Was Bitcoin actually just a Pump and Dump?

[Scamalert]

I must admit the bitcoin exhange rate looks a bit like those shitty altcoin.
First very low price, jump when hit major exhange, hype, and then dead cat bounce.
But I don't think bitcoin was a pump and dump, if that is so, then would Mr. Satoshi have dumbt at 1200 USD. But bitcoin is not over yet, we will still see 1000 USD again... just a matter of time.

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[deisik]

this is a cool project http://joel.mn/post/103546215249/the-blockchain-application-stack

basically turning everything on internet(like virtual storage) into decentralized application, you can build a freenet alike thing in top of the blockchain

it would be cool to have something like amazon c2 but in its decentralized version, so provided by the nodes

or another example is in the gaming industry, integrating it in the blockchain http://www.newsbtc.com/2015/04/26/blockchain-gaming-moonga/

what is really cool about this is the fact that you can be sustained by many nodes(which continue to expand the network every day) that have far more power than any centralized service, that you can find on the web

Cool, cool, cool... Do you think that naming something "cool" would lure someone into it? These "projects" look more like jokes than real developments. The first link is actually a blog post, the second about some obscure game where you can trade what is called "cards" through the blockchain (nice feature indeed, as a proof of concept, (ab)using the blockchain signed messaging), though the game itself has nothing to do with either Bitcoin or its blockchain (it has been released in 2009)...

Surely not something that I would care about

naming something cool, doesn't have anything to do with what you are saying or thinking, it just my opinion on that particular subject, and the fact that you don't care about it, doesn't makes those things less useful, and unlike you, i actually care, about implementing gaming on the blockchain

i think you are just trolling to be honest

It doesn't matter what your opinion is, what matters is a viable implementation of some useful technology based on the Bitcoin protocol (beyond that of a decentralized payment system we already have) and which wouldn't be parazitising on the existing implementation (that of Bitcoin). Your only example is just that, a parasite...

You may call me a troll as much as you please, but this won't change the facts by any means

[Amph]

this is a cool project http://joel.mn/post/103546215249/the-blockchain-application-stack

basically turning everything on internet(like virtual storage) into decentralized application, you can build a freenet alike thing in top of the blockchain

it would be cool to have something like amazon c2 but in its decentralized version, so provided by the nodes

or another example is in the gaming industry, integrating it in the blockchain http://www.newsbtc.com/2015/04/26/blockchain-gaming-moonga/

what is really cool about this is the fact that you can be sustained by many nodes(which continue to expand the network every day) that have far more power than any centralized service, that you can find on the web

Cool, cool, cool... Do you think that naming something "cool" would lure someone into it? These "projects" look more like jokes than real developments. The first link is actually a blog post, the second about some obscure game where you can trade what is called "cards" through the blockchain (nice feature indeed, as a proof of concept, (ab)using the blockchain signed messaging), though the game itself has nothing to do with either Bitcoin or its blockchain (it has been released in 2009)...

Surely not something that I would care about

naming something cool, doesn't have anything to do with what you are saying or thinking, it just my opinion on that particular subject, and the fact that you don't care about it, doesn't makes those things less useful, and unlike you, i actually care, about implementing gaming on the blockchain

i think you are just trolling to be honest

It doesn't matter what your opinion is, what matters is a viable implementation of some technology based on the Bitcoin protocol (beyond that of a decentralized payment system we already have) and which wouldn't be parazitising on the existing implementation (that of Bitcoin)...

You may call me a troll as much as you please but this won't change the facts by any means

i was not talking about a decentralized payment, but about decentralize everything by using the blockchain, this is one of the ways that you can implement something into the blockchain, there aren't others why, it's obvious that the only thing the blockchain can offer is the the most important aspect of it, namely the decentralization

like the gold, the only thing he can offer is the possibility to build stuff with it....

[deisik]

It doesn't matter what your opinion is, what matters is a viable implementation of some technology based on the Bitcoin protocol (beyond that of a decentralized payment system we already have) and which wouldn't be parazitising on the existing implementation (that of Bitcoin)...

You may call me a troll as much as you please but this won't change the facts by any means

i was not talking about a decentralized payment, but about decentralize everything by using the blockchain, this is one of the ways that you can implement something into the blockchain, there aren't others why, it's obvious that the only thing the blockchain can offer is the the most important aspect of it, namely the decentralization

I wasn't talking either, but you seem to have failed to understand where I was getting at. Using the Bitcoin blockchain is not the same as using the Bitcoin protocol. If you are using the former you are using the existing infrastructure, that is, that of the Bitcoin decentralized payment system (with all its nodes and miners), whether you like it or not. That would be parazitising on it...

[Amph]

It doesn't matter what your opinion is, what matters is a viable implementation of some technology based on the Bitcoin protocol (beyond that of a decentralized payment system we already have) and which wouldn't be parazitising on the existing implementation (that of Bitcoin)...

You may call me a troll as much as you please but this won't change the facts by any means

i was not talking about a decentralized payment, but about decentralize everything by using the blockchain, this is one of the ways that you can implement something into the blockchain, there aren't others why, it's obvious that the only thing the blockchain can offer is the the most important aspect of it, namely the decentralization

I wasn't talking either, but you seem to have failed to understand where I was getting at. Using the Bitcoin blockchain is not the same as using the Bitcoin protocol. If you are using the former you are using the existing infrastructure, that is, that of the Bitcoin decentralized payment system (with all its nodes and miners), whether you like it or not. That would be parazitising on it...

well my first post of all this debating was talking about the technology sorrounding bitcoin, i never said that you need to use bitcoin protocol, and what is the problem of using existing infrastructure and decentralize stuff on top of it? this is exactly how it can be enhanced

the whole discussion started because gold can be used for something else other than trading, the same can be said about the technology of bitcoin, the blochchain(it can be used to add something on top of it), simply as that, it does not matter if you use the appearance of something for which it was built(decentralization), the point is that it can be useful for something else based trading


It looks like you're turning the conversation in your favor....

[deisik]

the whole discussion started because gold can be used for something else other than trading, the same can be said about the technology of bitcoin, the blochchain(it can be used to add something on top of it), simply as that, it does not matter if you use the appearance of something for which it was built(decentralization), the point is that it can be useful for something else based trading

I guess, using gold for an investment as a precious metal (a sort of money) is quite different to using it in, say, electronics in comparison to expanding the Bitcoin blockchain functionality, on the other hand

well my first post of all this debating was talking about the technology sorrounding bitcoin, i never said that you need to use bitcoin protocol, and what is the problem of using existing infrastructure and decentralize stuff on top of it? this is exactly how it can be enhanced

You still lack proper understanding

Firstly, if someone develops something on top of the Bitcoin blockchain, using the existing infrastructure for his purposes (whatever they might be), the miners may not be quite happy with that (with all ensuing consequences thereby). Secondly, if this new development has nothing to do with the Bitcoin main functionality (that of a payment system), which is what your point is about (since you are "not talking about a decentralized payment"), then the success of it will, nevertheless, ultimately depend on the Bitcoin success as the payment system (miners opinion ignored here). So the question is, why would anyone want to risk into this?

[deisik]

It looks like you're turning the conversation in your favor....

Besides that, the first link that you provided as a proof of your point (and thought so cool about) actually talks about using the Bitcoin protocol (and implementing an independent blockchain), not existing Bitcoin blockchain (which serves only as an example). So who is actually turning the conversation in whose favor?

Thanks to the Blockchain, for the first time we can develop open source, decentralized protocols with built-in data (thanks to Overlay Networks and The Blockchain), validation, and transactions that are not controlled by a single entity. This is where the traditional architecture of software businesses begins to break down.

As an aside, however persuading that may sound, this is still no more than usual business hype

[ThEmporium]

Not what I want to think about when I've spent over 5000 GBP on BTC & judging by the current price I'm at a massive loss.

Sorry to hear that, looks like you are on a long run now if you are planning to hold them.

He might have miscalculated his expenditure, I do not know how he calculated his loss and profit, Better he would take some guidance to got to understand the whole investment procedures, Once upon a time Bitcoin value is 260$, if that scenario happens once again, he will be the most luckiest person in this world, to achieve that he should wait patiently or try to get marginal profit.

[Amph]

the whole discussion started because gold can be used for something else other than trading, the same can be said about the technology of bitcoin, the blochchain(it can be used to add something on top of it), simply as that, it does not matter if you use the appearance of something for which it was built(decentralization), the point is that it can be useful for something else based trading

I guess, using gold for an investment as a precious metal (a sort of money) is quite different to using it in, say, electronics in comparison to expanding the Bitcoin blockchain functionality, on the other hand

and so? this isn't the point,  it doesn't change that the bitcoin tech can be used for something else other than money, it doesn't matter how gold can have more differents use(or its uses are vastly different from trading to something else), compared to bitcoin tech, if the latter can still have more than one use

well my first post of all this debating was talking about the technology sorrounding bitcoin, i never said that you need to use bitcoin protocol, and what is the problem of using existing infrastructure and decentralize stuff on top of it? this is exactly how it can be enhanced

Firstly, if someone develops something on top of the Bitcoin blockchain, using the existing infrastructure for his purposes (whatever they might be), the miners may not be quite happy with that (with all ensuing consequences thereby). Secondly, if this new development has nothing to do with the Bitcoin main functionality (that of a payment system), which is what your point is about (since you are "not talking about a decentralized payment"), then the success of it will, nevertheless, ultimately depend on the Bitcoin success as the payment system (miners opinion ignored here). So the question is, why would anyone want to risk into this?

again you are diverting your speech, the fact that miners are not happy, does not mean nothing, my whole point is that it can be used for something different than trading, is this so hard to understand

i think yes, in your case, because, the one that not understands is you and not i

and again has nothing to do with the risk or anything involved, it is simply possible to build it, you are just raising other random concerns that has nothing to do with what we were talking about at the beginning

but i can simply respond to your question with, why not? every company is taking big risks nowadays this isn't any different...

It looks like you're turning the conversation in your favor....

Besides that, the first link that you provided as a proof of your point (and thought so cool about) actually talks about using the Bitcoin protocol (and implementing an independent blockchain), not existing Bitcoin blockchain (which serves only as an example). So who is actually turning the conversation in whose favor?

well that was just an example of another possible use, my main point was toward the blockchain

and see above, you are still the one that are turning the conversation around, with something that again has nothing to do with our first quote

if you are deliberately diverting the conversation , only to stretch it more, and claim to be right , then we can close this now

[deisik]

well my first post of all this debating was talking about the technology sorrounding bitcoin, i never said that you need to use bitcoin protocol, and what is the problem of using existing infrastructure and decentralize stuff on top of it? this is exactly how it can be enhanced

Firstly, if someone develops something on top of the Bitcoin blockchain, using the existing infrastructure for his purposes (whatever they might be), the miners may not be quite happy with that (with all ensuing consequences thereby). Secondly, if this new development has nothing to do with the Bitcoin main functionality (that of a payment system), which is what your point is about (since you are "not talking about a decentralized payment"), then the success of it will, nevertheless, ultimately depend on the Bitcoin success as the payment system (miners opinion ignored here). So the question is, why would anyone want to risk into this?

again you are diverting your speech, the fact that miners are not happy, does not mean nothing, my whole point is that it can be used for something different than trading, is this so hard to understand

The fact that it can be used doesn't in the least imply that it is or will ever be used beyond its main purpose (and signed messaging). I was trying to explain to you the reasons why there are essentially no such developments (and most likely won't be of anything substantial). Your whole point was that "there are many attempts to use the blockchain not just as a public ledger, everyone know it". These are your words, not mine, after all...

It seems that it is only you who "knows it" or should "know it". That, simply put, sums it up

[BTCevo]

No,Bitcoin never was pump and dump it was created for some very serious purposes but these were and are people who sometimes loses patience and dump their holdings for little profits.This should be traded to maintain the price and increase it value so both trade and holding a combination is needed.

I dont think it will be that way because if there are no one pump there will be no one to dump. So my point is bitcoin price is control by some people that they called it "whale" because they got a lot of money to pump a lot of bitcoin and the price is going higher but after some time they are getting enough profit and they will dump it for sure because they already get some profit

[illyiller]

In linear, the bitcoin chart resembles a lot of bubbles. And usually, bubbles don't happen twice. On the other hand, that's not what the log chart shows. So... we shall see. 

[solitude]

Was OP just a faggot?

[ridery99]

Bitcoin is going to change the world. Soon it's going to be accepted as a world currency and every transaction is monitored by AI so there can't be tax avoidance anymore. One world government will ban cash and monitor everything in economy by using bitcoin.

[Amph]

well my first post of all this debating was talking about the technology sorrounding bitcoin, i never said that you need to use bitcoin protocol, and what is the problem of using existing infrastructure and decentralize stuff on top of it? this is exactly how it can be enhanced

Firstly, if someone develops something on top of the Bitcoin blockchain, using the existing infrastructure for his purposes (whatever they might be), the miners may not be quite happy with that (with all ensuing consequences thereby). Secondly, if this new development has nothing to do with the Bitcoin main functionality (that of a payment system), which is what your point is about (since you are "not talking about a decentralized payment"), then the success of it will, nevertheless, ultimately depend on the Bitcoin success as the payment system (miners opinion ignored here). So the question is, why would anyone want to risk into this?

again you are diverting your speech, the fact that miners are not happy, does not mean nothing, my whole point is that it can be used for something different than trading, is this so hard to understand

The fact that it can be used doesn't in the least imply that it is or will ever be used beyond its main purpose (and signed messaging). I was trying to explain to you the reasons why there are essentially no such developments (and most likely won't be of anything substantial). Your whole point was that "there are many attempts to use the blockchain not just as a public ledger, everyone know it". These are your words, not mine, after all...

It seems that it is only you who "knows it" or should "know it". That, simply put, sums it up

none can predict the future, my point is that there is the possibility, i don't care if that possibility is slim(for you, for me it isn't), as long as there are other ways to use it, those way will be explored one day

gaming on the blochcahin is one of those, already on the way

[deisik]

well my first post of all this debating was talking about the technology sorrounding bitcoin, i never said that you need to use bitcoin protocol, and what is the problem of using existing infrastructure and decentralize stuff on top of it? this is exactly how it can be enhanced

Firstly, if someone develops something on top of the Bitcoin blockchain, using the existing infrastructure for his purposes (whatever they might be), the miners may not be quite happy with that (with all ensuing consequences thereby). Secondly, if this new development has nothing to do with the Bitcoin main functionality (that of a payment system), which is what your point is about (since you are "not talking about a decentralized payment"), then the success of it will, nevertheless, ultimately depend on the Bitcoin success as the payment system (miners opinion ignored here). So the question is, why would anyone want to risk into this?

again you are diverting your speech, the fact that miners are not happy, does not mean nothing, my whole point is that it can be used for something different than trading, is this so hard to understand

The fact that it can be used doesn't in the least imply that it is or will ever be used beyond its main purpose (and signed messaging). I was trying to explain to you the reasons why there are essentially no such developments (and most likely won't be of anything substantial). Your whole point was that "there are many attempts to use the blockchain not just as a public ledger, everyone know it". These are your words, not mine, after all...

It seems that it is only you who "knows it" or should "know it". That, simply put, sums it up

none can predict the future, my point is that there is the possibility, i don't care if that possibility is slim(for you, for me it isn't), as long as there are other ways to use it, those way will be explored one day

Wishful thinking is an interpretation of events as you would like them to be rather than as they really are, i.e. an erroneous belief that what you wish for is actually true...

[deisik]

gaming on the blochcahin is one of those, already on the way

I looked more narrowly at that trading card game of Moonga (and its site), and, alas, there is nothing beyond just using the Bitcoin blockchain as a payment system for buying additional cards in the game itself (as an option). This is not what I would call gaming on the blockchain, just like it is not gaming on MasterCard if you happen to buy some stuff in a game through that payment system...

EverdreamSoft is now accepting to be paid for any of their services in bitcoin, the revolutionary currency

...

In Moonga, users start playing by downloading the game for free. To progress, complete their collection and improve their game strategy, players can chose to buy additional cards, either using to the points earned in games, tournaments or contests, or via the Shop where the card boosters are for sale at varying prices.

So it seems that you got too deep into the illusion of taking wishes for facts

[Clint]

Your story is possible, but I don't think that was the reason they created it. How the hell would they know bitcoin would go this big in 4 years, they wouldn't care anyways, cause they left with billions just like you said. That part is true.

[dollarneed]

I think all of crypto coin just pump-dump scheme, especially altcoins with small cap, easy to manipulate.
as for bitcoin, it will be costly to manipulate the price, need a lot of coins and money

[ammy009]

Bitcoin is not just a pump n dump coin. it's true decentralized currency