TOO MANY BITCOINERS

[Junkbarman]

Ok, let's start this again. And why would I do that? When all I need to do is press Paypal button. Or Visa Button.

OK, sorry that this has been blown past. It deserves an honest answer.

Before you could 'just press the PayPal button', you had to create an account with PayPal, right? Then link that account with another funding source such as a credit card or a bank account, right? Then earn money, and put that money in the linked account, right? Well, in a similar fashion, you don't just get awarded BTC as a birthright.

Before you can spend bitcoins, you need to have some. There are many ways to accomplish this. As you seem enamored of old-world money mechanisms, I will describe what I think is the closest analog.

Go to Coinbase.com. Create an account and wallet there. Link it with your bank account and or credit card. Use Coinbase's handy interface to purchase bitcoins from them using funding from your liked account. Boom. You know have easily spendable bitcoins. In something very close to the PayPal model of doing business.

Now to spend them, it is as simple as choosing bitcoin as the checkout means of payment from a retailer that accepts bitcoins. Examples would be NewEgg, Expedia, Overstock...

You can also make your Home Depot purchase (many other retailers as well) quite painlessly, through the intermediary of Gyft. But you probably want to get some experience with the basics first, before adding this next layer.

We are not born knowing how to use bitcoin. Neither are we born knowing how to use wire transfers, credit cards, checks, or even cash. You've been around these other financial instruments your entire adult life, so you no longer think about the learning process in regards to them. But you should not expect using any new financial instrument to come with zero learning required.

Yes, things require a little effort. Less now than a year ago. In another year, they will be easier yet. Either go through the pain of learning now, or wait another year for the next simplification. There will still be learning required, but likely much less. All you'd be giving up is the possibility of another 10x possible increase in the value of the bitcoins you hold.

But stop whining - we're not going to do it for you. We have our own lives to run.

If people can't be civil in topics, then why the heck do you respond. You're internet doesn't freely give out a license to be a jerk, does it?

First lets set the record straight, I have a wallet, I have bitcoins, I know what they are used for, I know how to buy them, I know how to mine them, I know how to spend them..

In short, I know whats up.

If you actually read what I was trying to get at, I was using myself as an example, and talking about 1 method of growth in bitcoins.

As far as the rest, I leave this to the trolls. You have no clue, only what you are told.

[franky1]

If people can't be civil in topics, then why the heck do you respond. You're internet doesn't freely give out a license to be a jerk, does it?

First lets set the record straight, I have a wallet, I have bitcoins, I know what they are used for, I know how to buy them, I know how to mine them, I know how to spend them..

In short, I know whats up.

If you actually read what I was trying to get at, I was using myself as an example, and talking about 1 method of growth in bitcoins.

As far as the rest, I leave this to the trolls. You have no clue, only what you are told.

in short, reading some of the first comments from you, you are right, it is not mainstream yet, it doesnt have ATM's in every convenience store, it doesnt have TV adverts talking about coinbase or local bitcoins. so yea thats where bitcoins needs to grow.

but bitcoin is not a company.. its like asking dollars to advertise themselves. instead it would be hoped that coinbase, localbitcoins, bitpay would use their profit margins to get TV advert deals. for companies running ATM's to not just run 2 ATM's in their town, but 20. and have a person in every town that is a franchisee of the ATM company to maintain ATM's in multiple towns.

it is happening and we know of this issue, it just taking time to weed out the the true bitcoin enthusiasts that want to be franchisee's away from the basement dwellers looking for free handouts.. and not doing the work asked of them (that is the bigger problem)

[Bitcoin-hotep]

bitcoins is not about if you have paypal. to convert it to bitcoins, just to then instantly use on new egg.. if you have pay pal or a debit card.. just use it on new egg..

Everyone read the OP topic or just jump to page 3?

We are talking about growth here. Nothing of what you said isn't true.

But if you want more "neweggs" out there, then there needs to be growth in ease of access to actual coins.



The growth will explode when you have that many people using bitcoin daily.

I wish everyone could see that Bitcoin is FAR from a regular "stock", it is like Apple before the Ipod.

There is definetly a lot of miners out there, but its normal scenarion ; where people see profit, they exploit it to the point when there is more loss than actual gain.
For bitcoins price to erupt, targeted audience should be changed from general public, to privileged.
Does that defy the original bitcoin idea, well yes, but you cant have everyone satisfied.

That is ridiculous. You are now talking as if Bitcoin is a national currency, and will compete with money forever instead of becoming something that everyone uses.

[roslinpl]

I think everyone should stop mining and let me claim the current 15k prize every 10 minutes, sound fair?

That would be nice for you, isn't ?

Be the only miner   wow.


There will be more and more miners and more and more Bitcoiners.

Gavin didn't want to say "There are too many Bitcoiners. People should stop mining."

People should mine Bitcoin if they want and nothing will stop anyone as everybody can do it.

Problem is with ROI but well ... people need to calculate their profits reasonably and there is always a possibility that something might go wrong if you are thinking only about huge profit.

[jbreher]

If people can't be civil in topics, then why the heck do you respond.

Sorry. Didn't think I was being uncivil. I thought I was being direct in drawing analogy to the examples you provided. I answered your questions in what I thought was the most useful manner possible. I never called you any name, nor maligned your intelligence.

Methinks you are being awfully thin-skinned here.

Funny how your response included nothing about how closely my response matched up with your question.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I think everyone should stop mining and let me claim the current 15k prize every 10 minutes, sound fair?

That would be nice for you, isn't ?

Be the only miner   wow.


There will be more and more miners and more and more Bitcoiners.

Gavin didn't want to say "There are too many Bitcoiners. People should stop mining."

People should mine Bitcoin if they want and nothing will stop anyone as everybody can do it.

Problem is with ROI but well ... people need to calculate their profits reasonably and there is always a possibility that something might go wrong if you are thinking only about huge profit.

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming. And they should have trusted and noveltyly cool coins to buy, and coins they can earn for non mining tasks.

[Junkbarman]

If people can't be civil in topics, then why the heck do you respond.

Sorry. Didn't think I was being uncivil. I thought I was being direct in drawing analogy to the examples you provided. I answered your questions in what I thought was the most useful manner possible. I never called you any name, nor maligned your intelligence.

Methinks you are being awfully thin-skinned here.

Funny how your response included nothing about how closely my response matched up with your question.

I know where the ignore buttons are, have a good one.

[jbreher]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

[wakhidNkcom]

impossible to happen. people are even buying monstrous hardware just to mine.

yeah because altcoin having much chance to be scam coin -_-
i have told my friend whose have 1TH/s miners to try altcoin but he say if altcoin is most profitable no many people miners bitcoin again.. -_-

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

No, he did not say it casually like "There are just too many people and the shares are getting too small" NO. He was saying "There are TOO MANY MINERS", and even talked about the end of mining hopingly. Like "If only we were there".

[jonald_fyookball]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

No, he did not say it casually like "There are just too many people and the shares are getting too small" NO. He was saying "There are TOO MANY MINERS", and even talked about the end of mining hopingly. Like "If only we were there".

5 pages into this thread and I still don't know what is your exact point or what inference you are drawing
from what Gavin said.

What I think he meant to imply is: 1. there could be less miners and the network would still be very secure, and 2. new people shouldn't rush into mining.... and that's it.

[ShakyhandsBTCer]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

You really cannot have "too many" miners as the more miners you have, the more decentralized bitcoin will become. If anything there are too few miners, as there are few miners who control a lot of the network hashrate.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

No, he did not say it casually like "There are just too many people and the shares are getting too small" NO. He was saying "There are TOO MANY MINERS", and even talked about the end of mining hopingly. Like "If only we were there".

5 pages into this thread and I still don't know what is your exact point or what inference you are drawing
from what Gavin said.

What I think he meant to imply is: 1. there could be less miners and the network would still be very secure, and 2. new people shouldn't rush into mining.... and that's it.

I think he was in NO WAY implying a solution or change. He was just stating a PROBLEM. There are TOO MANY MINERS. That is all he said. He did not say that "There could be less miners" or "New people shouldn't rush in" he simply laid out the problem. And we are now analyzing and sharing our solutions.

My solution is Altcoins.

[jonald_fyookball]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

No, he did not say it casually like "There are just too many people and the shares are getting too small" NO. He was saying "There are TOO MANY MINERS", and even talked about the end of mining hopingly. Like "If only we were there".

5 pages into this thread and I still don't know what is your exact point or what inference you are drawing
from what Gavin said.

What I think he meant to imply is: 1. there could be less miners and the network would still be very secure, and 2. new people shouldn't rush into mining.... and that's it.

I think he was in NO WAY implying a solution or change. He was just stating a PROBLEM. There are TOO MANY MINERS. That is all he said. He did not say that "There could be less miners" or "New people shouldn't rush in" he simply laid out the problem. And we are now analyzing and sharing our solutions.

My solution is Altcoins.

Ok, so that's where we disagree.  I don't believe he meant there is a problem.
And why would it be? 

[ShakyhandsBTCer]

look at Monero if you want a fair chance at mining something that is better than Bitcoin in many levels but does not come to replace it.

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

You really cannot have "too many" miners as the more miners you have, the more decentralized bitcoin will become. If anything there are too few miners, as there are few miners who control a lot of the network hashrate.

price has not raised accordingly, a lot more people are mining BTC since 6 months ago and the price still -40%

This means that it is simply less profitable to mine bitcoin then it was 6 months ago.

All that mining really is a bet that the price of bitcoin will rise faster then the difficulty.

[Bitcoin-hotep]

I never said people should stop mining. My point is that he says there are too many, and we have more coming.

I can't help but think that you are taking this quote out of context. What does it mean to have 'too many' miners? Apart from the fact that it causes each such miner to reap less bitcoin, I see no downside. None. Nada. Zip. Zilch. No systemic issue from 'too many' miners.

No, he did not say it casually like "There are just too many people and the shares are getting too small" NO. He was saying "There are TOO MANY MINERS", and even talked about the end of mining hopingly. Like "If only we were there".

5 pages into this thread and I still don't know what is your exact point or what inference you are drawing
from what Gavin said.

What I think he meant to imply is: 1. there could be less miners and the network would still be very secure, and 2. new people shouldn't rush into mining.... and that's it.

I think he was in NO WAY implying a solution or change. He was just stating a PROBLEM. There are TOO MANY MINERS. That is all he said. He did not say that "There could be less miners" or "New people shouldn't rush in" he simply laid out the problem. And we are now analyzing and sharing our solutions.

My solution is Altcoins.

Ok, so that's where we disagree.  I don't believe he meant there is a problem.
And why would it be? 

Well he said it as if their were a problem. Then a person in the audience asked "What about the environmental impact of mining" and he replied with a reply that made it sound like he was ready for mining to be done with.

[jbreher]

he replied with a reply that made it sound like he was ready for mining to be done with.

Now I am sure you are taking things out of context. If mining was done with, there could never again be another transaction verified. Zero. Zilch. Zip. Nada.

[Jamie_Boulder]

Ok, let's start this again. And why would I do that? When all I need to do is press Paypal button. Or Visa Button.

OK, sorry that this has been blown past. It deserves an honest answer.

Before you could 'just press the PayPal button', you had to create an account with PayPal, right? Then link that account with another funding source such as a credit card or a bank account, right? Then earn money, and put that money in the linked account, right? Well, in a similar fashion, you don't just get awarded BTC as a birthright.

Before you can spend bitcoins, you need to have some. There are many ways to accomplish this. As you seem enamored of old-world money mechanisms, I will describe what I think is the closest analog.

Go to Coinbase.com. Create an account and wallet there. Link it with your bank account and or credit card. Use Coinbase's handy interface to purchase bitcoins from them using funding from your liked account. Boom. You know have easily spendable bitcoins. In something very close to the PayPal model of doing business.

Now to spend them, it is as simple as choosing bitcoin as the checkout means of payment from a retailer that accepts bitcoins. Examples would be NewEgg, Expedia, Overstock...

You can also make your Home Depot purchase (many other retailers as well) quite painlessly, through the intermediary of Gyft. But you probably want to get some experience with the basics first, before adding this next layer.

We are not born knowing how to use bitcoin. Neither are we born knowing how to use wire transfers, credit cards, checks, or even cash. You've been around these other financial instruments your entire adult life, so you no longer think about the learning process in regards to them. But you should not expect using any new financial instrument to come with zero learning required.

Yes, things require a little effort. Less now than a year ago. In another year, they will be easier yet. Either go through the pain of learning now, or wait another year for the next simplification. There will still be learning required, but likely much less. All you'd be giving up is the possibility of another 10x possible increase in the value of the bitcoins you hold.

But stop whining - we're not going to do it for you. We have our own lives to run.

If people can't be civil in topics, then why the heck do you respond. You're internet doesn't freely give out a license to be a jerk, does it?

First lets set the record straight, I have a wallet, I have bitcoins, I know what they are used for, I know how to buy them, I know how to mine them, I know how to spend them..

In short, I know whats up.

If you actually read what I was trying to get at, I was using myself as an example, and talking about 1 method of growth in bitcoins.

As far as the rest, I leave this to the trolls. You have no clue, only what you are told.

This has to be the most uneducated & unprovoked response I've ever come across on this forum, not sure if English isn't your first language or you just can't comprehend the sincere helpfulness in his answer (I would've thought this was obvious when he started it off with an apology).

You sir are a fool. Kudos to jbreher for the brilliant anology/reply.

[jonald_fyookball]

no need for a flame war.  basically he's asking "why should the average joe use bitcoins".  although nothing new, it was a fair question.  Franky gave a pretty good response.

[jonald_fyookball]

This thread is all noise and no signal.

lol. pretty much. GIGO.