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Author Topic: [ANN] RealCoin - Targeted to the IM world!  (Read 9785 times)
the joint
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January 17, 2012, 09:39:22 PM
 #61

I don't agree with the way you a distributing the coins with a faucet, a pre-mine, and an exchange.  The most fair blockchain right now is bitcoin, but even all the others are fair, they become fair as people use the coins in exchanges. As soon as one dollar is used in the exchange or service, the coin becomes fairer.  Mining is not a fair way to distribute coin.  

Someguy is going to use the faucet to get more than his fair share of coins for free.  Thus, end the faucet.  You don't know what the coins are going to be worth so end the pre-mine.  An exchange is the most fair way to distribute coins, btc for rc.  You could use the existing bitcoin blockchain, but you using an exchange is the same thing and avoids the blockchain bloat. The fairest thing you can do is pre-mine all the coins. Then use an exchange to sell 10,000,000 coins at a fixed rate of 5,000 per btc.  Set the block reward at a permanent 1.
 

Having all coins pre-mined is fair?  Are you kidding? 

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January 17, 2012, 09:45:19 PM
 #62

They are pre-mined, but the only way you can get them is exchange them for bitcoin.  It may take some deep thought, but what you are doing is basing the system on the most fair coin so far bitcoin.  Millions of exchanges have taken place in bitcoin, why not use that fairness to start a new coin. You could use the bitcoin blockchain directly, but you still have the issue of a 1 gb blockchain and how to get $10,000 to pay for the current coin.
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January 17, 2012, 09:52:47 PM
 #63

They are pre-mined, but the only way you can get them is exchange them for bitcoin.  It may take some deep thought, but what you are doing is basing the system on the most fair coin so far bitcoin.  Millions of exchanges have taken place in bitcoin, why not use that fairness to start a new coin. You could use the bitcoin blockchain directly, but you still have the issue of a 1 gb blockchain and how to get $10,000 to pay for the current coin.

Most fair coin is debatable.

Millions of exchanges?  Regardless, the ONLY RealCoin exchange would be owned by the same person owning every RealCoin in existence.  Doing this would make Bitcoin more unfair because the exchange owner would gain additional Bitcoin leverage.  RealCoin would simply be an indirect means by which the RealCoin exchange owner gains Bitcoin leverage.

Let's say that happens.  Here are a couple possible scenarios:
1)  All pre-mined RealCoins sell on exchange for $.01 as a starting point.  If this $.01 price remains constant for the entire distribution of them, then you are essentially adding $10,000 worth of Bitcoin to the Bitcoin market and nothing more.

2)  All pre-mined RealCoins sell on an exchange for $.01 an prices increase.  The more prices increase, the more unfair the whole situation becomes as the RealCoin owner simply keeps a few million for himself.

No thanks.

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January 17, 2012, 10:07:36 PM
 #64


2. The mining algorithm is CPU-friendly for now. GPU will be available at a later stage. Also mining is done only through the official client at least for the initial stages.

What!?! You are going to change the algorithm after you launch? Why?! Just write it correctly before you launch.

How is this different from Bitcoin?  How is this any different from Solidcoin?  Does Realcoin have any advantages over either of those other two?

You keep saying "average internet user" and "user friendly" but I do not see anything backing this up? How is it user-friendly?  Instead of average, do you really mean "naive chumps"?  That is what it sounds like to me.

You still have not said anything that demonstrates any value for this new coin over the dozen of other alt-chain attempts.  Except you have wasted/spent $10,000 developing it.
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January 17, 2012, 10:36:21 PM
 #65

So far I do not see any advantages over Bitcoin - disadvantages have been mentioned.

Too centralized (at least for now)

Security throught obscurity? :d

What's the USP??? How will you encourage people to use Realcoin when no one is using it - which is not the case of Bitcoin.
If I type digital currency I will see 5 results related (in title or description) to Bitcoin if I type cryptocurrency it will be all but two.
IMHO what you are offering now is not enough to convince people to use you currency - I wouldn't be surprised if people would only mine on it for a few weeks to sell it off on the exchange and then forget about it.

Everything you have mentioned so far can be done with Bitcoin, it is a matter of time before Bitcoin becomes more noob-friendly.

Investing $10k+ only shows you are seeking financial profit here (which is not bad, I am a capitalist myself) but people are allergic to that here (and so am I a bit). I think you would do better developping some businesses/products/services on the Bitcoin market.

What I don't understand is why do people think making dozens of 'competing' cryptocurrencies is good here, do you think everyone will bother installing 20+ clients for each cryptocurrency, downloading 20 blockchains, etc.? I am not saying it is a bad idea but I believe the Bitcoin market and community to be still too small for divisions.


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January 17, 2012, 10:59:14 PM
 #66

Repeating this again.  Just answer it instead of skipping over it.  If you answer this VERY SIMPLE QUESTION, it will likely shut up any opposition to this altcoin:

I just want to know one thing about RLC(?) that makes it inherently different from BTC (and changing the mining algo/client interface does NOT count).

I don't care about project focus.  I don't care about premine.  Give me one good reason your ideas warrant the addition of yet another altcoin instead of focusing your efforts and building on top of bitcoin.  The growing hatred of altcoins is NOT because so far every single one has either been a joke or a get rich quick scheme.  It stems from the fact that so far not a single one has managed to do anything different from Bitcoin, and thus has been nothing but a waste of time and energy.

If your ideas are so good, work on building them on top of bitcoin.  If your ideas CANT be built on top of Bitcoin, tell us what those ideas are SPECIFICALLY, and address why it cannot be built upon the already existing technology.  Unless you can do those two things, then you've done absolutely nothing worthy of wasting space on this forum.


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At this point every altcoin should be completely ignored and/or attacked unless their existence can be justified by offering something unique and different from what Bitcoin can provide.  If you can't do that, you're just another scammer hoping to make a quick buck at others expense.  An altcoin has no purpose in being made if its functionality could be achieved by an interface redesign to Bitcoin.

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January 17, 2012, 11:05:25 PM
 #67

what's the hash algorithm used? because if it's the same as bitcoin, you're going to see some attacks on your chain. *cough* coilcoin *cough*

It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.

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January 17, 2012, 11:07:16 PM
 #68

Pre mine
Closed source launch
CPU mining
Centralized control

http://solidcoin.info/
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January 17, 2012, 11:10:35 PM
 #69

Pre mine
Closed source launch
CPU mining
Centralized control

http://solidcoin.info/

Guys, don't tell me that I am the only one that finally got it.

This is SolidCoin 3 with 8.2 million premine !!!
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January 17, 2012, 11:30:59 PM
 #70

Ah...is the $10,000 startup cost  the profit he made from SolidCoin?

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January 17, 2012, 11:33:48 PM
 #71

How r u going to protect ur *coin against attacks of guys like Luke Jr.? Read https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=56675.0 to know what could happen.

You can only mine using the official client on your CPU. The exact mechanism how this is done is kept secret for the time being and is pretty difficult to reverse engineer. This is only a temporary measure while the network is still small.

Wait a minute. The expectation is that we will all run this code on our computers, without knowledge of exactly what's going on under the hood, and without the ability to look at the source?

No offense, but, after having gotten used to the transparency bitcoin offers... screw that.

Bitcoin is the ultimate freedom test. It tells you who is giving lip service and who genuinely believes in it.
...
...
In the future, books that summarize the history of money will have a line that says, “and then came bitcoin.” It is the economic singularity. And we are living in it now. - Ryan Dickherber
...
...
ATTENTION BFL MINING NEWBS: Just got your Jalapenos in? Wondering how to get the most value for the least hassle? Give BitMinter a try! It's a smaller pool with a fair & low-fee payment method, lots of statistical feedback, and it's easier than EasyMiner! (Yes, we want your hashing power, but seriously, it IS the easiest pool to use! Sign up in seconds to try it!)
...
...
The idea that deflation causes hoarding (to any problematic degree) is a lie used to justify theft of value from your savings.
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January 18, 2012, 12:44:35 AM
 #72

I think the word faucet has not been correctly used by me. This just means a reward of 10RLC to the first people to join the project. These 10RLC/user will be credited to each members account within the exchange. Thats all.

The exchange will feature both RLC<>Fiat and RLC<>BTC.


I don't agree with the way you a distributing the coins with a faucet, a pre-mine, and an exchange.  The most fair blockchain right now is bitcoin, but even all the others are fair, they become fair as people use the coins in exchanges. As soon as one dollar is used in the exchange or service, the coin becomes fairer.  Mining is not a fair way to distribute coin.  Mining is not fair to the existing owners of coin.

Someguy is going to use the faucet to get more than his fair share of coins for free.  Thus, end the faucet.  You don't know what the coins are going to be worth so end the pre-mine.  An exchange is the most fair way to distribute coins, btc for rc.  You could use the existing bitcoin blockchain, but you using an exchange is the same thing and avoids the blockchain bloat. The fairest thing you can do is pre-mine all the coins. Then use an exchange to sell 10,000,000 coins at a fixed rate of 5,000 per btc.  Set the block reward at a permanent 1.
 
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January 18, 2012, 12:50:46 AM
 #73

This sounds like another scamcoin to me.

The decision for a closed source client is the result of the multiple attacks on alternative coins. I am sure you all have figured this out by now.

This is incredibly dumb.  You think closed source is secure? You don't happen to use Internet Explorer do you?

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January 18, 2012, 12:53:14 AM
 #74

I think "premined" makes most people in here believe that someone spent hours mining on his own only to bring an alt coin to life when he gathered enough coins to fly away to Uruguay with all the riches. This is not the case with this alt coin.

The idea is to be fair to everyone. Therefore it is best to distribute a huge amount of coins to a large number of people and create a "reserve" with the fiat/btc gathered.

It will also bring the coin to life a lot quicker than if it was to start from 0 coins since there will plenty of coins to be distributed and thus more people getting their hands on it.

The closed source part is only for protection and frankly i dont understand why some of you in here support people destroying things created by others. If you dont like an alt coin then simply dont use it. If its a scam only for some guy to get rich let people know. This doesnt give the right to anyone to demolish something created by someone else.

Btw this is not a reply to your post but had to write it anyway.

Thanks for the wishes!

closed source and massive premined? um, no thankyou but good luck i guess
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January 18, 2012, 12:59:47 AM
 #75

I am still not sure why people fail to understand a very simple fact.

Fiat currency or Bitcoins will be gathered for the Fund and used as a "reserve" and for project funding.

Where did you get the idea that me or anyone else will run with the money? Just to add some info to this, neither I or any other investor of RealCoin will touch the backend of the exchange. Every detail will be publicly available since the Bitcoin Consultancy.

You trust them now with Intersango so why not trust them again with the RLC exchange?



They are pre-mined, but the only way you can get them is exchange them for bitcoin.  It may take some deep thought, but what you are doing is basing the system on the most fair coin so far bitcoin.  Millions of exchanges have taken place in bitcoin, why not use that fairness to start a new coin. You could use the bitcoin blockchain directly, but you still have the issue of a 1 gb blockchain and how to get $10,000 to pay for the current coin.

Most fair coin is debatable.

Millions of exchanges?  Regardless, the ONLY RealCoin exchange would be owned by the same person owning every RealCoin in existence.  Doing this would make Bitcoin more unfair because the exchange owner would gain additional Bitcoin leverage.  RealCoin would simply be an indirect means by which the RealCoin exchange owner gains Bitcoin leverage.

Let's say that happens.  Here are a couple possible scenarios:
1)  All pre-mined RealCoins sell on exchange for $.01 as a starting point.  If this $.01 price remains constant for the entire distribution of them, then you are essentially adding $10,000 worth of Bitcoin to the Bitcoin market and nothing more.

2)  All pre-mined RealCoins sell on an exchange for $.01 an prices increase.  The more prices increase, the more unfair the whole situation becomes as the RealCoin owner simply keeps a few million for himself.

No thanks.
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January 18, 2012, 01:00:38 AM
 #76

The closed source part is only for protection and frankly i dont understand why some of you in here support people destroying things created by others. If you dont like an alt coin then simply dont use it. If its a scam only for some guy to get rich let people know. This doesnt give the right to anyone to demolish something created by someone else.

I don't support destroying things. I support building things in a way that others can't destroy. Closed source is not the way to do this.  Closed source gives you a false sense of security and nothing more.

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January 18, 2012, 01:26:43 AM
 #77

I have been trying to explain but whenever i say something someone will try to pick a fight.

Does it have major differences to Bitcoin atm except the mining algo? No.

Will it have in the future? Yes.

Why not implement them now instead of at a later stage? You have to start from somewhere familiar and there are also numerous applications, clients, functions and addons that have popped up lately (for example Electrum) that its really hard to select one and go with it. Also time plays an important role in this. To fully develop a working client like i and others would like it to be, might even take a year or more.

Why dont you just use Bitcoin or build on top of it? I do like Bitcoin a lot but i dont see it fulfill some very important needs. Right now i can only use it to speculate and you can see that it is a speculative tool on your own. No need for me to tell you that.

Lets all think of PayPal. Why is PP accepted everywhere? Because it is user-friendly and simple to use both from the merchant's side and the consumer's.

Now Bitcoin could become a decentralized PP in terms of having all the advantages (or most of them) of PP but also being decentralized which is great.

Now ask yourself.

Has it become something like this or at least get close to it? No.

Will it become? I dont know.

Who decides what it will become? The core team who is developing it. Dont tell me that you actually have a say in what the client is or is not.

Is it user-friendly? Hmmm. Somewhere in the middle between Yes and No.

Could it be more user-friendly? Sure.

Would a regular average user benefit from a very simple tool that works like PP but is also under his own control? Definitely.

Would a merchant or a consumer or a business owner benefit? Of course.

Why doesnt Bitcoin fulfill this need? Probably because it might do it in the future but right not is focusing on other stuff.

Are there numerous functions on top of Bitcoin that make it better than just the client itself? Yes. Numerous.

Why are they not implemented into the client (apart from the technical side)? Maybe different goals.

Does Bitcoin has a Paper where the next steps that will be taken are clearly outlined? I am not aware of one.

There are numerous other questions.

The important thing is that the more alt coins fail the more stronger Bitcoin gets. So whenever someone like me or someone else posts an announcement on a new coin dont go crazy.

Lastly as i said in the beginning of this thread, why not be friends? Maybe in the future there is a function, utility, service developed in the RLC network that is good for BTC use and is adopted.

Also as you might have understood although the client might be really close to the BTC client, the economics behind RLC are different and there are some new ideas implemented. So look at this project as a way to research the side of economics rather than the pure source code and i am pretty sure that there will be important things that will come out of this.

Closing, i would like to say for once more that a DIFFERENT target/goal/aspiration/etc makes a DIFFERENT coin since the approach as well as the execution will be different.








2. The mining algorithm is CPU-friendly for now. GPU will be available at a later stage. Also mining is done only through the official client at least for the initial stages.

What!?! You are going to change the algorithm after you launch? Why?! Just write it correctly before you launch.

How is this different from Bitcoin?  How is this any different from Solidcoin?  Does Realcoin have any advantages over either of those other two?

You keep saying "average internet user" and "user friendly" but I do not see anything backing this up? How is it user-friendly?  Instead of average, do you really mean "naive chumps"?  That is what it sounds like to me.

You still have not said anything that demonstrates any value for this new coin over the dozen of other alt-chain attempts.  Except you have wasted/spent $10,000 developing it.

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January 18, 2012, 01:33:43 AM
 #78

You dont know how far Bitcoin is from being noob-friendly because you are neither developing it yourself nor there is plan laid out.

As for why different coins are good, its simply because they could be slightly different or way too different than Bitcoin (at least talking about those coins that actually have at least one small difference). In both cases they are different and therefore the end result will be different so something new to learn from each of them.


So far I do not see any advantages over Bitcoin - disadvantages have been mentioned.

Too centralized (at least for now)

Security throught obscurity? :d

What's the USP??? How will you encourage people to use Realcoin when no one is using it - which is not the case of Bitcoin.
If I type digital currency I will see 5 results related (in title or description) to Bitcoin if I type cryptocurrency it will be all but two.
IMHO what you are offering now is not enough to convince people to use you currency - I wouldn't be surprised if people would only mine on it for a few weeks to sell it off on the exchange and then forget about it.

Everything you have mentioned so far can be done with Bitcoin, it is a matter of time before Bitcoin becomes more noob-friendly.

Investing $10k+ only shows you are seeking financial profit here (which is not bad, I am a capitalist myself) but people are allergic to that here (and so am I a bit). I think you would do better developping some businesses/products/services on the Bitcoin market.

What I don't understand is why do people think making dozens of 'competing' cryptocurrencies is good here, do you think everyone will bother installing 20+ clients for each cryptocurrency, downloading 20 blockchains, etc.? I am not saying it is a bad idea but I believe the Bitcoin market and community to be still too small for divisions.



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January 18, 2012, 01:43:16 AM
 #79

I have answered this above but i will give you a simple answer since you are persistent.  Grin

Ideas cannot be built on top of Bitcoin because they will always be a different body. Ideas cannot be implemented in the official Bitcoin client because i dont develop it and i guess neither do you.

I dont want an engine, four tyres, 4 doors and a chasis to build a car on my own.

I want the whole car ready to go and i want it to be simple. I get in, push the start and im off.

Right now to fully take advantage of Bitcoin you need to get clients/services/applications/etc that dont come with it to actually use it. This comes from the business owner/consumer standpoint.

I hope now you clearly see a "small" difference.




Repeating this again.  Just answer it instead of skipping over it.  If you answer this VERY SIMPLE QUESTION, it will likely shut up any opposition to this altcoin:

I just want to know one thing about RLC(?) that makes it inherently different from BTC (and changing the mining algo/client interface does NOT count).

I don't care about project focus.  I don't care about premine.  Give me one good reason your ideas warrant the addition of yet another altcoin instead of focusing your efforts and building on top of bitcoin.  The growing hatred of altcoins is NOT because so far every single one has either been a joke or a get rich quick scheme.  It stems from the fact that so far not a single one has managed to do anything different from Bitcoin, and thus has been nothing but a waste of time and energy.

If your ideas are so good, work on building them on top of bitcoin.  If your ideas CANT be built on top of Bitcoin, tell us what those ideas are SPECIFICALLY, and address why it cannot be built upon the already existing technology.  Unless you can do those two things, then you've done absolutely nothing worthy of wasting space on this forum.


--
At this point every altcoin should be completely ignored and/or attacked unless their existence can be justified by offering something unique and different from what Bitcoin can provide.  If you can't do that, you're just another scammer hoping to make a quick buck at others expense.  An altcoin has no purpose in being made if its functionality could be achieved by an interface redesign to Bitcoin.
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January 18, 2012, 01:48:27 AM
 #80

PURE FAIL.

Your whole "concept" is simple for user.

So make a custom bitcoin client which is simple for user and has a built in exchange.  Done.

Your vague and nonsensical reasons about why you need a new coin to make it user friendly shows you either have no clue or you simply are looking to get rich quick.  There is no logical scenario where trying to bootstrap an entire economy (3rd party services, merchants, etc) makes sense.

The only reason for a ground up approach is if you were making CORE CHANGES which are incompatible with Bitcoin and you aren't.

Two years from now PureCoin is in the long list of tried and failed alt-coins.
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