any way. I don't know if other members are facing same problem like me. The 4 digit code didn't come to my phone, so I had to wait an extra 24 hours. After repeatedly failing to get the PIN with my local number, I then had success using a virtual number. Here I think to get the code, it also depends on the country where the user is located. Mixin messenger has many features, the most notable of which is that mobile number and mixin ID number can be added to the user's contact, and group chat can be done after creating a group. So anyone can create community using Mixin messenger. Another good move is that one user can send money to another user using Mixin ID number which is really a useful feature.

Wallet

When you enter the wallet, you will see a list of names of many crypto currencies chains that are popular among crypto users, and there are many currencies that I don't even know about, you can send and receive all those currencies using mixin wallet. I have only done bitcoin transactions using this wallet. All the transections I performed were done without any problems.

Wallet Fees

I added 0.00136896 Btc to mixin wallet for payment and deposit to mixin safe. After adding funds I paid mixin plan upgrade fee from mixin wallet and it was done without any fee. But when I go to deposit in Mixin safe I see the withdrawal fees of mixin wallet is 0.00025 BTC which is very high compared to my wallet funds, I paid $7.3 fee to withdraw $30.7 which is very high. So I think using mixin wallet to transact small amount of funds will be very expensive which will be difficult for normal users to afford. After adding such high fees it will be difficult for mixin wallet to beat the rest of the competitors in the market and take itself to a bigger stage. So the team should decide on these fees, and set acceptable fees as a wallet.

Sign in Mixin Safe

I was able to smoothly login to the mixin safe website using the https://safe.mixin.zone/start link on my laptop by scanning the QR code. Since I had two devices mobile phone and laptop, the login process in mixin safe was very smooth for me, but when a user goes to login using only one device, especially a mobile phone, that user may struggle to access mixin safe.

After sign in done I see this interface all options came in front of me to move to next step, I found very user friendly UI which will be easy to manage everything.

Upgrading Mixin Safe Plan

After I clicked to upgrade plan to standard I was transferred to the mixpay.me website, after coming to this website I found that there are different payment options. Since I had bitcoins, I went to make bitcoin payments and very easily paid from mixin wallet and it was successful in few seconds. I did not think that the payment can be made so fast, but I made the payment very fast and upgraded my plan.

Deposit and Withdrawal

Creating Safe

I have to create multisig safe to get deposit address. I easily created my safe using the Mornin Key option and got the deposit address. This process was also easy.

Deposit

After creating safe and getting bitcoin deposit address, I deposited bitcoin from mixin wallet to mixin safe. I only had to wait as long as it took for the bitcoin network to confirm as I saw bitcoin added to my mixin safe account quickly after the transaction was confirmed. So after creating the safe and getting the bitcoin deposit address, everything can be easily controlled there.

Withdrawal

New transection has to be created to withdraw from Mixin safe. And this process is also a very good idea in terms of security. Because it will not be possible to take withdrawal without owner's approval. So I added new transection from mixin safe and it was confirmed quickly, after a while I checked my own wallet and found that the funds withdrawn from mixin safe were added to my wallet. So it can be said that there is no problem with deposit and withdrawal from Mixin safe, at least I did not face any problem during my testing process.

 

Conclusion:

Mixin safe is a highly secure platform as authorization is required everywhere, thereby keeping a user's funds safe. Due to the multisign withdrawal mechanism, it is not possible to withdraw without the approval of the main owner of the mixin safe account, so it can be said that a user's funds will be completely safe with mixin safe. But there are some negative aspects, I don't see it as a good thing to make personal information like phone number mandatory to join mixin messenger, because crypto users are always very careful about their personal information. So I think if the team added some other option instead of phone number, it would have saved crypto users from sharing such sensitive personal information and would have been more interested in using this platform.

[naira]

Bitcointalk username: naira

Finally after 3 days of trying to complete all the processes here's my review (I'm using 2 Android phones because one of the phones can't download Mixin Messenger):

1. Download the Mornin Key application (mobile 1) because this application is paid, so for the first time the application in the playstore costs around $ 2, there is no problem in the installation process, I pay immediately, create a passcode, username and the backup stage is not much different from the method another wallet that I have used.


2. Download Mixin Messenger on my HP 2, now this is where a problem arose apart from not being available in my homeland, requiring me to find a way to install this application for 2 days and finally, I was able to find a solution including the OTP code which was not easy. Referring to the member's solution, I used a one-time use number, successfully entered my wallet, created a PIN, and deposited bitcoins, then suddenly my account was logged out because someone else was using the number, so I was worried about the balance. which has been deposited.


3. The support feature welcomes me but it's only a bot and the online support still hasn't responded to me until now and I try again for up to 15 minutes and then I can open my wallet, the balance is still safe.


4. Received Bitcoin: The deposit process went well but it took more than 30 minutes to receive it. (no problem for transactions) Even though the first deposit was less, a fee was charged 2x the transfer fee.


5. Sending Bitcoin: here I use a second wallet to process transactions, the fees charged are quite expensive so I made a 2x deposit as mentioned above. Actually I sent it back to my own address. Due to limited balance I didn't test the multisend feature, next time I will test if I have multiple sats already.
Network fee : 0.00021
minimum withdrawal: 0.0001


6. Send and receive altcoin features: However, the effectiveness and safety of a digital wallet application can be seen from the process of sending and receiving. Because then we will judge whether the wallet is safe or not. The other features are just an additional innovation in order to provide a differentiator from digital wallets in general. For this reason, apart from sending and receiving bitcoins, I also try to make altcoin transactions such as BNB (BEP 20), SOL, Matic, Doge and what I like the most is TRX.

7. The Chat feature is pretty good, but it's really hard for me to add members because no one understands how it works so it's difficult to use this feature.
As a result, I asked for a member ID here so I could test the chat feature as a whole. This feature is very helpful when confirming delivery of crypto, so I found it very useful. Makes me not need to open through a different chat application, because having it provided will make everything easier.

8. Desktop features: Connecting to the desktop view by scanning the QR code and everything can be seen in one view is more convenient and easier to understand. After making a payment of $ 2 without fees because it's free to use Mixinpay, so if you upgrade, you can get extra services rather than free.

Conclusions and suggestions: From start to finish, each application has its own advantages and disadvantages, whether it's a problem with complicated features such as using a cell phone number that users don't like, including me having to provide a number, even if it's a one-time use number. Paid desktop features, Chat etc seem to vary but if the user is just for transactions it might not be hard to use for the casual crypto user.
My advice, whether it's good or bad, is all for the sake of improvement in a better direction. Sorry if my review is not satisfactory but thank you for giving me the opportunity to try this Mixin wallet application.

best
naira

[SamReomo]

Bitcointalk username: SamReomo

This is my review about Mixin Safe and in this review I will describe in detail each feature of this amazing system. The review will describe everything in detail as I try to cover as much I possibly can. I will soon add the screenshots of the review because at time time I'm having some technical difficulties due to shifting to another home.

The Mixin safe website

I have visited the website of Mixin safe and the experience was quite interesting. The exact URL of the site was safe.mixin.zone, and I have visited the website using my Android based smartphone and there wasn’t a lag or delay browsing the site on that device. When I visited the website there was a button named “Get Started” and when I tapped it, I was taken to another page where the information about the Safe was shown in detail. The information include following text “Prepare Owner Wallet, Prepare Members Wallet, Set Mixin Messenger PIN, Add Mixin Messenger Contacts, Sign in Mixin Safe,” and when I scrolled down I found frequently asked questions as well. I have visited the website for sometime and after that I decided to go further and test the applications.


Mornin Key

Mornin Key was the application I used to approve my safe because I didn’t had access to complete Bitcoin core in order to install the PC version of the safe. I download and installed the APK file of the Mornin Key on my Android based smartphone. I recommend the Mixin team to make the Play Store and App Store version of the application to be free so that users would be more happy to install this application. However, for someone like me a free APK is enough to install an application.

Downloading of Mornin key

When I visited the website of the Mornin Key which was mornin.one, the website interface was similar to the Mixin Safe’s original site, and I didn’t gave further time to browse it in detail because I was basically there to download the Mornin Key. I scrolled all the way down to the bottom of the site and from there I clicked on Mornin Key option, and within a second I was taken to another page where I had the option to download Mornin Key either from Apple App Store or from Google Play Store, and when I clicked on the Play Store one I saw that the Application wasn’t for free. I have never used any paid application because I have never had any purchase on Play Store, and that’s why I revisited the website of Mornin key, and download the APK file from that page. Once the file was download then I installed it for free without any issue, and I began testing of the application.




Testing of the Mornin Key and Setting Passcode

I installed the Application of my smartphone Poco M3 pro with just 4 GB ram and there wasn’t any issue during installation, and then tapped the app icon to launch it. When the app was launched I had to create a new account and for that I clicked on “Create a new account” button and I was taken to a window where I had to write my account name. I used my Bitcointalk name for the account and then tapped the “Create” button. Soon after that I was taken to another window where I had two options “Use Biometric” or “Use Passcode”, I have selected the Passcode option, and there appeared another window where I had to set a 6 digit passcode to protect my data. I have selected the 6 digit passcode and it asked me to retype the passcode and I have retyped the passcode once again, and within a second my account was created. After that process a pop-up window appeared that asked me to “Secure the account,” and for that it had an option to select a Mnemonic Phrase. I tapped on Start button on that window and it asked me to write my passcode to unlock Mornin key, and after writing the code it gave me a Mnemonic code that I saved instantly, and then I tapped on Next button. After that it asked me to confirm the Mnemonic code and I confirmed it without any issue, and now I was ready to test Mixin Messenger.





Mixin Messenger and Setting of Pin

In order to test the Mixin Messenger I also used the same Android based smartphone, and I have gone with the same route of installing the APK file directly instead of going with the Play Store one. The installation was pretty smooth, and after the installation I tapped on the Mixin messenger icon to launch the application and it was launched without any lag or errors. Once the app was launched it asked me to write my phone number in order to create the account, and I entered my real phone number to get the verification code, but unfortunately after so many tries and waiting for a long time, I was still unable to get the code on my phone. The code wasn’t coming on my number and that’s why I decided to go with a throwaway number which was already allowed by Royse to be used during registration.  I tried to register my account with a throwaway number and I received a 4 digit code on that number without any issue but after confirming the code I found that someone has already created a mixin account using that number, and after that I tried to log out the account, but unfortunately I never found a log out button even after searing it for 10 minutes, and each time when I tried to load the Mixin messenger the account was already logged in on my app. I decided to “clear all data” of the app so that I can somehow be able to recreate another account and fortunately that worked for me. I have done the process on many throwaway numbers and most of them already were used to create an account by someone, but finally I found a number which was fresh, and I verified my account using that number.






After that I was taken to a window where I was asked to write my name, and I have written my Bitcointalk account name once again this time and tapped of next arrow. After that step I was taken to a window where I had to create a new wallet for me, and for that I clicked on continue button. After that it asked me to create a 6 digit pin, and I have written my 6 digit pin and clicked on start, and I have to reconfirm the pin for 4 times if I remember and then a small pop-up message appeared “Set PIN successfully,” and a some messages were given by team Mixin. I clicked on that tab and read those messages which were basically welcome messages, and some guideline messages.

Testing of Mixin

After that was done, I started testing the app. I first tapped on the left down icon on the app that was somehow similar to a lock type of icon, and once I tapped that then I was taken to a page where I had the option to send or receive crypto-currencies. I decided to deposit some money to test the app’s functions and out of all available crypto-currencies I went with Lite Coin as that’s the one which I always prefer because of low fees. I sent only $5 worth of Litecoin from my wallet and after 12 confirmations the Lite coin appeared on my messenger wallet. After that I added random contacts in my contact list to test the app, the contacts were added. I sent them some messages, but got no replies from those contacts.  I should also mention that I had transferred the $2 from my mixin messenger by reading the QR code of the wallet and then sending money to that wallet was easy. As soon as the transaction was completed the MixPay message appeared in my chat. After the purchase I had only $2.94 worth of Lite coin left on my account. I gave it a try to withdraw the money, but the fee was too high at $1.84 per transaction, and after seeing the fee I decided to deposit $5 more into my account. The deposit process was just like the previous one and it appeared on my wallet after 12 confirmations.
Now I tried to send some of my Lite coin to the ones in my contacts, and the first transaction I send was just 0.0001 LTC and it was sent very fast without any issues. After that I send another transaction worth of 0.001 LTC to another contact and that was sent instantly like the previous one.    





Creation of Safe

Now it was time to create my safe and for that I used my Mornin Key app to scan the QR code. I have now scanned the QR code of mixin safe from its website and authenticate the Mixin Safe Service to get access to my safe on the website. After that I have purchased the standard plan of the site which costs $2 dollars, and with that plan I was able to create my own safe. The standard plan to use the safe cost $2 dollars as of this day and may later be reduced or increased depends on the decision of the mixin, but I really recommend to reduce the cost of basic plan to $1 or even lower then that to attract new customers. After that was done and my account Samreomo was approved as a member of the case then I decided to deposit some money into the case.





                  
Connecting my safe and depositing money into it

Now it was time to approve some transactions using Mornin Key and for that I had to scan the QR code of my Safe with Mornin Key application. I scanned the QR code of my safe and approved it with Mornin Key app, and during approval I was required one again to enter my passcode, and the safe was approved instantly. After that I decided to deposit some of the Lite coin in my safe and for that I had to add the wallet number of the safe which I have added using mixin messenger once again and then I sent just 0.0001 LTC as first deposit to the site. The deposit was sent after sometime, but the fee was too high for that transaction. I just deposited 0.0001 LTC and the fee was 0.02 LTC which was quite higher than the transaction itself, and after that I decided to sent 0.02 LTC as my next transaction, and that transaction also had 0.02 LTC as fee. The fee was higher then other exchanges and that’s why I got curious that why the fee was so high as compare to the exchanges. For that reason I had to contact their Customer Care service.






Mixin Customer Care service      

Now it was time to ask some questions from the customer care service. I posted the message that why the fee of the transactions made with Lite coin were higher with mixin wallet from other exchanges? And, within few seconds I got some replies from the customer care of the mixin. They have explained the reason for higher fees, and I must say that it really made sense so that I thank them for the information they gave me. I must say that the customer service is quite good and responsive and they are always there to help you with their assistance.



Withdrawing Money from My Safe

After contacting the customer support now it was time to withdraw my Lite coin from the Safe, and for that reason I used my own Lite coin wallet address to withdraw coins into it. To do that I clicked on transactions button on my account page, and at the transaction page and I selected SamReomo safe, and after that I clicked on next button. After that the next window appeared in that window I pasted my wallet address and selected the amount that I was going to withdraw, and then clicked on the next button once again. Now I was taken to another page named summary and from that page I clicked on Create button, and I was taken to next page where I clicked on Approve button. A pop-up appeared where the member of the safe had to approve the transaction with a QR code to scan, I scanned the QR code using my mixin messenger and the transaction was approved. After that the final window appeared and at that window I also clicked on Approve button, and this time I need to scan the QR code with Mornin Key application. I have scanned it with Mornin Key and the transaction was approved, and soon it was completed. After a few minute I received the Lite coin In my wallet.






Setting Emergency Contact

Now it was time to have my emergency contact and for that I had tried on all of those contacts that I added, but none of them added me back as a friend and for that reason I was unable to add any of those as emergency contact. I was worried that how can I fulfill this requirement of the review and sudden I got an idea to create another mixin account on my brother’s smartphone, and for that I took my brother’s smart phone which had similar specs like the one I used. I created the account in the similar way that I used to create my original account. Once the account was created fully I added it as a friend by searching it with the help of its mixin id, and then I added my account as a friend on it in the same way. Now, I added this account as my emergency contact and I got the code from it and entered it to make a my emergency contact. The operation was done successfully and I had faced no issue at all. I must say that adding an emergency contact was a hard task, but still I have completed it successfully.
   
Withdrawing money from Mixin to my wallet

I decided to give mixin a try by withdrawing the money into my personal wallet. For that I have added my personal Lite coin wallet and requested a withdrawal using mixin messenger. I have withdrawn 0.0065869 worth of LTC to check that what happens, and fortunately I got my withdrawal without any issues, but once again the fee for the withdrawal was 0.02 LTC, but since I knew that why the fee was so high, and that’s why I didn’t care about that.

My Suggestion

Although the Mixin safe is a quite useful system but it needs some changes in order to be more useful for the users. The first suggestion I want to give is that the Mixin team should reduce the costs of the plans because many users won’t be happy to begin with a system that starts with $2 as basic plan. I would also advise Mixin team to make the Mornin Key app free on Play Store as well on App Store because many people don’t trust the applications that are installed from outside of the Play Store or App Store, and those people also consider such apps as suspicious. I find it okay to register an account using a phone number because most of the messenger apps also require phone verification, but still it would be better to allow the users to create accounts with e-mail address, however it isn’t necessary. Finally, I would recommend Mixin team to reduce the fee for withdrawals because the fee is very high and for those accounts who have less amount of crypto won’t be able to use it with those high fees.

Conclusion

Mixin safe is the most secure and useful safe for all those users who want to secure their crypto-currencies, and I believe that it is very important for everyone who wants high level of security. My experience with this system was really good and I have never faced any issue by using the safe. Anyone who is uses this application for one time would love to use it forever because the system is the safest one in the market, and so far my experience has been really good I must say. Anyone who loves to make their crypto safe can easily rely on Mixin safe because this thing is among the best one in the market.

[BlackHatCoiner]

As was discussed in PM.

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