Ethnic cleansing in Ukraine.

[247crypto]

[1715450182]

1715450182

[1715450182]

1715450182

[TaunSew]

There are no Russians in Ukraine anymore - Crimea was the only real area populated by ethnic Russians and it's been re-annexed into Russia.


Your people idea of "Russians" are these ethnically Ukrainian Kuban Cossacks mercenaries who are correctly fighting the Ukrainian Army, but fail to realize that these people are all ethnic Ukrainian.  Kuban Cossacks descend from Zaporozhye Cossacks who were predominately ethnic Ukrainians from the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth.

The war here isn't Russians versus Ukrainians.  It's Europhile Ukrainians versus Russophile Ukrainians, between whether to join the European Empire or the Russian Empire.  Things are more complicated when ethnic Ukrainians from Russia, therefore with Russian citizenship, are illegally migrating into the country to fight in this conflict.


Don't ask for me a comment on which is better.  Baltic countries lost 25% of their population, suffer from poverty & unemployment and are reduced to colonies under the EU, samething happened with most Eastern bloc European countries.  

Versus Russian Empire which may give you real jobs & economy but probably suppress your culture.  I'm going with Russia being the lesser evil so far but this is all hypothetical discussion since Putin probably doesn't want more Ukrainians in his country.   A lot of Russians can be upset with Sochi as it is, $50 billion dollars to appease crypto Ukrainians (who scratch Russian on the census form but only as long as the money keeps flowing in).

[bryant.coleman]

The war here isn't Russians versus Ukrainians.  It's Europhile Ukrainians versus Russophile Ukrainians, between whether to join the European Empire or the Russian Empire.  Things are more complicated when ethnic Ukrainians from Russia, therefore with Russian citizenship, are illegally migrating into the country to fight in this conflict.

Stop posting BS.

1. Yes. The conflict is between the pro-Russian ethnic Ukrainians and the pro-EU ethnic Ukrainians. But it is not as simple as it seems. Differences exists between the Eastern Ukrainians and the Western Ukrainians. The former are closer to the ethnic Russians, while the later are similar to the Poles.

2. A large part of the citizens living in Eastern Ukrainians possess additional Russian passports. This helps them to find work in Russia, where the wages are 4-5 times higher than that in Ukraine.

3. No one is illegally immigrating to Ukraine. The Ukrianian authorities have so far found not even one non-Ukrainian citizen, among the 100+ people who died fighting on the rebel side so far. On the other hand, some 600,000+ Ukrainians have arrived as refugees during the past 2-3 months in Russia.

[TaunSew]

The war here isn't Russians versus Ukrainians.  It's Europhile Ukrainians versus Russophile Ukrainians, between whether to join the European Empire or the Russian Empire.  Things are more complicated when ethnic Ukrainians from Russia, therefore with Russian citizenship, are illegally migrating into the country to fight in this conflict.

Stop posting BS.

1. Yes. The conflict is between the pro-Russian ethnic Ukrainians and the pro-EU ethnic Ukrainians. But it is not as simple as it seems. Differences exists between the Eastern Ukrainians and the Western Ukrainians. The former are closer to the ethnic Russians, while the later are similar to the Poles.

2. A large part of the citizens living in Eastern Ukrainians possess additional Russian passports. This helps them to find work in Russia, where the wages are 4-5 times higher than that in Ukraine.

3. No one is illegally immigrating to Ukraine. The Ukrianian authorities have so far found not even one non-Ukrainian citizen, among the 100+ people who died fighting on the rebel side so far. On the other hand, some 600,000+ Ukrainians have arrived as refugees during the past 2-3 months in Russia.

Alexander Mozhaev (famous bearded militiamen) admitted on camera that he from the Russian Federation, and doesn't have Ukrainian citizenship.  Truckloads of illegals from the Kuban, such as the aforementioned Mozahev, are coming into Ukraine to fight.

These guys may have Russian sounding surnames but almost all of them are admitting to be Kuban Cossacks or from that area, these guys are all pretty much ethnic Ukrainian who are extremely Russophile and even knock down Russian on the census form but history shows they only became Russian in the 1930s.

Who's rooting for Putin to get involved in this?  It's all Ukrainians fighting each other.  Who wants Moscow to be bombed because some 'Mother Russia' types in the Kuban want a bigger backyard?

[bryant.coleman]

Alexander Mozhaev (famous bearded militiamen) admitted on camera that he from the Russian Federation, and doesn't have Ukrainian citizenship. Truckloads of illegals from the Kuban, such as the aforementioned Mozahev, are coming into Ukraine to fight.

These guys may have Russian sounding surnames but almost all of them are admitting to be Kuban Cossacks or from that area, these guys are all pretty much ethnic Ukrainian who are extremely Russophile and even knock down Russian on the census form but history shows they only became Russian in the 1930s.

Who's rooting for Putin to get involved in this?  It's all Ukrainians fighting each other.

Mozhaev and others are still stationed at cities such as Lugask and Antratsyt, where there is no actual fighting (these cities are devoid of any Ukrainian troops). And talking about the Cossacks, they have claimed that there are no Russian citizens among them. The most heavy fighting is occurring in cities such as Slavyansk, Kramatorsk, Mariupol and Donetsk, where the only foreign mercenaries are those hired by Igor Kolomoyskyi.

[Nemo1024]

Whatever census data may show, it's not important insofar how people themselves identify their belonging. If Ukrainians say they are of Russian ethnicity, then it's good enough for Russians. If people speak the language, feel the culture, have the sense of identity that is Russian, then they are, for all intents and purposes, Russian. Case in point: Russian poet Pushkin, "our everything" he is called.

Napoleon and his Polish lapdog general Sokolnitskij failed to understand it, hoping to oppose Cossacks to Russians.

Also, the demographic composition of the Novorossia has not changed much since it was Novorossia County in Russian Empire, and when it was written off to Ukraine by Lenin in 1917. This seemed like a formality in USSR, as it did not change the peoples' sense of belonging. Nowadays, this sense of belonging makes itself heard more and more.

[247crypto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMDZBfGmLQk

[247crypto]

Ceмёнoвкa - Semenovka

[TaunSew]

Whatever census data may show, it's not important insofar how people themselves identify their belonging. If Ukrainians say they are of Russian ethnicity, then it's good enough for Russians. If people speak the language, feel the culture, have the sense of identity that is Russian, then they are, for all intents and purposes, Russian.

What you describe is assimilation to the state culture and it rests on the assumption that the state can continue to exert that influence.  It's really no different than this 'multiculturalism' in the west.  I see it as a losing proposition since it's a natural development for cultures to shift and evolve.  Not long ago there was no difference between the Dutch and the Germans, but the former descended when they revolted from the Holy Roman Empire and fought off the Hapsburg.

 If Russia itself was a marginal state or the Cossacks were independent then they would frankly stop caring about any 'Russian' identity.  

We all know what the west would do if they invaded Russia, would likely revive forgotten states like Novgorod and the locals there would be heavily propagandized, like the Estonians and Latvians, into thinking they are Nordic and would cease being Russian within 25 years.    Quarter the Novgorodian women would end up as whores in Czech / German brothels and the quarter the men would be building condos and fixing toilets in Britain.

[Balthazar]

It's interesting that Pskov, Novgorod states were the republics... Republic -> Autocracy -> Absolute Monarcy -> Republic -> Autocracy -> Absolute Monarchy -> ... Spiral model is in action

[TaunSew]

It's interesting that Pskov, Novgorod states were the republics... Republic -> Autocracy -> Absolute Monarcy -> Republic -> Autocracy -> Absolute Monarchy -> ... Spiral model is in action

There were a lot of tragic experiments in that area.

Little forgotten but if you thought the Poles were a monster with the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, they were serious about the Polish-Lithuanian-Moscow Commonwealth and almost succeeded.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Lithuanian%E2%80%93Muscovite_Commonwealth

Technically it did occur in history when the Tsar was crowned king of Poland, but it could had happened centuries earlier.   End result?  Maybe colonization of the Pacific North West and Australasia (Courland did, supposedly, pursue the latter).  Maybe the Ottomans, Swedes and the Germans would had teamed up on huge Poland-Lithuanian-Moscow Union.   

[bryant.coleman]

It's interesting that Pskov, Novgorod states were the republics... Republic -> Autocracy -> Absolute Monarcy -> Republic -> Autocracy -> Absolute Monarchy -> ... Spiral model is in action

The Novgorod Republic was disestablished more than 500 years ago. I don't think that anyone living in that region is interested in creating a new state, breaking away from Russia. Have to remember that the population of Novgorod Oblast has declined from 1,367,022 in 1897, to 634,111 in 2011. It is still declining sharply.

[247crypto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9PZcoFWLI8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdDmZDw0jBw

[247crypto]

https://soundcloud.com/wathchcat/rad1o

[Skele]

Difficult time for intelligence services on the west !
A indigenous population that is hostile , labeled terrorist.
Opera tions of just hit and run , instead of liberation .
And no moral high ground to stand on , to encourage troops other then tell them to murder left and right ,

[247crypto]

http://youtu.be/-QUZ5LeTODM

[247crypto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3no3siqK3qg

[247crypto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeERAflGOtI

[247crypto]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19tkYMN6UTw

[stompix]

^ Do you really have to add a video at a time?
You were the last person posting , just edit you last post and add a new link instead of creating this ton of posts.
It looks like you're spamming the baord.