How do you feel when you look at your first Bitcoin wallet?

[JayJuanGee]

From the start of my journey of investing into BTC, I had an investment thesis that involved ongoing accumulation of BTC, and sure if the price was going down then I was considering that it was good to buy the dip because I was lowering my investment cost, yet the BTC price kept dipping, and really it took a couple of years for my average cost per BTC to get back into profits and it even took more than 3 years for the first BTC that I bought to get back into profits and to stay there.

This is a true definition of patience , it might be hard sometimes but it's rewarding.

I am not trying to brag or anything like that, but I frequently make the claim that as long as you are choosing to invest an amount of money that is extra and that you are willing to ride your investment down to zero, then you should be able to ride out your investment moving against you, even if it seems to move against you for several years.. and sure if you keep buying at some points, you might start to question your conviction, especially if you keep buying, and even if you are buying a relatively small amount, the relatively small amounts still can add up.. even if it is ONLY $10 per week or some other similar kind of small amount. 

Of course, you can also choose between being aggressive and whimpy in terms of the amount that you are drawing from your discretionary income, so if you have an income that is between $400 and $1,500 per month with an average of around $900, yet your expenses are around $750 per month, then you can figure out ways to have an emergency fund that covers the gap and you can choose to be somewhat whimpy in your investment with maybe $10 per week, yet if you have a decent emergency fund in place that largely covers 3-6 months of your expenses (let's say that you have the whole 6 months covered, which would be $4,500 ($750*6), then you might feel that you are able to afford to be more aggressive, even $100 per week, but sure if there is that much variance in your income, you might figure out ways to adapt your DCA amount based on how much cash cushion that you have and even to have an amount that you invest into bitcoin no matter what, but another amount extra that would depend upon the size of your extra cash for that month, if any.

BTC it's self should have been tagged patience   let's flash back to the days when btc was still 0.$  probably, though it might feel easy to acquire but amongst the investor then if there were alot of small investors (I believe everyone should be a small investor then) whom had patience till this very  moment then there could have been a lot of scarcity  and a crazy hike in the price of BTC but who knew this was going to happen.  

Even though I agree with part of your overall point that the longer that anyone had been investing into bitcoin, then the more likely that the investment would have had ended up paying off.. which yes, could be considered as a form of patience and/or a form of deferred gratification.

At the same time, I think that it is not very realistic to be trying to make modern day comparisons to the situation that was available close to the time that bitcoin was just finding it's price, and even if we start from a later date, such as early 2012, when bitcoin was at $4 per BTC, it still might not be realistic to be considering those kinds of prices as realistic entry prices for any normal and regular people because they would have had to have been in some kind of niche group, and sure they might have been merely lucky in that regard, but probably the various developments in 2012 and 2013 did bring bitcoin more and more to the attention of more regular people.

It also seems to me that with the passage of time, bitcoin's investment thesis continues to get stronger and stronger, so hopefully anyone with a 4-10 year or longer investment time horizon is able to figure out a way to build some kind of a bitcoin investment plan that seems to continue to have good chances of paying off in the future. .even though there are no guarantees  in regards to the paying off of a longer term investment plan.. and surely even some folks who screwed up in the past in regards to the way that they treated their bitcoin will still be able to have good chances of making up for their past errors by getting started accumulating BTC persistently, consistently and ongoingly until they reach targets that are acceptable to them and their situation.

Even some used it as a trade for pizza because they simply had no patience

That is not a very fair and/or accurate characterization of the Lazlo pizza situation, even though a lot of people characterize Lazlo's pizza situation in that kind of inaccurate way.

If bitcoin did not really have much if any price, then it could have had been replaced for similar amounts of money (such as 2 pizzas for 10k BTC), but yeah there have been various price spikes in bitcoin in which it no longer becomes possible to replace bitcoin for anything close to the amount that they had been acquired, so even someone who might have come to bitcoin 10 years ago like me, and then maybe accumulated bitcoin over several of the earlier years (and maybe made some mistakes along the way too), he still might have had been going into 2016 or 2017 with BTC costs of $500 per BTC, but then let's say for example, he had accumulated 300 BTC, but then he decides to spend 100 of his BTC in early 2017 at $1k each, and so he buys a house or a car or some various consumer goods that may or may not hold their value very well, and he is thinking that he doubled his income because he bought them for $50k and he sold them for $100k, and yeah maybe he might have even sold them in mid 2017 for $2k each which would have gotten him 4x, but then how is he ever going to be able to generate enough money to buy back those 100BTC, so sure he still has 200BTC, but he still might be in a worse position for having had sold them, yet at the same time does he have enough BTC?  It depends on the overall situation and if he continues to make those kinds of mistakes or not.

With Lazlo he was very early to mining and he even was very innovative with the early conversion from CPU to GPU, so he had accumulated a lot of bitcoin through his mining efforts, and he surely may have felt needs to spend (and/or redistribute) decent quantities of his BTC holdings.. ..and we do not know how many times Lazlo spent 10k BTC on pizzas.. or how many BTC that he has left?  Did he spend like a drunken sailor and does not have any BTC left, or maybe he had saved some of those BTC that he had mined?  By the way, I did a quick calculation of how many BTC were being mined per day in 2010, and that would have been 7,500 (144 x 50), and so if Lazlo was mining a lot of bitcoin, he may well might have been able to mine 10k bitcoin in a week or less...and recall that in bitcoin's first 4 years, 10.5 million (or half of the total supply) was mined, so even if Satoshi got around 1 million of the coins, there was another 9.5 million going to other miners, and surely some of the miners ended up spending their coins in a variety of ways. 

[1714591957]

1714591957

[Jaycoinz]

Each of us have similar story like you op. I start using bitcoin from 2016. I worked on a app and received some dollar in Bitcoin as reward, after that I started investing with Bitcoin while it was 200-220$ per Bitcoin and i had around 7-8 Bitcoin which i made from trading and investment. Sometimes i feel regret as if i could have knowledge about btc but here is game! Future is unpredictable, most of us here didn't imagine Bitcoin could cross 67k$ ath but i think it is better to think about future. How to use those opportunities which will come in upcoming days

Your stories is what serves a lesson and aslo a motivation for those of us that didn't actually get that opportunity to have UpTo 1bitcoin in their wallet or even got the opportunity to be around during that period and am pretty sure that everyone is currently keen on their HODLing to actually see how the future unfolds, that's if their is more positivity as the growth and adoption of Bitcoin gets bigger and bigger by the day.

Sometimes I wonder if I hadn't found this forum and all its teaching about HODLing and accumulating of Bitcoin, especially the master lecturer @jayJuanGee, how would be with my Bitcoin today maybe, I would have probably traded it and lost it because of all the positive ads I do get on how trading is effective not knowing that it's a deadzone for anyone actually thinking of accumulating some Bitcoin anytime soon during different strategy like the DCA.

[DeathAngel]

I feel a mixture of emotions when I look at my Bitcoin wallet. I feel lucky & happy that I was early enough to build a not unsubstantial stash. I feel glad that I was able to invest because the alternative places to store your wealth are not good. Maybe I feel slightly unsatisfied as even though I have a decent stash I should have more.

[EarnOnVictor]

My journey into Bitcoin was entire due to the need to send payment across borders as there was FX and several other restrictions in my country. So, I joined Bitcoin just to use it for cross-border payment without knowing it could actually be a way of creating wealth in the future.

Just recently, I was tempted to check my first ever Bitcoin wallet to see what I have done in the past. I was so depressed seeing the volume of Bitcoin that have passed through my wallet without me saving a reasonable portion of it.

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

As you talk about this, I feel the pain more, but mine was a small Bitcoin but a huge amount of Litecoin that could have made me very rich. I started transacting in crypto as far back as 2013 or 2014 if I am correct and there are some wallets I never had access to anymore. Not that my assets were lost, I just stopped using them for one reason or the other. Not to mention the ones I still have access to, and the last time I checked one of the oldest, it was full of LTC transactions in hundreds of them because I was using it for my only deposits and withdrawals in nad from my FX trading account respectively and I withdrew a whole lot of them then.

Just like you, my goal was to deposit through them and get my money back through the cross-border opportunity that eased me from the bank wire transfer stress and extortion. It was nice then and it actually delivered in that regard. But I was too blind not to keep my money in crypto and was just converting it all to banks then. Well, the deed is done, there is no wisdom in biting oneself because of the past. You can still make amends now if you can. I started making money in crypto investments since last year and I know I will make more with time. So, no hurt feelings.

[promise444c5]

Even though I agree with part of your overall point that the longer that anyone had been investing into bitcoin, then the more likely that the investment would have had ended up paying off.. which yes, could be considered as a form of patience and/or a form of deferred gratification.

At the same time, I think that it is not very realistic to be trying to make modern day comparisons to the situation that was available close to the time that bitcoin was just finding it's price, and even if we start from a later date, such as early 2012, when bitcoin was at $4 per BTC, it still might not be realistic to be considering those kinds of prices as realistic entry prices for any normal and regular people because they would have had to have been in some kind of niche group, and sure they might have been merely lucky in that regard, but probably the various developments in 2012 and 2013 did bring bitcoin more and more to the attention of more regular people.

Well, I reasoned it too maybe the way I placed it but in one way still linked to patience, Bitcoin  was once a shit coin but at that shitty state there were some positive factors showing there would be a good outcome  on like other shitty coins which pump and dumb in a short period of time after it's being launched(this  pumps are not even up to a $)

You said developments in 2012 and 2013 did brought attention but who knows  there could be some future developments, some time patience could be a risk but once you are sure of what you are having patience on then, just have hope look forward to a positive effect.
A life example is everyone going to high-school, college, uni  with the view of getting a job we all trust the process but not all will make use of that certificate and not all will get rich from the Job. This might not really relate but in one way talking about taking the risk of going  to school because we expect a good outcome from it but we eventually taking what life throws at us.

This doesn't mean anyone reading this should go out and start buying all sort of shitty coins , I don't think there would be a coin like Bitcoin again even if there will be, by now we should have a contender at 10k, no one can predict  the future but it will be rare to find such .

All I'm saying  is have at least some little patience  ,  even  if you invest  now and you have no patience you might endup leaving at an unripe target point  fine! you made some profits but is it worth it

That is not a very fair and/or accurate characterization of the Lazlo pizza situation, even though a lot of people characterize Lazlo's pizza situation in that kind of inaccurate way.

Well I mad3 that as a joke not being serious about it though i thought of it too:
---For him to have  10k Bitcoins  then he probably has more than that and having so much of it means he probably saw potential in it and knows there will be a future appreciation in the price. Although,  I never knew he was a minner until now , I even looked it as a way of gaining attention as on how Bitcoin could be used as a payment of goods.

[Gaza13]

I feel a mixture of emotions when I look at my Bitcoin wallet. I feel lucky & happy that I was early enough to build a not unsubstantial stash. I feel glad that I was able to invest because the alternative places to store your wealth are not good. Maybe I feel slightly unsatisfied as even though I have a decent stash I should have more.

What you feel, I do too. Yes, even though someone has their own problems with financial limitations, and they want to add little by little, I think this person knows the future of this asset. I am happy or proud to be able to get to know this asset, compared to my own environment which doesn't know about investment, of course I have a different experience from these other people.

[JayJuanGee]

Each of us have similar story like you op. I start using bitcoin from 2016. I worked on a app and received some dollar in Bitcoin as reward, after that I started investing with Bitcoin while it was 200-220$ per Bitcoin and i had around 7-8 Bitcoin which i made from trading and investment. Sometimes i feel regret as if i could have knowledge about btc but here is game! Future is unpredictable, most of us here didn't imagine Bitcoin could cross 67k$ ath but i think it is better to think about future. How to use those opportunities which will come in upcoming days

Your stories is what serves a lesson and aslo a motivation for those of us that didn't actually get that opportunity to have UpTo 1bitcoin in their wallet or even got the opportunity to be around during that period and am pretty sure that everyone is currently keen on their HODLing to actually see how the future unfolds, that's if their is more positivity as the growth and adoption of Bitcoin gets bigger and bigger by the day.

Sometimes I wonder if I hadn't found this forum and all its teaching about HODLing and accumulating of Bitcoin, especially the master lecturer @jayJuanGee, how would be with my Bitcoin today maybe, I would have probably traded it and lost it because of all the positive ads I do get on how trading is effective not knowing that it's a deadzone for anyone actually thinking of accumulating some Bitcoin anytime soon during different strategy like the DCA.

From your mentioning of an aspiration for getting to 1 whole coin, that likely is becoming more and more unreachable by newbie bitcoiners, so each of us just need to attempt to create BTC accumulation targets that are reasonable for our own circumstances, so maybe we start out striving to get 1 million satoshis, and then after we reach that we might strive for 5 million, and then 10 million and then 21 million and then 50 million.. and gosh, if we end up getting to 50 million, then we have reached 0.5 BTC... so we do what we can, and it could still be possible to reach 1 BTC or multiple BTC, but likely not very possible or easy for normie no coiners who have not yet even started to take bitcoin accumulation seriously enough to figure out a plan to get started in their BTC accumulation journey as soon as possible.

Any of us, even the brand new bitcoiners, are still likely advantaged if we are ready, willing and able to get started in our BTC accumulation journey right now, even if we are feeling that our own budgetary situation might not allow us to yet be very aggressive, but if we treat these kinds of BTC accumulation in a serious way, then we might be able to increase our level of aggressiveness with the passage of time and still be advantaged, relatively speaking, by getting started.

But I was too blind not to keep my money in crypto and was just converting it all to banks then. Well, the deed is done, there is no wisdom in biting oneself because of the past. You can still make amends now if you can. I started making money in crypto investments since last year and I know I will make more with time. So, no hurt feelings.

For sure there still could be some questions regarding where you are choosing to store your value whether you are actually making money or just storing it, and if you are redistributing the value from time to time, there can also be questions regarding how much you might apportion in each category of crypto.. and hopefully you are not too distracted in terms of storing very much of your value into non-bitcoin kinds of crypto... which may or may not end up working out, but if you know some of the parameters for getting in and out of various crypto.. WHICH IS A BIG IF, then you still have to figure out where you might want to store the bulk of it, in the event that you are not trading like a degenerate gambler with all of it.. .. and surely in this thread we are mostly talking about storing in bitcoin rather than shitcoins, which much of the reason why I would suggest that the overwhelming majority of normies don't be fucking around with shitcoins at all (except maybe for transactional purposes and/or if they cannot control their gambling/trading tendencies to keep it less than 10% of the size of their bitcoin holdings.. and surely there may well be some guys who have more experience trading and/or gambling and who are able to play around with more than 10%, but guys like you (if you are one of them) EarnOnVictor are likely the exception rather than the rule in terms of the dangers of trading and/or holding much if any value in shitcoins.

[Wiwo]

From your mentioning of an aspiration for getting to 1 whole coin, that likely is becoming more and more unreachable by newbie bitcoiners, so each of us just need to attempt to create BTC accumulation targets that are reasonable for our own circumstances, so maybe we start out striving to get 1 million satoshis, and then after we reach that we might strive for 5 million, and then 10 million and then 21 million and then 50 million.. and gosh, if we end up getting to 50 million, then we have reached 0.5 BTC... so we do what we can, and it could still be possible to reach 1 BTC or multiple BTC, but likely not very possible or easy for normie no coiners who have not yet even started to take bitcoin accumulation seriously enough to figure out a plan to get started in their BTC accumulation journey as soon as possible.

Having to beat ourselves by trying to go beyond our reach in bitcoin accumulation due to the time and mistakes of the past is some how a bad approach and since I already know that fact,  I put every regret or missed chances of accumulating bitcoin when the price was more affordable,  bit at instance it best to take thing as easy as possible because on the long run,  what matters is the ability to resolve able to hold something tangible as out Bitcoin portfolio in the long run.

Let say in the next two to three years from now we should be in a better position where we already achieve what we thought we had missed,  and are in a good financial status through our Bitcoin holding,  and at that point, it becomes clear to us that Bitcoin is a lifetime journey and not some early birds only things,  because when it comes to Bitcoin investment,  what really matters is two things and that is.

1: the amount of capital you have to invest in Bitcoin

2: how much time you are ready to hold your investment and what you choose to do with your extra income while you waiting for that time to be achieved.

[JayJuanGee]

Even though I agree with part of your overall point that the longer that anyone had been investing into bitcoin, then the more likely that the investment would have had ended up paying off.. which yes, could be considered as a form of patience and/or a form of deferred gratification.

At the same time, I think that it is not very realistic to be trying to make modern day comparisons to the situation that was available close to the time that bitcoin was just finding it's price, and even if we start from a later date, such as early 2012, when bitcoin was at $4 per BTC, it still might not be realistic to be considering those kinds of prices as realistic entry prices for any normal and regular people because they would have had to have been in some kind of niche group, and sure they might have been merely lucky in that regard, but probably the various developments in 2012 and 2013 did bring bitcoin more and more to the attention of more regular people.

Well, I reasoned it too maybe the way I placed it but in one way still linked to patience, Bitcoin was once a shit coin but at that shitty state there were some positive factors showing there would be a good outcome on like other shitty coins which pump and dumb in a short period of time after it's being launched(this  pumps are not even up to a $)

You might have the gist of an understanding that bitcoin differs from shitcoins, but bitcoin was never a shitcoin, so you likely do not really understand bitcoin sufficiently enough to even frame how come bitcoin has gone up from pennies (or having hardly any value and then into the 10s of thousands of dollars - its current price range.

I am not sure if it is worth it to go down this path very much, but if you think about bitcoin as having had been a paradigm shifting break through in regards to its solving the ability to create digital scarcity, then you might see that almost all of the shitcoins are merely trying to copy bitcoin or to create affinity scams or to engage in the printing of money, so bitcoin actually invented something innovative, and shitcoins are not really inventing anything innovative.. so if you are trying to consider bitcoin having a similar life as shitcoins, but bitcoin is only advantaged because it was earlier, then you are not really understanding bitcoin very well.. and yeah, a  lot of shitcoiners, bitcoin naysayers, no coiners and just unknowledgeable people (in regards to bitcoin) talk about bitcoin in those kinds of superficial and misleading kinds of ways.

You said developments in 2012 and 2013 did brought attention but who knows  there could be some future developments, some time patience could be a risk but once you are sure of what you are having patience on then, just have hope look forward to a positive effect.

I was just referring to the ongoing ways that bitcoin was continuing to grow and even to transition between the very earliest niche stages and to become more mainstream, but even if we might say that bitcoin became more mainstream in 2012 and 2013, bitcoin still is not very mainstream, and it may well be the case that less than 1% of the world's population owns any bitcoin, and even if some of them own it, they don't own any kind of substantial amount...and owning shitcoins does not count to owning bitcoin, even though some folks might end up coming to bitcoin after starting out with being involved in shitcoins.

A life example is everyone going to high-school, college, uni  with the view of getting a job we all trust the process but not all will make use of that certificate and not all will get rich from the Job. This might not really relate but in one way talking about taking the risk of going  to school because we expect a good outcome from it but we eventually taking what life throws at us.

You are still making comparisons that fail/refuse to appreciate the intensity of the significance of bitcoin's invention, that differentiates it from other projects.. Paradigm changing means that bitcoin has changed the world forever in regards to what it has brought to the world in terms of both solving the digital scarcity problem, but also building in quite a few innovative ways with proof of work and the difficulty adjustment and various kinds of incentives around both mining and holding the coin.

This doesn't mean anyone reading this should go out and start buying all sort of shitty coins , I don't think there would be a coin like Bitcoin again even if there will be, by now we should have a contender at 10k, no one can predict  the future but it will be rare to find such .

Careful with being mislead by unit value.. because there are various shitcoins and tokens (and NFTs) that have had higher per unit pricing, and also be careful when comparing bitcoin's market cap to various shitcoins too.. sure there can be some value in making some of those comparisons, but they can also be misleading indicators in regards to what makes bitcoin valuable and how you might measure such value... sure price is one of them... but not the only way of measuring value.

All I'm saying  is have at least some little patience  ,  even  if you invest  now and you have no patience you might endup leaving at an unripe target point  fine! you made some profits but is it worth it

Of course, there are a lot of people who have gotten in and out of bitcoin and experienced dollar profits, but that frequently is not as valuable as experiencing various compounding effects that come from going through several doublings and then having more and more options.. and some times guys catch a wave too, so they get in and out, and I have my doubts in regards to the extent that there is much value in merely cashing out of fiat profits, even if some of them might also figure out ways to buy back most if not all of the coins that they sold.. and sometimes they even figure out how to buy back more coins than they sold.. . .. but selling to accumulate is probably not as sound of a practice as buying to accumulate... if your goal happens to be to accumulate BTC.. even if you measure the value of the BTC in terms of its fiat value (nothing wrong with that).

That is not a very fair and/or accurate characterization of the Lazlo pizza situation, even though a lot of people characterize Lazlo's pizza situation in that kind of inaccurate way.

Well I mad3 that as a joke not being serious about it though i thought of it too:

A lot of people make that same joke.  It is a pretty lame joke because it is not very accurate and it spreads the wrong ideas, even though it is the idea that you were trying to spin in order to tell a story about the value of patience... which is not a bad story to tell, but your whole approach to talking about patience in your last post was not a very realistic or even experientially based (which probably would have had been better to bring some story from your own life rather than mischaracterizing an historical event in a commonly mischaracterized way)..

---For him to have  10k Bitcoins  then he probably has more than that and having so much of it means he probably saw potential in it and knows there will be a future appreciation in the price. Although,  I never knew he was a minner until now , I even looked it as a way of gaining attention as on how Bitcoin could be used as a payment of goods.

It goes to show that you were making a pretty superficial point, even if there were some accuracies in it.. but I would still question how helpful it is to continue with the discussion of such point.

I feel a mixture of emotions when I look at my Bitcoin wallet. I feel lucky & happy that I was early enough to build a not unsubstantial stash. I feel glad that I was able to invest because the alternative places to store your wealth are not good. Maybe I feel slightly unsatisfied as even though I have a decent stash I should have more.

What you feel, I do too. Yes, even though someone has their own problems with financial limitations, and they want to add little by little, I think this person knows the future of this asset. I am happy or proud to be able to get to know this asset, compared to my own environment which doesn't know about investment, of course I have a different experience from these other people.

"of course I have a different experience from these other people"

Which is?  What is your different experience?  Pray tell.

From your mentioning of an aspiration for getting to 1 whole coin, that likely is becoming more and more unreachable by newbie bitcoiners, so each of us just need to attempt to create BTC accumulation targets that are reasonable for our own circumstances, so maybe we start out striving to get 1 million satoshis, and then after we reach that we might strive for 5 million, and then 10 million and then 21 million and then 50 million.. and gosh, if we end up getting to 50 million, then we have reached 0.5 BTC... so we do what we can, and it could still be possible to reach 1 BTC or multiple BTC, but likely not very possible or easy for normie no coiners who have not yet even started to take bitcoin accumulation seriously enough to figure out a plan to get started in their BTC accumulation journey as soon as possible.

Having to beat ourselves by trying to go beyond our reach in bitcoin accumulation due to the time and mistakes of the past is some how a bad approach and since I already know that fact,  I put every regret or missed chances of accumulating bitcoin when the price was more affordable,  bit at instance it best to take thing as easy as possible because on the long run,  what matters is the ability to resolve able to hold something tangible as out Bitcoin portfolio in the long run.

Let say in the next two to three years from now we should be in a better position where we already achieve what we thought we had missed,  

It can be very difficult to potentially chase the price up, so there can be a lot of mistakes along the way, but even my own tentative ideas about how many BTC I wanted to accumulate in a certain amount of time, and how much I had expected to pay for them, my own performance ended up substantially beating my expectations, even though I also made quite a few mistakes along the way.  

Yet, it seems to me that each of us is capable of making some projections (maybe using an Excel spreadsheet or maybe doing it on paper),and we can project out worse case scenario, best case scenario, base case scenario, and we can even project out various alternative outcomes, and surely one of the advantages of Excel spreadsheet is that we can end up copying./pasting or even saving various scenarios, but we can also set it up so that we can change some of the variables and then see how the future numbers play out...

I frequently will suggest planning around worse case scenarios, but still being able to see the various possible scenarios will also help us to figure out what kinds of probabilities we might assign to various scenarios, and that will help us to solidify what we believe is our base case scenario (which is the one that we might consider to have the highest likelihood of happening) but even if it is the scenario with the highest likelihood, that still does not mean that it will end up being the one that ends up happening... so the more that we play around with various kinds of these kinds of projections, the better we should become at outlining scenarios that are somewhat realistically aligned with our expectations and maybe even to cause our expectations to be more realistic.. because sometimes some of us might get too much caught upon the happening of some narrow set of events and maybe we learn through experiences of plotting things out that our own expectations are frequently skewed in a certain direction that we need to fix and to attempt to become more realistic in terms of how we project and then also how we might choose to prepare once we have outlined a variety of possible scenarios.

So another thing that I like to do is to end up exceeding expectations because I plan based on worser case scenarios, and almost inevitably things end up turning out better than expected...even though it may well end up being likely that the better case scenario had also been in the projection of possibilities, but it just was not relied upon... and there are needs to attempt to have some balance in all of this because preparing for outrageously up and outrageously down scenarios can also be helpful, even if they do not end up happening, but by going through a process of projecting out, there is a decent amount of financial and/or psychological preparation for all (any) of them.

and are in a good financial status through our Bitcoin holding,  and at that point, it becomes clear to us that Bitcoin is a lifetime journey and not some early birds only things,  

Through this forum (and even in my own journey) I have found a lot of members who have tailored their approaches to bitcoin to become much more solid based on going through various exercises to figure out their own situation as compared to their bitcoin holdings.  So there is some pleasure to see guys learning and adapting along the way.

because when it comes to Bitcoin investment,  what really matters is two things and that is.

1: the amount of capital you have to invest in Bitcoin

2: how much time you are ready to hold your investment and what you choose to do with your extra income while you waiting for that time to be achieved.

I have my doubts that there would be ONLY two factors or even if the two that you pointed out may well be amongst  important factors to consider, and at the same time, any of the factors can kind of be moving targets in which sometimes a bitcoin investor might have his shit together more in regards to one or more of the factors, but still the changing of one factor could affect other factors.  I personally like to consider 9 different factors, and some aspects of your two factors are included in my 9 factors.

......individual factors that influence your decision whether to invest into bitcoin and how to invest into bitcoin have financial, skills and psychological components that include:
1)   your cashflow,
2)   how much bitcoin you have already accumulated,
3)   your other investments (including cash reserves),
4)   your view of bitcoin as compared with other investments,
5)   your timeline,
6)   your risk tolerance,
7)   your time, skills, goals (investment/lifestyle targets, which includes figuring out the extent that you are in BTC accumulation, maintenance or liquidation stage),
8 )   your abilities to strategize, plan, research and learn along the way including tweaking strategies from time to time,
9)   your considering your time, your abilities and whether to trade, reallocate from time to time, to use of leverage and/or to use financial instruments... (and for sure the use of financial instruments, leverage and margin trading involve higher level skills and are not even necessary to still become richie in bitcoin's already existing asymmetric bet.)

[promise444c5]

Snipe

Okay I get it now,  I might have represent bitcoin as a shitcoin and made that joke  . I'm  taking note of all correction ,I guess I'm learning alot from this! Can you tell me more about its early stage (BTC) just briefly I need it directly from someone who experienced it  because I'm part of the folks who's trying to migrate to BTC , I literally just getting to understand BTC after Joining this forum. I once invested in Stellar lumens [XLM],poor me I knew nothing about crypto then.

[ancafe]

Just recently, I was tempted to check my first ever Bitcoin wallet to see what I have done in the past. I was so depressed seeing the volume of Bitcoin that have passed through my wallet without me saving a reasonable portion of it.

That also happened to me and when I saw the first wallet I created it was very tempting because the volume of bitcoin value was quite extraordinary. But that's nothing because consciously we are also slowly increasing the number of bitcoin holdings and have now reached a much larger volume level.

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

But unfortunately the volume we see may no longer be anything because previously the bitcoin ownership in the wallet had been sold. Now is the time to return to preparing investments regularly and perhaps as an effort to increase the amount of bitcoin ownership we have to more.

[JayJuanGee]

Snipe

Okay I get it now,  I might have represent bitcoin as a shitcoin and made that joke  . I'm  taking note of all correction ,I guess I'm learning alot from this! Can you tell me more about its early stage (BTC) just briefly I need it directly from someone who experienced it  because I'm part of the folks who's trying to migrate to BTC , I literally just getting to understand BTC after Joining this forum. I once invested in Stellar lumens [XLM],poor me I knew nothing about crypto then.

I doubt that there is much that I can tell you, and there is all kinds of sources of bitcoin-related information to read and to listen to podcasts.  If your language is not English then maybe there are podcasts in your language... but yeah, it can take a while to figure out better and worse sources of information, and a lot of folks do end up getting lured into various shitcoins...and sometimes it can be difficult to sort through and to figure out the better sources of bitcoin-related information.

Likely if you spend time learning about bitcoin first, and then you will have a better framework for understanding the variations of shitcoins, to the extent that any of them might matter.  It is possible to get sucked into a lot shitcoin materials, and you might not even realize when you are learning about bitcoin from someone who may well be purposefully misleading you into wanting to invest into their shitcoins.

Maybe with bitcoin, if you just start to buy some amount that is reasonably within your budget, whether that is $100 per week or $10 per week of some other amount, and then just spend time learning about it, and then maybe as you are investing and learning you will be able to hone your own investment style in accordance with 9 factors that I consider to be helpful to any investor into bitcoin.

[sulendra12]

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

Pretty much the same as you. I made my first bitcoin wallet at blockchain.info in 2013 (yes, that was 10 years ago). I thought at that day, ain't no way there is stuff like that when I was really young at that day. When I checked the wallet few months ago, I actually surprised with how much Bitcoin I left there before. Sure, I felt the sense of regret about that. But, it doesn't matter anyway I have learned something about this and time to move on.

[bocyaj]

I doubt that there is much that I can tell you, and there is all kinds of sources of bitcoin-related information to read and to listen to podcasts.  If your language is not English then maybe there are podcasts in your language... but yeah, it can take a while to figure out better and worse sources of information, and a lot of folks do end up getting lured into various shitcoins...and sometimes it can be difficult to sort through and to figure out the better sources of bitcoin-related information.

The English can be used because many people here are from various countries,since English consider as the global language the communication can be made in English.Actually the reason behind this was many countries was ruled by the British people before the end of the colonisation of longer period,this was hidden secret behind the globalisation of English around us.LoL

Likely if you spend time learning about bitcoin first, and then you will have a better framework for understanding the variations of shitcoins, to the extent that any of them might matter.  It is possible to get sucked into a lot shitcoin materials, and you might not even realize when you are learning about bitcoin from someone who may well be purposefully misleading you into wanting to invest into their shitcoins.

The bitcoin had their own importance over a period of time,but the same thing survive over a decade.Even though many new projects come in the cryptocurrency world,the bitcoin was considered to the god of the cryptocurrency.No one say the certain thing as god until it help them to earn some money by their influence into their lise.

Maybe with bitcoin, if you just start to buy some amount that is reasonably within your budget, whether that is $100 per week or $10 per week of some other amount, and then just spend time learning about it, and then maybe as you are investing and learning you will be able to hone your own investment style in accordance with 9 factors that I consider to be helpful to any investor into bitcoin.

The continuous buying like this will be the good for the longer period of time.So the trader will have the huge bitcoin after the year was ended.Now we are in the end of the year,So the current applying people like this will have their complete savings now.This bull run also gave them some additional dollars because of 42k dollars pump.

[JayJuanGee]

I doubt that there is much that I can tell you, and there is all kinds of sources of bitcoin-related information to read and to listen to podcasts.  If your language is not English then maybe there are podcasts in your language... but yeah, it can take a while to figure out better and worse sources of information, and a lot of folks do end up getting lured into various shitcoins...and sometimes it can be difficult to sort through and to figure out the better sources of bitcoin-related information.

The English can be used because many people here are from various countries,since English consider as the global language the communication can be made in English.Actually the reason behind this was many countries was ruled by the British people before the end of the colonisation of longer period,this was hidden secret behind the globalisation of English around us.LoL

You may be correct that I should not be assuming that anyone might not have sufficient skills to follow various English-source materials, even if they are podcasts and presenting information in audio rather than a written format.  Of course, audio format is going to be more challenging for non-native speakers but there are also caption tools and also the ability to slow down the audio.

At some previous point, I had considered putting together a thread to list various bitcoin-related podcasts and to rate them, from my own perspective in terms of their bitcoin maximalism, which I consider to be a plus, and surely there are podcasts that both focus on bitcoin, but also denigrate shitcoins, and seem to come from the right perspective (at least in my way of seeing them, so if I did list the podcasts that I listen to, i would probably try some kind of a rating system) - even though others are free to make their own judgements. 

Likely if you spend time learning about bitcoin first, and then you will have a better framework for understanding the variations of shitcoins, to the extent that any of them might matter.  It is possible to get sucked into a lot shitcoin materials, and you might not even realize when you are learning about bitcoin from someone who may well be purposefully misleading you into wanting to invest into their shitcoins.

The bitcoin had their own importance over a period of time,but the same thing survive over a decade.Even though many new projects come in the cryptocurrency world,the bitcoin was considered to the god of the cryptocurrency.No one say the certain thing as god until it help them to earn some money by their influence into their lise.

Well yeah.  There is the money making angle, and there is also the first mover advantage angle, yet I think that my earlier response about bitcoin solving the digital scarcity matter really put it into an innovator invention category, and the various copy cat coins are not really adding anything that would be 10x or greater than bitcoin, and frequently they are inferior, but if they were to be better, they would need to be 10x better to displace the king, and many times any kind of innovations of other coins projects could well be absobed into bitcoin, whether on the 1st layer or maybe on some after layer.

Maybe with bitcoin, if you just start to buy some amount that is reasonably within your budget, whether that is $100 per week or $10 per week of some other amount, and then just spend time learning about it, and then maybe as you are investing and learning you will be able to hone your own investment style in accordance with 9 factors that I consider to be helpful to any investor into bitcoin.

The continuous buying like this will be the good for the longer period of time.So the trader will have the huge bitcoin after the year was ended.Now we are in the end of the year,So the current applying people like this will have their complete savings now.This bull run also gave them some additional dollars because of 42k dollars pump.

You seem to be giving too much value to the trading perspective and also the ability to make short term valuations of bitcoin and to see that your holdings are in profits.  Sure, there seem to be some advantages in terms of BTC holdings being in profits, yet if your BTC holdings are in profits, you may well end up getting deterred from accumulating more because it will raise your costs per BTC... so in that regard, any newbie might feel bad if the BTC price is going down while he is accumulating, but there is a certain advantage to being able to accumulate more and more and more bitcoin, and perhaps even way more than what could have had been accumulated when the BTC price is going up.

Each of us have differing situations, and if we are accumulating BTC for several years, if we do not have the ability to front load our investment, then it may well take us one or two full cycles to really accumulate meaningful amounts of BTC, and that may also depend on how much extra cash flow that we have.

I doubt that trading helps anyone out in terms of their being able to accumulate more BTC in a faster way rather than just focusing on various ways to ongoingly buy BTC, and maybe even figuring out ways to increase income and/or cut expenses in order to have more discretionary income that is capable of being used to buy bitcoin consistently, persistently, ongoingly and maybe even aggressively.

[macson]

My journey into Bitcoin was entire due to the need to send payment across borders as there was FX and several other restrictions in my country. So, I joined Bitcoin just to use it for cross-border payment without knowing it could actually be a way of creating wealth in the future.

Just recently, I was tempted to check my first ever Bitcoin wallet to see what I have done in the past. I was so depressed seeing the volume of Bitcoin that have passed through my wallet without me saving a reasonable portion of it.

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

i don't really understand what your topic means, but when i look at the nominal amount of Bitcoin i have get so far, i feel quite proud, i invested some smoothly and didn't sell it, but i sold some out of necessity ^{(i feel a little regretful though)}, You can't possibly continue to hold the Bitcoin you have in your personal wallet, even those who invest long term in Bitcoin have a target date for when they will sell, in essence if you want to be a long term investor in Bitcoin, you must have a main job that can provide you with stable money so you can keep all the bitcoins you get, whether from paid bitcoin campaigns or from your purchases.

[JayJuanGee]

..... even those who invest long term in Bitcoin have a target date for when they will sell,.....

That is not true.

For sure there are some longer-term bitcoiners who plan their portfolio management around dates, and there are others who plan their BTC portfolio management around prices. Still, there are even others who plan to never sell, and so maybe they are planning to either kick the can down the road, or wait until maybe some life circumstances might cause them to sell or maybe they are planning to pass their coins through inheritance or some other ways (and even the ones who are planning to die with their coins.. so maybe not as uncommon as you might presume it to be).

No matter if they plan around dates, prices or some other criteria, they may well be merely considering selling fractions of their bitcoin holdings at any particular time (or maybe triggered based on certain events) or maybe in accordance with their selling criteria - as if they might be considering holding BTC to be a kind of insurance that they may or many not have to use during their lifetime - and so they might not get into a circumstance of needing to sell, and even if they might chose to sell some of their bitcoin, they don't necessarily decide to sell large portions or even all of their BTC holdings based on either time, price or one of their other triggering events.

Sure there are some longer-term bitcoiners who have specific timelines in mind.. but just because some of the longer term bitcoiners have timelines in mind, that does not mean that all longer term bitcoiners plan in the same kinds of ways  or that it is even necessary to plan to sell large amounts of their BTC or even to sell all of their BTC at any given time, absent some extreme circumstances such as knowing that they might be dying soon or some other emergency that might trigger a selling of all of the BTC rather than some of the BTC.

Even though surely I have no problem with ideas of planning to sell small or even significantly large parts of our BTC holdings that could be time-based and/or price based.. which I cover both of those kinds of withdrawal ideas in my sustainable withdrawal thread... and neither of the time-based or price-based withdrawal systems that I outline (by default) include much if any intention to sell large portions of a person's BTC stash within any particular timeline, even though optionally those who tailor these particular systems to their own preferences could tailor their own plans in such a way to sell large portions of their BTC - even though I had been personally trying to present the ideas in terms of sustainable withdrawal.

Even if someone were to tailor some of my ideas and presumptions of sustainable withdrawal and to engage in non-sustainable withdrawal of most if not all of their BTC rather than selling in sustainable chunks.. they have the rights to use the ideas and to deviate from those kinds of sustainable withdraw (of BTC) ideas that I am trying to promote and emphasize in my sustainable withdrawal thread..

Edited: added a few ideas to expand beyond time and price based selling.

[bettercrypto]

My journey into Bitcoin was entire due to the need to send payment across borders as there was FX and several other restrictions in my country. So, I joined Bitcoin just to use it for cross-border payment without knowing it could actually be a way of creating wealth in the future.

Just recently, I was tempted to check my first ever Bitcoin wallet to see what I have done in the past. I was so depressed seeing the volume of Bitcoin that have passed through my wallet without me saving a reasonable portion of it.

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

Of course, at first, if I experienced having Bitcoin, I was happy, but later it became normal, especially if you save it little by little and eventually see that your savings are growing.

So right now, since my Bitcoin holdings are small, I just leave them in my wallet. Even if little by little, I am able to somehow save up because of the high transaction fee in its bitcoin network. So maybe that's good, so I can hold Bitcoin too.

[Assface16678]

My journey into Bitcoin was entire due to the need to send payment across borders as there was FX and several other restrictions in my country. So, I joined Bitcoin just to use it for cross-border payment without knowing it could actually be a way of creating wealth in the future.

Just recently, I was tempted to check my first ever Bitcoin wallet to see what I have done in the past. I was so depressed seeing the volume of Bitcoin that have passed through my wallet without me saving a reasonable portion of it.

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

Same as you, I still use my first ever bitcoin wallet, and I see my transactions in the past. I would say that I should save more or don't use those bitcoins or satoshis. I should do more holdings than use them for my own good, because I'm aware that yes, I invest in bitcoin, but as long as I earn from my holdings, I convert them right away with the excitement that I could buy the things that I need and want. In the past, I lacked future sight or planning for the future. That's why I focus on earning and spending, which I regret that I do.

So now I do more investing than spending the profit that I get from investing in bitcoin, and I have more holdings now than before. The history of my transactions will be my motivation to do better and think wisely before spending my assets.

[lienfaye]

Just recently, I was tempted to check my first ever Bitcoin wallet to see what I have done in the past. I was so depressed seeing the volume of Bitcoin that have passed through my wallet without me saving a reasonable portion of it.

I have the feeling that many forum users too have similar experience; do kindly share just maybe I can feel a little better knowing that I'm not a lone.

Pretty sure I also have a significant amount of Bitcoin that passed through my wallet as i'm not a fan of holding before, when I was just starting. Everytime I buy, it doesn't take too long for me to sell my Bitcoin. It's just come and go (as I never expected this is something that I will regret later on) until I learned the importance of holding. Well, as others have said already, even many of us have similar experience, it's not yet late to buy Bitcoin and hold. There's no such thing as too late if your plan is to hold for long period. Thus, timing when to buy and be firm to hold because it is proven as an effective strategy to profit in Bitcoin. But one should have a long patience.