Paycoin (XPY) is scam

[bitgeek]

crypto world has gone down to shit

Not completely, there are still people like you and me who donate our time and warn others for free of scams even when they involve BTC.

He just registered on the forum and what was the first thing he did? He went to the altcoin section to attack the CEO of a particular company and 5 minutes later you're commenting on how much you both have in common. Give me a break...

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[tokeweed]

it is going up?  yes it is scam, don't buy.

[inBitweTrust]

He just registered on the forum and what was the first thing he did? He went to the altcoin section to attack the CEO of a particular company and 5 minutes later you're commenting on how much you both have in common. Give me a break...

Hardly, how much we have in common but just recognizing a good deed wen I see one.

it is going up?  yes it is scam, don't buy.

Bad advice. Value increasing should not be a factor in determining if something is a likely scam or not.

Yes, I know you are probably trolling...but misrepresenting peoples objections can confuse would be investors.

[favelle75]

Ethics? What a maroon. You make me laugh.

Care to elaborate sir, or will an ad hominem and run suffice?

P.S... no need for racial slurs either -https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maroon_%28people%29

I had no control over the feelings my father had for that African refugee on that cold lonely night.

Sure, I'll elaborate. You cry and cry about ethics and that people who profited from $6 Paycoins are unethical. How so? If I believe in Paycoin and STILL have a stake in the game, how does it make me unethical to buy low and sell high?  Are BTC traders unethical then? What about people that play the BTC/LTC ratio? They must be unethical as well, no?

I didn't pump and dump the coin...I didn't tell people to sell it because it sucks, then quickly buy their cheap coins, then tell them its the best so I could sell them back higher. THAT is unethical. I am invested in Paycoin. I took some out which happened to be my original investment plus 2.4x. I STILL have $29K Canadian invested into Paycoin, either in the coin itself or in stakers. So I ask you again, HOW is that unethical if I am STILL invested in it?

Should be interesting.....next thing you know, I'll be called a scam and renamed to Ponzi75.  LOL, this place.

[favelle75]

So what is the timeline when we can no longer call this thing a scam?  A month?  3 months?  5 years?  What is it? Or is this like the perma-bulls for BTC where they keep saying "the moon" is just around the corner as the coin devalues by 80% over 6 months?

[inBitweTrust]

Sure, I'll elaborate. You cry and cry about ethics and that people who profited from $6 Paycoins are unethical. How so? If I believe in Paycoin and STILL have a stake in the game, how does it make me unethical to buy low and sell high?  Are BTC traders unethical then? What about people that play the BTC/LTC ratio? They must be unethical as well, no?

There is nothing wrong with trading, being greedy or making a profit. What I find objectionable is those that do so within likely scams on the backs of victims. Are you trying to suggest that Bitcoin is a ponzi or just suggesting you don't acknowledge any of the warning signs that paycoin is a likely ponzi?

I didn't pump and dump the coin...I didn't tell people to sell it because it sucks, then quickly buy their cheap coins, then tell them its the best so I could sell them back higher. THAT is unethical. I am invested in Paycoin. I took some out which happened to be my original investment plus 2.4x. I STILL have $29K Canadian invested into Paycoin, either in the coin itself or in stakers. So I ask you again, HOW is that unethical if I am STILL invested in it?

If you are completely deluded and don't see any warning signs that this is a likely ponzi than you aren't acting in an unethical manner. GAW has shown unethical business practices, and others are choosing to play the market knowing this is a scam which is immoral.

So what is the timeline when we can no longer call this thing a scam?  A month?  3 months?  5 years?  What is it? Or is this like the perma-bulls for BTC where they keep saying "the moon" is just around the corner as the coin devalues by 80% over 6 months?

This was already answered in the other thread:

Ok, so if this hasn't blown up by February 1st, what then? Is it still a scam?

If it survives till Feb it is less likely a ponzi, but certainly could still be one .... look at how long pbmining lasted before imploding or madolf.

What we can be absolutely sure of now is the sketchy pump and dump practices, lies, and exaggerations coming from that company.

[favelle75]

Sure, I'll elaborate. You cry and cry about ethics and that people who profited from $6 Paycoins are unethical. How so? If I believe in Paycoin and STILL have a stake in the game, how does it make me unethical to buy low and sell high?  Are BTC traders unethical then? What about people that play the BTC/LTC ratio? They must be unethical as well, no?

There is nothing wrong with trading, being greedy or making a profit. What I find objectionable is those that do so within likely scams on the backs of victims. Are you trying to suggest that Bitcoin is a ponzi or just suggesting you don't acknowledge any of the warning signs that paycoin is a likely ponzi?

But that makes NO sense. If we disagree and I think Paycoin is the future, legitimate, awesome, etc etc, and I make money from it, how does that make me unethical? Just because YOU think its a scam or ponzi or whatever, doesn't mean everyone does. And that's fine. We can disagree upon the merits of a particular coin/investment. But that doesn't make me unethical if I am invested in said coin. I WOULD be unethical if I agreed with you about Paycoin yet STILL tried to make $$ at it.

See the difference?

[favelle75]

This was already answered in the other thread:


Quote from: inBitweTrust on December 22, 2014, 10:24:07 PM
Quote from: favelle75 on December 22, 2014, 10:17:04 PM
Ok, so if this hasn't blown up by February 1st, what then? Is it still a scam?

If it survives till Feb it is less likely a ponzi, but certainly could still be one .... look at how long pbmining lasted before imploding or madolf.

What we can be absolutely sure of now is the sketchy pump and dump practices, lies, and exaggerations coming from that company.

Sweet, I'll come back in February to this thread and we can see who was right.

[inBitweTrust]

But that makes NO sense. If we disagree and I think Paycoin is the future, legitimate, awesome, etc etc, and I make money from it, how does that make me unethical? Just because YOU think its a scam or ponzi or whatever, doesn't mean everyone does. And that's fine. We can disagree upon the merits of a particular coin/investment. But that doesn't make me unethical if I am invested in said coin. I WOULD be unethical if I agreed with you about Paycoin yet STILL tried to make $$ at it.

See the difference?

Did I say you were acting in an unethical way? Where are you reading that?

If you are completely deluded and don't see any warning signs that this is a likely ponzi than you aren't acting in an unethical manner.

Where is the ethics involved?  That makes less than zero sense. You aren't trying to scam people to get them to buy in. If you (me) believe in the coin and are invested in it, how is that unethical? You and I might disagree on the legitimacy of the coin...but that doesn't mean I am unethical for trading in it and believing in it. Well, maybe in this forum it does. LOL

If you really believe in this coin and don't see the warning signs than you aren't acting unethically and my comments aren't directed at you.

Sweet, I'll come back in February to this thread and we can see who was right.

You seem to be misreading all of my comments.

You understand that there is no coming back in Feb. to see who is right because the ponzi could still be in operation?

What you can do is refute any of my current assertions of sketchy and unethical behaviors coming from GAW.

[favelle75]

But that makes NO sense. If we disagree and I think Paycoin is the future, legitimate, awesome, etc etc, and I make money from it, how does that make me unethical? Just because YOU think its a scam or ponzi or whatever, doesn't mean everyone does. And that's fine. We can disagree upon the merits of a particular coin/investment. But that doesn't make me unethical if I am invested in said coin. I WOULD be unethical if I agreed with you about Paycoin yet STILL tried to make $$ at it.

See the difference?

Did I say you were acting in an unethical way? Where are you reading that?

Where is the ethics involved?  That makes less than zero sense. You aren't trying to scam people to get them to buy in. If you (me) believe in the coin and are invested in it, how is that unethical? You and I might disagree on the legitimacy of the coin...but that doesn't mean I am unethical for trading in it and believing in it. Well, maybe in this forum it does. LOL

If you really believe in this coin and don't see the warning signs than you aren't acting unethically and my comments aren't directed at you.

Sweet, I'll come back in February to this thread and we can see who was right.

You seem to be misreading all of my comments.

You understand that there is no coming back in Feb. to see who is right because the ponzi could still be in operation?

What you can do is refute any of my current assertions of sketchy and unethical behaviors coming from GAW.

So if the ponzi goes on for 200 years and I am screwing over favelle 2314, does that make me unethical?  At some point we have to call this and say ok, its a either a scam or it isn't.

Conversely, what can you do to refute that this is ACTUALLY a ponzi and ACTUALLY a scam?  I've never launched a crypto, let alone one that tries to bridge the gap between FIAT and digital. I have no idea how hard that is. Seeing a bunch of internet randoms create memes and strawmans doesn't make me believe its a scam. GAW to me has delivered WAY more than what it hasn't delivered. Apple iPhone 3 was delayed 2 months...ZOMG, Apple is a scam! WTF?  I have no doubt that the sh*t they are trying to accomplish is beyond my comprehension and hard as f**k. That doesn't mean its a scam. It means its hard.

[favelle75]

You understand that there is no coming back in Feb. to see who is right because the ponzi could still be in operation?

Well that's a pretty f**king sweet situation for your argument then. You can basically NEVER be wrong.

"2050, Paycoin is adopted worldwide as the internet currency"

inBitweTrust: "Well, it COULD still be a scam you know"

So what, we wait another 50 years?  Awesome.

[tokeweed]

He just registered on the forum and what was the first thing he did? He went to the altcoin section to attack the CEO of a particular company and 5 minutes later you're commenting on how much you both have in common. Give me a break...

Hardly, how much we have in common but just recognizing a good deed wen I see one.

it is going up?  yes it is scam, don't buy.

Bad advice. Value increasing should not be a factor in determining if something is a likely scam or not.

Yes, I know you are probably trolling...but misrepresenting peoples objections can confuse would be investors.

bat it is increasing.  so this is pump and dump.

[inBitweTrust]

Well that's a pretty f**king sweet situation for your argument then. You can basically NEVER be wrong.

"2050, Paycoin is adopted worldwide as the internet currency"

inBitweTrust: "Well, it COULD still be a scam you know"

So what, we wait another 50 years?  Awesome.

Yes, I believe GAW is running on a ponzi scheme. I believe this based upon the evidence and lack thereof. Does this mean I think that paycoin is 100% likely a ponzi? Of course not, that would be an absurd belief.

This really isn't about me or you but about informing others of shady and dangerous business practices.

You seem to need me to set a cutoff date for sake of argument for some reason. Ok, in 4 months if paycoin isn't at or above a 20usd than I will admit that I was overly skeptical and it is less likely to be a ponzi.

Happy?

[favelle75]

Well that's a pretty f**king sweet situation for your argument then. You can basically NEVER be wrong.

"2050, Paycoin is adopted worldwide as the internet currency"

inBitweTrust: "Well, it COULD still be a scam you know"

So what, we wait another 50 years?  Awesome.

Yes, I believe GAW is running on a ponzi scheme. I believe this based upon the evidence and lack thereof. Does this mean I think that paycoin is 100% likely a ponzi? Of course not, that would be an absurd belief.

This really isn't about me or you but about informing others of shady and dangerous business practices.

You seem to need me to set a cutoff date for sake of argument for some reason. Ok, in 4 months if paycoin isn't at or above a 20usd than I will admit that I was overly skeptical and it is less likely to be a ponzi.

Happy?

I'll be happy if you're wrong and I'll be sad/poorer if you are right. But I am glad you finally admitted that a Ponzi can't really go on FOREVER and still be a Ponzi, LOL.

And no, I don't agree about shady business practices.  If you were an actual customer, you'd know that GAW/Josh has basically bent over backwards for his customers. Just because your an outsider looking in, doesn't mean its a scam. 99.99% of the world thinks Bitcoin is a scam. Does that make it true?

[inBitweTrust]

bat it is increasing.  so this is pump and dump.

Correlation does not equal causation. Just because a coin is volatile doesn't mean its a pump and dump. In this case you are likely right though becuase Josh is hyping this coin with all the tools of trade, exaggerated promised, last minute features and promos, all forms of marketing, affiliate promotion and spam.

[inBitweTrust]

I'll be happy if you're wrong and I'll be sad/poorer if you are right.

I hope I am wrong in this case because the amount of damage this will do to the victims and cryptocurrency ecosystem in general will equal another MtGox disaster. What I hope for and where the evidence points disagrees unfortunately.

And no, I don't agree about shady business practices.  If you were an actual customer, you'd know that GAW/Josh has basically bent over backwards for his customers. Just because your an outsider looking in, doesn't mean its a scam. 99.99% of the world thinks Bitcoin is a scam. Does that make it true?

Bitcoin is unlikely to be a scam but there certainly are elements to bitcoin that are completely scammy. I believe most cloud mining to be fractional reserve mining or outright ponzi's. This is something that the Bitcoin community is going to have to address and something I have been very vocal about.

I am not going to try and convince you personally of GAW's misbehavior because you seem impervious to any GAW negativity.

[tokeweed]

bat it is increasing.  so this is pump and dump.

Correlation does not equal causation. Just because a coin is volatile doesn't mean its a pump and dump. In this case you are likely right though becuase Josh is hyping this coin with all the tools of trade, exaggerated promised, last minute features and promos, all forms of marketing, affiliate promotion and spam.

yes if more people lose money here, those people will also point to other rising coins as scam. and we all become confused.

[inBitweTrust]

more delays as predicted....

https://hashtalk.org/topic/25441/paybase-launch-rescheduled
https://archive.today/W3OTH

So on the 29th how will they be able cover the spread? Will they get lucky and convince enough stakers to freeze their coins in hashstakers where the coins cannot be sold? Will they impose limits on the amount of XPY sold without KYC and eat through their remaining reserves? Will the hype machine alone be able to convince many new victims into raising the floor themselves? Or will other technical or regulatory concerns arise at the last moment?

[inBitweTrust]

Did Bob dump? 

"Bob" has been dumping this whole time after a quick market push. The market is capitulating now with the bad news... but don't worry ... there will be at least one more pump and dump so he can squeeze more out of those "savvy day traders" and victims that buy into his scheme.

[suchmoon]

If you were an actual customer, you'd know that GAW/Josh has basically bent over backwards for his customers.

When you get a chance ask Josh (respectfully of course) about the "Founder's club" promises of free hosting and other perks.