Idea: Diablo III Bitcoin Auction House

[Vladimir]

If only I had a reliable solution of input/output i.e. how you deliver in game assets to the customers and how they deliver in game assets to you!

Give me the above solution (or idea) and I am on board for this project, otherwise seems like a waste of time.

[etotheipi]

To add to this ... I think the idea is fantastic if people are already using Bitcoin and the RMAH didn't exist.  Unfortunately, neither of these are true, and thus the idea is DOA.

Users don't want to go out and purchase some weird currency prone to theft,  and install potential malware on their system, just so they can pay a stranger over the internet for items that may never be sent.

Relative to that, 15% fee seems completely fair for the 100% scam-proof, easy-to-understand method of just using the RMAH.  I think 15% is ludicrous actually... Blizzard is being ridiculously greedy.  But they'll get away with it because they know how desperately users want to be able to buy and sell items to other users, and they know users will pay it.

[Fuzzy]

If only I had a reliable solution of input/output i.e. how you deliver in game assets to the customers and how they deliver in game assets to you!

The BTC auction house would act as a middle man/arbiter and meeting place for sellers/buyers. Someone lists an item, funds are sent by the buyer and held by the house, once the item is confirmed as delivered in game by the buyer, funds are released to the seller. Maybe have sellers video cap the in game transaction? A rep system based on number of items and value sold/bought will help keep things honest, but isn't 100% guaranteed.

Give me the above solution (or idea) and I am on board for this project, otherwise seems like a waste of time.

I wouldn't suggest undertaking something like this as a means of income or guaranteed profit. If you aren't into this out of curiosity alone, then this is far too risky in terms of time wasted.

Users don't want to go out and purchase some weird currency prone to theft,  and install potential malware on their system, just so they can pay a stranger over the internet for items that may never be sent.

It does sound grim when you put it that way.

I think 15% is ludicrous actually... Blizzard is being ridiculously greedy.  But they'll get away with it because they know how desperately users want to be able to buy and sell items to other users, and they know users will pay it.

If you think about it, the goods you are selling are nothing but digital items spawned according to their rules in their game.

It's genius how they turn their customers into cash farmers.

[adamstgBit]

Users don't want to go out and purchase some weird currency prone to theft,  and install potential malware on their system, just so they can pay a stranger over the internet for items that may never be sent.

I play Hardcore and their is not a real money AH for hardcore players...

Users don't want to go out and purchase some weird currency prone to theft,  and install potential malware on their system, just so they can pay a stranger over the internet for items that may never be sent.

exactly, that's why everything (including  storing the bitcoins) would be handled by the exchange. users just have to keep his login password safe

Relative to that, 15% fee seems completely fair for the 100% scam-proof, easy-to-understand method of just using the RMAH.  I think 15% is ludicrous actually... Blizzard is being ridiculously greedy.  But they'll get away with it because they know how desperately users want to be able to buy and sell items to other users, and they know users will pay it.

15% kinda sucks, wtf do they do with the gold anyway  

I would definitely we willing contribute my time and skills to collaborate on it if someone in web programming were to willing, and if we could somehow work around the eula  

I am a diablo3 player and a web dev.
I would be interested in working with you on this project
I have my own idea of how it should work

sending PM, lets do this thing!

[MaxSan]

Would use.

As would half our dev team

[etotheipi]

Users don't want to go out and purchase some weird currency prone to theft,  and install potential malware on their system, just so they can pay a stranger over the internet for items that may never be sent.

exactly, that's why everything (including  storing the bitcoins) would be handled by the exchange. users just have to keep his login password safe

Oh, I misunderstood.  I thought the service was simply for letting users post and bid on things and handle the cash themselves.  If you're talking about a service, with customer support, then you'll have to take some profit in order to sustain non-trivial costs of maintenance and handling user issues/complaints, etc.  And you risk violating Blizzard EULAs unless you plan to be completely detached from the game and only handle the money side.  But then that means you have no way to verify whether the seller actually transferred the items to the buyer.  Have fun arbitrating disputes...

In the end, Blizzard is being greedy, but I don't think there's a legit way for competition to step in, even if they could get away with it legally.

On the other hand, if we're talking Diablo II and all sales are between strangers trusting each other over the internet, then Bitcoin fills the niche pretty well.  But I think Blizzard has firmly undercut any potential competition on this one...

[adamstgBit]

Users don't want to go out and purchase some weird currency prone to theft,  and install potential malware on their system, just so they can pay a stranger over the internet for items that may never be sent.

exactly, that's why everything (including  storing the bitcoins) would be handled by the exchange. users just have to keep his login password safe

Oh, I misunderstood.  I thought the service was simply for letting users post and bid on things and handle the cash themselves.  If you're talking about a service, with customer support, then you'll have to take some profit in order to sustain non-trivial costs of maintenance and handling user issues/complaints, etc.  And you risk violating Blizzard EULAs unless you plan to be completely detached from the game and only handle the money side.  But then that means you have no way to verify whether the seller actually transferred the items to the buyer.  Have fun arbitrating disputes...

In the end, Blizzard is being greedy, but I don't think there's a legit way for competition to step in, even if they could get away with it legally.

On the other hand, if we're talking Diablo II and all sales are between strangers trusting each other over the internet, then Bitcoin fills the niche pretty well.  But I think Blizzard has firmly undercut any potential competition on this one...

actually we are now talking about doing a simple exchange D3gold / BTC
I think this would be much easier to do well, and would be more piratical for users. ( no need for strangers trusting each other over the internet  )

they would send BTC to the exchange to buy D3Gold
or
they would send D3Gold to the exchange to buy BTC

this would be a free market like all other bitcoin exchanges.

[etotheipi]

You're going to need Diablo III accounts to handle the transfers of the D3 gold.  That puts you at risk of getting banned, getting stuff confiscated, etc.

You might consider just holding the BTC and letting the players do the money transfer. That's a lot less risk for you.  But I don't know the details of transferring gold in D3...

[adamstgBit]

You're going to need Diablo III accounts to handle the transfers of the D3 gold.  That puts you at risk of getting banned, getting stuff confiscated, etc.

You might consider just holding the BTC and letting the players do the money transfer. That's a lot less risk for you.  But I don't know the details of transferring gold in D3...

right, i need to find out how game gold sellers are doing it.

http://www.offgamers.com/diablo/d3/diablo-3-gold-us/all-server-normal-mode-c-4143-5166-5226-5227.ogm?gclid=CMi4s8zOl7ACFQlN4AodPzEG1w
why is it hes not getting banned?

[Ferroh]

While this is not an auction house, you can purchase D3 gold with bitcoin here https://ferroh.com/d3


If I understood correctly, you are suggesting that we set up an ebay like service for D3 items (where users can sell directly to one another)?

It might work for hardcore, where there is no RMAH.

[ElectricMucus]

I now wasted enough time with the game (not as much as with this forum yet  ) to know how it can be done and how the AH system works in game. I still see alot of potential for this.

If only I had a reliable solution of input/output i.e. how you deliver in game assets to the customers and how they deliver in game assets to you!

Give me the above solution (or idea) and I am on board for this project, otherwise seems like a waste of time.

Technically and practically, yes in every regard.

Lawsuit proof, probably not at least not the fully automated, completely fraud proof part.

[mrkent]

I've had this idea for a while and spoke with a few in the community about it (Matthew Wright can confirm).

The two main advantages of using a website instead of RMAH is:
1. Price can be MUCH lower
2. FEATURES, such as more advanced searching/filtering, historical data, etc.

I've been reluctant to invest too much time into it, because D3 economy is totally fucked, and Blizzard is taking steps to further fuck it up with each patch.
If any developers would like to work together, let me know.

[Sukrim]

Biggest issue is still delivery imho.

Either the exchange holds items/gold in escrow --> easy to ban from Blizzard side.

Right from the beginning of the EULA:

2. Additional License Limitations. The license granted to you in Section 1 is subject to the limitations set forth in Sections 1 and 2 (collectively, the "License Limitations"). Any use of the Service or any Game in violation of the License Limitations will be regarded as an infringement of Blizzard’s copyrights in and to the Service and/or Game. You agree that you will not, under any circumstances:
    [...]
    2.2 exploit the Service, a Game or any part thereof for any commercial purpose, including without limitation (a) use at a cyber cafe, computer gaming center or any other commercial establishment without the express written consent of Blizzard, unless otherwise stated in a EULA; (b) to communicate or facilitate any commercial advertisement or solicitation; (c) for gathering in-game currency, items or resources for sale outside the Game without Blizzard’s authorization; (d) selling or trading Game characters or accounts for the Service and/or a Game; or (e) performing in-game services in exchange for payment outside the Game, e.g., power-leveling;
    [...]
    2.4 buy or sell for real money or in exchange for in-game currency, items or resources that may be used in a Game outside the Game without Blizzard’s authorization;

After you've been banned, you'd have to go to court - good luck with that!

Otherwise, delivery would have to be done by the people advertising --> scams, scams everywhere! It might be possible to have someone from the exchange as a 3rd person in the game (A sells item X to B --> A gives item X to escrower, escrower releases BTC to A and hands item X to B ingame) but then it doesn't scale or requires bots, which is something that Blizzard might be even more allergic to than selling gold/items outside of the game.

You could offer a service to fund anyone's BattleNet balance with your PayPal account paid with BTC though, which would be something similar to an exchange operation.


Something else that might work would be to use the official (gold) Auction House to transfer gold. There are high fees, but in the end ingame all you do is trading. It might still be bannable, but harder to detect maybe. It'd work like this (if you want to have gold):
* Get a unique item (blue or higher, random cheap one from running Act 1 on Normal difficulty for 2 minutes)
* Put it up in the auction house for a buyout of the amount of gold you want to have
* Post the exact values of this auction + item to the web site
* As soon as the auction is verified as being truly unique (no other auction with an item that has the exact same item values and buyout), it is bought by the counter party who sold the gold

The 15% fees are happening there again though...

[ElectricMucus]

Yes Sukrim that are exactly the issues we would be facing.

However since trading items for bitcoins might not be selling them in some interpretation because it is not recognized legal tender. Oh the irony...

There is a fairly easy way to automate the process without hacking the game, well almost, I would choose a microcontroller acting as a USB mouse/keyboard. This way Blizz can patch process monitoring in their software all they want.
It will most likely be get the account banned if Blizzard gets wind of it but I doubt there would be a lawsuit.

But yes using real person escrower would work and was also what I had in mind. This can scale very well if you enable people to earn their share acting as escrow if they have high reputation.

[mrkent]

Yes Sukrim that are exactly the issues we would be facing.

However since trading items for bitcoins might not be selling them in some interpretation because it is not recognized legal tender. Oh the irony...

Biggest issue is still delivery imho.

What I've been thinking might be the best way is to make the site very similar to bitmit/ebay, except with the ability for sellers to say "I'm online." That way, no escrows are needed because transactions are completed within 5 minutes. Auctions of this nature would then be more desirable for the majority of items being sold.

[mikegogulski]

I own the domain btc2diablo.com if anyone's interested in acquiring it.

[ElectricMucus]

For some reason I am not that interested in DiabloIII anymore, the game was a little disappointing, I don't really play it any more.

Other than that: Domain squatting sucks.

GTFO

[Spekulatius]

I own the domain btc2diablo.com if anyone's interested in acquiring it.

you probably know already: https://ogrr.com/

[ElectricMucus]

I own the domain btc2diablo.com if anyone's interested in acquiring it.

you probably know already: https://ogrr.com/

Please don't encourage the guy.

[Spekulatius]

I own the domain btc2diablo.com if anyone's interested in acquiring it.

you probably know already: https://ogrr.com/

Please don't encourage the guy.

I was trying to discourage him actually