Paycoin (XPY) is scam

[swansong]

its too bad that coinmarketcap.com listing that scamcoin.

[inBitweTrust]

So it appears as if GAW couldn't end up securing any real merchant partnerships they boasted as having. So they ended up buying Zincsave in a last ditch attempt to make it appear that you can spend XPY at major merchants when all they are doing is exchnaging the XPY for BTC or Fiat behind the scenes.

Here are the problems with ZincSave Paysave


https://www.paybase.com/faq.html#where-will-my-order-come-from

Where will my order come from?

We fulfill your order from the lowest cost vendor or retailer. This means that if you place an order using the PaySave button on Macy's, it may come in a box from Walmart, or vice versa.

What retailers are supported?

PaySave currently supports Walmart, Macy's, and Target. We'll be supporting more retailers very soon! Homepage mentions amazon but FAQ omits.


The way is works:

http://lifehacker.com/zinc-skips-the-coupon-clipping-and-automatically-applie-1532877581
They joined that retailer's affiliate program and give you portion of their referral commission. All four of the retailers mentioned have an affiliate program with their online store.

Which means it's NOT a real coupon. It's commission split. This also means if you used any referral links, like you clicked through someone else's referral link, this will likely "steal" that referral and substitute their own.


What clients don't like about it:


1) Shipping may take longer
2) The ordered items don't appear on the clients history
3) Returns and cancellations have to be handled through zincsave and not directly through amazon
4) Products may come from another company entirely (This is the part you need to pay attention to as paysave will scalp sales from merchants)


What amazon TOS says about it:

We've received an official response from Amazon regarding the Chrome extension and intend on publishing it in the near future once all of the facts are gathered in the matter but I'm going to take the highlights of the response and share them here in the meantime.

"Amazon does not allow nor condone the use of any piece of software that violates our terms of service specifically the following sections:

[...] will not intercept, record, redirect, read, interpret, or fill in the contents of any electronic form or other material submitted to us by any person or entity.

[...] will not request, collect, obtain, store, cache, or otherwise use any account information used by our customers in connection with any Amazon Site [...]

[...] will not modify, redirect, suppress, or substitute the operation of any button, link, or other feature of the Amazon Site.

[...] will not make any orders or engage in other transactions of any kind on the Amazon Site on behalf of any other person or entity, or authorize, assist, or encourage any other person or entity to do so.

[...] will not take any action that could reasonably cause any customer confusion as to our relationship with you, or as to the site on which any functions or transactions (e.g., search, browse, or order) are occurring.

Any piece of software, extension or other system which implies a partnership or intercepts customers or customer information is in direct violation of our terms and Amazon will act accordingly."

These are just some highlights. As we continue securing facts and information our team will work to publish a full piece.

Meanwhile you can already save 15-20% on amazon with purse.io or 3% from amazon and any other merchant with Gyft in Bitcoin and not have to deal with paysave problems.

[chipmadness]

BIG CORPORATE SHIT COIN

[Crestington]

Code:

static const int64 MAX_MONEY = 2000000000 * COIN;
static const int STAKE_START_TIME = 1418470264; // Sat 13 Dec 2014 06:31:04 AM EST
static const unsigned int POW_START_TIME = 1418403600; // Fri 12 Dec 2014 12:00:00 PM EST
static const unsigned int POW_END_TIME = 1419181200; // Sun 21 Dec 2014 12:00:00 PM EST

2,000,000,000 total coins with 12,000,000 premine, current total coins 12,375,656. Means 375,656 POW but we have to minus the large POS blocks and early POW blocks (ill get to that).

Now I dont know the specs but I seen 500,000 XPY was the apparent POW supply which was incorrect and deliberately coded incorrectly to allow less POW blocks then indicated. If you were to allow a certain number of blocks you would allocate the POW change to block height, no time. By using Ntime you will usually a) confuse users as you are only estimating and b) always get it wrong. Block times are averages and using time instead of height is a deliberate method to reduce total coins. Now if we look at the stake start times, once again should be based off height not time, POS kicked in the day after launch. This then ensures less POW blocks are generated and more POS blocks, once again reducing total coins allocated to POW as more POW blocks are mined before the POW cut off time. Now even if total coins for the POW stage are not pre-announced, this method is what most devs use to allocate a greater % of total coins vs what they advertise.

Now 375,656 POW coins is fine I guess until we look at the POS blocks generated. So between block 9180 and 9229, 13,000 XPY were generated through POS. Between block 14200 and 14000, another 18,000 XPY were generated. When POW was disabled, we had a total count of 12,343,000 or 343,000 coin POW phase. Since that POW phase has ended a total of 33,800 XPY have been staked with all 32,700 XPY going to POS on premined coins and addresses, with only 900 XPY to the 341,000 POW owners. This is based on the code below and looking through the block explorer.

Stake Min and Max Age

Code:

static const int STAKE_MIN_AGE = 60 * 60; // minimum age for coin age
static const int STAKE_MAX_AGE = 60 * 60 * 24 * 5; // stake age of full weight

Primenode Requirements.

Code:

static const int64 NUMBER_OF_PRIMENODE = 50;
static const int64 MINIMUM_FOR_ORION = 50 * COIN;
static const int64 MINIMUM_FOR_PRIMENODE = 125000 * COIN;

Primenode Rewards.

Code:

if (primeNodeRate == 0)
        nRewardCoinYear = 5 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 10)
        nRewardCoinYear = 10 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 20)
        nRewardCoinYear = 20 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 100)
        nRewardCoinYear = 100 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 350)
        nRewardCoinYear = 350 * CENT;

Now using the previous figures, lets take a look at the yearly projection using the base that POS stage is 10 days old.

Primenode yearly POS XPY count 32,700 XPY * 36.5= 1,193,500 XPY (Total (BTC)51797.88806500)

POW nodes yearly POS XPY count 900 * 36.5= 32,850 XPY. (Total (BTC)1425.68967150)


As long as these match up to the projections and pre announcements, who cares I guess. These numbers are not 100% accurate, check the block explorer for an exact amounts.

Wow!

Talk about Ponzi!

With 5 days maximum age that means it limits all the smaller Blocks. The Coins from the premine will always push out the small players as those Coins that DO stake, compound with interest.

To limit the smaller Blocks can be good for the Coin, but you need a balance where the average person CAN stake their Coins.

This means that GAW has a nearly unlimited supply of Coins they can dump on the market.

[Penny Pincher XPP]

PAYCRAP!!!!

[tyson187]

This is just a fad, wait 3-4 months and it will be forgotten.

just like most of the scam coins that were launched during summer , no one even remembers their names anymore except the people that lost money

[inBitweTrust]

This is just a fad, wait 3-4 months and it will be forgotten.

just like most of the scam coins that were launched during summer , no one even remembers their names anymore except the people that lost money

Even their employees(affiliates) show no allegiance, very telling.

Long term clients are speaking up -

A Reply to Josh's answer that escalated into a thread! My take of Operation! Ponzi? Honest and great company? I say both

I like this small company of Josh, but sometimes I feel like you guys talk out of both sides of your mouth! And it is so true! I wanted to go to the old paycoin website for evidence where you guys stated that Paycoin will be sold and bought for $20. And don't argue with me here, it was there! If you felt like putting it there that time then be a man and put it there now too. (I am sorry I cannot get the evidence, GAW changed the semi-decent website to some cheap site that even shi*coins beat)

And basically now when your industry revolutionizing super-duper payment mega-computer financial system after months of work involving many (as you said it and I always LAUGHED so hard on this: "Industry leading companies that we bought) - no you did not... fails to launch on time you start claiming that we had a 3x upside on Paycoin because we bough it at $4 and now it is $12 on exchanges!!! No that is not true you claimed and stated that the price floor will be established at $20. So stop talking out both of your mouth here!

(Also now that I feel like showing some light to your company, there is one more doubt in me that I feel is true, and that is the very creation of Paycoin!!!!!!

Back in the day whenever you guys were accused of being a ponzi scheme you guys come up with some 5th amendment BS up until the day when you guys purchased 5PH from a mining company. After that you guys posted on every site proudly that here it is: look at the confirmation from this developer we have 5PH. and then the pictures with the mining operations started to come. and Paycoin was announced which as you guys figured out needed some power to be mined in the early stages!!

So here is my take: You guys did not have the power to support all the users on zencloud, it was a huge ponzi after a while and you guys needed an out: So you guys introduced Hashcoin and made us mine HP (I know you guys NOT made us, but don't you use that against me, the reason everyone switched to HP mining is that your zenpool payouts were RIDICULOUSLY low -- further sign of the ponzi scheme, lowering payouts.)

So then everyone started mining basically NOTHING and then you guys extended that NOTHING 3 times just to get you guys some time to actually set up the 5PH mining operation and cover the lies and doubts.

After this you guys introduced Paycoin and then asked us for all the help to actually make Paycoin what it is now. Your version of the White Paper was a joke and when educated people told you that you guys let them do the hard work and let them fix the issues.

After that the whole mistery regarding the very limited hashstaker slots and the LIE that you guys don;t know how many Prime Controllers will be yours -- I am gonna say it: all the controllers are yours and a ridiculous amount of Paycoin is in your hands as premine!!!! and then regular mining too!!!

For some reason you guys were able to convert all solos and zens to stakers and even after that you guys put stakers on sale in the market!!!!!

I know that at some parts I was too harsh but you guys, JOSH, know that at some parts I was generous not to dig deeper.

anyways so when you say that when some long time users including myself lose a little faith in your very shady and questionable operations because of the failure to launch your industry revolutionizing Paybase on time you ARE MISSING THE POINT: We lost a little faith because of all the shady and questionable things you guys have done in the past!

Day by day I get more and more concerned about the future of Paycoin! If you want to change things maybe you should fire all the "Industry Innovator trolls" working for you and actually, but Josh for real now, hire and acquire companies with dev teams that can actually do the work! Also make your company less shady! It might not be that bad for us in crypto, but for a regular user???!!!! Whenever I mentioned GAW to a friend of mine he checked it out and jsut left it there telling me that DUDE! Is this a joke? I am so confused! What is this company even doing!

You guys should make your websites more user friendly and noob oriented with a lot more FAQ !

lets put some company members here, I would love to see there 1 sentence comments, in which they turn around a not important part of my thread and use it against me! @GAWCEO @GAW_Amber @GAW_GM

https://hashtalk.org/topic/26482/paybase-status/264

Blockchain got corrupted, it was not in anyones control bud.

Luckily we had a back up, thats they are switching to.

"@redacted and surely they should have the blockchain on at least 1 pc somewhere if they they did in fact beta test it. Cause it kinda feels like when they say beta they mean alpha and when they saw release they mean beta"

"Usually I keep it zipped in pubic. But this reflects very poorly on the professionalism of your dev team. I don't know which is worse, that someone told you this, or that you believe them.

If the blockchain module was the very last thing that got coded, someone's project plan had badly misplaced task priorities. If it wasn't, it should have been pre-loaded a day or two before launch, at minimum.

Sorry to have to say it, but you need to hear it. If anyone had ever come to me with a story like this one, they'd have been sitting in the lobby waiting for their last check."

Further Capitulation--
PayCoin (XPY)
$ 10.91 (-20.36 %)
1    Cryptsy   XPY/BTC    $ 460,302   $ 10.89    65.86 %    Recently
2    Bittrex   XPY/BTC    $ 171,052   $ 10.89    24.47 %    Recently
3    Coin-Swap   XPY/BTC    $ 48,322   $ 10.92    6.91 %    Recently

[inBitweTrust]

History of problems :

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/canaan-vt/THJFBNV4MIFIR075C

[Creampuff]

History of problems :

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/canaan-vt/THJFBNV4MIFIR075C

OMG  you've really opened my eyes with this one lol, I'm absolutely sure that everything you say is completely correct.

And I'm sure you and most other people on this forum are people so unbelievably perfect in every way that have never made mistakes or regretted anything you've ever done or said.
I'm sure every business venture you've every tried was rolled out without flaws and succeeded beyond your wildest dreams.

My advice to you and anyone else thats slams something / someone is: Can you do better yourself? Then do it! get of your arse and do better! dont just keep slaming everything you dont F**king agree with... Do Better or shut the fuck up you whinny arsed keyboard jockies!

Andy

[EvilPanda]

This is just a fad, wait 3-4 months and it will be forgotten.

just like most of the scam coins that were launched during summer , no one even remembers their names anymore except the people that lost money

Even their employees(affiliates) show no allegiance, very telling.

Obviously, you have no idea how a signature campaign works.

A sig campaign doesn't influence opinions and people with signatures are NOT affiliates.

[inBitweTrust]

Obviously, you have no idea how a signature campaign works.

A sig campaign doesn't influence opinions and people with signatures are NOT affiliates.

Advertising banners in a signature doesn't influence people? That is a new first.

I consider paid independent contractors a type of employee, but I understand you may not.

My advice to you and anyone else thats slams something / someone is: Can you do better yourself?

I half agree, there is no reason people cannot do both however. Spreading information and facts can be helpful.

[EvilPanda]

Obviously, you have no idea how a signature campaign works.

A sig campaign doesn't influence opinions and people with signatures are NOT affiliates.

Advertising banners in a signature doesn't influence people? That is a new first.

I consider paid independent contractors a type of employee, but I understand you may not.

The viewing of signatures can be turned off, so a person with a signature doesn't even have to look at it, nor actively promote the company. Most people here have one signature or the other and it's not required of them to even know what they are promoting. This forum also allows you to promote a company of your choice, you just have to buy a banner space for a given time and doing it doesn't make theymos your employee.

[pereira4]

This is just a fad, wait 3-4 months and it will be forgotten.

Has anyone made money with altcoins lately? The last time I saw decent money being made was with the DRK pump and the NAUT one.

Did I miss any interesting opportunities to get some extra BTC from altcoins? I got bored and didnt check the alt section for months.

[Sir Alpha_goy]

.

[inBitweTrust]

I'm worried enough that I wouldn't put more into paycoin today at $10, but not so much as to dump all my coins at a loss. I think that the claims about apis mean that there has been a big change to the plugin and it's not just zincsave rebranded. (I'd still like anyone who has the old plugin to upload it somewhere, as it's not in chrome store anymore). Other than that, it does seem like they aren't too good at launches.

Keep in mind that if they are using Amazon API's they ARE bound to the Amazon TOS. Your use as a developer, company or anything else of the Amazon API means you had to agree to the Amazon TOS and they were quite clear to us in the latest statement that what GAW is doing is in violation.

I literally was in Seattle yesterday meeting with Amazon people. This isn't going to end well.

I'm no legal expert, I have no skin in the game here, I am just a reporter and Amazon gave us ANOTHER statement that we will be sharing once we have the rest of the story. So far we have official comments from Amazon and Target and are awaiting another comment to come in.

[Creampuff]

History of problems :

http://www.topix.com/forum/city/canaan-vt/THJFBNV4MIFIR075C

OMG   you've really opened my eyes with this one lol, I'm absolutely sure that everything you say is completely correct.

And I'm sure you and most other people on this forum are people so unbelievably perfect in every way that have never made mistakes or regretted anything you've ever done or said.
I'm sure every business venture you've every tried was rolled out without flaws and succeeded beyond your wildest dreams.

My advice to you and anyone else thats slams something / someone is: Can you do better yourself? Then do it! get of your arse and do better! dont just keep slaming everything you dont F**king agree with... Do Better or shut the fuck up you whinny arsed keyboard jockies!

Andy

Emotion baiting?


Try again.

Perhaps a little annoyed... I really am not keen on people who are quick to judge but simply don't have the will to do better, and lets face it most forums are filled to bursting with people like that.

I've done massive amounts of reading on Josh and his companies histories, and I personally haven't seen anything that worries me to the extent that some on this forum would have you believe.

What I've gleaned is that this is a man that got off his arse and tried something, did he fail a few times along the road? yeah sure! thats how you learn.
Did he stop there and get a job in an office? No he got off his arse and tried again, and again, and again. And he seems to have done quite well for himself... Good for him! thats what hard work gets you in most cases.

Did he piss people off on the way? well probably I piss people off on a weekly basis, Thats part of my job. I manage a small business and have to think about the business the people I employ and my customers, that means that sometimes I have to be a bit of a bastard to get the job done. does that make me a bad person?

Yes he's made questionable decisions at times... is he the only person to have ever done this?

Yes GAW could have done things better at times... Name any company you like and you'll find a thousand things they could have done better.

All I seem to see with these threads is plenty of people complaining but very few trying to do better.

If ya really think he's that bad, Do Better and you'll put him out of business.

[inBitweTrust]

If ya really think he's that bad, Do Better and you'll put him out of business.

Agreed on this point, But you need to keep in mind these 4 things:

1) One can do both simultaneously
2) Part of building ones business relates to educating the community of corruption and scams for the good of the larger crypto ecosystem
3) Putting him out of business can involve not only creating a better product or services but also educating clients on how a competing product or service is dishonest or inferior
4) Some of us care about ethics and morality and don't put profits first

P.S... This isn't a Bitcoin vs Paycoin issue with me as anyone can see from my sig and post history I attack bitcoin companies all the time for unethical behavior.

[inBitweTrust]

Launch was a bit of a fiasco:

1) PAYBASE SHOP DOES NOT WORK. IT ONLY GIVES ERRORS.
2) 2FA keeps failing on many people and multiple other bugs
3) Some seeing large delays in transferring XPY
4) 20 dollar wall on paybase instantly crumbled ... where are those millions in investor capital supposed to hold the 20?
5) 700 dollar weekly limit on withdrawals... and no paywall of 20 dollars ,,, very suspicious because the limit was intended specifically to prevent the reserves from being depleated ... but the reserves aren't being used because paybase is showing marketprice and not promised 20 USD

As mentioned in previous updates, you will not need a verification to sell your XPY to bitcoin! But, to help manage a possible rush of sellers, we have limited PayBase sells to $700 a week, which gives us a very effective way of managing our financing in a responsible way - to protect our partners, you guys. We expect to quickly increase this.

Current market price below 14 , including on paybase where it was promised to be 20-
1    Cryptsy   XPY/BTC    $ 1,267,130   $ 13.52    82.63 %    Recently
2    Bittrex   XPY/BTC    $ 176,898   $ 13.82    11.54 %    Recently
3    Coin-Swap   XPY/BTC    $ 59,332   $ 13.91    3.87 %    Recently

No confirmations coming in on people able to withdraw their GAWBTC tokens from their wallets yet...
Remember Mtgox folks ... you do not own any of the money in your paybase account, you only control your funds if you store them yourselves.

[Videlicet]

Don't forget to read their source code:

Code:

int64 GetProofOfStakeReward(int64 nCoinAge, int primeNodeRate)
{

    int64 nSubsidy = 0;
    int64 nRewardCoinYear = 0;  // creation amount per coin-year

    if (primeNodeRate == 0)
        nRewardCoinYear = 5 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 10)
        nRewardCoinYear = 10 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 20)
        nRewardCoinYear = 20 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 100)
        nRewardCoinYear = 100 * CENT;
    else if (primeNodeRate == 350)
        nRewardCoinYear = 350 * CENT;

    nSubsidy = nCoinAge * nRewardCoinYear * 33 / (365 * 33 + 8);

    if (fDebug && GetBoolArg("-printcreation"))
        printf("GetProofOfStakeReward(): primeNodeRate=%d create=%s nCoinAge=%"PRI64d"\n", primeNodeRate, FormatMoney(nSubsidy).c_str(), nCoinAge);
    return nSubsidy;
}

This gives special slots that are only redeemable with private keys that GAW holds. Note the highest POS is 350%

Make sure to Check their Coin Cap:

Code:

static const int64 MAX_MONEY = 2000000000 * COIN;

2 Billion Max Coins - 350% of 12,500,000 is 43,750,000 XPY produced a year from the massive pre-mine and their "Prime Nodes".

The facts are here, but are we willing to see?
Viz.

[sonihr]

I hate scams...