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Author Topic: Wtf is the government thinking  (Read 2497 times)
aqrulesms
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June 03, 2012, 06:51:49 PM
 #1

The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people, in the USA at least.  Yet we have constantly seen that people are being controlled by the government, and our freedoms being taken away slowly, and slowly, and slowly,  yet we have allowed this to happen.

Let me list some things:

1. Tobacco Tax
2. Banning smoking in public places
3. Plastic bag ban
4. Ban on drugs (Looks bad, but there is no reason for marijuana to really even be banned)
5. Closure of coal plants (30 closed across the nation, decreasing our electricity generation capacity)

And more...

Unfortunately for me to make things worse, I live in a liberal city full of liberals that want things only their way.  They're increasing electric rates, banning plastic bags soon and making a big stir...

Electric used to be much cheaper $0.03-0.04 and now it's going up to rates such as $0.15/KWh.  They decided to close down a ton of power plants in the city while demand is rising, and decided that stealing more money from our pockets is a viable solution to lower demand and rolling blackouts.

So why don't people stand up to the government?  Our freedoms are slowly being taken away.  The majority politicians only go into government to control people and have power.  Of course that is human nature but we still can limit that from having such slow and devastating impacts on our freedoms.
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June 03, 2012, 06:54:08 PM
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by smoking in public places, you are forcing other people to smoke indirectly.

so its okay for you to force something upon others, but its not okay that the government does it?

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves and wiser people so full of doubts." -Bertrand Russell
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June 03, 2012, 07:09:15 PM
 #3

Well the electricity part, the government is scared shitless about a total loss of the grid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWy06s2fRk4

In essence, they are prepping and making the market conducive for profiteering, simultaneously. If the impending storm does less damage than predicted, corporations win. If they don't do anything, we all lose if it's really bad.

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June 03, 2012, 07:33:24 PM
 #4

The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people, in the USA at least.  Yet we have constantly seen that people are being controlled by the government, and our freedoms being taken away slowly, and slowly, and slowly,  yet we have allowed this to happen.

Let me list some things:

1. Tobacco Tax
2. Banning smoking in public places
3. Plastic bag ban
4. Ban on drugs (Looks bad, but there is no reason for marijuana to really even be banned)
5. Closure of coal plants (30 closed across the nation, decreasing our electricity generation capacity)

This sounds like a very simplistic rant motivated by base political ideals. I see no in depth analysis here that addresses population growth, sustainability, conservation, long term planning, etc.

It sounds like a meme derived from the chanting of the word 'Freedom', without an acknowledgement of the complexity of the world we live in, and its evolving state.
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June 03, 2012, 07:35:51 PM
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The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people

Still believe that?

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June 03, 2012, 10:01:19 PM
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The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people

Still believe that?

Wake up, and smell the ashes.
aqrulesms
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June 03, 2012, 10:59:53 PM
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The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people

Still believe that?

Wake up, and smell the ashes.

Playing too much Half-Life 2?  Grin



But yes the government is not truly there for the people.  I predict that the government will eventually turn into a totalitarian state, due to utter chaos that will come from future lack of resources (oil and other hydrocarbon energy sources)

As to the other posters and criticisms, you must agree that the government is in fact placing too many regulations and taxes upon us.  They are limiting job creation while at the same time promising to promote them.  Take from the candidates that are running for office, for example.  I have not seen much improvement and most of it is just empty promises to simply get them in power.

Although the government may be trying to prepare for the future and sustainability I don't think they are taking it the right way.  After all, the government cannot do this alone.  By them setting up all types of programs they are simply wasting tax payer money.  It is up to ourselves and private sector companies to shape our growth.

What the government is doing is simply stunting future growth.
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June 04, 2012, 12:45:58 AM
 #8

I live in a liberal city full of liberals that want things only their way.

Honestly I'm not really sure what those people are.  Mostly they are just welfare dependents.  They can't really be called liberals.

Most of the things you mention are just excuses to institute sin taxes to pay for social welfare.

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June 04, 2012, 12:14:28 PM
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The Government is one big pot everyone takes from. Quickly the world is divided into 2 classes, slaves and parasites. When the former can't support the latter...
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June 16, 2012, 10:14:11 PM
 #10

China is burning coal and killing dolphins like there is no tomorrow.
They know that they have to switch to renewable energy sources sooner or later:
http://dft.ba/-chinasolar

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June 17, 2012, 01:39:35 PM
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China is actually making a lot of steps to go greener

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June 17, 2012, 02:03:33 PM
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Watch this if you're interested in why things are the way they are and who's really in charge.

The sort answer is, people aren't aware, and it's too big of an idea for them to believe. A lot like the Matrix.
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June 17, 2012, 02:24:04 PM
 #13

The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people, in the USA at least.  Yet we have constantly seen that people are being controlled by the government, and our freedoms being taken away slowly, and slowly, and slowly,  yet we have allowed this to happen.

Let me list some things:

1. Tobacco Tax
2. Banning smoking in public places
3. Plastic bag ban
4. Ban on drugs (Looks bad, but there is no reason for marijuana to really even be banned)
5. Closure of coal plants (30 closed across the nation, decreasing our electricity generation capacity)

And more...

Unfortunately for me to make things worse, I live in a liberal city full of liberals that want things only their way.  They're increasing electric rates, banning plastic bags soon and making a big stir...

Electric used to be much cheaper $0.03-0.04 and now it's going up to rates such as $0.15/KWh.  They decided to close down a ton of power plants in the city while demand is rising, and decided that stealing more money from our pockets is a viable solution to lower demand and rolling blackouts.

So why don't people stand up to the government?  Our freedoms are slowly being taken away.  The majority politicians only go into government to control people and have power.  Of course that is human nature but we still can limit that from having such slow and devastating impacts on our freedoms.

Liberals?   The liberals are not trying to take away your pot. 

Smoking ban in public places, I am all for it.  You can damage your own lungs in private, but you should not be able to chase me out of public areas with your smoke.  I am not against public smoking in wide open public spaces with no crowding. 

Probably the only thing you even have a point on is the power plants.  When we close up a power plant all we are doing is freeing that coal to be burned in a Chinese power plant with less pollution controls.  That is after the coal is hauled 10,000 miles via ocean freighter putting even more pollutant in the air. 

You could have brought up more sinister government actions like trying to control soft drinks........

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June 17, 2012, 02:28:03 PM
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Not bad for an 18 year old. Bravo op.

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June 17, 2012, 05:57:28 PM
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Liberals?   The liberals are not trying to take away your pot. 

They are in New Hampshire. The republican controlled house and senate passed a MMJ law, and the democrat governor vetoed it. IIRC, a previous decrim law was passed and he vetoed that too.

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June 17, 2012, 07:28:04 PM
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The Government is one big pot everyone takes from. Quickly the world is divided into 2 classes, slaves and parasites. When the former can't support the latter...

Um - when you are healthy and working you pay taxes.  When you are sick or unemployed, you get health care and dole.  So which class you are in depends on what virus is floating about or what industry is doing well right now.

Doesn't' that strike you as fundamentally stupid to say that your class depends on such things? 

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June 17, 2012, 09:59:17 PM
 #17

The designations of Democrat and Republican as liberal and concervative don't really make sense anymore.  If you think of all of them as politicians out to do whatever they think will keep them in power, you will be a lot less naive as to how governments work.  If that involves lying to you to trick you into voting for them or accepting bribes (oh, I think you mean campain contributions), many will do so.

There will always be good, principled people in all walks of life.  If government had only good, honest people in it, a monarchy would suffice.  But government has a way of attracting the most unsavory kinds of people that want to have everything and make you pay for it.  Which is why things like checks and balances in governments is so important.  The removal of these checks and balances makes me very concerned for the future of our society.

For the medical marijuana argument I have this: the same issues that are taking place with marijuana prohibition are the exact same issues that took place with alchohol prohibition.  Mobs/gangs/drug cartels, bootleggers/drug runners.  Call them whatever you want, forcing a substance to be illegal causes the rise of organized crime, and not the other way arround.

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June 17, 2012, 11:55:56 PM
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China is actually making a lot of steps to go greener

Indeed, look up the Chinese electric car made in Shenzhen, it's called BYD E6.

Ok, we're not talking cars or fuel, electricity wise it's also making progress. The price of electricity has raised dramatically in China, specially on the richer areas such as the South.

Where I live I'm paying US$0.11/KWh which is similar to the price in some developed countries as I have read from other people's posts.

Now I don't know where is the power coming from, whether it is still powered by coal or another source. But the price move is an indication that the it's not coal anymore or it's soon to stop being.
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June 18, 2012, 08:58:01 PM
 #19

The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people, in the USA at least.  Yet we have constantly seen that people are being controlled by the government, and our freedoms being taken away slowly, and slowly, and slowly,  yet we have allowed this to happen.

Let me list some things:

1. Tobacco Tax
2. Banning smoking in public places
3. Plastic bag ban
4. Ban on drugs (Looks bad, but there is no reason for marijuana to really even be banned)
5. Closure of coal plants (30 closed across the nation, decreasing our electricity generation capacity)

This sounds like a very simplistic rant motivated by base political ideals. I see no in depth analysis here that addresses population growth, sustainability, conservation, long term planning, etc.

It sounds like a meme derived from the chanting of the word 'Freedom', without an acknowledgement of the complexity of the world we live in, and its evolving state.

Alright since not many folks are willing to call you out I will.

What "Complexities" are you referring to? Please in great detail.

Now since I do know what you're going to say I'll present this notion. Is there such a thing as irreducible complexity in nature? Meaning a life form so complex that evolution (the process of chaos leading to order) cannot explain how it came into being?

If you're as rational as you portray yourself to be "in writing" then you would likely have to concede that irreducible complexity is a fallacy. By that concession you do also acknowledge that a chaotic process based on the principles of "Freedom" and/or "Liberty" (chaotic tactic) can lead to an emergent order. One that is not only possible but inherently "natural" or inevitable would you not agree?

If Cosmology, Biology and Quantum Physics all point to how uncertainty is a fact of life. Then by through uncertainty (Liberty/Freedom etc) one can derive a sense of certainty (emergent order) as individual economic players (or groups of voluntary individuals) through their actions... exchanges and co-operative efforts lay the foundations for a "Stateless Society" (emergent order).

Your problem is that you rely on Sacred Cows a little too much. You seem so certain of yourself when the truth is only uncertainty is for certain. That is a rule of thumb in all Socio/Economic affairs just as it is when we turn to Quantum Mechanics, Biology and various other sciences. At most we can only predict in "Probabilities" and this doesn't jive well with the Black/White legal framework of Liberal Democracies or its Central Economic model(s). A State (or the Statist mindset) is therefore nothing more than a relic left over by an old way of thinking. A religious way of thinking. An Ordered way of thinking.

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June 18, 2012, 09:57:43 PM
 #20

The government, ironically, is supposed to be a government for the people, in the USA at least.  Yet we have constantly seen that people are being controlled by the government, and our freedoms being taken away slowly, and slowly, and slowly,  yet we have allowed this to happen.

Let me list some things:

1. Tobacco Tax
2. Banning smoking in public places
3. Plastic bag ban
4. Ban on drugs (Looks bad, but there is no reason for marijuana to really even be banned)
5. Closure of coal plants (30 closed across the nation, decreasing our electricity generation capacity)

This sounds like a very simplistic rant motivated by base political ideals. I see no in depth analysis here that addresses population growth, sustainability, conservation, long term planning, etc.

It sounds like a meme derived from the chanting of the word 'Freedom', without an acknowledgement of the complexity of the world we live in, and its evolving state.

Alright since not many folks are willing to call you out I will.

What "Complexities" are you referring to? Please in great detail.

Now since I do know what you're going to say I'll present this notion. Is there such a thing as irreducible complexity in nature? Meaning a life form so complex that evolution (the process of chaos leading to order) cannot explain how it came into being?

If you're as rational as you portray yourself to be "in writing" then you would likely have to concede that irreducible complexity is a fallacy. By that concession you do also acknowledge that a chaotic process based on the principles of "Freedom" and/or "Liberty" (chaotic tactic) can lead to an emergent order. One that is not only possible but inherently "natural" or inevitable would you not agree?

If Cosmology, Biology and Quantum Physics all point to how uncertainty is a fact of life. Then by through uncertainty (Liberty/Freedom etc) one can derive a sense of certainty (emergent order) as individual economic players (or groups of voluntary individuals) through their actions... exchanges and co-operative efforts lay the foundations for a "Stateless Society" (emergent order).

Your problem is that you rely on Sacred Cows a little too much. You seem so certain of yourself when the truth is only uncertainty is for certain. That is a rule of thumb in all Socio/Economic affairs just as it is when we turn to Quantum Mechanics, Biology and various other sciences. At most we can only predict in "Probabilities" and this doesn't jive well with the Black/White legal framework of Liberal Democracies or its Central Economic model(s). A State (or the Statist mindset) is therefore nothing more than a relic left over by an old way of thinking. A religious way of thinking. An Ordered way of thinking.
bla bla bla... all you people that that the world is simple are wrong. it is not, you should really get more  out of yours parents basement.

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves and wiser people so full of doubts." -Bertrand Russell
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