vave.com - is a scammers & nationalists

[h4nnmann11]

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

[1714657851]

1714657851

[Mahdirakib]

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

You are right on this point. The clause 2.1 isn't available in the other version of the terms, except English. There are 11 clauses under the "(2) General Terms" in English version, where there are 10 clauses in other language version. Perhaps, they have added the clause 2.1 recently.

BTW, do you still have access to your account? You should share some evidence here to make your claim valid. Screenshot of the deposit and withdrawal history, screenshot of the conversations with their support agent.

[ryzaadit]

Creating a scam assumption would be better.

IMO, it's clear that they're targeting you to avoid the money is being withdrawn from their site:
1. They have rules not being completed same from all-different language
2. They have a restriction, but not stand with their word (If they really care about it, they should block your IP + ask KYC first before make any deposit.

This is one of the shity tactic casino.

[Cantsay]

Perhaps, they have added the clause 2.1 recently.

It could be but there’s no way to verify if they recently added it or it has been like that and the Op didn’t see it.

I tried to check if the site was archived before anything was altered but web archive is not working on my end prolly due to my network. Another thing again, I’m sure that during the time Op started playing at the site his Ip must have been that of Russia why didn’t the site block his account then to prevent usage of their site why wait until Op had that amount before requesting for kyc? It seems like a shady business tbh.

[bitbollo]

in such a case, I would try to talk to the institution that issued their gaming license or to a player's association for support (maybe they have already experienced similar situations).
as a last resort, and to be evaluated, I would consider consulting a lawyer, just to understand how much it is really possible to win such a dispute

[Casdinyard]

Perhaps, they have added the clause 2.1 recently.

It could be but there’s no way to verify if they recently added it or it has been like that and the Op didn’t see it.

I tried to check if the site was archived before anything was altered but web archive is not working on my end prolly due to my network. Another thing again, I’m sure that during the time Op started playing at the site his Ip must have been that of Russia why didn’t the site block his account then to prevent usage of their site why wait until Op had that amount before requesting for kyc? It seems like a shady business tbh.

He has for sure read the clauses of the terms and conditions. Otherwise I don't think he would blow up like this, as well as vave.com taking up the mistake and reinstating access on his account and giving back his money with 3000 on top of that.

There has been a clear mistake on vave's part here which is the lack of transparency on their end. It would've been easy to put out an announcement or a notification on their platform stating that some things will be changed in their terms and conditions, but they still carried on with it not knowing that some of their players have done their homework and read the service agreements before pressing "I agree". I don't think it's particularly racist, although I understand how OP feels since this is a personal attack, but that doesn't mean they could just do it willy-nilly to customers and users.

[Cadaver20]

If verification is required, it should be completed before depositing. And after submitting your kyc documents they sent you $3000 but they kept another $15000. From here it is clear that their only intention is not to let you withdraw your assets. Better avoid this shit casino.

[Alphie12]

Are you geoblocked and have to use a VPN to get in? If you are goeblocked then it's your fault. If not you are getting scammed.

[Johnyz]

Probably not a discrimination but part of the sanction, but if its not on their rules in the first place then why impose it.
Though if I understand this correctly, they just freeze your winning money and didn't let you to get everything which I believe is unusual.
If the site really follow their rules about the withdrawals and the restrictions then better to communicate it with you.
Anyway, stop posting the same comment on their thread your account might be tagged if ever.

[SamReomo]

Are you geoblocked and have to use a VPN to get in? If you are goeblocked then it's your fault. If not you are getting scammed.

If you read the whole thread carefully then you'll know that the OP isn't geo-blocked but instead he's from a country which the casino doesn't allow for sports betting. The OP is from Russia and in 2.1. of "Terms and Conditions" of the casino it is stated that the users from Russia are not allowed to place bet on sports events and unfortunately the clause is only present on English version of the Terms and Conditions and others language versions lack that clause. The user won't be able to place anymore bets of the sports events but he will be able to place bets on other areas of the casino.

I would recommend OP to avoid such casinos because they just add such clauses in their Terms and Conditions to loop money out of our pockets. I don't think that any casino has such clause where players from Russia aren't allowed to take part in sports betting. And, if they have rules where players from Russia can't place bets then they better lock the sports betting for players that are from Russia. They're most probably making up a story to shift the attention of the OP and their intentions don't seem to be good.

[Alphie12]

Are you geoblocked and have to use a VPN to get in? If you are goeblocked then it's your fault. If not you are getting scammed.

If you read the whole thread carefully then you'll know that the OP isn't geo-blocked but instead he's from a country which the casino doesn't allow for sports betting. The OP is from Russia and in 2.1. of "Terms and Conditions" of the casino it is stated that the users from Russia are not allowed to place bet on sports events and unfortunately the clause is only present on English version of the Terms and Conditions and others language versions lack that clause. The user won't be able to place anymore bets of the sports events but he will be able to place bets on other areas of the casino.

I would recommend OP to avoid such casinos because they just add such clauses in their Terms and Conditions to loop money out of our pockets. I don't think that any casino has such clause where players from Russia aren't allowed to take part in sports betting. And, if they have rules where players from Russia can't place bets then they better lock the sports betting for players that are from Russia. They're most probably making up a story to shift the attention of the OP and their intentions don't seem to be good.

If you read his post carefully only the English version bans Russia. He may have not read the English version before playing.

[serjent05]

Creating a scam assumption would be better.

IMO, it's clear that they're targeting you to avoid the money is being withdrawn from their site:
1. They have rules not being completed same from all-different language
2. They have a restriction, but not stand with their word (If they really care about it, they should block your IP + ask KYC first before make any deposit.

This is one of the shity tactic casino.

I agree with you.  It looks like the site has seen a reason to steal the player's money.  I believe the TOS was modified so that @OP will not get his money once his account is in green.  This is not being racist but is a shady casino whose tactic is TOS modification once a player gets a huge amount of winnings and in order to prevent them from withdrawing the funds.

Are you geoblocked and have to use a VPN to get in? If you are goeblocked then it's your fault. If not you are getting scammed.

If you read the whole thread carefully then you'll know that the OP isn't geo-blocked but instead he's from a country which the casino doesn't allow for sports betting. The OP is from Russia and in 2.1. of "Terms and Conditions" of the casino it is stated that the users from Russia are not allowed to place bet on sports events and unfortunately the clause is only present on English version of the Terms and Conditions and others language versions lack that clause. The user won't be able to place anymore bets of the sports events but he will be able to place bets on other areas of the casino.

I would recommend OP to avoid such casinos because they just add such clauses in their Terms and Conditions to loop money out of our pockets. I don't think that any casino has such clause where players from Russia aren't allowed to take part in sports betting. And, if they have rules where players from Russia can't place bets then they better lock the sports betting for players that are from Russia. They're most probably making up a story to shift the attention of the OP and their intentions don't seem to be good.

And since the 2.1 of Terms and Condition is not in other languages, it is possible that it is recently added.  The clause is banning Russian citizens from sports betting, it should also have its Russian translation counterpart because it is addressed to the Russian citizen.

[dothebeats]

An example of how the terms and conditions can be used against players. In this case, since whoever in Vave found out that you're Russian, they believe they can scam you out of your money easily because of the ongoing conflict plus the sanctions imposed against Russia. This is the first time I've heard that a person gets his money confiscated on a gambling platform just because of his nationality. Imagine adding a clause on the terms just to fuck with your players.

Create a scam accusation thread and post all evidence there. Might not get you back your money but you've damaged the site's reputation by doing so.

[OgNasty]

First off, it’s spelled racist. It’s hard to take everything else you say seriously when the subject has a misspelling in the allegation. The terms having an extra clause for the English reading players to me might not be nefarious, but a lack of business resources. Maybe their lawyer gave them that to include in English, but they haven’t hired translators to get it added in other languages also.

[Porfirii]

First off, it’s spelled racist. It’s hard to take everything else you say seriously when the subject has a misspelling in the allegation. The terms having an extra clause for the English reading players to me might not be nefarious, but a lack of business resources. Maybe their lawyer gave them that to include in English, but they haven’t hired translators to get it added in other languages also.

I think so too, because I hace witnessed how many services, not only casinos and not only related to cryptocurrencies, give priority to commercial translations, while the legal ones are treated like secondary info, not really necessary for making money fast, which seems to be the most important. If they don't mind to risk and don't want to avoid legal actions against them is up to them, of course, but it is a bit discouraging to see how many services fail in doing important things like this well.

[davis196]

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item

Just because the Terms and conditions aren't posted in your language that doesn't mean that you are free to break them.
I also live in a country, where English isn't the main language, but I don't expect all the websites in the world to post their Terms of Service in my language.
Vave.com cannot be racist, because race doesn't matter here. I assume that your are white(like most Russians) and the owners of vave.com are also white. I guess that they are just coming up with an excuse to shave your money.
You made an interesting point about the crypto casinos allowing withdrawals only when the player account is "red" (more money lost than won).
When the account becomes green (more money won than lost) all those verifications and problems begin to appear.
I guess that's why I never had any problems with withdrawals. My accounts aren't "green".

[EKoston]

really strange case here

but ím wondering how OP were able to get such high amount, i got limited after winning 800 Dollar

[piebeyb]

The first thing when you accuse something related to your money or what you mean by racism is the most important thing is a screenshot, because everyone can make up stories to bring down certain casinos especially if you are also a beginner account, so you have to understand that how you do it To bring people's attention here to your problem, I'm not defending the casino because I just think we should be fair.

So there is no intention to defend anyone here, I also definitely will not be happy if there are racist acts in gambling because in my opinion it will never look fair, so I hope you have strong evidence such as screenshots or other evidence that can be published here it is getting better, especially on the fraud accusation board, because without it you will be said to be making up and many people will ignore your problem. I hope your problem will be resolved soon by Vave 

[Crypt0Gore]

I will like to know why you choose to use vave, This is the first time someone will mention this casino on here as I am new to it, but I do know that they are offering some free spins if you use some promo code, I bet this will attract a lot of people, the number of the free spin is 100+ and they claimed it will maximize the chances of winning jackpot.

I also do some research about this website and the reviews I can find are those that content creators made on Medium and Reddit, I believe those are paid advertisements and not real reviews from users, which is why I asked why you chose this platform instead of many popular options out there.

Accept things the way they are, there is nothing you can do, this normally happen with online casinos that are not doing so well, they later resort to cheating their customer's funds and blaming them as if they are the ones at fault.

Next time, pick from the list of the best online casinos, you've learned a lesson I hope.

[ryzaadit]

-snip-

No every person is a forum geek + not everyone is from bitcointalk.

Most of the people/user who are facing a problem with (unknown casinos) are not quite popular are users who just registered on bitcointalk. They register in here due facing the problem and don't know anything about the forum.

Expecting by creating a forum thread, at least their problem can be solved. You cannot blame he at all due not everyone came from here, even he played casino with a list pick (most of the time they will search in internet) and the list pick are from paid article.

[FatFork]

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item

Just because the Terms and conditions aren't posted in your language that doesn't mean that you are free to break them.
I also live in a country, where English isn't the main language, but I don't expect all the websites in the world to post their Terms of Service in my language.

Did you take a look at the website? They did publish the Terms in his language (Russian), but conveniently left out the clause that restricts sports betting for players from Russia. What's more, the OP claims that they added the restriction after he had already used the sportsbook, which means, from a legal perspective, he has every right to complain.

Vave.com cannot be racist, because race doesn't matter here. I assume that your are white(like most Russians) and the owners of vave.com are also white.

LOL! You do understand that racism is not only about the color of your skin? 

Racism is discrimination and prejudice towards people based on their race or ethnicity.

[Odusko]

If verification is required, it should be completed before depositing. And after submitting your kyc documents they sent you $3000 but they kept another $15000. From here it is clear that their only intention is not to let you withdraw your assets. Better avoid this shit casino.

The casino is making attempts to withhold the ops money and irrespective pf what their call it as a practice,  KYC verification should have been the highest level of that requirement so at that point where ops passed the KYC and were allowed to withdraw $3,000 he should have been allowed to withdraw the total amount instead of the casino still holding back 15,000 of the remaining balance.

But then also this is what has always been evident with the shiny casinos we have around, they accept any amount of deposits but when it comes to withdrawal, they will set various rules and regulations.

[acroman08]

@OP have you asked them when they added that rules? because if they added that months after the war between Ukraine and Russia, I would have assumed at this points that they would have a translated version of that rules in Russian and other languages.

would you mind posting screenshots of your conversation with their support. also, I'd suggest to refrain from spamming the same thing on their ANN thread, you could get banned from doing it.

really strange case here

but ím wondering how OP were able to get such high amount, i got limited after winning 800 Dollar

not everyone gets limited after winning several hundred dollars.

[Gozie51]

2. They have a restriction, but not stand with their word (If they really care about it, they should block your IP + ask KYC first before make any deposit.

This is one of the shity tactic casino.

I was to say this also. I read their Terms and conditions

2.1.      Any kind of sports betting or live betting for players from Russia is strictly prohibited. We reserve the right to confiscate funds and block an account if it is proven that sports betting was made by a Russian citizen.

2.2.      Should any of these rules be violated, the Company reserves the right to refuse to pay any winnings or to refund stakes, as well as to cancel any bets. The Company shall not be liable in relation to the moment when they become aware that the customer falls within any of the aforementioned categories. This means that the Company shall be entitled to take the above measures at any time once they have become aware that the customer is an individual who can be designated as above.

Depending on when these clauses were added to their rules like you claimed they were not there at the time you registered, they should have made effort to identify your IP or restricted Russian IP from registering on their website to safe everyone the headache.

My question is did you evade any registration process or using VPN? If you are not guilty of violating registration procedure then they should be able to identify you were registering from Russia.

[CryptSafe]

Sometimes some cases I read here sounds very funny tough. Casinos too can be this funny too. For such a long time a client been playing and on negative and they kept silent over it and did not stop the loss. OP made deposit and they did not ask OP for KYC to verify OPs identity but when OP started to win and beginning to make withdrawal there comes the  KYC policies and terms of services. I wonder when all these bruhaha with casinos would stop. Why not state you terms and conditions of service and engagement clear for prospective members to see while doings things with shady intentions to hold perceived members down to ransom. Its not fair though and the spate at which such issues is coming forte is not good.

OP your complaint is some worth sincere but it would require you to go the extra miles in uploading a proof for members to see because just this is not enough to convince members to believe you are saying the real thing as it happened.

[Cadaver20]

If verification is required, it should be completed before depositing. And after submitting your kyc documents they sent you $3000 but they kept another $15000. From here it is clear that their only intention is not to let you withdraw your assets. Better avoid this shit casino.

The casino is making attempts to withhold the ops money and irrespective pf what their call it as a practice,  KYC verification should have been the highest level of that requirement so at that point where ops passed the KYC and were allowed to withdraw $3,000 he should have been allowed to withdraw the total amount instead of the casino still holding back 15,000 of the remaining balance.

But then also this is what has always been evident with the shiny casinos we have around, they accept any amount of deposits but when it comes to withdrawal, they will set various rules and regulations.

Here I see that all the efforts of this casino are just to not allow OP to withdraw his winning money. That is, they just want to deposit your money, lose your money and don't think to withdraw your money.

[light_warrior]

This is some kind of spammer. Spammed the entire casino topic with his identical posts. Wrote there in a row as many as 7 identical posts. And plus there casino representative has already responded to him. And this spammer was on the forum today, but did not comment. And most importantly, the casino representative referred to the Russian language page of the casino rules, which clearly states that quote "In the event of there being a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version will prevail".

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5433885.msg62741338#msg62741338

[Alphie12]

This is some kind of spammer. Spammed the entire casino topic with his identical posts. Wrote there in a row as many as 7 identical posts. And plus there casino representative has already responded to him. And this spammer was on the forum today, but did not comment. And most importantly, the casino representative referred to the Russian language page of the casino rules, which clearly states that quote "In the event of there being a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version will prevail".

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5433885.msg62741338#msg62741338

OP was tricked with two sets of rules but the spamming makes it tough to side with him.

[Bushdark]

Sometimes some cases I read here sounds very funny tough. Casinos too can be this funny too. For such a long time a client been playing and on negative and they kept silent over it and did not stop the loss. OP made deposit and they did not ask OP for KYC to verify OPs identity but when OP started to win and beginning to make withdrawal there comes the  KYC policies and terms of services. I wonder when all these bruhaha with casinos would stop. Why not state you terms and conditions of service and engagement clear for prospective members to see while doings things with shady intentions to hold perceived members down to ransom. Its not fair though and the spate at which such issues is coming forte is not good.

OP your complaint is some worth sincere but it would require you to go the extra miles in uploading a proof for members to see because just this is not enough to convince members to believe you are saying the real thing as it happened.

The power that casinos have is when they have your money in there possession. This is a pretty understandable situation because I still don't imagine why they is a ban when you are from Russia using there English version while the native version has no restriction.
Is there something we are not getting right? There is more explanation to what op had explained because I don't know why a casino will be racist on just one country.

[Webetcoins]

Creating a scam assumption would be better.

IMO, it's clear that they're targeting you to avoid the money is being withdrawn from their site:
1. They have rules not being completed same from all-different language
2. They have a restriction, but not stand with their word (If they really care about it, they should block your IP + ask KYC first before make any deposit.

This is one of the shity tactic casino.

Well, we can't really call this a scam since they didn't run away with the money or banned him without saying anything and they were even allowing him to make withdrawals as long as his account was negative because he had made higher deposits, but right after he got an upper hand and wanted to withdraw some profit, they refused to pay and they thought of an excuse where they would say that people from his country are not allowed to bet on sports.

I know this is totally wrong because as you said, if this rule was there from the beginning, they should have banned him right after he created his account and tried making his first deposit because his IP address was not hidden and they even allowed him to make withdrawals earlier. Maybe if creating a scam accusation can help him in some way, he should go for it with all the evidence.

[uneng]

This is some kind of spammer. Spammed the entire casino topic with his identical posts. Wrote there in a row as many as 7 identical posts. And plus there casino representative has already responded to him. And this spammer was on the forum today, but did not comment. And most importantly, the casino representative referred to the Russian language page of the casino rules, which clearly states that quote "In the event of there being a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version will prevail".

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5433885.msg62741338#msg62741338

OP was tricked with two sets of rules but the spamming makes it tough to side with him.

It doesn't change the fact the casino's rules are dubious and confusing. It's not the duty of the customer to investigate every translations of the set of rules minuciously trying to find discrepancies between them when signing up at an online platform.

The casino even gave him 3000$ back as goodwill gesture, so why not to give him his 18,000$ and ban his account after that? Then I would believe that is a goodwill gesture, because the way it was done was simply a cunning gesture.

A ban against russians for the reason we know very well which one it is should be explicitly stated on the website, including the signing up screen.

[Hispo]

-

OP was tricked with two sets of rules but the spamming makes it tough to side with him.

A ban against russians for the reason we know very well which one it is should be explicitly stated on the website, including the signing up screen.

I agree on that. It could easily avoid a lot of people to go through the tiring process of asking for their money and not even mentioning the waiting times before receiving a refund.    But I guess they know if they do that there is a chance they could lose volume and money; the volume on any online casino is life the blood which keeps it alive after all.

Also, unlike OP, I would not call this a racist measure taken by a casino; this falls more properly within the category of indirect deception against all gamblers which do not know how to read English well enough. It is nothing personal against the people of Russian but rather lack of attention to distribution of information for the sake of gains.

Anyways, hopefully this bad experience won't even repeat again to you, OP. 

[solsolsols]

Do I understand correctly that you only won $1.5k from their bookie but they still confiscated $15k? If so, that's thieft 

I tried to find when they changed the TOS with no luck but my Russian friend successfully verified his account no more than a week ago and withdrew all his winnings, so it must be a very recent change. He also told me that Sportsbook is no longer available to him, so it's not really clear how you violate their TOS if they just disabled Sportsbook for any Russian player right after the TOS change.

Personally, I had a similar case when the casino put my country on the list of banned countries and retroactively canceled my winnings, but after complaining to the licensor, they obliged to pay out every penny.

[decodx]

I've already asked about this in their ANN thread. The key question here is when exactly they introduced the restriction for Russian citizens in their Terms of Service. Also, I'm curious why Russia isn't listed among the other restricted countries, especially if it's supposedly a requirement from their licensee, as they claim.

If this is a recent inclusion in their terms, which seems likely considering they haven't updated the other languages, then they have no right to confiscate the player's funds. In that case, the player's winnings are valid and should be rightfully upheld.

[Casdinyard]

Are you geoblocked and have to use a VPN to get in? If you are goeblocked then it's your fault. If not you are getting scammed.

you might wanna read upon his post further. He literally said that he once was able to withdraw money form vave.com until he tried one day to do so and was disallowed, he got hit with a new change in their terms agreement that specifically bars russians from playing in their site. Such a change was weird and so they contacted him, under which they compensated the guy for the trouble with some extra as well. This is clear admission of guilt and a massive misplay on vave's part. Not in any way whatsoever the gambler's fault. He's borderline scammed if not for the fact that they paid him back his winnings and extra bonus for the trouble. which reinforces the fact that these gambling sites and casinos should always inform their players of changes like these.

[wxa7115]

Perhaps, they have added the clause 2.1 recently.

It could be but there’s no way to verify if they recently added it or it has been like that and the Op didn’t see it.

I tried to check if the site was archived before anything was altered but web archive is not working on my end prolly due to my network. Another thing again, I’m sure that during the time Op started playing at the site his Ip must have been that of Russia why didn’t the site block his account then to prevent usage of their site why wait until Op had that amount before requesting for kyc? It seems like a shady business tbh.

It is possible the cached version of the casino exists somewhere on the Internet and in that case we could verify when that clause was added, if it was there before the third withdrawal of the OP then as bad as this looks the casino will be on the right, especially with that clause which states the English version of the terms of service supersede the rest.

However if this was a recent addition to their terms and it appeared after the third withdrawal attempt by the OP, then they are on the right and this is just an attempt to scam a player using a cheap excuse.

[bettercrypto]

According to what I understood from your story, it's very clear that they don't want to give you what you won; that's the only reason I saw why they did that. Maybe that's just a thank you, no matter how you got out what you deposited somehow.

It seems that those kinds of casinos are very hard to trust, and I found that the casino platform did something wrong, to be honest. Maybe that's good; at least you saw the motive and intention of the gambling platform.

[noormcs5]

It seems that those kinds of casinos are very hard to trust, and I found that the casino platform did something wrong, to be honest. Maybe that's good; at least you saw the motive and intention of the gambling platform.

I do not know why people trust these casinos and they do not do homework to find out about the credibility of the casino before actually depositing and playing at the casino.

A simple search about vave.com at scam adviser. and you can well understand that it is not safe to play at this casino. I guess we need to understand that we should research thoroughly about the casino before putting our money in the casino.

[h4nnmann11]

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

You are right on this point. The clause 2.1 isn't available in the other version of the terms, except English. There are 11 clauses under the "(2) General Terms" in English version, where there are 10 clauses in other language version. Perhaps, they have added the clause 2.1 recently.

BTW, do you still have access to your account? You should share some evidence here to make your claim valid. Screenshot of the deposit and withdrawal history, screenshot of the conversations with their support agent.

yes, i have access to my account. In their rules it is written that they block players from Russia, but I am forbidden to place sports bets, but the account is not blocked.
ye i have a screenshots
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=drive_link

[h4nnmann11]

@OP have you asked them when they added that rules? because if they added that months after the war between Ukraine and Russia, I would have assumed at this points that they would have a translated version of that rules in Russian and other languages.

would you mind posting screenshots of your conversation with their support. also, I'd suggest to refrain from spamming the same thing on their ANN thread, you could get banned from doing it.

really strange case here

but ím wondering how OP were able to get such high amount, i got limited after winning 800 Dollar

not everyone gets limited after winning several hundred dollars.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=drive_link
there is a screenshots

[h4nnmann11]

2. They have a restriction, but not stand with their word (If they really care about it, they should block your IP + ask KYC first before make any deposit.

This is one of the shity tactic casino.

I was to say this also. I read their Terms and conditions

2.1.      Any kind of sports betting or live betting for players from Russia is strictly prohibited. We reserve the right to confiscate funds and block an account if it is proven that sports betting was made by a Russian citizen.

2.2.      Should any of these rules be violated, the Company reserves the right to refuse to pay any winnings or to refund stakes, as well as to cancel any bets. The Company shall not be liable in relation to the moment when they become aware that the customer falls within any of the aforementioned categories. This means that the Company shall be entitled to take the above measures at any time once they have become aware that the customer is an individual who can be designated as above.

Depending on when these clauses were added to their rules like you claimed they were not there at the time you registered, they should have made effort to identify your IP or restricted Russian IP from registering on their website to safe everyone the headache.

My question is did you evade any registration process or using VPN? If you are not guilty of violating registration procedure then they should be able to identify you were registering from Russia.

I used proxy. But the problem is that my friends used vave.com through a proxy and went through KYC in July 2023 on their Russian documents and everything was fine and KYC was successful. My friends recommended vave.com to me.

[h4nnmann11]

Sometimes some cases I read here sounds very funny tough. Casinos too can be this funny too. For such a long time a client been playing and on negative and they kept silent over it and did not stop the loss. OP made deposit and they did not ask OP for KYC to verify OPs identity but when OP started to win and beginning to make withdrawal there comes the  KYC policies and terms of services. I wonder when all these bruhaha with casinos would stop. Why not state you terms and conditions of service and engagement clear for prospective members to see while doings things with shady intentions to hold perceived members down to ransom. Its not fair though and the spate at which such issues is coming forte is not good.

OP your complaint is some worth sincere but it would require you to go the extra miles in uploading a proof for members to see because just this is not enough to convince members to believe you are saying the real thing as it happened.

proof of my complaint
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=sharing

[decodx]

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=drive_link
there is a screenshots

As you're still new to the forum and can't upload pictures yet, I'd be happy to re-share your screenshots in a more user-friendly format.

[h4nnmann11]

Do I understand correctly that you only won $1.5k from their bookie but they still confiscated $15k? If so, that's thieft 

I tried to find when they changed the TOS with no luck but my Russian friend successfully verified his account no more than a week ago and withdrew all his winnings, so it must be a very recent change. He also told me that Sportsbook is no longer available to him, so it's not really clear how you violate their TOS if they just disabled Sportsbook for any Russian player right after the TOS change.

Personally, I had a similar case when the casino put my country on the list of banned countries and retroactively canceled my winnings, but after complaining to the licensor, they obliged to pay out every penny.

yes, you understood everything correctly. My account was red (lost more than won) and the payouts were going well. As soon as my account went green (won $1.5k more than I lost) they requested KYC and took my $18k winnings.

[h4nnmann11]

@OP have you asked them when they added that rules? because if they added that months after the war between Ukraine and Russia, I would have assumed at this points that they would have a translated version of that rules in Russian and other languages.

would you mind posting screenshots of your conversation with their support. also, I'd suggest to refrain from spamming the same thing on their ANN thread, you could get banned from doing it.

really strange case here

but ím wondering how OP were able to get such high amount, i got limited after winning 800 Dollar

not everyone gets limited after winning several hundred dollars.

vave.com didn't reply to me when they added the item about Russian players.

[decodx]

@OP have you asked them when they added that rules? because if they added that months after the war between Ukraine and Russia, I would have assumed at this points that they would have a translated version of that rules in Russian and other languages.

would you mind posting screenshots of your conversation with their support. also, I'd suggest to refrain from spamming the same thing on their ANN thread, you could get banned from doing it.

really strange case here

but ím wondering how OP were able to get such high amount, i got limited after winning 800 Dollar

not everyone gets limited after winning several hundred dollars.

vave.com didn't reply to me when they added the item about Russian players.

I noticed that the casino staff confirmed in one of the emails that the current terms and conditions had been newly implemented on their website by the casino management. However, they avoided addressing whether these conditions were in place before you registered on the website or not. To me, this strongly suggests the casino's questionable behavior, indicating their main goal was to confiscate your funds as soon as your balance turned positive.

Also, if the casino actually wants to stick to their own rules, they should give you a full refund instead of just turning down the winning bets while taking the losing ones.

[h4nnmann11]

Are you geoblocked and have to use a VPN to get in? If you are goeblocked then it's your fault. If not you are getting scammed.

you might wanna read upon his post further. He literally said that he once was able to withdraw money form vave.com until he tried one day to do so and was disallowed, he got hit with a new change in their terms agreement that specifically bars russians from playing in their site. Such a change was weird and so they contacted him, under which they compensated the guy for the trouble with some extra as well. This is clear admission of guilt and a massive misplay on vave's part. Not in any way whatsoever the gambler's fault. He's borderline scammed if not for the fact that they paid him back his winnings and extra bonus for the trouble. which reinforces the fact that these gambling sites and casinos should always inform their players of changes like these.

they gave away only $3,000 of the $17,000 deposit. And the account had $18,000. That is, they did not return my money to me and did not return any bonus on top of the payment.

[Coin_trader]

Do I understand correctly that you only won $1.5k from their bookie but they still confiscated $15k? If so, that's thieft 

I tried to find when they changed the TOS with no luck but my Russian friend successfully verified his account no more than a week ago and withdrew all his winnings, so it must be a very recent change. He also told me that Sportsbook is no longer available to him, so it's not really clear how you violate their TOS if they just disabled Sportsbook for any Russian player right after the TOS change.

Personally, I had a similar case when the casino put my country on the list of banned countries and retroactively canceled my winnings, but after complaining to the licensor, they obliged to pay out every penny.

yes, you understood everything correctly. My account was red (lost more than won) and the payouts were going well. As soon as my account went green (won $1.5k more than I lost) they requested KYC and took my $18k winnings.

By your definition of “winnings” means your original bankroll plus your 1.5K profit is hostage on the casino?

Do you read their ToS before you play? They knew the fact that Russian players is typically restricted to play in the online casino due to the license requirements. They are using this to hostage your money which they really have a claim in technical perspective due to ToS violation. I’m not aware how the ToS of Vave.com looks like but reading their recent answer to your queries seems like they using your locality as trump card to hold your funds which is really shady.

But they should atleast refund your original balance and confiscate only your profit. This is the downside on playing to casino that you knew that you are violating their ToS simce your country is sanctioned on most services outside your country. They will surely allow you to play and lose but they will do this scammy trick when you are on profit side.

[h4nnmann11]

Do I understand correctly that you only won $1.5k from their bookie but they still confiscated $15k? If so, that's thieft 

I tried to find when they changed the TOS with no luck but my Russian friend successfully verified his account no more than a week ago and withdrew all his winnings, so it must be a very recent change. He also told me that Sportsbook is no longer available to him, so it's not really clear how you violate their TOS if they just disabled Sportsbook for any Russian player right after the TOS change.

Personally, I had a similar case when the casino put my country on the list of banned countries and retroactively canceled my winnings, but after complaining to the licensor, they obliged to pay out every penny.

yes, you understood everything correctly. My account was red (lost more than won) and the payouts were going well. As soon as my account went green (won $1.5k more than I lost) they requested KYC and took my $18k winnings.

By your definition of “winnings” means your original bankroll plus your 1.5K profit is hostage on the casino?

Do you read their ToS before you play? They knew the fact that Russian players is typically restricted to play in the online casino due to the license requirements. They are using this to hostage your money which they really have a claim in technical perspective due to ToS violation. I’m not aware how the ToS of Vave.com looks like but reading their recent answer to your queries seems like they using your locality as trump card to hold your funds which is really shady.

But they should atleast refund your original balance and confiscate only your profit. This is the downside on playing to casino that you knew that you are violating their ToS simce your country is sanctioned on most services outside your country. They will surely allow you to play and lose but they will do this scammy trick when you are on profit side.

[/quote]
By your definition of “winnings” means your original bankroll plus your 1.5K profit is hostage on the casino?
[/quote]


you understood correctly about winning. But specifically about the casino, they have a clause and there are players from Belarus, Curacao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, United Kingdom, United States of America, Cyprus, France, Netherlands and that they are forbidden to play games on vave.com. And about Russian players, it was just said that you can’t make sports bets.

[h4nnmann11]

vave still added item 2.1. in the rules in Russian. Looks like they did it today or yesterday. Because 2 days ago I went there and there was no this item. https://vave.com/en/information/terms-and-conditions




they also answered that they introduced this rule about Russian players less than a month ago. So they had to notify me about this, since I was already an active player and at least give back my deposits.

proof - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/11_5q2BfKJnV7jA4fx4cbVjHR_kJHuAHX?usp=drive_link

[decodx]

vave still added item 2.1. in the rules in Russian. Looks like they did it today or yesterday. Because 2 days ago I went there and there was no this item. https://vave.com/en/information/terms-and-conditions




they also answered that they introduced this rule about Russian players less than a month ago. So they had to notify me about this, since I was already an active player and at least give back my deposits.

proof - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/11_5q2BfKJnV7jA4fx4cbVjHR_kJHuAHX?usp=drive_link

I also noticed that they inserted rule 2.1 into their Terms of Service (Russian translation) today. This particular item wasn't there yesterday.

Have you considered bringing your case to their licensor and filing a formal complaint? Also, since it seems like you're in the right here, why not explore third-party mediation? In my experience, the following are reputable mediators:

https://thepogg.com/
https://www.casinomeister.com/
https://casino.guru/
https://www.askgamblers.com/
Even if they choose not to respond to any of the mediators listed above, it could still negatively impact their reputation on those platforms.


ps. I edited your quote to show the screenshots.

[h4nnmann11]

vave still added item 2.1. in the rules in Russian. Looks like they did it today or yesterday. Because 2 days ago I went there and there was no this item. https://vave.com/en/information/terms-and-conditions




they also answered that they introduced this rule about Russian players less than a month ago. So they had to notify me about this, since I was already an active player and at least give back my deposits.

proof - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/11_5q2BfKJnV7jA4fx4cbVjHR_kJHuAHX?usp=drive_link

I also noticed that they inserted rule 2.1 into their Terms of Service (Russian translation) today. This particular item wasn't there yesterday.

Have you considered bringing your case to their licensor and filing a formal complaint? Also, since it seems like you're in the right here, why not explore third-party mediation? In my experience, the following are reputable mediators:

https://thepogg.com/
https://www.casinomeister.com/
https://casino.guru/
https://www.askgamblers.com/
Even if they choose not to respond to any of the mediators listed above, it could still negatively impact their reputation on those platforms.


ps. I edited your quote to show the screenshots.

thanks for the help. I appreciate it.

[Slow death]

This is some kind of spammer. Spammed the entire casino topic with his identical posts. Wrote there in a row as many as 7 identical posts. And plus there casino representative has already responded to him. And this spammer was on the forum today, but did not comment. And most importantly, the casino representative referred to the Russian language page of the casino rules, which clearly states that quote "In the event of there being a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version will prevail".

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5433885.msg62741338#msg62741338

I don't think he created many threads, he only created this thread and posted it on the casino's ann thread, I don't see how that would be spam


well, as far as i know ( i could be wrong ) but the sanctions are not prohibiting all citizens of russia not to play in online casinos, now if i am wrong and online casinos are prohibited from accepting people from russia then even if in the casino's totes do not mention anything about Russian citizens they could confiscate your money claiming that they are complying with international laws. From what I read of the response from their representative at this casino, he said that the casino did not confiscate anything, I confess that I did not understand what he means by that, if he is saying that they did not confiscate anything in your account and you are saying that you had money at the casino, then he said he asked you to send your username, you already sent him your username?

something that I see as being very strange is that the casino representative here on the forum ran to say that there was no deduction of money from your account, funny that he says that he found that, but when you showed him that money was deducted from your account then he then asked you for your username to go check your problem, I wonder why the casino representative ran to say that there was no deduction in your account and he still says that he found it, but then he asked you for your data? this is not a good sign, it looks like the casino is creating some kind of excuse for not paying you mainly because then it says that people from russia cannot use the casino, with that it is already clear that unfortunately these guys are not going to get you pay nothing

they already have an argument for not paying you, in their next answer they will say that because you are a Russian citizen and you have used the casino, so they cannot pay you and your account will be closed, I hope I am wrong in my prediction, but knowing the new casinos , I do not doubt that these will be their next answers, unfortunately casino tos are used as weapons by many new casinos, even when there is nothing in the tos they will add something to serve as an argument for not paying

[h4nnmann11]

This is some kind of spammer. Spammed the entire casino topic with his identical posts. Wrote there in a row as many as 7 identical posts. And plus there casino representative has already responded to him. And this spammer was on the forum today, but did not comment. And most importantly, the casino representative referred to the Russian language page of the casino rules, which clearly states that quote "In the event of there being a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version will prevail".

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5433885.msg62741338#msg62741338

I don't think he created many threads, he only created this thread and posted it on the casino's ann thread, I don't see how that would be spam


well, as far as i know ( i could be wrong ) but the sanctions are not prohibiting all citizens of russia not to play in online casinos, now if i am wrong and online casinos are prohibited from accepting people from russia then even if in the casino's totes do not mention anything about Russian citizens they could confiscate your money claiming that they are complying with international laws. From what I read of the response from their representative at this casino, he said that the casino did not confiscate anything, I confess that I did not understand what he means by that, if he is saying that they did not confiscate anything in your account and you are saying that you had money at the casino, then he said he asked you to send your username, you already sent him your username?

something that I see as being very strange is that the casino representative here on the forum ran to say that there was no deduction of money from your account, funny that he says that he found that, but when you showed him that money was deducted from your account then he then asked you for your username to go check your problem, I wonder why the casino representative ran to say that there was no deduction in your account and he still says that he found it, but then he asked you for your data? this is not a good sign, it looks like the casino is creating some kind of excuse for not paying you mainly because then it says that people from russia cannot use the casino, with that it is already clear that unfortunately these guys are not going to get you pay nothing

they already have an argument for not paying you, in their next answer they will say that because you are a Russian citizen and you have used the casino, so they cannot pay you and your account will be closed, I hope I am wrong in my prediction, but knowing the new casinos , I do not doubt that these will be their next answers, unfortunately casino tos are used as weapons by many new casinos, even when there is nothing in the tos they will add something to serve as an argument for not paying

sent them my username and e-mail registered on vave in telegram. So far, no one has answered.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

That's tough luck.
But it's the usual way these sites conduct their business. As long as you are down, no problem. As soon as you want to withdraw "their money", here come the KYC mail and further problems.

Changing the TOS without informing the players has been seen a lot lately. Stake does this all the time recently, they don't care if people read the new rules as long as they are protected by them.

People accept the rules when the register. Newly implemented rules clearly must be pointed out. I don't understand why that would be so hard, just send an email to all existing players that the TOS have changed, case closed.
Them changing the rules now, and you have proof of that, might play into your case against them. Maybe you can file a complaint at askgamblers or one of those other mediation sites.

I really hope the matter can be solved but given the history of casinos making changes as a disadvantage to the players I clearly doubt it, at least without any outside help.

By the way, I also have never heard of this site. Why deposit so much money at a relatively unknown gambling site is always beyond my understanding. I wouldn't take that risk. Those sites have 0 reputation and even making this case public will not really be interesting for them.

[Porfirii]

-snip-

Changing the TOS without informing the players has been seen a lot lately. Stake does this all the time recently, they don't care if people read the new rules as long as they are protected by them.

People accept the rules when the register. Newly implemented rules clearly must be pointed out. I don't understand why that would be so hard, just send an email to all existing players that the TOS have changed, case closed.
Them changing the rules now, and you have proof of that, might play into your case against them. Maybe you can file a complaint at askgamblers or one of those other mediation sites.

I really hope the matter can be solved but given the history of casinos making changes as a disadvantage to the players I clearly doubt it, at least without any outside help.

I have seen a few TOS which stated that changes in the rules would have some kind of vacatio legis of 15 days, so during that time they are not firm and you can make the corresponding decisions. Of course, this is tricky because, if they don't notify you about these changes, it is difficult to constantly monitor the TOS of all the services you use, as long as you don't dedicate professionally to it, but that's the way these things work in the internet, not only in gambling.

By the way, I also have never heard of this site. Why deposit so much money at a relatively unknown gambling site is always beyond my understanding. I wouldn't take that risk. Those sites have 0 reputation and even making this case public will not really be interesting for them.

That's a mystery to me too AHOYBRAUSE: we keep seeing cases like that and we keep asking ourselves "why!?". There are so many tested platforms, why would anybody deposit such amounts at an unknown one with zero reputation?

[Cadaver20]

sent them my username and e-mail registered on vave in telegram. So far, no one has answered.

They will not respond to your message. As long as you keep losing your money in these casinos, the rules & regulations will be fine. Whenever you win and try to withdraw money, problems will start. If you win too much money, your account will be banned. This is their policy.

[decodx]

By the way, I also have never heard of this site. Why deposit so much money at a relatively unknown gambling site is always beyond my understanding. I wouldn't take that risk. Those sites have 0 reputation and even making this case public will not really be interesting for them.

That's a mystery to me too AHOYBRAUSE: we keep seeing cases like that and we keep asking ourselves "why!?". There are so many tested platforms, why would anybody deposit such amounts at an unknown one with zero reputation?

I can't speak for the OP, but I can share from my own experience. When I first started gambling, I was completely clueless. I had no idea which platforms were trustworthy or reputable, and I was pretty lost when it came to finding them. In the early days, I experimented with different online casinos. Luckily, back then, strict KYC verification wasn't a big thing, so I didn't have to share my real personal info. I basically judged casinos based on my own experience. Needless to say, my experiences weren't always rosy. It wasn't until later that I stumbled upon this forum and other reputable casino review sites like BTCGOSU and the like.

So, I don't really feel like it's fair to pass judgment on the OP for going with a casino that isn't popular here. Perhaps the casino has some popularity within his local community or social circle. Maybe he stumbled upon an ad or a special promo offer that caught his attention. Or maybe he had some other valid reason for picking that casino. However, that doesn't give the casino a free pass to pull a scam on players.

[TwitchySeal]

If the clause that explains that Russian players will have their funds seized if they make certain wagers is excluded from the Russian terms, and the player is able to make a wager without being warned, then I consider it unethical to enforce the terms.

Adding it to the Russian terms after a player with frozen funds points out that it was missing, and then still refusing to pay the player just makes them look even more shady.

Even if it were included in the Russian terms, if they don't give a warning or anything and allow a player to make the wager the same as any other non restricted wager, I would still consider it unethical.  If players from Russia aren't allowed to make sports wagers, then don't offer sports wagers to players from Russia.  Seizing player funds should not be part of your business model.

Maybe their lawyer gave them that to include in English, but they haven’t hired translators to get it added in other languages also.

Hired translators?  It's 2023 and they're running a crypto casino. 

[jostorres]

I've already asked about this in their ANN thread. The key question here is when exactly they introduced the restriction for Russian citizens in their Terms of Service. Also, I'm curious why Russia isn't listed among the other restricted countries, especially if it's supposedly a requirement from their licensee, as they claim.

If this is a recent inclusion in their terms, which seems likely considering they haven't updated the other languages, then they have no right to confiscate the player's funds. In that case, the player's winnings are valid and should be rightfully upheld.

What you said is true, but who is the rule maker around there? It's them! We can't make them pay OP whatever they owe him as long as they don't want to, and since they have already added the clause in their terms and conditions, we can't prove that they have added that recently unless one of us or maybe OP has a screenshot of the same position of terms and conditions from before the inclusion of the new rule which will prove that they are lying.

If we can't prove that they have added the rule recently, after the winnings of OP, only so that they don't have to pay him his winnings, then we might have a case against the platform, otherwise, I don't see them being good enough to be willing to pay him what he has won without dragging this matter much.

[Zoomic]

I Think Op has a case

Let us therefore re-examine the following points from Op;

• Op claimed that rule 2.1 was not in the ToS when he registered although he might not have evidence
• Op said that the rule of Rusia restriction is only available in the English version.  This shows that the edit was hastily done
• Another factor for determination is if Russia IP was blocked in the site and Op used VPN. If this is so, Op could be at fault,  especially if there is a rule not to conceal IP
• Op, consider to use a legal means if you are sure you didn't default no 3. I am sure Russia  blocks access to certain websites and vice versa

[mak013]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

I Think Op has a case

Let us therefore re-examine the following points from Op;

• Op claimed that rule 2.1 was not in the ToS when he registered although he might not have evidence
• Op said that the rule of Rusia restriction is only available in the English version.  This shows that the edit was hastily done
• Another factor for determination is if Russia IP was blocked in the site and Op used VPN. If this is so, Op could be at fault,  especially if there is a rule not to conceal IP
• Op, consider to use a legal means if you are sure you didn't default no 3. I am sure Russia  blocks access to certain websites and vice versa

100% he has a case.
The last proof he needed was them adding the Russian version of the updated term to their TOS.
Why else would they do this right after this incident if not recognizing they made a huge mistake, which they truely did.
This practice it very shady and deserves more light.

They are basically freerolling this customer, not more and not less.

At least they are kind of represented in our forum, this topic has be brought up in their ANN already. Their reply was only:

Hi,
Please note that any kind of sports betting or live betting for players from Russia is strictly prohibited and it's a requirement of our licensee. Also, we reserve the right to confiscate funds and block an account if it is proven that sports betting was made by a Russian citizen.
https://vave.com/information/terms-and-conditions
Thank you.

Kind of ridiculous.

[seoincorporation]

I was reading the ToS from the site Vave, and they give us a list of the countries that aren't allowed on the casino, but they never mention Russia in that list:

3.6. Players from Belarus, Cyprus, Curaçao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, France, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States of America are not allowed to play for real money to wager on Vave games.

And I agree with OP point, the fact that casinos only ask for KYC when the users are making some profit is a nasty move, and they should give a warning to the users before he make more deposits.

[acroman08]

I was reading the ToS from the site Vave, and they give us a list of the countries that aren't allowed on the casino, but they never mention Russia in that list:

3.6. Players from Belarus, Cyprus, Curaçao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, France, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States of America are not allowed to play for real money to wager on Vave games.

It is on "general terms 2.1"(which is kind of weird), the gambling support claims that the rule is recently implemented, how recent? I am not sure. if you ask me, I feel like the rule was only implemented when they found out OP was from Russia because they didn't want to pay his withdrawal and they have the "perfect" excuse as to why Russians aren't allowed to bet on sports betting or live betting(it is also weird that Russians are only prohibited on those two sections).

[h4nnmann11]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

no, you got it wrong.
They returned the deposit minus $14,000.

[mak013]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

no, you got it wrong.
They returned the deposit minus $14,000.

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

Let`s count. I marked all operations in your start post.
You deposited 27,500. Your withdrawals: 12,500; 12,000; 3,000. Summary we get 12,500+12,000+3,000=27,500. So it looks same with your deposit, isn`t it?
May be i mistaken somewhere, but not in maths, may be you missed something or i don`t understand something.

[dezoel]

I can't speak for the OP, but I can share from my own experience. When I first started gambling, I was completely clueless. I had no idea which platforms were trustworthy or reputable, and I was pretty lost when it came to finding them. In the early days, I experimented with different online casinos. Luckily, back then, strict KYC verification wasn't a big thing, so I didn't have to share my real personal info. I basically judged casinos based on my own experience. Needless to say, my experiences weren't always rosy. It wasn't until later that I stumbled upon this forum and other reputable casino review sites like BTCGOSU and the like.

So, I don't really feel like it's fair to pass judgment on the OP for going with a casino that isn't popular here. Perhaps the casino has some popularity within his local community or social circle. Maybe he stumbled upon an ad or a special promo offer that caught his attention. Or maybe he had some other valid reason for picking that casino. However, that doesn't give the casino a free pass to pull a scam on players.

I wouldn't blame OP for choosing that casino as well, but there is one thing that I would say that is different from your situation back in the day and the situation of OP right now. When you first start gambling, there might not have been enough resources available for you to check and understand which platforms are actually trustworthy or have a good reputation, but that isn't the case with OP as there are a lot of resources available for him to check from.

As you said, this forum alone is enough for someone to determine if a platform is trustworthy or not or has any reputation within the gambling community or not. So, though the platform shouldn't do this, OP could have joined a more trusted and reputable platform by doing a bit of research.

[Zoomic]

I was reading the ToS from the site Vave, and they give us a list of the countries that aren't allowed on the casino, but they never mention Russia in that list:

3.6. Players from Belarus, Cyprus, Curaçao, Estonia, Israel, Latvia, Lithuania, France, the Netherlands, the United Kingdom and the United States of America are not allowed to play for real money to wager on Vave games.

It is on "general terms 2.1"(which is kind of weird), the gambling support claims that the rule is recently implemented, how recent? I am not sure. if you ask me, I feel like the rule was only implemented when they found out OP was from Russia because they didn't want to pay his withdrawal and they have the "perfect" excuse as to why Russians aren't allowed to bet on sports betting or live betting(it is also weird that Russians are only prohibited on those two sections).

I have been reading around that some casino changes their ToS without consenting the customers, it seems this is one of those shady acts. I also read that if a casino understands that the government of your country does not support gambling, they will likely confiscate your winnings.
The above two scenarios is what is playing out. If someone from a particular region is not allowed to play on your site, do a geo block to every IP coming from those regions and that will settle it.

[h4nnmann11]

So, if i understand right, they returned you only your deposit. On the one hand, they wrote about ban, but on the other hand, they wrote it only on one language. I can decide who is right but the OP just spent lots of time without profit and the casino didn`t lose. The result is about zero except time. It is not fair for both sides but it is the optimal decision as for me.

no, you got it wrong.
They returned the deposit minus $14,000.

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

Let`s count. I marked all operations in your start post.
You deposited 27,500. Your withdrawals: 12,500; 12,000; 3,000. Summary we get 12,500+12,000+3,000=27,500. So it looks same with your deposit, isn`t it?
May be i mistaken somewhere, but not in maths, may be you missed something or i don`t understand something.

you can find summe of my deposits on this screenshots - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=sharing

there is summe of deposits is 41501.77 USDT
27500 is the most lossing saldo in my account is the moment. After this was depositing and withdrawls togerher.

[mindrust]

Another scum casino that is weaponizing KYC on their customers… Sadly, This is a very common behavior among the shit casinos. It is all good as long as you lose money and when you start winning suddenly Russia, Iran or whatever unpopular country you live in becomes the mother of all problems. This shit has to end. Thanks for sharing this with us, now I know that i will never ever play in this casino even if they were giving outstanding freebies/promotions. Some casinos don’t accept any players from the USA too. When these casinos are in search for an excuse to steal, they will find one. Being Russian, Iranian, American or European, it won’t matter. If they decided to steal from you, they will.

[Stalker22]

OP, I just checked out your complaint on casino.guru.

They are waiting for you to come back with some evidence and screenshots. Have you shared that info with them already? It would be a smart move to do it before the deadline, rather than letting them close the complaint.

[mak013]

you can find summe of my deposits on this screenshots - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1iEs4BtjrVENlTpUIA1rCBLE8W4jwD1iQ?usp=sharing

there is summe of deposits is 41501.77 USDT
27500 is the most lossing saldo in my account is the moment. After this was depositing and withdrawls togerher.

It means i misunderstood, but i counted as it was in the post. Thanks for proves. I don`t need it but it is good that you have it - it can help to attract attention to this casino.
It change situation seriously. In such situation the casino steal your money, and try to prove it using the ToS. And here we see a strange situation again. The gambler mustn`t read the ToS on all languages. If it is translated - we sure that it is equal in all variants. And it means that the gambler didn`t know about any restrictions he has. We best way to casino is to return money to zero balance as for me.

[h4nnmann11]

OP, I just checked out your complaint on casino.guru.

They are waiting for you to come back with some evidence and screenshots. Have you shared that info with them already? It would be a smart move to do it before the deadline, rather than letting them close the complaint.

thanks for the tip

[decodx]

OP undeniably has a case here!

The evidence speaks volumes: their support team openly admitted via email that they implemented the ban on Russian players just about a month ago, which was after OP registered on their site, and they conveniently omitted informing their players about it. To make matters worse, failing to include this rule in the Russian translation of the Terms of Use is like the cherry on top, confirming their lack of transparency. Not to mention their sneaky move of introducing rule 2.1 in place of the existing rule, creating even more confusion between different versions of the Terms of Service. This is not how reputable businesses operate. The proper way would have been to make an amendment to the existing rules with a clearly marked date for the changes.

The casino allowed OP to deposit money and keep playing as long as they were losing. But the moment OP started winning and tried to cash out, the casino pulled the ban card and confiscated the winnings instead of voiding all bets and returning the initial deposit. It's a clear case of selective scamming, or at the very least, a shady practice that deserves a strong disapproval from the community.

[Eureka_07]

That's unfair. It's good to see that you're able to document proofs. They will be of great assistance in this case. Now, I don't believe your winnings will be returned – perhaps only if you file a lawsuit and win. However, this will ultimately harm their reputation, which is a positive outcome if all your claims are indeed true, as they appear to be.

If verification is required, it should be completed before depositing.
<snip>

Doesn't it depend on the casino's own policies? Or should verification be ALWAYS required before a deposit? AFAIK, it may also depend on the jurisdiction they are in.

[TwitchySeal]

OP you seem to have a solid case. 

If you want people to take it seriously, you should change the subject of this thread to something relevant.

[BenCodie]

The case is solid - I have nothing more to add on top of what everyone else has said. It's good to see that the community have been able to rationally look at this situation and validate the case of the OP. This is completely unacceptable behavior from Vave and it is definitely true that this is possibly a race-related case.

Vave should be boycotted from this forum for behaving this way. I am going to post in their thread shortly after this post. Good luck OP.

[Alphie12]

Different rules for each language is shady.

[BenCodie]

Different rules for each language is shady.

The same rules with difficult translation is natural. Completely differing rules (for non-translation reasons) is 100% shady.

[Haunebu]

Never heard of this site before and will be actively avoiding it now that I have learnt about how messed up they truly are. Scum like them give a bad name to legitimate crypto gambling sites.

They are following in the footsteps of sites like 1xbit by selectively scamming gamblers. Will advise others to avoid it whenever necessary.

[aysg76]

Never heard of this site before and will be actively avoiding it now that I have learnt about how messed up they truly are. Scum like them give a bad name to legitimate crypto gambling sites.

They are following in the footsteps of sites like 1xbit by selectively scamming gamblers. Will advise others to avoid it whenever necessary.

That's why it's hard to trust new casinos these days because all of them want to make quick money through scamming people but there are legit casinos as well but they need to be tested and build their reputation over time but yes don't play over such fake casinos that will scam you and freeze your funds.

[decodx]

Never heard of this site before and will be actively avoiding it now that I have learnt about how messed up they truly are. Scum like them give a bad name to legitimate crypto gambling sites.

They are following in the footsteps of sites like 1xbit by selectively scamming gamblers. Will advise others to avoid it whenever necessary.

That's why it's hard to trust new casinos these days because all of them want to make quick money through scamming people but there are legit casinos as well but they need to be tested and build their reputation over time but yes don't play over such fake casinos that will scam you and freeze your funds.

I'm not sure if this casino is new, but their domain is pretty ancient, dating back to 2003-05-29! You can check it out here: https://whois.domaintools.com/vave.com

From what I can see, they're not very active on this forum, and their official announcement thread doesn't get updated much.

It looks like the casino is managed and operated by TechOptions Group B.V. (registration number 153194). I did some digging online and found at least one more casino site run by the same operator, which is hell-spin.org. Both of these sites share the same gambling license regulated by the Curacao Gaming Authority (License Number GLH-OCCHKTW0702282021).

I totally agree that it's a good idea to steer clear of any casino connected to this company because of their shady practices. Hope this info helps!

[Cantsay]

A thread with five pages and yet the casino representative chose to ignore everything that has been written and even when the case was taken to their official Ann thread they still left the accusation unattended to after making some vague statements about the allegations.

Shouldn’t a neg-tag be awarded to the casinos account until the case is resolved? Because from what I have seen they are in for a shady business and if not handled properly others might still come to the forum with the same complaint.

I'm not sure if this casino is new, but their domain is pretty ancient, dating back to 2003-05-29! You can check it out here: https://whois.domaintools.com/vave.com

Indeed it has an old domain but it’s a new casino, because if you check web archive you’ll see that the domain was listed for sale in the year 2021 after being used for a weight losing service then it had no archive again till 2023, if you ask me I think those time of inactivity in the web archive space are probably when the site was still for sale and as soon as it was bought by this casino they started having traffic and that led to the increase in archives. So for a casino that was created in 2023 I think they are still new.

[Haunebu]

That's why it's hard to trust new casinos these days because all of them want to make quick money through scamming people but there are legit casinos as well but they need to be tested and build their reputation over time but yes don't play over such fake casinos that will scam you and freeze your funds.

The crypto gambling market has already become over-saturated these days making it a lot tougher for new sites to claim a piece of the pie which was expected thanks to the rising popularity of cryptocurrencies.

They need to come up with something unique(Example: Moneypot offering 0.1% house edge etc) in order to establish themselves based on my observations.

[Webetcoins]

Never heard of this site before and will be actively avoiding it now that I have learnt about how messed up they truly are. Scum like them give a bad name to legitimate crypto gambling sites.

They are following in the footsteps of sites like 1xbit by selectively scamming gamblers. Will advise others to avoid it whenever necessary.

That's why it's hard to trust new casinos these days because all of them want to make quick money through scamming people but there are legit casinos as well but they need to be tested and build their reputation over time but yes don't play over such fake casinos that will scam you and freeze your funds.

This market saturation is being used very well by those who want to earn money and aren't really serious about starting a business or running a casino for a very long time. Such people will create a casino, and lure in gamblers by promoting the platform, and once they get some money on top of their invested capital, they will start doing things that are not normal like delaying withdrawals, not adding large deposits into user accounts, and even manipulating game results.

That is why, it has become very important for a gambler to do their due diligence, collect some feedback, and do some research before joining a new casino platform so that they don't face such issues and don't waste their money on such platforms and instead use a legit platform for their gambling activities.

[khaled0111]

^^
They posted the announcement thread on January, so I suppose they probably launched their casino at the same time. So, it's not an old casino.
They definitely should have made it clear that customers from Russia can't use their services and they definitely shouldn't have allowed customers from Russia to make deposits in first place.
OP, better move this thread to the scam accusation board.

[mak013]

A thread with five pages and yet the casino representative chose to ignore everything that has been written and even when the case was taken to their official Ann thread they still left the accusation unattended to after making some vague statements about the allegations.

Shouldn’t a neg-tag be awarded to the casinos account until the case is resolved? Because from what I have seen they are in for a shady business and if not handled properly others might still come to the forum with the same complaint.

I think that they don`t want to answer. They made a mistake when made changes in the ToS only in one language, and due to this mistake they looks like the cheaters. On the other hand - they have a debt they don`t want to return. And it is to late to make a translation to other languages.
The best way is to pay debt, make changes in the ToS and ban the gambler due to their new rules. But first of all they ought to close debt.

[Mr. Magkaisa]

-snip-

No every person is a forum geek + not everyone is from bitcointalk.

Most of the people/user who are facing a problem with (unknown casinos) are not quite popular are users who just registered on bitcointalk. They register in here due facing the problem and don't know anything about the forum.

Expecting by creating a forum thread, at least their problem can be solved. You cannot blame he at all due not everyone came from here, even he played casino with a list pick (most of the time they will search in internet) and the list pick are from paid article.

       -    I somewhat agree with what you said; the things you mentioned are true. Maybe the other complainants who appear here at the casino don't really like to hang out here on the forum platform. That's why we can notice that others have fewer than five posts in their post history, because their only goal is to get a solution to their problem.

And the others seem like the only reason is to destroy a casino because they know there are many crypto communities on this platform, but they don't get the sympathy of the majority. And there are others who have evidence and are just getting an opinion or advice on what they should do.

[shanz]

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

We would like to address the issue previously discussed and express our understanding of the emotions and frustration you may be experiencing as a player. We want to make it unequivocally clear that we do not engage in any form of discrimination based on ethnicity, race, religion, sex, or geolocation. However, we are bound by regulatory requirements, licensing terms, and legal obligations that may appear unjust to some users, and regrettably, we have no influence over these aspects.

Regarding the absence of this information in the Russian version of our Terms and Conditions, we kindly direct your attention to the following page: https://vave.com/ru/help/sportsbook-rules Section 2.18 states: "In the event of a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version shall prevail."

We hope this explanation clarifies the situation, and we remain dedicated to providing a gaming experience that is fair and transparent for all of our users.

[Ann3tt3]

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

This is not the first time I have come across this kind of situation. Mostly on forums, people who face such difficulties do not read the rules very carefully. I'm not defending Vave, but on the other hand, there was information that residents of your country are restricted.

[darkangel11]

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

IMO this was made in hope that you'll take the money and stop complaining. Basically shut up money.
If they were doing this lawfully and you'd really break the rules, there wouldn't be any gestures of good will, but since they were stealing from you and making money in the process, they could share some of their profit with you to shut you up and look better in the eyes of the community in case you decided to go public.

This is not the first time I have come across this kind of situation. Mostly on forums, people who face such difficulties do not read the rules very carefully. I'm not defending Vave, but on the other hand, there was information that residents of your country are restricted.

If they have multiple translations of their terms of service and that information is only in the one in English they are at fault because nobody will read all the translations. Some people will only choose the ones in their native languages. We also don't know when this information was added to the English version.

[coolcoinz]

Regarding the absence of this information in the Russian version of our Terms and Conditions, we kindly direct your attention to the following page: https://vave.com/ru/help/sportsbook-rules Section 2.18 states: "In the event of a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version shall prevail."

We hope this explanation clarifies the situation, and we remain dedicated to providing a gaming experience that is fair and transparent for all of our users.

It doesn't. Why add translations if they can confuse users? Can't do it right? Then don't to it, don't offer translations!

Imagine this situation happening with a user instruction of a tool.
You translate it to a number of languages. In one it says the item can be operated in high moisture and rain, in the english section it says it cannot. The user reads only his native version and gets electrocuted.
Who do you think is going to win in court? You, because you had a verse in the English instruction saying all mistakes in other sections don't count, or the guy's family claiming damages?

I advise OP to go to court over this because mistakes in translation that lead to misuse of the site shouldn't be blamed on the user and he shouldn't pay for it.

[Yogee]

[....]

Regarding the absence of this information in the Russian version of our Terms and Conditions, we kindly direct your attention to the following page: https://vave.com/ru/help/sportsbook-rules Section 2.18 states: "In the event of a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version shall prevail."

This doesn't look like a simple discrepancy. You decided to restrict Russia in your terms and you didn't specify or completely omitted that in the Russian translation? You can't be that dumb to overlook this matter.

I agree with other's statement that it was only added just to avoid paying players like the OP.

[h4nnmann11]

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

This is not the first time I have come across this kind of situation. Mostly on forums, people who face such difficulties do not read the rules very carefully. I'm not defending Vave, but on the other hand, there was information that residents of your country are restricted.

this rule appeared after I registered and made some deposits.

[h4nnmann11]

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

After 10-12 days, I started to break away and increase my balance and made a withdrawal of $12,500 without problems (the account was still in the red by $15k). The second withdrawal also went without problems. I ordered another $12,000 for withdrawal a week after the first withdrawal. The account was still negative, which is probably why the withdrawal went quickly and without problems.

But 2 days ago, the bets started winning one by one and the account balance became $18,000 (if you count the account balance, it turns out that my balance is in positive territory by $1,500 for 3 weeks of my account life).

On the third withdrawal of $10,500, vave was asked for verification. I am a resident of Russia, so I have a Russian Federation passport. But who would have thought that vave are so arrogant and can impose sanctions on sports betting for only one country. And it naturally turned out to be Russia. I registered on August 1st and there was no clause in their terms-and-conditions that players from Russia cannot bet on sports, I am more than sure of this.

And the funny thing is that the site supports 19 different languages, respectively, the section "Terms and Conditions" is translated into all available 19 languages. And Clause 2.1. in "Terms and Conditions", where it says about the ban on players from Russia is only on the English version of the site. No other language has this item.

I sent photos within 40 minutes of the verification request and received a response after 80 minutes. That is, verification was fast. As a result, the balance was $18,000, of which $15,000 was confiscated by vave, and $3,000 was given to me (apparently as a gesture of goodwill). This is nothing short of racist and making up rules on the fly. Because banning players from a single country from betting on sports is blatant discrimination.

We would like to address the issue previously discussed and express our understanding of the emotions and frustration you may be experiencing as a player. We want to make it unequivocally clear that we do not engage in any form of discrimination based on ethnicity, race, religion, sex, or geolocation. However, we are bound by regulatory requirements, licensing terms, and legal obligations that may appear unjust to some users, and regrettably, we have no influence over these aspects.

Regarding the absence of this information in the Russian version of our Terms and Conditions, we kindly direct your attention to the following page: https://vave.com/ru/help/sportsbook-rules Section 2.18 states: "In the event of a discrepancy between the English language version of these rules and any other language version, the English language version shall prevail."

We hope this explanation clarifies the situation, and we remain dedicated to providing a gaming experience that is fair and transparent for all of our users.

how can you be "bound by regulatory requirements, licensing terms, and legal obligations" if you block sports betting only for residents from Russia, when sports betting is legal in Russia? Why are there no similar blocks for residents of Muslim countries where gambling is punishable by death?

[JeffBrad12]

A thread with five pages and yet the casino representative chose to ignore everything that has been written and even when the case was taken to their official Ann thread they still left the accusation unattended to after making some vague statements about the allegations.

Shouldn’t a neg-tag be awarded to the casinos account until the case is resolved? Because from what I have seen they are in for a shady business and if not handled properly others might still come to the forum with the same complaint.

I'm not sure if this casino is new, but their domain is pretty ancient, dating back to 2003-05-29! You can check it out here: https://whois.domaintools.com/vave.com

Indeed it has an old domain but it’s a new casino, because if you check web archive you’ll see that the domain was listed for sale in the year 2021 after being used for a weight losing service then it had no archive again till 2023, if you ask me I think those time of inactivity in the web archive space are probably when the site was still for sale and as soon as it was bought by this casino they started having traffic and that led to the increase in archives. So for a casino that was created in 2023 I think they are still new.

It seems like the team is just intentionally ignoring this case. I just see if vave is just launching its signature campaign recently. That means the team is still monitoring the things that are happening in the forum.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5465570.0

I thought that if the manager was in direct contact with the representative from vave team.

[julerz12]

It seems like the team is just intentionally ignoring this case. I just see if vave is just launching its signature campaign recently.

It would be best if you could just scroll up ^{just a little bit} as their representative has just recently responded to this issue (even did so weeks ago when OP posted on their ann thread). Pretty sure that's not what someone who want to "ignore" this case would do.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5465570.0
I thought that if the manager was in direct contact with the representative from vave team.

Yes, I am in contact with the same person who controls their account here in this forum.

[Mayyyy]

While my account was in the red, vave was withdrawing money without any problems. At the moment I had $27,500 deposited on my account and not a single withdrawal. Of course they won't ask me for any documents as long as I bring them my money.

It is definitely inappropriate to call it racism. The problem here is that you did not follow the rules. I don't think there is any smell of racial discrimination here.

[FatFork]

It is definitely inappropriate to call it racism. The problem here is that you did not follow the rules. I don't think there is any smell of racial discrimination here.

Nice shilling! Here's a cookie!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3562315



Your first forum post:

Finally, casinos are moving towards cryptocurrencies. I really hope that Vave has done it well. Because crypto is the future and it is quite close.

[Mayyyy]

It is definitely inappropriate to call it racism. The problem here is that you did not follow the rules. I don't think there is any smell of racial discrimination here.

Nice shilling! Here's a cookie!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3562315

https://talkimg.com/images/2023/09/05/mmPRw.jpeg

Your first forum post:

Finally, casinos are moving towards cryptocurrencies. I really hope that Vave has done it well. Because crypto is the future and it is quite close.

Dude, you're so funny. If I hadn't said my opinion and just started hating on the casino, you would have passed by, of course. I certainly don't sit here like you 24/7, and is there a problem with that?)

[h4nnmann11]

there was an update about when the rule was introduced on the account of Russian players. August 21, the day before my account was verified. Nothing strange "at all".

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5433885.new#new

[Stalker22]

@h4nnmann11,

I just checked out your complaint on casino.guru again. It looks like they need some more details from you about your issue with Vave casino. It is best to do it before the deadline to avoid them closing the complaint.