Capitalism and immorality

[Birdy]

This is completely false for the free market. A trade in the free market is always a win-win. It is the definition of the free market. If a trade is not win-win, it will not be completed.

Sorry, but this is false.

example:
A trade can also happen, because you think it's a win for you, but in reality it isn't. (e.g. a retiree that buys a useless insurance)
Or because you lack other options.
Your sentence is wishful thinking, but reality isn't like that.

[scryptasicminer]

This is completely false for the free market. A trade in the free market is always a win-win. It is the definition of the free market. If a trade is not win-win, it will not be completed.

There will always be cases of seller cheating the buyer by selling crappy products and services.

Or there will be cases called "externality" where factory owners and buyer of their products area happy with the price but do not have to pay the cost of polluting the area.

[ShakyhandsBTCer]

This is completely false for the free market. A trade in the free market is always a win-win. It is the definition of the free market. If a trade is not win-win, it will not be completed.

Sorry, but this is false.

example:
A trade can also happen, because you think it's a win for you, but in reality it isn't. (e.g. a retiree that buys a useless insurance)
Or because you lack other options.
Your sentence is wishful thinking, but reality isn't like that.

All trades on the free market should be a win-win for all parties involved. In order for this to happen there needs to be a sufficient amount of transparency and neither party is able to cheat. Unfortunately this is often not the case.

[cbeast]

If you have a lamp for sale and you know your competitor across the street has the same item for less money, is it immoral not to tell your customers about the other?

[Erdogan]

This is completely false for the free market. A trade in the free market is always a win-win. It is the definition of the free market. If a trade is not win-win, it will not be completed.

Sorry, but this is false.

example:
A trade can also happen, because you think it's a win for you, but in reality it isn't. (e.g. a retiree that buys a useless insurance)
Or because you lack other options.
Your sentence is wishful thinking, but reality isn't like that.

All trades on the free market should be a win-win for all parties involved. In order for this to happen there needs to be a sufficient amount of transparency and neither party is able to cheat. Unfortunately this is often not the case.

Are you talking about fraud? That is not allowed in the free market. That is stealing your reality. You have the right to compensation for that.

[Erdogan]

If you have a lamp for sale and you know your competitor across the street has the same item for less money, is it immoral not to tell your customers about the other?

No. You are not obliged to supply your customer with any or all information. What you tell, should be honest in my opinion, but normally a grown up should be expected to handle a certain amount of misinformation also.

There are fringe cases, so defining fraud is not an exact science. Here is what probably is fraud: You have a person that you know is not experienced, maybe minor, you tell him that everybody sells at a higher price, construct false shops in the neighbourhood which displays the wares at a higher price, make a call to a supposedly knowledgeable, supposedly third party, expert who really is your partner, who lies. Based on that the customer agrees to buy. These things can happen, if the stake is high.

[cbeast]

If a patient goes to a doctor with extreme pain and a doctor tells him he needs immediate surgery when it's only gas, is that immoral?

[kerafym]

If a patient goes to a doctor with extreme pain and a doctor tells him he needs immediate surgery when it's only gas, is that immoral?

Same situation easily arise from other type of system.

Communism killed more people than capitalism, is that moral?

[Erdogan]

If a patient goes to a doctor with extreme pain and a doctor tells him he needs immediate surgery when it's only gas, is that immoral?

Sure. In the free market, actors must act ethical to aquire trust. It doesn't solve everything, but the current system does not either, it is probably worse.

[cbeast]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

[hodap]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

[cbeast]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

[ShakyhandsBTCer]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

The term "overcharging" cannot be easily defined. It is fair to allow people to make a profit off of the time and capital they invest in their business.

The only true way to "overcharge" someone for something is to charge a price that is above the market rate, but if you charged this much then you would not be able to sell your product/service.

[cbeast]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

The term "overcharging" cannot be easily defined. It is fair to allow people to make a profit off of the time and capital they invest in their business.

The only true way to "overcharge" someone for something is to charge a price that is above the market rate, but if you charged this much then you would not be able to sell your product/service.

What planet are you from that doesn't have salesmen?

[Erdogan]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

No. Why do you differentiate between types of products and services? In the free market, you offer something for a price, and there is no unethical price. In the non-free market, the question doesn't even need an answer, because it is not you the customer, or you the merchant, or you the doctor who decides. It is the one dominating over you, based on his physical power to harm you.

[cbeast]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

No. Why do you differentiate between types of products and services? In the free market, you offer something for a price, and there is no unethical price. In the non-free market, the question doesn't even need an answer, because it is not you the customer, or you the merchant, or you the doctor who decides. It is the one dominating over you, based on his physical power to harm you.

So how will you know if you are really about to die or the doctor just needs to make a yacht payment?

[Erdogan]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

No. Why do you differentiate between types of products and services? In the free market, you offer something for a price, and there is no unethical price. In the non-free market, the question doesn't even need an answer, because it is not you the customer, or you the merchant, or you the doctor who decides. It is the one dominating over you, based on his physical power to harm you.

So how will you know if you are really about to die or the doctor just needs to make a yacht payment?

How do you know under obamacare?

[cbeast]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

No. Why do you differentiate between types of products and services? In the free market, you offer something for a price, and there is no unethical price. In the non-free market, the question doesn't even need an answer, because it is not you the customer, or you the merchant, or you the doctor who decides. It is the one dominating over you, based on his physical power to harm you.

So how will you know if you are really about to die or the doctor just needs to make a yacht payment?

How do you know under obamacare?

Exactly. Obamacare is a free market healthcare system of private insurers. They own a lot of yachts.

[joshraban76]

I'm totally against you, capitalism is the root of all evil, and has nothing to do with morals.

I did see that you ignored socialism and communism and yes I'm a Communist.

When you are giving the chance for people to be seen how much they COST MORE, then don't talk about morals.

[ShakyhandsBTCer]

So it's ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

What is your definition of over charging?

Buyers don't buy based on price alone. You need to take trust, after sales service into account.

Let me rephrase the question. Is it ethical to overcharge for a lamp, but unethical to overcharge for healthcare?

The term "overcharging" cannot be easily defined. It is fair to allow people to make a profit off of the time and capital they invest in their business.

The only true way to "overcharge" someone for something is to charge a price that is above the market rate, but if you charged this much then you would not be able to sell your product/service.

What planet are you from that doesn't have salesmen?

A salesman will try to get you to buy their specific product, or a product that you may not otherwise purchase. They would still need to charge a "fair" price, otherwise even if you are "sold" on the product you would not buy from the salesmen, and/or would buy the product from another channel