Fractional Reserve Lending IS NOT bad - its unavoidable

[RoadTrain]

Yes, WEALTH should be stored in something other than fiat, and many make the wise decision to do that very thing. That's why banksters(and their puppet politicians) keep attacking things that represent stable stores of value over time that cannot be used to steal through inflation.

What do bankers steal through inflation? Can you describe the process?

[solarion]

Yes, WEALTH should be stored in something other than fiat, and many make the wise decision to do that very thing. That's why banksters(and their puppet politicians) keep attacking things that represent stable stores of value over time that cannot be used to steal through inflation.

What do bankers steal through inflation? Can you describe the process?

Goodness no. Please look up the millions of books or articles on the subject. I can recommend you look up Thomas Jefferson, Andrew Jackson, and Alexander Hamilton's history. If you're disinterested in reading then look up the thousands of youtube videos dealing with FRB, jeckel island, FRBNY, etc. Not doing your homework for you. This stuff should be required reading material for anyone unfortunate enough to have to deal with fiat currency, not a semi off topic paragraph.

[solarion]

*NotLambchop adds "non-government crooks(FRBNY)" to the cliche list*

Is there anyone not conspiring to part you and your monyz, solarion?

Not in government or banking...no.

I know...I know there's no way Americans will be treated to a Cypriot like looting. It can't happen here. FDR has been dead and gone a long time! US banks are safe, honorable institutions!

[NotLambchop]

The last looting I heard of in Cyprus was a little Bitcoin bank called NeoBee :$

[solarion]

The last looting I heard of in Cyprus was a little Bitcoin bank called NeoBee :$

Relevance? I know very little about neobee and bitcoin securities in general. They're not for me. If people choose to entrust their bitcoins with someone else then they were at risk. That should be obvious with a non-redeemable currency like Bitcoin. I haven't heard of anyone being forced to engage in bitcoin commerce or investing.

[NotLambchop]

The last looting I heard of in Cyprus was a little Bitcoin bank called NeoBee :$

Relevance? I know very little about neobee and bitcoin securities in general...

You should probably familiarize yourself with Bitcoin securities.
It is a shining example of laissez-faire economy based on non-inflationary currency in action.  ~95% failure rate.
NeoBee was a lulzy proposal by a charismatic young man named Danny Brewster to start a Bitcoin/fiat bank.  He has raised millions by pitching his brainchild to a receptive audience of Libertarian-leaning amateur financiers.
Then he ran away

Not quite sure how happy that would'a made Grandma.  Oh wait...



Photo cutesy of http://www.neo-bee.com/en/ , which is still up to mock the hobby finance aficionados.

[solarion]

The last looting I heard of in Cyprus was a little Bitcoin bank called NeoBee :$

Relevance? I know very little about neobee and bitcoin securities in general...

You should probably familiarize yourself with Bitcoin securities.
It is a shining example of laissez-faire economy based on non-inflationary currency in action.  ~95% failure rate.
NeoBee was a lulzy proposal by a charismatic young man named Danny Brewster to start a Bitcoin/fiat bank.  He has raised millions by pitching his brainchild to a receptive audience of Libertarian-leaning amateur financiers.
Then he ran away

Not quite sure how happy that would'a made Grandma.  Oh wait...

Please cite the bitcoin legal tender law that requires me to engage in bitcoin commerce or crypto related investing. Your posts are akin to soccer moms that blame guns for "killing" people. Make sense man.

[NotLambchop]

^
*NotLambchop add "MuhGunz" to the cliche list*

No law requires you to engage in bitcoin commerce, but this begs the question:  What's bitcoin good for, if not for commerce?  Isn't that sort-a a given that money is, you know... used?

[solarion]

^
*NotLambchop add "MuhGunz" to the cliche list*

No law requires you to engage in bitcoin commerce, but this begs the question:  What's bitcoin good for, if not for commerce?  Isn't that sort-a a given that money is, you know... used?

Money? Did you mean to say currency? ...or did you intend to imply that Bitcoin fits the definition of the word money? I'm fine with that provided you also agree that fiat clearly does NOT fit the definition of money.

Sure, please permit me to quote myself, as I've already answered this question in this thread.

Yes, WEALTH should be stored in something other than fiat, and many make the wise decision to do that very thing.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=604083.msg6691978#msg6691978

[NotLambchop]

^
*NotLambchop add "MuhGunz" to the cliche list*

No law requires you to engage in bitcoin commerce, but this begs the question:  What's bitcoin good for, if not for commerce?  Isn't that sort-a a given that money is, you know... used?

Money? Did you mean to say currency?

I meant to say exactly what I have said -- mon·eyˈmənē/

Sure, please permit me to quote myself, as I've already answered this question in this thread.

Yes, WEALTH should be stored in something other than fiat, and many make the wise decision to do that very thing.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=604083.msg6691978#msg6691978

Err...  Why dredge that up again?  Who told you that fiat was a great store of wealth?  How does that statement, regardless of it's validity, relate to bitcoin's use as money (or "currency," if you want to fool people into thinkin' you've been to finishin' school)?  Are you suggesting that it isn't?

[solarion]

^
*NotLambchop add "MuhGunz" to the cliche list*

No law requires you to engage in bitcoin commerce, but this begs the question:  What's bitcoin good for, if not for commerce?  Isn't that sort-a a given that money is, you know... used?

Money? Did you mean to say currency?

I meant to say exactly what I have said -- mon·eyˈmənē/

Sure, please permit me to quote myself, as I've already answered this question in this thread.

Yes, WEALTH should be stored in something other than fiat, and many make the wise decision to do that very thing.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=604083.msg6691978#msg6691978

Err...  Why dredge that up again?  Who told you that fiat was a great store of wealth?  How does that statement, regardless of it's validity, relate to bitcoin's use as money (or "currency," if you want to fool people into thinkin' you've been to finishin' school)?  Are you suggesting that it isn't?

Holy crap, I retract my previous comment about what you seem to know. I apologize, I overestimated your understanding of the topic.

[NotLambchop]

[solarion]

Only at the parents of the embryo smoking the cancer stick.

[NotLambchop]

...and now it's smoking
Tell me what you *do* like, solarion, because it's starting to seem like you just have a case of the blahs.
How about we turn that frown upside down?

[solarion]

...and now it's smoking
Tell me what you *do* like, solarion, because it's starting to seem like you just have a case of the blahs.
How about we turn that frown upside down?

In no particular order: Women(except when they smoke as it makes them taste like I envision an ashtray tastes), motorcycles, cars, cryptos, learning, sincerity, hockey, empathy, liberty.

We? I don't think you're my type bud, but thanks.

[solarion]

^
Now that you found out that fiat money is inflationary, you can avoid being a chump by investing it or spending it on goods and services -- not stuffing it in your mattress and expecting it to retain its value.

The cool kids know this, and have been doing this "investing and spending" thing all along.  Give it a shot

How does that help people attempting to store funds for retirement, the risk averse, or entrepreneurs? Should they be invested in something risky to attempt to keep up with the rate of inflation? This debt based "monetary" system encourages risky(stupid) investments by punishing inactivity, just like ppaca does. Even those that thought they were prepared are getting looted, that's why grandma is working at mc donalds now. She may well have saved up what she thought was a significant sum, but then inflation worked it's magic on her savings.

That's not quite right. It's not the monetary system that's responsible, it's monetary authorities. Monetary authorities which set absurdly low interest rates which in turn fuel bubbles and stuff.
Retirement savings wouldn't be a problem if interest rates were in line with inflation.

I missed this post previously.

While I agree that absurdly low(artificially low is how I usually refer to it) interest rates are a huge problem, as it doesn't allow for a price discovery mechanism to operate, brutally punishes savers, and rewards gamblers, this isn't the whole problem. After all the very same NON governmental "authority" setting interest rates also "prints" the nation's currency, which it then lends to congress with interest. Plainly there's no legitimate reason to do this as congress is granted the authority to print our currency directly without interest, which is why there's a US treasury(they still stamp our coins). However if you're a politician in DC and you want to spend more than you're taking in it's fantastic, as you can inflate the budget to your heart's content and saddle future generations with that debt. This wouldn't be possible with a sound currency. You cannot simply whip up an extra trillion gold certificates as someone may well try to exchange those certificates for gold you do not have.

[NotLambchop]

...This wouldn't be possible with a sound currency. You cannot simply whip up an extra trillion gold certificates as someone may well try to exchange those certificates for gold you do not have.

Fractional-reserve banking predates the existence of governmental monetary authorities and originated many centuries ago in bankers' realization that generally not all depositors demand payment at the same time.[5]

Savers looking to keep their valuables in safekeeping depositories deposited gold and silver at goldsmiths, receiving in exchange a note for their deposit (see Bank of Amsterdam). These notes gained acceptance as a medium of exchange for commercial transactions and thus became as an early form of circulating paper money.

-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional_reserve_banking

...and yet

[solarion]

Again, not getting the relevance of your post. I'm familiar with the long history of fraud in the fractional reserve system, with or without sound money.

Are you saying that because there were crooks long ago that there aren't any now? Are you saying that because there were crooks long ago that crooks now are excused?

...are you trying to say that they're only crooks if their name does NOT contain the word "federal" to allow you to help yourself to the erroneous conclusion that they're a part of legitimate US government authority?

What's your point?

[NotLambchop]

You said fractional reserve is impossible with "sound money."  I showed you wrong.  Your inability to such basics is, frankly, worrying
I gave you some bright red font, see if that helps.  If not, there are plenty of promising careers in ditch-digging and fryer management.
.

...This wouldn't be possible with a sound currency. You cannot simply whip up an extra trillion gold certificates as someone may well try to exchange those certificates for gold you do not have.

Fractional-reserve banking predates the existence of governmental monetary authorities and originated many centuries ago in bankers' realization that generally not all depositors demand payment at the same time.[5]

Savers looking to keep their valuables in safekeeping depositories deposited gold and silver at goldsmiths, receiving in exchange a note for their deposit (see Bank of Amsterdam). These notes gained acceptance as a medium of exchange for commercial transactions and thus became as an early form of circulating paper money.

-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional_reserve_banking

...and yet

[solarion]

So you're saying because people steal gold is bad? ...or you're saying because people fell for the concept of gold deposit slips that therefore gold is bad?

JUST SPELL IT OUT MAN.

Quoting me out of context and adding a link isn't doing anything for me. I know you can type, you did it previously. Now you've colored stuff red...perhaps you could just spit it out?