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Author Topic: Bitcoin, copyright, profit  (Read 3243 times)
nebulus
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March 03, 2012, 11:33:21 PM
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I was thinking about a scenario where someone sells some IP for bitcoins. Is this still considered a legal offense if the IP is covered by trademark/copyright? Since countries do not recognize BTC as a currency, doesn't that make 'making profit from BTC' impossible? (considering relevant legal definitions). It seems to me like IP for BTC is a very exploitable area. Obviously, bitcoin is multinational and there is no unanimous copyright law for the world as well as some kind of enforcer. I have heard about some cases where China has "violated" a lot of US copyright laws and US can't do anything about it. Has anyone else ever thought of that? I am interested to hear from both fronts: pro and anti-copyright. Looking forward to your insight.

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Herodes
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March 03, 2012, 11:58:06 PM
 #2

So, you're outside radio shack, you see someone break the window and jump out with a stereo. You buy this immediately with bitcoins. Bitcoins are not recognized, so it's not a crime to buy that stereo, right ? (I'm not comparing the stereo with software, but just putting it here for sake of simplicity).

Hum.. do you even see how wrong your thinking is ? The last thing we want, is for bitcoin to become some kind of a piracy currency, that will only draw negative attention.

So if you think of starting a service offering copyrighted material for bitcoins, look at MegaUpload, the US govt. cracked down on them pretty hard. And they probably will once you're drawing sufficient attention..
nebulus
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March 04, 2012, 12:27:02 AM
 #3

Bitcoin is some kind of piracy currency

DeathAndTaxes
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March 04, 2012, 01:22:57 AM
 #4

If I buy stolen IP w/ gold coins is it legal?
What about purchasing drugs with guns?  Is that legal?

You belief that something is only illegal if it involves legal tender is false and if you think about it absurd.
triplehelix
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March 04, 2012, 01:46:10 AM
 #5

Bitcoin is some kind of piracy currency

only if you wear an eye patch while you make the transaction, and say, "arrrrrr" after its sent.
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March 04, 2012, 04:39:38 PM
 #6

Bitcoin is some kind of piracy currency
Wake up ! State currencies are being hijacked by banksters and you call bitcoin what ??

Dictators all over the world use the same reasoning: as long as they are in power, there is no chaos !
Oh really ..I do not want that kind of order. We have lived under the dictatorship of the "GNP" for too long.

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March 04, 2012, 04:45:13 PM
 #7

Bitcoin is some kind of piracy currency

only if you wear an eye patch while you make the transaction, and say, "arrrrrr" after its sent.
I do that! Don't everyone not do that, arrr?

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves and wiser people so full of doubts." -Bertrand Russell
triplehelix
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March 04, 2012, 04:56:12 PM
 #8

Bitcoin is some kind of piracy currency

only if you wear an eye patch while you make the transaction, and say, "arrrrrr" after its sent.
I do that! Don't everyone not do that, arrr?

yeah, my wife looks at me funny when i slip into my peg leg, but she's a noob and doesn't understand the intricacies of high finance.
nebulus
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March 04, 2012, 04:59:48 PM
 #9

wow, so much for a productive discussion...

Bitcoin is outside of law, that's what makes it piracy currency... Not sure why people are even trying to argue this fact.
As far as my post goes, I was just trying to see if there were any intelligent people out there who would consider a thought experiment where bitcoin is involved in copyright infringement on multinational scale. Apparently not...

kiba
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March 04, 2012, 05:04:51 PM
 #10

wow, so much for a productive discussion...

Bitcoin is outside of law, that's what makes it piracy currency... Not sure why people are even trying to argue this fact.
As far as my post goes, I was just trying to see if there were any intelligent people out there who would consider a thought experiment where bitcoin is involved in copyright infringement on multinational scale. Apparently not...

WTF?

Piracy currency? What's that?

triplehelix
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March 04, 2012, 06:40:11 PM
 #11

wow, so much for a productive discussion...

Bitcoin is outside of law, that's what makes it piracy currency... Not sure why people are even trying to argue this fact.
As far as my post goes, I was just trying to see if there were any intelligent people out there who would consider a thought experiment where bitcoin is involved in copyright infringement on multinational scale. Apparently not...

your basic and fundamental lack of understanding about what your trying to spark a discussion on, prevent any productive discussion, because you are offering nothing of value to discuss.

ARRRRRRR!!!
Kluge
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March 04, 2012, 06:51:46 PM
 #12

I've made a good few purchases with BTC, but I'm not sure I've ever bought IP using BTC, though I've expressed interest in buying games from Steam. Arrr!

If the IP were stolen and then sold for BTC, damages would be sought in the FMV of BTC in USD (assuming you reside in the US). ARRR!

Just as if you bought something with gold, the IRS will still want their share based on the USD FMV value of that gold. IP owners would sue for damages just as if the transaction were done in USD. Arrr!

Bitcoins are a medium of exchange, and have a fair market value easily-calculable for almost every government currency. Arr.

Copyright law is still copyright law, and this thread is retarded. ARRRRR!

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
kokjo
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March 04, 2012, 06:53:18 PM
 #13

wow, so much for a productive discussion...

Bitcoin is outside of law, that's what makes it piracy currency... Not sure why people are even trying to argue this fact.
As far as my post goes, I was just trying to see if there were any intelligent people out there who would consider a thought experiment where bitcoin is involved in copyright infringement on multinational scale. Apparently not...

your basic and fundamental lack of understanding about what your trying to spark a discussion on, prevent any productive discussion, because you are offering nothing of value to discuss.

ARRRRRRR!!!
+1 ARRRRRR!!

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves and wiser people so full of doubts." -Bertrand Russell
schnell
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March 04, 2012, 07:19:13 PM
 #14

You would still be charged with recieving stolen goods.
What is 'selling some IP'?
Not internet protocol address thingies?
Kluge
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March 04, 2012, 07:19:48 PM
 #15

You would still be charged with recieving stolen goods.
What is 'selling some IP'?
Not internet protocol address thingies?
I'm guessing he's talking about "Intellectual Property."

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
PatrickHarnett
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March 04, 2012, 07:29:59 PM
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wow, so much for a productive discussion...

Bitcoin is outside of law, that's what makes it piracy currency... Not sure why people are even trying to argue this fact.
As far as my post goes, I was just trying to see if there were any intelligent people out there who would consider a thought experiment where bitcoin is involved in copyright infringement on multinational scale. Apparently not...

Illegal sharing of copyright material is still illegal even without a transfer of value.

Bitcoin is not a piracy currency, even considering what such a definition of that might be.  It's similar to other forms of private money (green dollars or barter).  It's very useful and I was able to get someone on the other side of the world to post me something I couldn't get sent direct.  USD9.72 would have been expensive to pay, but a couple of bitcoins, and it was all good.  Arrrrr.

"productive discussion" - you've been here a few weeks and you still don't know how big a bunch of jerks some of us are (hey, I'm a starfish, no brain or even central nervous system).  ARRRRR

(not to be confused with Castle of "Aaaaarrrrrrggghhh")
cbeast
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March 04, 2012, 08:37:41 PM
 #17

wow, so much for a productive discussion...

Bitcoin is outside of law, that's what makes it piracy currency... Not sure why people are even trying to argue this fact.
As far as my post goes, I was just trying to see if there were any intelligent people out there who would consider a thought experiment where bitcoin is involved in copyright infringement on multinational scale. Apparently not...
Stolen goods have been purchased even before Bitcoin existed. I tell you this just in case you were born yesterday. If you want to discuss Bitcoin and IP then a search for "timestamp documents" will show some interesting threads about the future of copyright, notarization, and other IP issues. As far as your claim that Bitcoin is "outside the law," would you please quote a statute?

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
drakahn
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March 04, 2012, 09:20:28 PM
 #18

arrrr?

....

ARRRR!?


....

arrrrrrr. *knowing nod*

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Qoheleth
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March 04, 2012, 10:45:24 PM
 #19

    I was thinking about a scenario where someone sells some IP for bitcoins. Is this still considered a legal offense if the IP is covered by trademark/copyright? Since countries do not recognize BTC as a currency, doesn't that make 'making profit from BTC' impossible? (considering relevant legal definitions). It seems to me like IP for BTC is a very exploitable area. Obviously, bitcoin is multinational and there is no unanimous copyright law for the world as well as some kind of enforcer. I have heard about some cases where China has "violated" a lot of US copyright laws and US can't do anything about it. Has anyone else ever thought of that? I am interested to hear from both fronts: pro and anti-copyright. Looking forward to your insight.
    Let me present two scenarios for your consideration.

    • Let's say that I'm the holder of some intellectual property, and I sign it away to someone else. Now they're the holder, whether I signed it away in exchange for some money, or some apple pie, or nothing at all.
    • Let's say that I have access to some intellectual property, and I distribute it to someone else outside the bounds of fair use/fair dealing/&c. That's infringement, whether I was compensated for the copy with money, or apple pie, or nothing at all.
    The use of bitcoins as compensation changes neither of these scenarios, because the scenarios apply independent of compensation or lack of compensation. Nothing has changed.

    (And as an aside: bitcoins are legally a "store of value" - it'd be like accepting payment in Amazon giftcards. The difficulty of tracking and returning stolen coins in no way puts Bitcoin "outside the law".)

    If there is something that will make Bitcoin succeed, it is growth of utility - greater quantity and variety of goods and services offered for BTC. If there is something that will make Bitcoin fail, it is the culture of naive fools and conmen, the former convinced that BTC is a magic box that will turn them into millionaires, and the latter arriving by the busload to devour them.
    marcus_of_augustus
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    March 05, 2012, 12:11:46 AM
     #20


    Pirates prefer gold doubloons ... now that really is some kind of piracy currency .... hahaha-arrrr-haaaa!

    ... pirates will accept many currencies, (maybe not the digital fiat, monopoly issuance of the evil facist empire though) but does that make them "piracy currencies"? or privacy currencies?

    Swapping electronic files with friends becomes "piracy" when exactly? Swapping other digital files (like private keys) in exchange can only blur the boundaries further and ultimately, stretch the flawed laws to their inevitable absurd outcomes ... "reductio ad adbsurdum".

    Laws are made for peaceful societies, peaceful societies are not made by laws.

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