Collapse or dollar= collapse of Rome= armagedon, but WHY!?

[Mikcik]

I have been reading about the collapse of dollar for several months and know that the issue is a years or even dozen of years old topic. I dont think i fully understand it but im quite leaning on the side that the collapse will happen, but even if i have a hard time believing the total apocalypse some of the people are portaing it to be... (like "the biggest event in human history" (this is the stupidest phrase i have heard so far).

Can someone concretely eplain to others WHY should the collapse of dollar mean a depression bigger then the one in 1930?

Simple quick points, because i dont see it...?

[1714666877]

1714666877

[zimmah]

The economy nowadays is more global than ever.

The dollar is the major currency used worldwide in trade, even if for example France wants to buy something from Japan, they will not use Euros nor Yen, they'll use dollars.

If when the dollar collapses, the whole world will feel the pain.

Also, many banks and governments have huge amounts of dollars or dollar-denominated bonds and security and other financial assets that are directly tied to the dollar. And not to mention when the dollar collapses, wall street will too. 

Also, the USA is by far the biggest importer of pretty much everything, but all they really export is dollars. In other words they are pretty much pumping (worthless) dollars in the world economy while they buy all the goods. When the dollar loses it's value (and it will as many countries are finally seeing the scam for what it is), most industries will not be able to sell their products anymore, since the USA will not be able to afford it anymore, which will trigger a domino-effect much bigger than the housing bubble (which also started in the USA and had a big influence on the whole world).

The world will have to rely on barter for a short while and will quickly turn to what it knew worked in the past, which is gold and silver.

[Mikcik]

The economy nowadays is more global than ever.

The dollar is the major currency used worldwide in trade, even if for example France wants to buy something from Japan, they will not use Euros nor Yen, they'll use dollars.

If when the dollar collapses, the whole world will feel the pain.

Also, many banks and governments have huge amounts of dollars or dollar-denominated bonds and security and other financial assets that are directly tied to the dollar. And not to mention when the dollar collapses, wall street will too. 

Also, the USA is by far the biggest importer of pretty much everything, but all they really export is dollars. In other words they are pretty much pumping (worthless) dollars in the world economy while they buy all the goods. When the dollar loses it's value (and it will as many countries are finally seeing the scam for what it is), most industries will not be able to sell their products anymore, since the USA will not be able to afford it anymore, which will trigger a domino-effect much bigger than the housing bubble (which also started in the USA and had a big influence on the whole world).

The world will have to rely on barter for a short while and will quickly turn to what it knew worked in the past, which is gold and silver.

Well i have read a lot of this before, but is this really based on your own thoughts and research or are you just repeating something you read somewhere else without thinkinh about it yourself? (without taking into consideration how much "real" and knowledgeable the person from whom you read this seemed to be).

For example, are you sure that the majority of the world has an important ammount of dollars (or something tied to dollars) part of their foreign reserves??

I just cannot see such a disaster happening in the modern world with the ammount on information and technology the world has... but again i might be wrong but i think the impact of dollar collapse is being over estimated, at least world wide, in USA im sure it might get ugly, but globally i just dont see it.

[zimmah]

if you doubt the power of the dollar, then why is Europe in crisis?

What caused the crisis here if not for the crisis in the American economy?

[Ibian]

information and technology

Technology is useless on its own.

Legends speak of an ancient library, filled with all the worlds wisdom and knowledge. Wise men from across the lands journeyed for months or years to read the valuable scrolls or make their own contributions. The internet is better in every way than the Library of Alexandria, and what do we use it for? Cat pictures, selfies and porn.

It doesn't matter what we have the theoretical capacity to do or know when people are stupid and willingly uninformed.

[twiifm]

if you doubt the power of the dollar, then why is Europe in crisis?

What caused the crisis here if not for the crisis in the American economy?

Eurozone had their own credit bubble/ housinng bubble.  Not tied to USD.

You talking about Ireland, Greece and Spain?

[Dalmar]

The irony is that technical analysis based on the dollar index suggests there may actually be a bull run on the dollar the coming years. The main reserve currency competitors (the euro and the yuan) are at the brink of falling into a multiyear bear market against the USD.

[peter palms]

GLOBAL ECONOMIC MELTDOWN 2014
Four times in U.S. history in the collapse the Central Bank now known as Federal Reserve System of the United States has failed. The debt level of the U.S. has reached $202 trillion in fiat Federal Reserve notes, when all liabilities are counted. In the world history of the past 2000 years, an economic collapse has always occurred whenever fiat money came into existence. In America this would be the fourth collapse of the Federal Reserve System and fractional banking. Global consciousness is awakening, as evidenced by the growing number of "Occupy Wall Street" demonstrations; a 2 hour 8 minute film named "Thrive” made at a cost of three million dollars by Foster Gamble and  was first shown 11/11/11 by ThriveMovement.com.  Fiat money has always ended this way and a description of what you can expect, can be obtained from us in a detailed 600 page document with 8 pages of bibliography. It describes in detail the decline in American prosperity; the increase in the size of government; the decrease in personal freedom; the growth of taxes; evidence that this is according to plan by an elite ruling group which hopes to merge the United States into world government on the basis of "equality" with less developed nations; the environmentalist movement shows to be an outgrowth of that plan.
            A PESSIMISTIC SCENARIO                                                 
A banking crisis and massive bailouts have already come to pass. The still unfolding scenario includes hyperinflation, collapse of the economy, a new global currency, domestic violence, U.N. "Peacekeeping" forces in the U.S., and the arrival of high tech feudalism.
             A REALISTIC SCENARIO                                               
What must be done if we are to avert the pessimistic scenario; list of specific measures that must be taken to stop the monetary binge; an appraisal of how severe the economic hangover will be; a checklist for personal survival and beyond.             
APPENDIX
           A. Structure and Function of the Federal Reserve                                       
           B. Natural Laws of Human behavior in Economics   
           C.  Is M1 Subtractive or Accumulative                                                           
Our Economic Adviser services are available during the Global Economic meltdown of 2012-2013 about matters Great Public Interest concerning;
1. Hyper-inflation
2. Oil prices no long denominated in dollars
3. Currencies issued by other nations of new gold backed currencies
4. Soaring gold prices
5. Collapse of the Real Estate banking industry
6. Collapse of the Commercial Banking industry 7. Fall of the republic
8. Cyber war for which there is presently no defense, replace nuclear war
9. Creation of an inter-planetarty Internet
10. Other matters of great public interest
4. Soaring gold prices
5. collapse of the Real Estate banking industry
6. Collapse of the Commercial Banking industry
7. Fall of the republic
8. Cyber war for which there is presently no defense, replace nuclear war
9. Creation of an interplanetary Internet
10. Other matters of great public interest
 Complete details will be delivered to qualified governments, corporations and wealthy individuals for a token cost for a token cost of $100.00 payable through PayPal.com to cover FedEx delivery world wide of these 600 pages, plus access to a two hour video, as well as credentials, references, awards, testimonials and introduction from presidents of several countries and government agencies.
Subsequently our advice will be available to those who become our clients.
Further details available upon request.
The previous collapses of the first three Central banks of the United States.

The story of the Bank of North America, the nation's first central bank, which was formed even before the Constitution was drafted; the story of the First Bank of the United States, the nation's second central bank, which was formed in 1791; the massive inflation caused by both banks; the causes of their demise.
The Bank of North America existed from 1781 and collapsed before 1791

The Bank of North America was modeled closely after the Bank of England. Following the practice of fractional reserve, it was allowed to issue paper promissory notes in excess of actual deposits, but, since some gold and silver had to be held in the vault.

The intended result was that the Bank's paper would be accepted as money, which for a while, it was. Furthermore, the Bank was made the official depository for all federal funds and it almost immediately lent $1.2 million to the government, much of which was created out of nothing for that purpose. So, in spite of the limitations placed upon the Bank, and in spite of the fact that it was essentially a private institution, it was intended to be and, in fact, did function as a central bank.

The Bank of North America was fraudulent from the very start. The charter required that private investors provide $400,000 for the initial subscription. When Morris was unable to raise that money, he used his political influence to make up the shortfall out of government funds. In a maneuver that was nothing less than legalized embezzlement, he took the gold that had been lent to the United States from France and had it deposited in the Bank. Then, using this as a fractional-reserve base, he simply created the money that was needed for the subscription and lent it to himself and his associates. Such is the power of the secret science.'


It will be recalled that, after the Bank of North America was terminated and after the Constitutional Convention "closed the door on paper money," the United States enjoyed a period of unparalleled economic growth and prosperity. But, while the door may have been closed, the window was still open. Congress was denied the power to print money, but it was not denied the power to borrow it.
In the vocabulary of the common man, to borrow is to accept a loan of something that already exists. He is confused, therefore, when the banker issues money out of nothing and then says he is lending it. He appears to be lending but, in reality, he is creating.
Then, as now, the mysteries of banking vocabulary were not revealed to the average man, and it was difficult to understand

how privately-issued bank notes could serve precisely the same purpose as printing-press money—with precisely the same disastrous results. That being the case, the monetary and political scientists decided to end run the Constitution. Their plan was to establish a bank, to give that bank the power to create money, to lend most of that money to the government, and then to make sure the IOUs are accepted as money by the public. Congress, therefore, would not be emitting bills of credit. The bank would do that.
Thus, the First Bank of the United States was conceived.


there were definite limits to how far that process could go.



The Bank of North America , the nation’s first central bank formed in 1781 The bank did not have its charter renewed by Congress
The First Bank of the United States the nation’s second central bank existed from 1791 to 1811 and collapsed
The  Second bank of the United States the nation’s third central bank existed from 1816 to 1836 an collapsed
The Fourth Central Bank was created in 1913 and has not yet collapsed but it will

• It is incapable of accomplishing its stated objectives.
• It is a cartel operating against the public interest.       
• It is the supreme instrument of usury.                         
• It generates our most unfair tax.                                 
• It encourages war.                                                       
• It destabilizes the economy.                                         
• It is an instrument of totalitarianism.                           

It is incapable of achieving it stated objectives
FIRST REASON TO ABOLISH THE SYSTEM
MYTH ACCEPTED AS HISTORY
The accepted version of history is that the Federal Reserve was created to stabilize our economy. One of the most widely-used textbooks on this subject says: "It sprang from the panic of 1907, with its alarming epidemic of bank failures: the country was fed IT once and for all with the anarchy of unstable private banking." Even the most naive student must sense a grave contradiction between this cherished view and the System's actual performance. Since its inception, it has presided over the crashes of 1921 and 1929; the Great Depression of '29 to '39; recessions in '53, '57, '69, '75, and '81; a stock market "Black Monday" in '87; and a 1000% inflation which has destroyed 90% of the dollar's purchasing
3
power.
Let us be more specific on that last point. By 1990, an annual income of $10,000 was required to buy what took only $1,000 in 1914.4 That incredible loss in value was quietly transferred to the federal government in the form of hidden taxation, and the Federal Reserve System was the mechanism by which it was accomplished.
Actions have consequences. The consequences of wealth confis- cation by the Federal-Reserve mechanism are now upon us. In the current decade, corporate debt is soaring; personal debt is greater than ever; both business and personal bankruptcies are at an all-time high; banks and savings and loan associations are failing in
1.   Quoted by Kolko, Triumph, p. 235.
2.   Paul A. Samuelson, Economics, 8th ed. (New York: McGraw-Hill, 1970), p. 272.
3.   See "Money, Banking, and Biblical Ethics," by Ronald H. Nash, Durell Journal of Money and Banking, February, 1990.
4.   When one considers that the income tax had just been introduced in 1913 and that such low figures were completely exempt, an income at that time of $1,000 actually was the equivalent of earning $15,400 now, before paying 35% taxes. When the amount now taken by state and local governments is added to the total bite, the figure is close to $20,000.
 
larger numbers than ever before; interest on the national debt is consuming more than half of our personal income tax; heavy industry largely has been replaced by overseas competitors; we are facing an international trade deficit for the first time in our history; 75% of downtown Los Angeles and other metropolitan areas is owned by foreigners; and the nation is in economic recession
FIRST REASON TO ABOLISH THE SYSTEM
That is the scorecard eighty years after the Federal Reserve was created supposedly to stabilize our economy! There can be no argument that the System has failed in its stated objectives. Furthermore, after all this time, after repeated changes in personnel, after operating under both political parties, after numerous experiments in monetary philosophy, after almost a hundred revisions to its charter, and after the development of countless new formulas and techniques, there has been more than ample opportunity to work out mere procedural flaws. It is not unreasonable to conclude, therefore, that the System has failed, not because it needs a new set of rules or more intelligent directors, but because it is incapable of achieving its stated objectives.
If an institution is incapable of achieving its objectives, there is no reason to preserve it—unless it can be altered in some way to change its capability. That leads to the question: why is the System incapable of achieving its stated objectives? The painful answer is: those were never its true objectives. When one realizes the circumstances under which it was created, when one contemplates the identities of those who authored it, and when one studies its actual performance over the years, it becomes obvious that the System is merely a cartel with a government facade. There is no doubt that those who run it are motivated to maintain full employment, high productivity, low inflation, and a generally sound economy. They are not interested in killing the goose that lays such beautiful golden eggs. But, when there is a conflict between the public interest and the private needs of the cartel—a conflict that arises almost daily—the public will be sacrificed. That is the nature of the beast. It is foolish to expect a cartel to act in any other way.
This view is not encouraged by Establishment institutions and publishers. It has become their apparent mission to convince the American people that the system is not intrinsically flawed. It merely has been in the hands of bumbling oafs. For example,
 
William Greider was a former Assistant Managing Editor for The Washington Post. His book, Secrets of The Temple, was published in 1987 by Simon and Schuster. It was critical of the Federal Reserve because of its failures, but, according to Greider, these were not caused by any defect in the System itself, but were merely the result
of economic factors which are "s000 complicated" that the good men who have struggled to make the System work just haven't
been able to figure it all out. But, don't worry, folks, they're working on it! That is exactly the kind of powder-puff criticism which is acceptable in our mainstream media. Yet, Greider's own research points to an entirely different interpretation. Speaking of the System's origin, he says:
As new companies prospered without Wall Street, so did the new regional banks that handled their funds. New York's concentrated share of bank deposits was still huge, about half the nation's total, but it was declining steadily. Wall Street was still "the biggest kid on the block," but less and less able to bully the others.
This trend was a crucial fact of history, a misunderstood reality that completely alters the political meaning of the reform legislation that created the Federal Reserve. At the time, the conventional wisdom in Congress, widely shared and sincerely espoused by Progressive reformers, was that a government institution would finally harness the "money trust," disarm its powers, and establish broad democratic control over money and credit.... The results were nearly the opposite. The money reforms enacted in 1913, in fact, helped to preserve the status quo, to stabilize the old order. Money-center bankers would not only gain dominance over the new central bank, but would also enjoy new insulation against instability and their own decline. Once the Fed was in operation, the steady diffusion of financial power halted. Wall Street maintained its dominant position—and even enhanced it. 1
Antony Sutton, former Research Fellow at the Hoover Institution for War, Revolution and Peace, and also former Professor of Economics at California State University, Los Angeles, provides a somewhat deeper analysis. He writes:
Warburg's revolutionary plan to get American Society to go to work for Wall Street was astonishingly simple. Even today,... academic theoreticians cover their blackboards with meaningless equations, and the general public struggles in bewildered confusion with inflation and the coming credit collapse, while the quite simple explanation of
1. Greider, p. 275.
 
the problem goes undiscussed and almost entirely uncomprehended. The Federal Reserve System is a legal private monopoly of the money supply operated for the benefit of the few under the guise of protecting and promoting the public interest.1
The real significance of the journey to Jekyll Island and the
creature that was hatched there was inadvertently summarized by
the words of Paul Warburg's admiring biographer, Harold Kellock:
Paul M. Warburg is probably the mildest-mannered man that ever personally conducted a revolution. It was a bloodless revolution: he did not attempt to rouse the populace to arms. He stepped forth armed simply with an idea. And he conquered. That's the amazing thing. A shy, sensitive man, he imposed his idea on a nation of a hundred million people?

MYTH ACCEPTED AS HISTORY
The accepted version of history is that the Federal Reserve was created to stabilize our economy. One of the most widely-used textbooks on this subject says: "It sprang from the panic of 1907, with its alarming epidemic of bank failures: the country was fed IT once and for all with the anarchy of unstable private banking." Even the most naive student must sense a grave contradiction between this cherished view and the System's actual performance. Since its inception, it has presided over the crashes of 1921 and 1929; the Great Depression of '29 to '39; recessions in '53, '57, '69, '75, and '81; a stock market "Black Monday" in '87; and a 1000% inflation which has destroyed 90% of the dollar's purchasing
3
power.
Let us be more specific on that last point. By 1990, an annual income of $10,000 was required to buy what took only $1,000 in 1914.4 That incredible loss in value was quietly transferred to the federal government in the form of hidden taxation, and the Federal Reserve System was the mechanism by which it was accomplished.
Actions have consequences. The consequences of wealth confis- cation by the Federal-Reserve mechanism are now upon us. In the current decade, corporate debt is soaring; personal debt is greater than ever; both business and personal bankruptcies are at an all-time high; banks and savings and loan associations are failing in
1.   Quoted by Kolko, Triumph, p. 235.
2.   Paul A. Samuelson, Economics, 8th ed. (New York: McGraw-Hill, 1970), p. 272.
3.   See "Money, Banking, and Biblical Ethics," by Ronald H. Nash, Durell Journal of Money and Banking, February, 1990.
4.   When one considers that the income tax had just been introduced in 1913 and that such low figures were completely exempt, an income at that time of $1,000 actually was the equivalent of earning $15,400 now, before paying 35% taxes. When the amount now taken by state and local governments is added to the total bite, the figure is close to $20,000.
 
larger numbers than ever before; interest on the national debt is consuming more than half of our personal income tax; heavy industry largely has been replaced by overseas competitors; we are facing an international trade deficit for the first time in our history; 75% of downtown Los Angeles and other metropolitan areas is owned by foreigners; and the nation is in economic recession

[indiemax]

GLOBAL ECONOMIC MELTDOWN 2014
Four times in U.S. history in the collapse the Central Bank now known as Federal Reserve System of the United States has failed. The debt level of the U.S. has reached $202 trillion in fiat Federal Reserve notes, when all liabilities are counted. In the world history of the past 2000 years, an economic collapse has always occurred whenever fiat money came into existence. In America this would be the fourth collapse of the Federal Reserve System and fractional banking. Global consciousness is awakening, as evidenced by the growing number of "Occupy Wall Street" demonstrations; a 2 hour 8 minute film named "Thrive” made at a cost of three million dollars by Foster Gamble and  was first shown 11/11/11 by ThriveMovement.com.  Fiat money has always ended this way and a description of what you can expect, can be obtained from us in a detailed 600 page document with 8 pages of bibliography. It describes in detail the decline in American prosperity; the increase in the size of government; the decrease in personal freedom; the growth of taxes; evidence that this is according to plan by an elite ruling group which hopes to merge the United States into world government on the basis of "equality" with less developed nations; the environmentalist movement shows to be an outgrowth of that plan.
            A PESSIMISTIC SCENARIO                                                 
A banking crisis and massive bailouts have already come to pass. The still unfolding scenario includes hyperinflation, collapse of the economy, a new global currency, domestic violence, U.N. "Peacekeeping" forces in the U.S., and the arrival of high tech feudalism.
             A REALISTIC SCENARIO                                               
What must be done if we are to avert the pessimistic scenario; list of specific measures that must be taken to stop the monetary binge; an appraisal of how severe the economic hangover will be; a checklist for personal survival and beyond.             
APPENDIX
           A. Structure and Function of the Federal Reserve                                       
           B. Natural Laws of Human behavior in Economics   
           C.  Is M1 Subtractive or Accumulative                                                           
Our Economic Adviser services are available during the Global Economic meltdown of 2012-2013 about matters Great Public Interest concerning;
1. Hyper-inflation
2. Oil prices no long denominated in dollars
3. Currencies issued by other nations of new gold backed currencies
4. Soaring gold prices
5. Collapse of the Real Estate banking industry
6. Collapse of the Commercial Banking industry 7. Fall of the republic
8. Cyber war for which there is presently no defense, replace nuclear war
9. Creation of an inter-planetarty Internet
10. Other matters of great public interest
4. Soaring gold prices
5. collapse of the Real Estate banking industry
6. Collapse of the Commercial Banking industry
7. Fall of the republic
8. Cyber war for which there is presently no defense, replace nuclear war
9. Creation of an interplanetary Internet
10. Other matters of great public interest
 Complete details will be delivered to qualified governments, corporations and wealthy individuals for a token cost for a token cost of $100.00 payable through PayPal.com to cover FedEx delivery world wide of these 600 pages, plus access to a two hour video, as well as credentials, references, awards, testimonials and introduction from presidents of several countries and government agencies.
Subsequently our advice will be available to those who become our clients.
Further details available upon request.
The previous collapses of the first three Central banks of the United States.

The story of the Bank of North America, the nation's first central bank, which was formed even before the Constitution was drafted; the story of the First Bank of the United States, the nation's second central bank, which was formed in 1791; the massive inflation caused by both banks; the causes of their demise.
The Bank of North America existed from 1781 and collapsed before 1791

The Bank of North America was modeled closely after the Bank of England. Following the practice of fractional reserve, it was allowed to issue paper promissory notes in excess of actual deposits, but, since some gold and silver had to be held in the vault.

The intended result was that the Bank's paper would be accepted as money, which for a while, it was. Furthermore, the Bank was made the official depository for all federal funds and it almost immediately lent $1.2 million to the government, much of which was created out of nothing for that purpose. So, in spite of the limitations placed upon the Bank, and in spite of the fact that it was essentially a private institution, it was intended to be and, in fact, did function as a central bank.

The Bank of North America was fraudulent from the very start. The charter required that private investors provide $400,000 for the initial subscription. When Morris was unable to raise that money, he used his political influence to make up the shortfall out of government funds. In a maneuver that was nothing less than legalized embezzlement, he took the gold that had been lent to the United States from France and had it deposited in the Bank. Then, using this as a fractional-reserve base, he simply created the money that was needed for the subscription and lent it to himself and his associates. Such is the power of the secret science.'


It will be recalled that, after the Bank of North America was terminated and after the Constitutional Convention "closed the door on paper money," the United States enjoyed a period of unparalleled economic growth and prosperity. But, while the door may have been closed, the window was still open. Congress was denied the power to print money, but it was not denied the power to borrow it.
In the vocabulary of the common man, to borrow is to accept a loan of something that already exists. He is confused, therefore, when the banker issues money out of nothing and then says he is lending it. He appears to be lending but, in reality, he is creating.
Then, as now, the mysteries of banking vocabulary were not revealed to the average man, and it was difficult to understand

how privately-issued bank notes could serve precisely the same purpose as printing-press money—with precisely the same disastrous results. That being the case, the monetary and political scientists decided to end run the Constitution. Their plan was to establish a bank, to give that bank the power to create money, to lend most of that money to the government, and then to make sure the IOUs are accepted as money by the public. Congress, therefore, would not be emitting bills of credit. The bank would do that.
Thus, the First Bank of the United States was conceived.


there were definite limits to how far that process could go.



The Bank of North America , the nation’s first central bank formed in 1781 The bank did not have its charter renewed by Congress
The First Bank of the United States the nation’s second central bank existed from 1791 to 1811 and collapsed
The  Second bank of the United States the nation’s third central bank existed from 1816 to 1836 an collapsed
The Fourth Central Bank was created in 1913 and has not yet collapsed but it will

• It is incapable of accomplishing its stated objectives.
• It is a cartel operating against the public interest.       
• It is the supreme instrument of usury.                         
• It generates our most unfair tax.                                 
• It encourages war.                                                       
• It destabilizes the economy.                                         
• It is an instrument of totalitarianism.                           

It is incapable of achieving it stated objectives
FIRST REASON TO ABOLISH THE SYSTEM
MYTH ACCEPTED AS HISTORY
The accepted version of history is that the Federal Reserve was created to stabilize our economy. One of the most widely-used textbooks on this subject says: "It sprang from the panic of 1907, with its alarming epidemic of bank failures: the country was fed IT once and for all with the anarchy of unstable private banking." Even the most naive student must sense a grave contradiction between this cherished view and the System's actual performance. Since its inception, it has presided over the crashes of 1921 and 1929; the Great Depression of '29 to '39; recessions in '53, '57, '69, '75, and '81; a stock market "Black Monday" in '87; and a 1000% inflation which has destroyed 90% of the dollar's purchasing
3
power.
Let us be more specific on that last point. By 1990, an annual income of $10,000 was required to buy what took only $1,000 in 1914.4 That incredible loss in value was quietly transferred to the federal government in the form of hidden taxation, and the Federal Reserve System was the mechanism by which it was accomplished.
Actions have consequences. The consequences of wealth confis- cation by the Federal-Reserve mechanism are now upon us. In the current decade, corporate debt is soaring; personal debt is greater than ever; both business and personal bankruptcies are at an all-time high; banks and savings and loan associations are failing in
1.   Quoted by Kolko, Triumph, p. 235.
2.   Paul A. Samuelson, Economics, 8th ed. (New York: McGraw-Hill, 1970), p. 272.
3.   See "Money, Banking, and Biblical Ethics," by Ronald H. Nash, Durell Journal of Money and Banking, February, 1990.
4.   When one considers that the income tax had just been introduced in 1913 and that such low figures were completely exempt, an income at that time of $1,000 actually was the equivalent of earning $15,400 now, before paying 35% taxes. When the amount now taken by state and local governments is added to the total bite, the figure is close to $20,000.
 
larger numbers than ever before; interest on the national debt is consuming more than half of our personal income tax; heavy industry largely has been replaced by overseas competitors; we are facing an international trade deficit for the first time in our history; 75% of downtown Los Angeles and other metropolitan areas is owned by foreigners; and the nation is in economic recession
FIRST REASON TO ABOLISH THE SYSTEM
That is the scorecard eighty years after the Federal Reserve was created supposedly to stabilize our economy! There can be no argument that the System has failed in its stated objectives. Furthermore, after all this time, after repeated changes in personnel, after operating under both political parties, after numerous experiments in monetary philosophy, after almost a hundred revisions to its charter, and after the development of countless new formulas and techniques, there has been more than ample opportunity to work out mere procedural flaws. It is not unreasonable to conclude, therefore, that the System has failed, not because it needs a new set of rules or more intelligent directors, but because it is incapable of achieving its stated objectives.
If an institution is incapable of achieving its objectives, there is no reason to preserve it—unless it can be altered in some way to change its capability. That leads to the question: why is the System incapable of achieving its stated objectives? The painful answer is: those were never its true objectives. When one realizes the circumstances under which it was created, when one contemplates the identities of those who authored it, and when one studies its actual performance over the years, it becomes obvious that the System is merely a cartel with a government facade. There is no doubt that those who run it are motivated to maintain full employment, high productivity, low inflation, and a generally sound economy. They are not interested in killing the goose that lays such beautiful golden eggs. But, when there is a conflict between the public interest and the private needs of the cartel—a conflict that arises almost daily—the public will be sacrificed. That is the nature of the beast. It is foolish to expect a cartel to act in any other way.
This view is not encouraged by Establishment institutions and publishers. It has become their apparent mission to convince the American people that the system is not intrinsically flawed. It merely has been in the hands of bumbling oafs. For example,
 
William Greider was a former Assistant Managing Editor for The Washington Post. His book, Secrets of The Temple, was published in 1987 by Simon and Schuster. It was critical of the Federal Reserve because of its failures, but, according to Greider, these were not caused by any defect in the System itself, but were merely the result
of economic factors which are "s000 complicated" that the good men who have struggled to make the System work just haven't
been able to figure it all out. But, don't worry, folks, they're working on it! That is exactly the kind of powder-puff criticism which is acceptable in our mainstream media. Yet, Greider's own research points to an entirely different interpretation. Speaking of the System's origin, he says:
As new companies prospered without Wall Street, so did the new regional banks that handled their funds. New York's concentrated share of bank deposits was still huge, about half the nation's total, but it was declining steadily. Wall Street was still "the biggest kid on the block," but less and less able to bully the others.
This trend was a crucial fact of history, a misunderstood reality that completely alters the political meaning of the reform legislation that created the Federal Reserve. At the time, the conventional wisdom in Congress, widely shared and sincerely espoused by Progressive reformers, was that a government institution would finally harness the "money trust," disarm its powers, and establish broad democratic control over money and credit.... The results were nearly the opposite. The money reforms enacted in 1913, in fact, helped to preserve the status quo, to stabilize the old order. Money-center bankers would not only gain dominance over the new central bank, but would also enjoy new insulation against instability and their own decline. Once the Fed was in operation, the steady diffusion of financial power halted. Wall Street maintained its dominant position—and even enhanced it. 1
Antony Sutton, former Research Fellow at the Hoover Institution for War, Revolution and Peace, and also former Professor of Economics at California State University, Los Angeles, provides a somewhat deeper analysis. He writes:
Warburg's revolutionary plan to get American Society to go to work for Wall Street was astonishingly simple. Even today,... academic theoreticians cover their blackboards with meaningless equations, and the general public struggles in bewildered confusion with inflation and the coming credit collapse, while the quite simple explanation of
1. Greider, p. 275.
 
the problem goes undiscussed and almost entirely uncomprehended. The Federal Reserve System is a legal private monopoly of the money supply operated for the benefit of the few under the guise of protecting and promoting the public interest.1
The real significance of the journey to Jekyll Island and the
creature that was hatched there was inadvertently summarized by
the words of Paul Warburg's admiring biographer, Harold Kellock:
Paul M. Warburg is probably the mildest-mannered man that ever personally conducted a revolution. It was a bloodless revolution: he did not attempt to rouse the populace to arms. He stepped forth armed simply with an idea. And he conquered. That's the amazing thing. A shy, sensitive man, he imposed his idea on a nation of a hundred million people?

MYTH ACCEPTED AS HISTORY
The accepted version of history is that the Federal Reserve was created to stabilize our economy. One of the most widely-used textbooks on this subject says: "It sprang from the panic of 1907, with its alarming epidemic of bank failures: the country was fed IT once and for all with the anarchy of unstable private banking." Even the most naive student must sense a grave contradiction between this cherished view and the System's actual performance. Since its inception, it has presided over the crashes of 1921 and 1929; the Great Depression of '29 to '39; recessions in '53, '57, '69, '75, and '81; a stock market "Black Monday" in '87; and a 1000% inflation which has destroyed 90% of the dollar's purchasing
3
power.
Let us be more specific on that last point. By 1990, an annual income of $10,000 was required to buy what took only $1,000 in 1914.4 That incredible loss in value was quietly transferred to the federal government in the form of hidden taxation, and the Federal Reserve System was the mechanism by which it was accomplished.
Actions have consequences. The consequences of wealth confis- cation by the Federal-Reserve mechanism are now upon us. In the current decade, corporate debt is soaring; personal debt is greater than ever; both business and personal bankruptcies are at an all-time high; banks and savings and loan associations are failing in
1.   Quoted by Kolko, Triumph, p. 235.
2.   Paul A. Samuelson, Economics, 8th ed. (New York: McGraw-Hill, 1970), p. 272.
3.   See "Money, Banking, and Biblical Ethics," by Ronald H. Nash, Durell Journal of Money and Banking, February, 1990.
4.   When one considers that the income tax had just been introduced in 1913 and that such low figures were completely exempt, an income at that time of $1,000 actually was the equivalent of earning $15,400 now, before paying 35% taxes. When the amount now taken by state and local governments is added to the total bite, the figure is close to $20,000.
 
larger numbers than ever before; interest on the national debt is consuming more than half of our personal income tax; heavy industry largely has been replaced by overseas competitors; we are facing an international trade deficit for the first time in our history; 75% of downtown Los Angeles and other metropolitan areas is owned by foreigners; and the nation is in economic recession

Interesting but don't think you just pulled that out your head but must have come from somewhere?

[AnonyMint]

The dollar isn't going to collapse, rather it will get much stronger as capital flees the peripheral economies (which is descending into riots, chaos, and provoking external war to redirect their citizens angst, e.g. Russia lashing out, China and Japan lashing out, even Argentina tried to renew the Falklands Islands war) to the only safe haven with the strongest military (and a mainland that can't be threatened by any foreign military) over the coming years. The global collapse is coming because of massive socialism and global debt-to-GDP ratio indebtedness above 200 year highs.

You need to read the entire following thread to understand:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=365141.0

[waldox]

when the local fiat collapses, all your daily grocery costs will skyrocket to unaffordable prices... when the population is hungry. there will be riots and overthrow of the government by people with nothing to lose.

that is the simple explanation version

[JustBetweenUs]

The economy nowadays is more global than ever.

The dollar is the major currency used worldwide in trade, even if for example France wants to buy something from Japan, they will not use Euros nor Yen, they'll use dollars.

If when the dollar collapses, the whole world will feel the pain.

Also, many banks and governments have huge amounts of dollars or dollar-denominated bonds and security and other financial assets that are directly tied to the dollar. And not to mention when the dollar collapses, wall street will too. 

Also, the USA is by far the biggest importer of pretty much everything, but all they really export is dollars. In other words they are pretty much pumping (worthless) dollars in the world economy while they buy all the goods. When the dollar loses it's value (and it will as many countries are finally seeing the scam for what it is), most industries will not be able to sell their products anymore, since the USA will not be able to afford it anymore, which will trigger a domino-effect much bigger than the housing bubble (which also started in the USA and had a big influence on the whole world).

The world will have to rely on barter for a short while and will quickly turn to what it knew worked in the past, which is gold and silver.

I agree except for your last sentence. It is when something the human race never had before, technology, comes in and saves the day.

[JustBetweenUs]

information and technology

Technology is useless on its own.

Legends speak of an ancient library, filled with all the worlds wisdom and knowledge. Wise men from across the lands journeyed for months or years to read the valuable scrolls or make their own contributions. The internet is better in every way than the Library of Alexandria, and what do we use it for? Cat pictures, selfies and porn.

Some other people create Bitcoin, Nxt and all those things that will truly change the world.

Just because you spend your days browsing for cat pictures doesn't mean the rest of the world does too. I don't, and I'm surrounded with a lot of people that do a lot more than that too. Heck I'm sure you probably don't too, in fact.

There will always be a "lower" class of people, if you allow me those words, and it's perfectly fine like that.

[peeveepee]

The reason is when the dollar is no longer accepted by foreign governments/companies, US consumer will have to pay huge premium to buy foreign good.

Welfare for US have to be cut and we all know US consumers are deeply depended on government handout and subsidy.

[spazzdla]

The economy nowadays is more global than ever.

The dollar is the major currency used worldwide in trade, even if for example France wants to buy something from Japan, they will not use Euros nor Yen, they'll use dollars.

If when the dollar collapses, the whole world will feel the pain.

Also, many banks and governments have huge amounts of dollars or dollar-denominated bonds and security and other financial assets that are directly tied to the dollar. And not to mention when the dollar collapses, wall street will too. 

Also, the USA is by far the biggest importer of pretty much everything, but all they really export is dollars. In other words they are pretty much pumping (worthless) dollars in the world economy while they buy all the goods. When the dollar loses it's value (and it will as many countries are finally seeing the scam for what it is), most industries will not be able to sell their products anymore, since the USA will not be able to afford it anymore, which will trigger a domino-effect much bigger than the housing bubble (which also started in the USA and had a big influence on the whole world).

The world will have to rely on barter for a short while and will quickly turn to what it knew worked in the past, which is gold and silver.

Store food and water.. they will be worth their weight in silver.

[Asrael999]

if you doubt the power of the dollar, then why is Europe in crisis?

What caused the crisis here if not for the crisis in the American economy?

Too much debt, corruption, graft, lack of productivity, an overly generous benefits system (in almost all countries), an attitude of entitlement, a currency that works perfectly for none of its members, inefficient and uncompetitive industry (Germany excepted) and a lack of labour mobility,  amongst other things.

[Zarathustra]

Civilizations (problem solving societies) collapse because of the diminishing return on additional investment in additional complexity. Tainter's Law.

http://www.jayhanson.org/page134.htm

[AnonyMint]

Those who are expecting dollar collapse and hyperinflation are clueless about history. Never in the history of the world, not even in Rome, has the global reserve currency collapsed. It doesn't happen. Only revolutionary governments which can't sell their own bonds collapse into hyperinflation.

Rather what is happening now is the "borrower is slave to lender". The USA is taking control of the globe now and the dollar will become very strong. They will track down all wealth globally and confiscate it. All the pawns of the USA (Europe, Japan, etc) and the fake antagonists (Russia, China) are on board this plan to share information to track down "tax evasion" which is a code word for Totalitarianism.

Again find the link in my prior post and read that entire Mad Max thread so you can re-educate yourselves.

Civilizations (problem solving societies) collapse because of the diminishing return on additional investment in additional complexity. Tainter's Law.

http://www.jayhanson.org/page134.htm

No they collapse because of socialism and collectivism when the private sector shrinks to for example 25% of GDP (and govt+regulation compliance is 75% of GDP as is the case in the USA and Europe now), which is an orthogonal property to knowledge formation. Here are a few examples of the cancer upon us now:

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/05/21/unions-out-of-control-the-real-poison-pill/
http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/05/21/how-bureaucrats-undermine-everything/

Don't conflate the perils of collectivism with the beauty of technological advance.

We already had this discussion in two other threads already and I am not going to debate you again, as I already shown the idiotic illogic of your conflation of the two:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=564097.msg6513193#msg6513193

[TaunSew]

If Rome Collapse - then it didn't occur to the people who lived through it ~ historians regard the 'collapse' of Rome as having lasted 300+ years at a time when the life expectancy was in the 30s to 40s and after the collapse did occur general nutrition and living standards actually improved.

Rome itself didn't disappear - people continued to live within Rome itself and the 'Roman Empire' technically got bigger, if we regard the Roman Catholic Church as being the proper continuation of the Empire.

True collapses rarely occur in history - they're more like fades into obscurity and often whimpers at that.

Maybe the one exception was the Soviet Union where the collapse was almost instantaneous to the American perspective, although the Soviet people themselves were well evident it was a dying institution at best.

[AnonyMint]

---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------
Subject: Eliminating career politicians doesn't eliminate the power vacuum   of democracy
From:    AnonyMint
Date:    Wed, May 21, 2014 8:24 pm
To:      "Armstrong Economics" <armstrongeconomics@gmail.com>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/05/21/return-of-corruption-sorry-lobbying/

it seems remarkable that companies would do anything but
lobby. A particularly vivid example was in 2004, when an aggressive
corporate campaign prompted Congress to grant a one-off tax holiday for
American companies to repatriate foreign earnings. The outright return on
lobbying costs, according to one of the various studies that served as
inspiration for the Strategas index, was $220 for each $1 spent. (see also
CNBC).

An you wonder WHY I say we FIRST need to get rid of career politicians –
one term only. Do that, and most else will start to fall into
place.

Martin, setting term limits won't resolve the perils of socialism and
collectivism.

You are naively expecting that if the people who are elected have no
incentive to remain in office then they will try to do what is best for
the citizens rather than appeasing lobbyists.

Again you fail to understand the deeper implications of the reference I
have sent you numerous times as follows.

http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=984

Some Iron Laws of Political Economics

Mancur Olson, in his book The Logic Of Collective Action,
highlighted the central problem of politics in a democracy. The benefits
of political market-rigging can be concentrated to benefit particular
special interest groups, while the costs (in higher taxes, slower economic
growth, and many other second-order effects) are diffused through the
entire population.

The result is a scramble in which individual interest groups perpetually
seek to corner more and more rent from the system, while the incremental
costs of this behavior rise slowly enough that it is difficult to sustain
broad political opposition to the overall system of political privilege
and rent-seeking.

Let me spell it out for you. The "special interest groups" are the
citizens. The citizens form groups that demand the government give them
benefits. For example, you documented this recently "Germany is promising
a Woman’s Mother’s Pension  for those mothers whose children were born
before 1992. They will be entitled to early retirement at 63":

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/05/18/german-politicians-promise-unfunded-pensions-just-to-win/

Politicians get elected when they promise everyone everything. Term limits
won't change the fact that citizens view government as a collective trough
from which each citizen should vote to get their fair share. Problem is
that to appease this it requires politicians to promise more and more
share, i.e. government becomes a larger and larger share of the GDP
crowding out the private sector and ultimately reaching Totalitarianism as
we are entering now with the NSA and the hunt for all wealth to fund the
for example $200 trillion of actuarial obligations promised by the U.S.
government.

Martin you are just masturbating with the term limits idea. In fact, you
play right into the plans of the globalists, because reform of the
nation-states is part of the globalist agenda taking us towards
"international cooperation and oversight for transparency" which is a code
phrase for global hegemony and enslavement of the global citizen in the
power vacuum of global collectivism.

The only solution to rising to periodic end game of collectivism (when it
reaches Totalitarianism) has always been for the intellectuals and
forthright to seek out frontiers. In fact, your masturbation delusion
about term limits as a nirvana is in direct defiance of the your own model
which tells you there must always be a cycle. The cycle has always been
and will always be an oscillation between rising socialism and rising
frontiers.

So now the frontier of geography and cash are gone. So what is the next
frontier? It is of course technological.

Sooner or later you will realize I am correct.