NEO and BEE talk (unmoderated)

[okaynow]

Is there any official+"legal" basis for Havelock to re-list the asset unilaterally? ("legal" because, well...bitcoin...)

Freezing the trading was a good decision, re-listing unilaterlaly with the .Q added is just scammy.

there is nothing official, apart from the announcements made here and on twitter a few days ago.

Havelock changing the listing name, because they "care" for customers without any formal announcement at least on their site, like they did with the trade-stop, is more than scammy.

screams of manipulation.

[NanoAkron]

Is there any official+"legal" basis for Havelock to re-list the asset unilaterally? ("legal" because, well...bitcoin...)

Freezing the trading was a good decision, re-listing unilaterlaly with the .Q added is just scammy.

there is nothing official, apart from the announcements made here and on twitter a few days ago.

Havelock changing the listing name, because they "care" for customers without any formal announcement at least on their site, like they did with the trade-stop, is more than scammy.

screams of manipulation.

Are you blind or stupid?

Formal announcements directly from Havelock's site (https://www.havelockinvestments.com/fund.php?symbol=NEOBEEQ):

April 4, 2014

On March 28, 2014 Havelock Investments halted trading of the NEOBEE Fund; Havelock Investments has yet to receive any formal information in regards to the questionable trading activity on the LMB share platform website. We have not received any formal information on the current situation at LMB Holdings. Due to those factors we have decided that the unit holders on the NEOBEE Fund should no longer be suspended from trading their units. The Fund will now be designated as NEOBEEQ to reflect the uncertainty of the future of LMB Holdings – NEO BEE Ltd. Financial information on the status of the company has not been released. The units of this Fund will continue to trade even if the company will file for bankruptcy. We will continue to update you if any information is provided to us.
Trading will resume today at 5:00 PM EST


March 28, 2014

Havelock Investments has been formally informed by the Pass-Through Fund Manager of NEOBEE that the compliance officer of Neo and Bee Ltd has stated that due to an increase of abnormal activity on the LMB share platform, there may be a high possibility of questionable trading activity. While Neo and Bee Ltd investigate the issue further they have strongly recommended that we halt trading and transfers.
Havelock Investments has halted the NEOBEE fund and is awaiting further instructions from the issuer.

[okaynow]

havelock is not in a position to give formal announcements on behalf of the listings.
Thats like saying that NYSE can announce what CocaColaInc can do with their listing.
all havelock can do is provide us with their reasoning for acting like they did.

there was no ann on this by neo.
Havelock has gone ahead and done what they though was good for them, according to havelock announcement.

Until neo confirms that everything was in accordance to them, nothing is official

[sporket]

and nothing of value was lost.

[NanoAkron]

and nothing of value was lost.

What a malicious little troll you are.

[sporket]

You tried to sell out Bitcoin to a banker.  Your scheme fell apart.  Bitcoin in the free market paradigm functioned exactly as intended.
Invisible hand in action is a joy behold.

[KS]

Is there any official+"legal" basis for Havelock to re-list the asset unilaterally? ("legal" because, well...bitcoin...)

Freezing the trading was a good decision, re-listing unilaterlaly with the .Q added is just scammy.

Can't wait for decent people to make a decent exchange...

How is freezing trading a good decision?

And why is allowing people to trade their shares scammy?

Neobee loses 10k btc and 2k in bitfunder and you say havelock is scammy?

Get real.

Freezing trading means you don't get to sell for satoshis. If lets everyone clear the panic and protects the investors against manipulations like Neo or whomever buying back cheap shares.

Also, freezing was done on behalf of Neobee, because Neobee _asked_ for it. The re-listing was done unilaterally by Havelock. They have no right to do it and it wasn't done because Neo asked. That created a panic and ppl sold for satoshis. Bascially, Havelock stole all your Bitcoins Neo shares and gave you Goxcoins Neobee.Q shares.

If it were a real company, I would seize the SEC or equivalent and get their ass sued to kingdom come.

[bitpop]

Danny needs a bullet hole

[jimmothy]

Freezing trading means you don't get to sell for satoshis. If lets everyone clear the panic and protects the investors against manipulations like Neo or whomever buying back cheap shares.

Also, freezing was done on behalf of Neobee, because Neobee _asked_ for it. The re-listing was done unilaterally by Havelock. They have no right to do it and it wasn't done because Neo asked. That created a panic and ppl sold for satoshis. Bascially, Havelock stole all your Bitcoins Neo shares and gave you Goxcoins Neobee.Q shares.

Havelock is not an investor protection service. It is a stock exchange. People use the site to trade stocks and as a shareholder that is exactly what I want to do.

I dont need you or neobees permission if I want to freely trade my shares. If you don't want to trade your shares then feel free to not trade your shares.

Neobee did not have the right to freeze trading simply because there is "suspicious trading" on a seperate trading platform.

And havelock does not need neobees permission to resume trading because there is no neobee.

No company. No ceo. No staff. Nobody to resume trading. Havelock is in charge of the passthrough now that TAT quit.

So should all shareholders be stuck with their shares indefinately and call it a game? Of course not. We should be able to salvage pennies on the dollar if we want and speculators should be free to speculate.

And how is havelock stealing anything? They have earned a whopping 0.1btc in trading fees since enabling trading. Do you really think they care about so little btc?

If it were a real company, I would seize the SEC or equivalent and get their ass sued to kingdom come.

No you wouldn't because first you need to be invested in neobee which you clearly aren't because if you were then you would not be against unfreezing trading. Second the SEC has no jurisdiction in panama. Thirdly this is the last thing someone would go to the SEC for.

Please stop talking shit.

Realize that havelock is actually a pretty decent exchange.

[velacreations]

none of the shares on HL are owned by NeoBee anyway.  What right do they have to limit trading of publicly held shares?

[tiberiandusk]

where's TAT?  why hasn't he explained his actions?

TAT is ... somewhere very far away from this place  

Please ban me. I'm serious.

...

In short: Fuck you, motherfuckers.

Ban me.

Out of context much?

[okaynow]

Neobee did not have the right to freeze trading simply because there is "suspicious trading" on a seperate trading platform.

And havelock does not need neobees permission to resume trading because there is no neobee.

You are implying than a stock exchange has supreme power over a company, above board of directors, and shareholders, because the share is traded there.
Havelock stopped trading because the company asked so.
Havelock resumed trading on their own and actually store your shares, as others have pointed.

And if havelock says jump, do you ask how high mate?

EDIT, could not resist, you fluffy troll, bold test is my emphasis:

And how is havelock stealing anything? They have earned a whopping 0.1btc in trading fees since enabling trading.

for the past two days, neoq had more than 200btc trade vol, per day.
You are implying that havelock made 0.1 btc with over 400btc daily trade vol on neobee, in two days?
you so funny.

[Darkstone2]

for the past two days, neoq had more than 200btc trade vol, per day.

False. For the past 7 days, the total tade volume of NeoBeeQ was 74 BTC total. Havelock gains 0.4% per trade, so that is <0.3 BTC total. LMB holdings probably gets 10% of that.

[sporket]

It probably went down something like this:
-OMGWTF we halted trading?!  How dafuq r we gunna justify this when CSA comes knocking?!
-We're in Panama.
-Right, whatever.  What now, eh?
-So let them trade again, eh?
-Right.  You gonna finish that poutine, eh?

[ffwong]

Here is the missing Danny?   

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=561454.0

[jimmothy]

Neobee did not have the right to freeze trading simply because there is "suspicious trading" on a seperate trading platform.

And havelock does not need neobees permission to resume trading because there is no neobee.

You are implying than a stock exchange has supreme power over a company, above board of directors, and shareholders, because the share is traded there.
Havelock stopped trading because the company asked so.
Havelock resumed trading on their own and actually store your shares, as others have pointed.

And if havelock says jump, do you ask how high mate?

EDIT, could not resist, you fluffy troll, bold test is my emphasis:

And how is havelock stealing anything? They have earned a whopping 0.1btc in trading fees since enabling trading.

for the past two days, neoq had more than 200btc trade vol, per day.
You are implying that havelock made 0.1 btc with over 400btc daily trade vol on neobee, in two days?
you so funny.

I do love when people talk out of their ass.

First of all the fund listed on havelock is not under neobees control. It is a passthrough run by tat who ragequit giving control to havelock.

Fact is that trading should have never been halted to begin with. If danny or tat didn't authorize it then who did?

Second, there was only 74btc traded so far since trading resumed. Only half of that is taxed (no fees on buys) so havelock has made a whopping 0.15 btc by allowing trading. Wow such scam. Very profit.

[Darkstone2]

You have no idea what you're talking about. Havelock makes 0.4% per trade, that is 0.3 BTC, not 0.15.

Fact is that trading should have never been halted to begin with. If danny or tat didn't authorize it then who did?

The announcement clearly states that the NeoBee compliance officer requested the trading halt.

[jimmothy]

You have no idea what you're talking about. Havelock makes 0.4% per trade, that is 0.3 BTC, not 0.15.

Fact is that trading should have never been halted to begin with. If danny or tat didn't authorize it then who did?

The announcement clearly states that the NeoBee compliance officer requested the trading halt.

0.3btc or 0.15 doesn't matter because it is incredibly tiny. We are talking about a company which supposedly lost 12k btc of investors funds a month after launch and you guys are concerned about havelock making 0.3btc on trading fees?

The announcement clearly states "they have strongly recommended that we halt trading and transfers."

So it was only a strong recommendation which havelock is free to ignore.

[sporket]

...
0.3btc or 0.15 doesn't matter because it is incredibly tiny. ...

We're talking about an exchange with absolutely no volume, .30 ain't nothin' to sneeze at for Havelock.
But you're right, it's not the .3BTC they were after.  They probably thought that resuming trading was the simplest way to undo the harm they caused by halting it.  Worked about as well as expected.

[bittymitty]

If anyone is interested this is Danny's bitcoin wallet address.

https://blockchain.info/address/16HQH4QNhec4MgRYnetdhD6KzH3uRsZ3hp

The last transaction is 20th March.  and its now empty.