vave.com - is a scammers & nationalists

[Zoomic]

I Think Op has a case

Let us therefore re-examine the following points from Op;

• Op claimed that rule 2.1 was not in the ToS when he registered although he might not have evidence
• Op said that the rule of Rusia restriction is only available in the English version.  This shows that the edit was hastily done
• Another factor for determination is if Russia IP was blocked in the site and Op used VPN. If this is so, Op could be at fault,  especially if there is a rule not to conceal IP
• Op, consider to use a legal means if you are sure you didn't default no 3. I am sure Russia  blocks access to certain websites and vice versa

[1714260742]

1714260742

[1714260742]

1714260742

[1714260742]

1714260742

[mak013]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

I Think Op has a case

Let us therefore re-examine the following points from Op;

• Op claimed that rule 2.1 was not in the ToS when he registered although he might not have evidence
• Op said that the rule of Rusia restriction is only available in the English version.  This shows that the edit was hastily done
• Another factor for determination is if Russia IP was blocked in the site and Op used VPN. If this is so, Op could be at fault,  especially if there is a rule not to conceal IP
• Op, consider to use a legal means if you are sure you didn't default no 3. I am sure Russia  blocks access to certain websites and vice versa

100% he has a case.
The last proof he needed was them adding the Russian version of the updated term to their TOS.
Why else would they do this right after this incident if not recognizing they made a huge mistake, which they truely did.
This practice it very shady and deserves more light.

They are basically freerolling this customer, not more and not less.

At least they are kind of represented in our forum, this topic has be brought up in their ANN already. Their reply was only:

Hi,
Please note that any kind of sports betting or live betting for players from Russia is strictly prohibited and it's a requirement of our licensee. Also, we reserve the right to confiscate funds and block an account if it is proven that sports betting was made by a Russian citizen.
https://vave.com/information/terms-and-conditions
Thank you.

Kind of ridiculous.

[seoincorporation]

I was reading the ToS from the site Vave, and they give us a list of the countries that aren't allowed on the casino, but they never mention Russia in that list:

3.6. Players from Belarus, Cyprus, Curaçao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, France, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States of America are not allowed to play for real money to wager on Vave games.

And I agree with OP point, the fact that casinos only ask for KYC when the users are making some profit is a nasty move, and they should give a warning to the users before he make more deposits.

[acroman08]

I was reading the ToS from the site Vave, and they give us a list of the countries that aren't allowed on the casino, but they never mention Russia in that list:

3.6. Players from Belarus, Cyprus, Curaçao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, France, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States of America are not allowed to play for real money to wager on Vave games.

It is on "general terms 2.1"(which is kind of weird), the gambling support claims that the rule is recently implemented, how recent? I am not sure. if you ask me, I feel like the rule was only implemented when they found out OP was from Russia because they didn't want to pay his withdrawal and they have the "perfect" excuse as to why Russians aren't allowed to bet on sports betting or live betting(it is also weird that Russians are only prohibited on those two sections).

[h4nnmann11]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

no, you got it wrong.
They returned the deposit minus $14,000.

[mak013]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

no, you got it wrong.
They returned the deposit minus $14,000.

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

Let`s count. I marked all operations in your start post.
You deposited 27,500. Your withdrawals: 12,500; 12,000; 3,000. Summary we get 12,500+12,000+3,000=27,500. So it looks same with your deposit, isn`t it?
May be i mistaken somewhere, but not in maths, may be you missed something or i don`t understand something.

[dezoel]

I can't speak for the OP, but I can share from my own experience. When I first started gambling, I was completely clueless. I had no idea which platforms were trustworthy or reputable, and I was pretty lost when it came to finding them. In the early days, I experimented with different online casinos. Luckily, back then, strict KYC verification wasn't a big thing, so I didn't have to share my real personal info. I basically judged casinos based on my own experience. Needless to say, my experiences weren't always rosy. It wasn't until later that I stumbled upon this forum and other reputable casino review sites like BTCGOSU and the like.

So, I don't really feel like it's fair to pass judgment on the OP for going with a casino that isn't popular here. Perhaps the casino has some popularity within his local community or social circle. Maybe he stumbled upon an ad or a special promo offer that caught his attention. Or maybe he had some other valid reason for picking that casino. However, that doesn't give the casino a free pass to pull a scam on players.

I wouldn't blame OP for choosing that casino as well, but there is one thing that I would say that is different from your situation back in the day and the situation of OP right now. When you first start gambling, there might not have been enough resources available for you to check and understand which platforms are actually trustworthy or have a good reputation, but that isn't the case with OP as there are a lot of resources available for him to check from.

As you said, this forum alone is enough for someone to determine if a platform is trustworthy or not or has any reputation within the gambling community or not. So, though the platform shouldn't do this, OP could have joined a more trusted and reputable platform by doing a bit of research.

[Zoomic]

I was reading the ToS from the site Vave, and they give us a list of the countries that aren't allowed on the casino, but they never mention Russia in that list:

3.6. Players from Belarus, Cyprus, Curaçao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, France, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States of America are not allowed to play for real money to wager on Vave games.

It is on "general terms 2.1"(which is kind of weird), the gambling support claims that the rule is recently implemented, how recent? I am not sure. if you ask me, I feel like the rule was only implemented when they found out OP was from Russia because they didn't want to pay his withdrawal and they have the "perfect" excuse as to why Russians aren't allowed to bet on sports betting or live betting(it is also weird that Russians are only prohibited on those two sections).

I have been reading around that some casino changes their ToS without consenting the customers, it seems this is one of those shady acts. I also read that if a casino understands that the government of your country does not support gambling, they will likely confiscate your winnings.
The above two scenarios is what is playing out. If someone from a particular region is not allowed to play on your site, do a geo block to every IP coming from those regions and that will settle it.

[h4nnmann11]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

no, you got it wrong.
They returned the deposit minus $14,000.

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

Let`s count. I marked all operations in your start post.
You deposited 27,500. Your withdrawals: 12,500; 12,000; 3,000. Summary we get 12,500+12,000+3,000=27,500. So it looks same with your deposit, isn`t it?
May be i mistaken somewhere, but not in maths, may be you missed something or i don`t understand something.

you can find summe of my deposits on this screenshots - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=sharing

there is summe of deposits is 41501.77 USDT
27500 is the most lossing saldo in my account is the moment. After this was depositing and withdrawls togerher.

[mindrust]

Another scum casino that is weaponizing KYC on their customers… Sadly, This is a very common behavior among the shit casinos. It is all good as long as you lose money and when you start winning suddenly Russia, Iran or whatever unpopular country you live in becomes the mother of all problems. This shit has to end. Thanks for sharing this with us, now I know that i will never ever play in this casino even if they were giving outstanding freebies/promotions. Some casinos don’t accept any players from the USA too. When these casinos are in search for an excuse to steal, they will find one. Being Russian, Iranian, American or European, it won’t matter. If they decided to steal from you, they will.

[Stalker22]

OP, I just checked out your complaint on casino.guru.

They are waiting for you to come back with some evidence and screenshots. Have you shared that info with them already? It would be a smart move to do it before the deadline, rather than letting them close the complaint.

[mak013]

you can find summe of my deposits on this screenshots - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=sharing

there is summe of deposits is 41501.77 USDT
27500 is the most lossing saldo in my account is the moment. After this was depositing and withdrawls togerher.

It means i misunderstood, but i counted as it was in the post. Thanks for proves. I don`t need it but it is good that you have it - it can help to attract attention to this casino.
It change situation seriously. In such situation the casino steal your money, and try to prove it using the ToS. And here we see a strange situation again. The gambler mustn`t read the ToS on all languages. If it is translated - we sure that it is equal in all variants. And it means that the gambler didn`t know about any restrictions he has. We best way to casino is to return money to zero balance as for me.

[h4nnmann11]

OP, I just checked out your complaint on casino.guru.

They are waiting for you to come back with some evidence and screenshots. Have you shared that info with them already? It would be a smart move to do it before the deadline, rather than letting them close the complaint.

thanks for the tip

[decodx]

OP undeniably has a case here!

The evidence speaks volumes: their support team openly admitted via email that they implemented the ban on Russian players just about a month ago, which was after OP registered on their site, and they conveniently omitted informing their players about it. To make matters worse, failing to include this rule in the Russian translation of the Terms of Use is like the cherry on top, confirming their lack of transparency. Not to mention their sneaky move of introducing rule 2.1 in place of the existing rule, creating even more confusion between different versions of the Terms of Service. This is not how reputable businesses operate. The proper way would have been to make an amendment to the existing rules with a clearly marked date for the changes.

The casino allowed OP to deposit money and keep playing as long as they were losing. But the moment OP started winning and tried to cash out, the casino pulled the ban card and confiscated the winnings instead of voiding all bets and returning the initial deposit. It's a clear case of selective scamming, or at the very least, a shady practice that deserves a strong disapproval from the community.

[Eureka_07]

That's unfair. It's good to see that you're able to document proofs. They will be of great assistance in this case. Now, I don't believe your winnings will be returned – perhaps only if you file a lawsuit and win. However, this will ultimately harm their reputation, which is a positive outcome if all your claims are indeed true, as they appear to be.

If verification is required, it should be completed before depositing.
<snip>

Doesn't it depend on the casino's own policies? Or should verification be ALWAYS required before a deposit? AFAIK, it may also depend on the jurisdiction they are in.

[TwitchySeal]

OP you seem to have a solid case. 

If you want people to take it seriously, you should change the subject of this thread to something relevant.

[BenCodie]

The case is solid - I have nothing more to add on top of what everyone else has said. It's good to see that the community have been able to rationally look at this situation and validate the case of the OP. This is completely unacceptable behavior from Vave and it is definitely true that this is possibly a race-related case.

Vave should be boycotted from this forum for behaving this way. I am going to post in their thread shortly after this post. Good luck OP.

[Alphie12]

Different rules for each language is shady.

[BenCodie]

Different rules for each language is shady.

The same rules with difficult translation is natural. Completely differing rules (for non-translation reasons) is 100% shady.