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Author Topic: [VIDEO] New Animated Bitcoin Video! "Screw Banks" make it viral!  (Read 5386 times)
the joint
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May 10, 2012, 07:32:46 AM
 #61

Any teenage idiot has heard about occupy wall street or zeitgeist or alex jones or someone like that, and they're easy to brainwash.

Besides, the tone of voice that's used in the video is a brilliant form of peer pressure

Emphasis in the above quotes mine.

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through brainwashing and peer pressure?

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through emotions instead of intelligence?

I was actually assuming the people who made the video actually agreed with the video, in which case I would just say I have a difference of opinion with them.

But it doesn't seem like very many people here really do agree with it. It seems like almost everyone is saying, "I don't agree with it, but I think it's OK to trick other people that are gulliable enough to fall for it."

I think that such an approach is unethical.

Now, some people will say, "it's unethical - OK, so what, who cares, as long as it attracts people to bitcoin?"

I don't agree that's it's OK to be unethical. But even setting that aside, being unethical doesn't really make sense as a strategy for attracting people to bitcoin.

Consider the following (independent) points.

(1) That strategy reflects very poorly on the trustworthiness of the bitcoin community, which is going to dissuade people from getting involved.

(2) Behaving unethically is just going to attract unethical people, and that's not really going to help the community much.

(3) Most importantly: "Idiot" teenagers who can easily be "brainwashed" are not going to be particularly good advocates of bitcoin. Bitcoin needs smart, articulate people to spread - there are still TONS of those who have not even HEARD of it. Also, it takes someone with intelligence and a good deal of patience/persistance to actually obtain and use bitcoin, at this stage of the game.

By the way, let me emphasize, I am really glad people are putting time/effort into making videos to get more people interested in bitcoin. I do applaud that effort.

I know most people who have bothered to speek up in this thread so far do not agree with me, but there are going to be differences of opinion and I hope everyone is OK with that fact.

If, as you assumed, the makers of the video believe in what they are saying in the video, then where does the unethical part come in?

And even if they didn't, consider this question:  Would it be unethical to brainwash someone into choosing good over evil?  If, as I think we all assume, that the Bitcoin protocol itself has more potential for ethical application than does the alternative (fiat currency and its implications), then is it wrong to brainwash others to get them to use it?

Regardless, perhaps "brainwash" as understood in the fullest sense was an inappropriate word choice.  People can make their own decisions, including choosing to be ignorant.

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Meni Rosenfeld
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May 10, 2012, 08:46:13 AM
 #62

Would it be unethical to brainwash someone into choosing good over evil?
Yes. If you're using evil methods to achieve your goals - even if the goal is to promote a supposedly good cause - it means your moral compass is too screwed up to be trusted to decide what is good and what is evil. Sooner or later you'll use the evil methods you have perfected for evil goals, making the victory Pyrrhic.

Achieving your goals honestly is tougher, but any success is genuine and indicative of truly making the world more good.

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through brainwashing and peer pressure?

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through emotions instead of intelligence?
If you were advising Martin Luther King, he would have given an "I have a plan" speech, and African Americans would still be drinking from their own water fountains.
The words "instead of" are very important, hence they were bolded. You can invoke emotions while still respecting your audience's intelligence, it's all about how you do it.

Edit: Ironically, one could argue that using bolded words was a form of appeal to emotion...

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May 10, 2012, 09:14:55 AM
 #63

Yes. If you're using evil methods to achieve your goals - even if the goal is to promote a supposedly good cause - it means your moral compass is too screwed up to be trusted to decide what is good and what is evil. Sooner or later you'll use the evil methods you have perfected for evil goals, making the victory Pyrrhic.

Achieving your goals honestly is tougher, but any success is genuine and indicative of truly making the world more good.

What is so evil about this video? I thought that you were earlier criticizing the tone/style of this video, now it is ethically wrong? Are there some wrong facts in this video?

The video is simplistic/naive, but that is the point.

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May 10, 2012, 09:36:25 AM
 #64

Yes. If you're using evil methods to achieve your goals - even if the goal is to promote a supposedly good cause - it means your moral compass is too screwed up to be trusted to decide what is good and what is evil. Sooner or later you'll use the evil methods you have perfected for evil goals, making the victory Pyrrhic.

Achieving your goals honestly is tougher, but any success is genuine and indicative of truly making the world more good.

What is so evil about this video? I thought that you were earlier criticizing the tone/style of this video, now it is ethically wrong? Are there some wrong facts in this video?

The video is simplistic/naive, but that is the point.
I didn't say the video is evil. I answered the joint's question.

mollison argued that, under a given interpretation of the video creators' intentions, promoting the video could be construed as unethical, and there was a question about the implications of such a conclusion.

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May 10, 2012, 09:59:30 AM
 #65

"People do not buy what you do , they buy why you do it". This is brilliantly explained by Simon Sinek in this video
Why do I do bitcoin software ?


Because I believe in changing the status quo for a better world. A better world needs a better banking system. I believe bitcoin is going to change the status quo in banking.

"Screw banks" sums it up like no other bitcoin video did so far.

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May 10, 2012, 03:33:07 PM
 #66

Any teenage idiot has heard about occupy wall street or zeitgeist or alex jones or someone like that, and they're easy to brainwash.

Besides, the tone of voice that's used in the video is a brilliant form of peer pressure

Emphasis in the above quotes mine.

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through brainwashing and peer pressure?

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through emotions instead of intelligence?

I was actually assuming the people who made the video actually agreed with the video, in which case I would just say I have a difference of opinion with them.

But it doesn't seem like very many people here really do agree with it. It seems like almost everyone is saying, "I don't agree with it, but I think it's OK to trick other people that are gulliable enough to fall for it."

I think that such an approach is unethical.

Now, some people will say, "it's unethical - OK, so what, who cares, as long as it attracts people to bitcoin?"

I don't agree that's it's OK to be unethical. But even setting that aside, being unethical doesn't really make sense as a strategy for attracting people to bitcoin.

Consider the following (independent) points.

(1) That strategy reflects very poorly on the trustworthiness of the bitcoin community, which is going to dissuade people from getting involved.

(2) Behaving unethically is just going to attract unethical people, and that's not really going to help the community much.

(3) Most importantly: "Idiot" teenagers who can easily be "brainwashed" are not going to be particularly good advocates of bitcoin. Bitcoin needs smart, articulate people to spread - there are still TONS of those who have not even HEARD of it. Also, it takes someone with intelligence and a good deal of patience/persistance to actually obtain and use bitcoin, at this stage of the game.

By the way, let me emphasize, I am really glad people are putting time/effort into making videos to get more people interested in bitcoin. I do applaud that effort.

I know most people who have bothered to speek up in this thread so far do not agree with me, but there are going to be differences of opinion and I hope everyone is OK with that fact.

Hear hear. Well said.

I have always maintained the view - might as well repeat it - that we don't need belligerence ( which is more a sign of insecurity than anything ).
We don't need to attack the banks, credit cards, and paypal etc. in order for bitcoin to be successful. That would, if anything, only give them a
moral advantage.

We just need to focus on what bitcoin can do and let people choose what works best for them.  Better than trying to manipulate the ignorant
emotionally is to help relieve them of that ignorance somewhat with information.

Is bitcoin so lacking in positive qualities that we need to play these unethical marketing games to try and impose it on the masses? 

Do we really need to become raving conspiracy clowns?

 

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May 10, 2012, 11:16:03 PM
 #67

Any teenage idiot has heard about occupy wall street or zeitgeist or alex jones or someone like that, and they're easy to brainwash.

Besides, the tone of voice that's used in the video is a brilliant form of peer pressure

Emphasis in the above quotes mine.

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through brainwashing and peer pressure?

Does this community really endorse trying to spread bitcoins through emotions instead of intelligence?

I was actually assuming the people who made the video actually agreed with the video, in which case I would just say I have a difference of opinion with them.

But it doesn't seem like very many people here really do agree with it. It seems like almost everyone is saying, "I don't agree with it, but I think it's OK to trick other people that are gulliable enough to fall for it."

I think that such an approach is unethical.

Now, some people will say, "it's unethical - OK, so what, who cares, as long as it attracts people to bitcoin?"

I don't agree that's it's OK to be unethical. But even setting that aside, being unethical doesn't really make sense as a strategy for attracting people to bitcoin.

Consider the following (independent) points.

(1) That strategy reflects very poorly on the trustworthiness of the bitcoin community, which is going to dissuade people from getting involved.

(2) Behaving unethically is just going to attract unethical people, and that's not really going to help the community much.

(3) Most importantly: "Idiot" teenagers who can easily be "brainwashed" are not going to be particularly good advocates of bitcoin. Bitcoin needs smart, articulate people to spread - there are still TONS of those who have not even HEARD of it. Also, it takes someone with intelligence and a good deal of patience/persistance to actually obtain and use bitcoin, at this stage of the game.

By the way, let me emphasize, I am really glad people are putting time/effort into making videos to get more people interested in bitcoin. I do applaud that effort.

I know most people who have bothered to speek up in this thread so far do not agree with me, but there are going to be differences of opinion and I hope everyone is OK with that fact.

Hear hear. Well said.

I have always maintained the view - might as well repeat it - that we don't need belligerence ( which is more a sign of insecurity than anything ).
We don't need to attack the banks, credit cards, and paypal etc. in order for bitcoin to be successful. That would, if anything, only give them a
moral advantage.

We just need to focus on what bitcoin can do and let people choose what works best for them.  Better than trying to manipulate the ignorant
emotionally is to help relieve them of that ignorance somewhat with information.

Is bitcoin so lacking in positive qualities that we need to play these unethical marketing games to try and impose it on the masses? 

Do we really need to become raving conspiracy clowns?

 

Look, I'm all for an ideal world where we can all play Dalai Lama and Gandhi and let everyone decide for themselves and do what they want to do.  That's fine, and I would prefer it.

Practically, we live within a global economy driven by capitalism, and if you want any idea to succeed in a capitalist market, it will likely be done through competition in any of its various forms.

Your words are dubious.  Appealing to someone's intellect to convince them is also manipulation, though ironically, perhaps the words I chose earlier such as 'brainwash' appealed to YOUR emotion, (albeit negatively) and so here you are stating what you are stating. 

In either case, appealing to emotion works and it elicits a reaction.  If the intent is to deceive for a greater good, and I don't believe it was, then that's what we call a little white lie, and little white lies are ethically justified in their own right.  By the way, I love that ugly sweater your wearing.


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May 11, 2012, 02:37:14 AM
 #68

Your words are dubious.  Appealing to someone's intellect to convince them is also manipulation, though ironically, perhaps the words I chose earlier such as 'brainwash' appealed to YOUR emotion, (albeit negatively) and so here you are stating what you are stating.

What I am saying, which might be a little different from Meni and Mollison, even though I agree pretty much with the points they make as well,
is that bitcoin's positive qualities can speak for themselves, once they are communicated in such a way as to be understood. No need to try and
convince or persuade people with any games, intellectual, emotional or otherwise.  I certainly feel bank bashing and belligerence will only tend
to obscure those qualities, especially if you throw in any "white lies", as you call it, which would only give ammunition to bitcoin's critics, in this
war some seem to want to start. 
 
Quote
In either case, appealing to emotion works and it elicits a reaction...

Often the opposite from what is intended... often resented when the audience feels they are being manipulated...
often having little to do with the actual subject of the advertising/promotional campaign... and sure often successful if one is
very skillful or very lucky, but I would prefer to see people respond to bitcoin itself. Why do some seem to be in desperate
need of a reaction? Why try to push the river?  Why not allow it to build organically; slowly, but deeply...
   
Your words didn't bother me emotionally or otherwise. And I am not trying to push anyone's buttons either.
These are just my opinions on this subject. 


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May 11, 2012, 07:26:33 AM
 #69

The most effective marketing invokes lots of emotions. Both negative and positive. Deal with it.

Or if you don't like it, make your own marketing video.

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May 11, 2012, 06:43:10 PM
 #70

The most effective marketing invokes lots of emotions. Both negative and positive. Deal with it.

Or if you don't like it, make your own marketing video.


An emotional reaction... causing you to totally miss my point...

Thanks for helping to make my point.   Grin

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May 17, 2012, 01:55:47 AM
 #71

Illum Productions explains a bit about the production of the video

Bitcoin to the Rescue…
May 16th, 2012

http://illumproductions.com/blog/?p=488

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May 21, 2012, 03:09:24 AM
 #72

For me it's a bit too much government bashing and too little actual information.
Yeah, but you're probably a geek and think cute cat videos have too little actual information, too.

The video gets a +1 from me; effective marketing appeals to emotion, not intellect.


Agreed, great job on the video.

+1 on the video for promo and marketing

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May 22, 2012, 12:11:26 AM
 #73

Would it be possible to port the video to the webm format

yes

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May 22, 2012, 06:27:32 PM
 #74

I too was confused by the term "screw banks".

After watching the video I immediately went to a local bank, bored a hole in the side of it and had intercourse with the bank.

Boy was I embarrassed when I came back to this thread and read what it really meant.

Some people just do not understand slang.

You need to put a disclaimer..."do not go have sexual intercourse with a bank". If it saves one other person from the chaffing it would be worth it.

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