Malaysia Airlines MH17 Crash: Boeing 777 Crashed in Ukraine Near Russian Border

[fsb4000]

Why did the plane fly on the territory of the civil war?
IMHO, Ukrainian dispatchers made ​​a mistake paving the route.

[bryant.coleman]

Why did the plane fly on the territory of the civil war?
IMHO, Ukrainian dispatchers made ​​a mistake paving the route.

As the rebels could only target aircraft which are flying below 15,000 feet, the route was deemed safe for civilian aircraft which were flying at 30,000 ft or above. Anyway... the flight data recorder has been sent to Moscow. Soon, we'll have answers to our questions.

[mladen00]

Europe must be proud of itself now. European leaders looked the other way when evidence emerged that snipers with the Maidan forces were behind the infamous mass killing on Kiev, they looked the other way when it emerged Proshenko army was used banned weapons such as white phosphorus on the civilian population.
Coul d they look the other way know?

[bryant.coleman]

Europe must be proud of itself now. European leaders looked the other way when evidence emerged that snipers with the Maidan forces were behind the infamous mass killing on Kiev, they looked the other way when it emerged Proshenko army was used banned weapons such as white phosphorus on the civilian population.

Well... NATO / EU / US won't be able to hide the truth. The downed jet belonged to Malaysia. They have launched an investigation and no matter what the perpetrators try, the truth will eventually come out.

[Paya]

Now that the initial shock has died down a bit, it's interesting to observe the first reaction.

This. Everyone, including Malaysia and Netherlands, seem to be very reluctant to blame anyone. Except the Ukraine, which has already launched full-scale media war against rebels.

[Alex077]

A Malaysia Airlines 3786.KU -8.89% plane carrying 283 passengers and 15 crew crashed Thursday in the battle-torn east Ukraine region of Donetsk, where U.S. intelligence agencies say it was struck by a ground-to-air missile.

The U.S. agencies are divided over whether the missile was launched by the Russian military or by pro-Russia separatist rebels, who officials say lack the expertise on their own to bring down a commercial airline in midflight. Ukraine, which also has sophisticated antiaircraft weaponry, said it hadn't shot any such missiles at any time during the conflict.

"All roads lead to the Russians to some degree," said a U.S. official.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/malaysia-airlines-loses-contact-with-plane-over-ukrainian-airspace-1405612373?mod=trending_now_1

[Nemo1024]

A Malaysia Airlines 3786.KU -8.89% plane carrying 283 passengers and 15 crew crashed Thursday in the battle-torn east Ukraine region of Donetsk, where U.S. intelligence agencies say it was struck by a ground-to-air missile.

The U.S. agencies are divided over whether the missile was launched by the Russian military or by pro-Russia separatist rebels, who officials say lack the expertise on their own to bring down a commercial airline in midflight. Ukraine, which also has sophisticated antiaircraft weaponry, said it hadn't shot any such missiles at any time during the conflict.

"All roads lead to the Russians to some degree," said a U.S. official.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/malaysia-airlines-loses-contact-with-plane-over-ukrainian-airspace-1405612373?mod=trending_now_1

And that freedom fighters say they didn't and couldn't shoot that plane is disregarded, while Ukrainians' claim is takes as an absolute truth. They also have nothing to gain from it.
In any case, I'd say that:

"All roads lead to the Americans to some degree,"

or they wouldn't be commenting and laying the blame even before the investigations is launched. Russia doesn't, playing by the rules.

[BCEmporium]

WTF!!!...

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/805200-igor-girkin-commander-of-donetsk-peoples-army-igor-strelkov-says-they-shot-down-malaysia-airlines-mh17-photos/

[Paya]

the flight data recorder has been sent to Moscow. Soon, we'll have answers to our questions.

I am not sure how the black box can reveal who shot down the plane. I mean, they will pull out the data showing catastrophic damage as well as the exact time and location of interception (which is already pretty much known), but what else...? I tend to think that finding remains of the missile may be a lot more important. What if it turns out that it was S-300, S-200 or aircraft launched weapon, all of those definitely unavailable to rebels?

WTF!!!...

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/805200-igor-girkin-commander-of-donetsk-peoples-army-igor-strelkov-says-they-shot-down-malaysia-airlines-mh17-photos/

It's already outdated (and possibly Ukrainian-fabricated news). Rebels officialy denied that they shot down the airliner so we'll have to wait for the results of investigation.

[fsb4000]

WTF!!!...

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/805200-igor-girkin-commander-of-donetsk-peoples-army-igor-strelkov-says-they-shot-down-malaysia-airlines-mh17-photos/

I advise you to read authentic statements and not journalists fiction.
https://vk.com/strelkov_info

[Alex077]

 Russian-made mobile air-defense missile appears to have struck the Malaysian Airlines (MAS) jetliner that crashed in eastern Ukraine, according to U.S. military and intelligence officials.

While the matter is still being reviewed, evidence so far indicates that the plane was hit by a weapons system known as the SA-11 or Buk, according to four officials who asked for anonymity because of the continuing investigation. The surface-to-air missiles, widely deployed in Eastern Europe, are mounted on vehicles that resemble tanks.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-17/missile-hit-malaysian-jet-in-ukraine-u-s-officials-say.html

In international laws  investigate crash ..., only Ukraine, Malaysia and representative office boeing, but not Russia. And terrorists sent black boxes exactly in Russia.!!

[manfred]

This shows all plane position live, easten Ukraine is now bare. Clicking on planes gives details.
http://www.flightradar24.com/51.41,32.5/3

[Nemo1024]

Ukrainian Prosecutor General Jarema stated that the resistanse did not capture any SAMs like "Buk" of S-300:
http://rusvesna.su/news/1405666465

«Пocлe тoгo, кaк был cбит пaccaжиpcкий caмoлeт, вoeнныe дoлoжили пpeзидeнтy, чтo y oпoлчeнцeв нeт нaшиx paкeтныx кoмплeкcoв „Бyк“ и C300. Зaxвaтa этoгo вoopyжeния нe былo», — пpивoдит зaявлeниe Яpeмы ИTAP-TACC.

Ukrainian MSM reported yesterday about 80 children and American citizens on board. According to the Airline, there were 3 children and no Americans. So those were another example of fabrication from Ukraine:
http://rusvesna.su/news/1405665043


PRD established headquarters to investigate the crash:
http://rusvesna.su/news/1405669094


Putin: Thorough investigation of Malaysian airliner tragedy in Ukraine required
http://rt.com/news/173744-putin-ukraine-plane-russia/


Gruesome images of Malaysia MH17 plane crash in east Ukraine appear online
http://rt.com/news/173644-photos-plane-malaysia-crash/


Tragic history of passenger planes shot down
http://rt.com/news/173680-passenger-planes-shot-down/


Ukrainian Buk battery radar was operational when Malaysian plane downed - Moscow
http://rt.com/news/173784-ukraine-plane-malaysian-russia/

“The Russian equipment detected throughout July 17 the activity of a Kupol radar, deployed as part of a Buk-M1 battery near Styla [a village some 30km south of Donetsk],” the ministry said in a statement.

Seems that the information war continues:

In his tweets, the Spanish air controller working in Ukraine revealed information regarding Ukrainian air fighter following the airliner minutes before the downing. Now his account was deleted!

A very detailed video with transcript:
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/world/malaysia-airlines-flight-mh17-shot-down-over-ukraine-near-russian-border-20140718-3c4nl.html

6:42pm: "The airspace the aircraft was traversing was unrestricted. Fifteen out of 16 airlines in the associations of the Asia Pacific Airlines fly this route over Ukraine. In the hours before the incident, a number of passenger aircraft from different carriers used the same route," said Malaysia's Transport Minister Liow Tiong Lai said.

He also listed the following fatalities, indicating there were still 20 people whose nationalities remain to be verified:

- 173 Dutch
- 44 Malaysians
- 27 Australian (although Foreign Minister Julie Bishop has updated this to 28)
- 12 Indonesians
- 9 from the United Kingdom
- 4 Germans
- 4 Belgians
- 3 Filipinos
- 1 Canadian
- 1 from New Zealand

4:32pm: Foreign Minister Julie Bishop confirmed the number of Australians killed in the MH17 tragedy had risen to 28 after a meeting with Russian ambassador Vladimir Morozov in Sydney on Friday afternoon, reports SMH State Political Correspondent Sean Nicholls.

Ms Bishop said she told the ambassador that the Australian people and government were "devastated by the news".

"I asked him for Russia’s explanation as to how a commercial plane could come down from that altitude over eastern Ukraine," she said.

"I asked that Russia give its unqualified support for a full, thorough, credible, international, independent investigation into the downing of this flight."

Ms Bishop also sought Russia's "unqualified support" for UN security council resolutions to "facilitate such an investigation".

"What we intend to establish through the UN security council is an investigation that will get to the bottom of who is responsible for this unspeakable crime and that they be brought to account."

She also sought support for seeking a ceasefire to retrieve the bodies and debris relevant to the investigation.

Mr Morozov "provided that unqualified support … and assured me Russia would do what it could to find those responsible".

Ms Bishop said the ambassador denied Russian involvement in the incident.

Given the above, the following statement from Kiev seems a bit panicky:
http://rt.com/news/173628-malaysian-plane-crash-ukraine/

10:15 GMT:

The black boxes from the Malaysian plane should remain on the territory of Ukraine, said a statement from the Ukraine’s Foreign Ministry. The transportation of the boxes abroad is illegal, it added.

[Elwar]

Party A will blame Party B. Party B will blame Party A.

In war, the truth is always the first casualty.

[Nemo1024]

US removed the page of the Spanish air traffic controller from Twitter, then edited them and reposted:
http://zergulio.livejournal.com/1770705.html

The words on the Twitter page today do not correspond what was screen captured by people yesterday. Why would US need to remove evidence?

People now comment that they hope the controller himself would not get removed (killed) to erase evidence of Ukrainian/US involvement.

The Spanish controller seems to have managed to posted that he evacuated from Ukraine together with his family.


Someone using the s-word again:
http://rt.com/news/173628-malaysian-plane-crash-ukraine/

10:30 GMT:

It is too “premature to draw conclusions” before the forensic teams have investigated the wreckage of the plane, German Chancellor Angela Merkel said.

"Regarding sanctions, I'd like to point out that the events with the plane, as far as I remember, were not even 24 hours ago and at the moment we need to sort out an independent investigation,” she added.

[Grinder]

Before this article gets also deleted:

http://en.itar-tass.com/world/738262

The proof that the rebels had indeed a Buk missile defense system.

DONETSK, June 29, /ITAR-TASS/. Self-defence forces of the Donetsk People’s Republic have taken control over a missile defence army unit equipped with Buk missile defence systems, the press service of the Donetsk People’s Republic told Itar-Tass on Sunday.

Why are they now claiming they don't have it ?

Because if Ukraine can prove the rebels didn't take it from them, it means they must have gotten it from Russia.

[Daniel91]

Here you can watch Unconfirmed video of Malaysian MH17 plane being shot down:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q2__0Lo0bo

[manfred]

Here you can watch Unconfirmed video of Malaysian MH17 plane being shot down:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q2__0Lo0bo

This is not the 777 it is the first plane they shot down, Ukrainian army AN-26

[Nemo1024]

In the meantime:
Questions over why Malaysian plane flew over Ukrainian warzone
http://rt.com/news/173792-malaysian-plane-diverted-warzone/

“There are still question to answer like why this plane was flying over that area, whether it was on the correct flight path. It was flying over a war zone where missiles have been fired. It’s a war zone, so why was it flying over there?” blogger and writer Neil Clark asked in an interview with RT.

...

 “MAS had used this route for years and it had always been safe. Fifteen out of 16 Asean Pacific airlines and even some airlines from Europe fly that route,” Malaysian Transport Minister Datuk Seri Liow Tiong Lai said at a media conference on Friday. “There were no last minute instructions to change the flight path to a different route."  

And the image of flight paths:



Also, read this Op-Edge!
Why was MH17 flying through a war zone where 10 aircraft have been shot down?
http://rt.com/op-edge/173788-malaysian-plane-crash-ukraine/
This Op-Edge takes a bigger picture perspective on the events.

[gmx95]

And I highly doubt it crashed, some Asshole with a surface to air missile probably thought it would be funny to shoot down a civilian aircraft. ...

No. Boeing 777 flying at 10,200 metres (35,000 feet) can't be shot down with MANPADS such as Igla or Strela. It requires either sophisticated SAM batteries or air-to-air missiles fired from fighter jets.

This is true. The whole story looks like one of those conspiracy theories. Everybody rushed to blame Russia and the separatists, although they did not have a capability to do such thing. Ukraine however had previously shot down a Russian plane - in 2001 - apparently by mistake, using the same type of rocket which was evidently used in this case.