How high is the probability of accusations vs. casinos in BitcoinTalk are true?

[EarnOnVictor]

All of your points are something we must look at specially the calling for FORUM ARBITRATOR because bitcointalk is gathering so much issues about scamming so we should have our panel here to  face these cases.

This doesn't make any sort of sense whatsoever. I have no idea why you guys are suggesting forum arbitrators when there are forum mods already available and the fact that this is a free forum.

Stuff like this was suggested before too and shot down for the reasons that I stated. None of this will ever change in my opinion.

This doesn't exist by name, but I think we really have them in the forum, and they are the DT members. DT members are trusted individuals expected to make sound decisions to protect the forum and its users. As long as there is enough evidence presented by the accuser, the DT members will support it and paint a red tag to the accused casino's BTT profile. This system is quite effective because people in the forum are aware that once a casino has a red tag, it is a casino to stay away from.

@Haunebu, forum arbitrator? Well, I have not seen any serious reason for that, it can only be on the light mood or the guy who suggested it did not know the meaning of arbitrators. I don't know what such a task is looking for in a forum like this that is even trying to keep its head down and do its things in such a way that will be entirely oversight and controlled by it. Not even a forum that is about fiats needs such a thing, not to mention a Bitcoin forum.

@freedomgo, it's true that we have them and this forum came prepared if I must say but trusting the decision of many of them after all I have witnessed on the forum? I don't think so. The moderators are doing great but may include the reason why they take some actions to make it fair and the mistake avoidable next time. But for the DTs, I think some of them are power drunk, oh yes, I mean it and I don't think it's uncommon they use the power as an instrument to deal with another. Is that what we call fairness? This is the only reason why I think an independent judge or whatever they will call it may be needed.

[rodskee]

Yes I noticed this also, it’s been happening for years and it’s almost always a new account and that’s why it’s hard to take them seriously.

Though there might some others that may say true yet since they are newbie its really hard to listen and
believe in their accusation knowing that they are not presenting valid arguments and proofs so how can we give
them good reason to believe .

Some people do make emotional decisions while gambling and go on tilt and end up losing it all. Then they try and say they were scammed in hopes they get a refund. They figure the casino doesn’t want bad publicity and they might get their money back. But it rarely works out that way.

that is the normal scenarios here , those losers cannot accept their defeat and instead of looking for
another way to win? they chose to put accusations and stupid arguments that only ended them being tagged
and gone.

[cicadasTR]

High. Which is why it's naive for strangers to make excuses for gambling companies.

[Synchronice]

Currently, there's a pattern. A person makes a new account in BitcoinTalk, makes a topic/accuses a casino of scamming him/her, and because some users need to bump up their post count for their signature campaigns, the topic gets more attention than it should be during a normal situation.

OK, it's understandable that users need to bump up their post count, but we should also be responsible to find the truth, and merely not believing an accusation from a person who literally made a brand new account, nor discussing it with the person like something wrong actually happened. Because actual scammers themselves will take advantage of us.

Every scam accusation topic deserves a significant attention because if someone recently became a victim, there is a chance that others will become soon. If the fact that many people bump scam accusation topic for the sake of signature campaign, I would say that that's a positive side effect, this will also motivate businesses to quickly solve the problem and will push their customer supports to offer fast service.

Yes I noticed this also, it’s been happening for years and it’s almost always a new account and that’s why it’s hard to take them seriously.

It's always a new account because they register on Bitcointalk when they have a problem with casino. In fact, they aren't the members of this forum, they only register to solve their problem with the help of DT members.

[Mr. Magkaisa]

Currently, there's a pattern. A person makes a new account in BitcoinTalk, makes a topic/accuses a casino of scamming him/her, and because some users need to bump up their post count for their signature campaigns, the topic gets more attention than it should be during a normal situation.

OK, it's understandable that users need to bump up their post count, but we should also be responsible to find the truth, and merely not believing an accusation from a person who literally made a brand new account, nor discussing it with the person like something wrong actually happened. Because actual scammers themselves will take advantage of us.

        -   Because those are just two things, whether what a complainant accuses is true or not. Of course, if you are the one making the accusation, you must prove that what you are accusing in a casino is true. And the evidence that you will show should not be one; that's why there is a proper section for these things.

The accuser will not be able to say that the accused must prove what he is alleging here. That's why what usually happens to the complainants here in a casino who make a post topic in the forum is that they can't stand or prove their accusations because their evidence is lacking.

[Hamphser]

Currently, there's a pattern. A person makes a new account in BitcoinTalk, makes a topic/accuses a casino of scamming him/her, and because some users need to bump up their post count for their signature campaigns, the topic gets more attention than it should be during a normal situation.

OK, it's understandable that users need to bump up their post count, but we should also be responsible to find the truth, and merely not believing an accusation from a person who literally made a brand new account, nor discussing it with the person like something wrong actually happened. Because actual scammers themselves will take advantage of us.

        -   Because those are just two things, whether what a complainant accuses is true or not. Of course, if you are the one making the accusation, you must prove that what you are accusing in a casino is true. And the evidence that you will show should not be one; that's why there is a proper section for these things.

The accuser will not be able to say that the accused must prove what he is alleging here. That's why what usually happens to the complainants here in a casino who make a post topic in the forum is that they can't stand or prove their accusations because their evidence is lacking.

Proof is all we do need before making or drawing up conclusions and this is something that they should really be providing on the moment that they would be throwing those accusations.
On the moment that we are seeing accusations specially into this forum or in other places on which its not something that would be easily to believe on not until on the moment that they will be showing proofs on which it would really be just that a normal approach. Yes, it might be false accusations for some point but it would be still giving out that kind of impact when it comes to overall reputation of a certain
platform on which this is something that could give out some negative effect even if its not a proven one. This community isnt something that could believe whenever there are accusations been thrown out.

[Kavelj22]

Currently, there's a pattern. A person makes a new account in BitcoinTalk, makes a topic/accuses a casino of scamming him/her, and because some users need to bump up their post count for their signature campaigns, the topic gets more attention than it should be during a normal situation.

OK, it's understandable that users need to bump up their post count, but we should also be responsible to find the truth, and merely not believing an accusation from a person who literally made a brand new account, nor discussing it with the person like something wrong actually happened. Because actual scammers themselves will take advantage of us.

This is how things usually work because the accusations board is dedicated to that type of topic and it is easy for anyone to use it once they create a free account on the forum.

On the one hand, we cannot judge the intentions of anyone who publishes a topic containing allegations related to a casino, whether they are realistic or just allegations. There are actually those who take advantage of the abundance of activity on the forum to spread false allegations with the intention of distorting the reputation of one of the casinos, and this can only be stopped by proving the falsity of those charges, which are always the responsibility of the casino subject of accusation, and for this reason it is recommended that any existing crypto casino should have an official representation here on the forum to answer all allegations.
On the other hand, the interaction of members is important to ask questions to op and verify the validity of the claims within the limits of what the intuitive logic of things allows. Most of the posts in this section are constructive, and many times the claim is proven false because it lacks some of the basics of a valid claim.

[freedomgo]

@freedomgo, it's true that we have them and this forum came prepared if I must say but trusting the decision of many of them after all I have witnessed on the forum? I don't think so. The moderators are doing great but may include the reason why they take some actions to make it fair and the mistake avoidable next time. But for the DTs, I think some of them are power drunk, oh yes, I mean it and I don't think it's uncommon they use the power as an instrument to deal with another. Is that what we call fairness? This is the only reason why I think an independent judge or whatever they will call it may be needed.

At the moment, there's no group of people who can judge except the DT members. Forum moderators have a different job; they don't interfere with the trust system or feedback. Their main job is to moderate the forum based on the posts, determining if a user is a spammer, deleting posts, and banning users if they violate forum rules.

DT members, as I've mentioned, can leave negative feedback on a user's profile. While we cannot deny that some DT members might abuse their power, they usually don't last long in that position since those who trusted them might eventually distrust them. It's important to first understand how the trust system works to see the big picture and recognize how useful it is.

[boyptc]

Yes I noticed this also, it’s been happening for years and it’s almost always a new account and that’s why it’s hard to take them seriously.

It's always a new account because they register on Bitcointalk when they have a problem with casino. In fact, they aren't the members of this forum, they only register to solve their problem with the help of DT members.

And they fall down to the forum probably because of their desperation. But not all of these newbies have a legit concern.

They are writing a long story on how they have been scammed or they've been not allowed to withdraw. While I've seen successful disputes but it's that most of them were losers that can't accept it.

They're coming to that point because they think that it's going to give them a refund with their losses.

[paxmao]

Yes I noticed this also, it’s been happening for years and it’s almost always a new account and that’s why it’s hard to take them seriously.

It's always a new account because they register on Bitcointalk when they have a problem with casino. In fact, they aren't the members of this forum, they only register to solve their problem with the help of DT members.

And they fall down to the forum probably because of their desperation. But not all of these newbies have a legit concern.

They are writing a long story on how they have been scammed or they've been not allowed to withdraw. While I've seen successful disputes but it's that most of them were losers that can't accept it.

They're coming to that point because they think that it's going to give them a refund with their losses.

Newbie or Jr Member accounts are always to be taken with a pinch of salt we can reckon. You can see out there users who are newbie but obviously have a good degree of understanding of the forum and make comments that are relevant and reveal knowledge. These are usually secondary accounts, but other are simply open for accusation as you say and will not carry much credibility.

[Russlenat]

They're coming to that point because they think that it's going to give them a refund with their losses.

They could expect compensation, but that will not be granted by the casinos. These losers can create or destroy the name of the casino, but without proper evidence, they won't get the attention of the community in the forum to support them.

Newbies are mostly throwaway accounts. Once they've served their purpose, they'll be discarded, as new ones can easily be created for their schemes. That's why, as responsible users, we should be aware of these newbies. They not only can be victims, but they could also victimize others by ruining the reputation of a casino if we easily get convinced by their stories.

[cicadasTR]

Yes I noticed this also, it’s been happening for years and it’s almost always a new account and that’s why it’s hard to take them seriously.

It's always a new account because they register on Bitcointalk when they have a problem with casino. In fact, they aren't the members of this forum, they only register to solve their problem with the help of DT members.

And they fall down to the forum probably because of their desperation. But not all of these newbies have a legit concern.

They are writing a long story on how they have been scammed or they've been not allowed to withdraw. While I've seen successful disputes but it's that most of them were losers that can't accept it.

They're coming to that point because they think that it's going to give them a refund with their losses.

Newbie or Jr Member accounts are always to be taken with a pinch of salt we can reckon. You can see out there users who are newbie but obviously have a good degree of understanding of the forum and make comments that are relevant and reveal knowledge. These are usually secondary accounts, but other are simply open for accusation as you say and will not carry much credibility.

I made two complaints as a new account, both resolved in my favour. Making 2000 posts vs 10 means the former has way too much time on their hands, not credibility.

[Reid]

I usually ignore this type of accusations especially from new users here in forum. I don't want to read it because if you are brave enough you should be using your main account to face the problem. Not doing it on another account which will probably have less believers in it.

I've seen some who would come forward and tell their experience and it can easily be noticed and supported thanks to the courage he shown. It's true, we must not just believe any accusations that comes out because there are times they are just angry from the losses they experienced.

[danherbias07]

Very low.
There are ways to do this properly and that is directly telling it to their gambling threads which most of the gambling sites here created for that purpose and updates.
Yes, we should not easily believe those accusations as there's a possibility that it's just an attack on the gambling site especially now with the growing competition. I do find myself sometimes reading the replies of other members because I am seeking another experience as the post opener did. Sadly, most of the time none have the same experience and the poster is the one being blamed for his mistake.

[freedomgo]

Very low.
There are ways to do this properly and that is directly telling it to their gambling threads which most of the gambling sites here created for that purpose and updates.
Yes, we should not easily believe those accusations as there's a possibility that it's just an attack on the gambling site especially now with the growing competition. I do find myself sometimes reading the replies of other members because I am seeking another experience as the post opener did. Sadly, most of the time none have the same experience and the poster is the one being blamed for his mistake.

Most of the posts are just attempts to destroy the reputation of the casino, which is why they choose to post in the gambling section where gamblers are more likely to see it. If they were serious about their intentions, they should have posted in the "scam accusation" board. However, since all they have are narratives that can't be backed by evidence, they cannot proceed and instead choose the popular board to mislead gamblers.

[kotajikikox]

Very low.
There are ways to do this properly and that is directly telling it to their gambling threads which most of the gambling sites here created for that purpose and updates.
Yes, we should not easily believe those accusations as there's a possibility that it's just an attack on the gambling site especially now with the growing competition. I do find myself sometimes reading the replies of other members because I am seeking another experience as the post opener did. Sadly, most of the time none have the same experience and the poster is the one being blamed for his mistake.

Most of the posts are just attempts to destroy the reputation of the casino, which is why they choose to post in the gambling section where gamblers are more likely to see it. If they were serious about their intentions, they should have posted in the "scam accusation" board. However, since all they have are narratives that can't be backed by evidence, they cannot proceed and instead choose the popular board to mislead gamblers.

Yes because they cannot even provide concrete evidence and the funny thing is ? once they are being burned that said account will leave the forum and never come back again in which proving they are only here for ruining the reputation or trying to black mail each casino , action of not worth to listen account an that is what we have been seeing mostly from those  accusations .

[Mrbluntzy]

It is possible that most of those accusations against those casinos is true, even if all is not true, majority of it is  true. Some non reputable casinos might have indeed scammed those guys that create the scam accusation topics while some of those accusations are also a false accusations which was the fault of the gambler and not the casino mentioned. If any reputable casino on this community is falsely accused, they will definitely respond to clear their name or their representative will likely respond.

Do you visit frequently on scam accusation board? Most of the scam accusation there is against reputable casino which ended up as garbage thread after failure of providing evidence.

Most of the accusations in the forum against casino is hoax since those users is just using the forum to take shield on hiding their ToS violation on the casino. Playing victim is very popular on that board that makes it very hard to support or follow new complaints especially if its involved sudden account freeze since this case usually incorporates violation of ToS once the casino reps clear their name by providing evidence.

You are right @Eternad, I don't make comments on the reputation board often but I regularly visit the thread and see some baseless accusations that some newbies make against even reputable casino without providing evidence. I completely agree with what you said that's why on my first comment, I didn't say that every single accusation made is true. I believe that some are true too.

[boyptc]

And they fall down to the forum probably because of their desperation. But not all of these newbies have a legit concern.

They are writing a long story on how they have been scammed or they've been not allowed to withdraw. While I've seen successful disputes but it's that most of them were losers that can't accept it.

They're coming to that point because they think that it's going to give them a refund with their losses.

Newbie or Jr Member accounts are always to be taken with a pinch of salt we can reckon. You can see out there users who are newbie but obviously have a good degree of understanding of the forum and make comments that are relevant and reveal knowledge. These are usually secondary accounts, but other are simply open for accusation as you say and will not carry much credibility.

I agree but I've seen some newbies that are real new to the forum and have got real accusations and their concerns were addressed and solved by the casino they accused.

They're coming to that point because they think that it's going to give them a refund with their losses.

They could expect compensation, but that will not be granted by the casinos. These losers can create or destroy the name of the casino, but without proper evidence, they won't get the attention of the community in the forum to support them.

Newbies are mostly throwaway accounts. Once they've served their purpose, they'll be discarded, as new ones can easily be created for their schemes. That's why, as responsible users, we should be aware of these newbies. They not only can be victims, but they could also victimize others by ruining the reputation of a casino if we easily get convinced by their stories.

If they're solely just a bunch of losers and the accusations are just man made, they're not going to have anything from them.

And you guys are right with those throwaway accounts, they'd just dispose them and forget them once they are done.

[khaled0111]

I usually ignore this type of accusations especially from new users here in forum. I don't want to read it because if you are brave enough you should be using your main account to face the problem. Not doing it on another account which will probably have less believers in it.

Bravery has nothing to do with this. If someone chooses to use a new account to post an accusation thread then it's most likely for privacy concerns. Besides, there is nothing wrong with that, even theymos encourages users to use alt accounts in similar cases.
And, honestly, I don't understand why do you, guys, think that old accounts have more credibility than new ones! We should only look at the evidence regardless of who posted it.

[EarnOnVictor]

@freedomgo, it's true that we have them and this forum came prepared if I must say but trusting the decision of many of them after all I have witnessed on the forum? I don't think so. The moderators are doing great but may include the reason why they take some actions to make it fair and the mistake avoidable next time. But for the DTs, I think some of them are power drunk, oh yes, I mean it and I don't think it's uncommon they use the power as an instrument to deal with another. Is that what we call fairness? This is the only reason why I think an independent judge or whatever they will call it may be needed.

At the moment, there's no group of people who can judge except the DT members. Forum moderators have a different job; they don't interfere with the trust system or feedback. Their main job is to moderate the forum based on the posts, determining if a user is a spammer, deleting posts, and banning users if they violate forum rules.

DT members, as I've mentioned, can leave negative feedback on a user's profile. While we cannot deny that some DT members might abuse their power, they usually don't last long in that position since those who trusted them might eventually distrust them. It's important to first understand how the trust system works to see the big picture and recognize how useful it is.

Perhaps, instead of the arbitrator that was suggested by some users, why can't the moderators add that to their roles or another established role that can take care of that be convened by the forum admin? This will be in the form of a jury and maybe a somewhat judge will be included to avoid some unjust decisions by the DTs. Be it DT1 or D2, they are human beings and they can be influenced by many things including personal interest, mood, vendetta, wrong decisions etc. But with the jury suggested, when such DT's decision is reported, such a new convened role will be activated to deliver the lasting decision.

I am sure that two heads are better than one, so if one DT makes a mistake or thinks he can misuse the power, the new role will undo it. However, if persistent wrong decisions are being made by the same DT, such would be relieved of his DT power.

As for the DT losing their power for an abuse, well, it depends on what you term the abuse because the sentiment towards the abuse, the particular DT, how the person who was mistreated takes it and many more are factors here. Some users are just voiceless and you will not even know such a thing happened, while a few who saw it may turn a blind eye because they are less concerned or may not want to offend the concerned DT. That's the way I see it.