Bitcoin Forum
December 08, 2016, 06:09:45 AM *
News: To be able to use the next phase of the beta forum software, please ensure that your email address is correct/functional.
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 [4] 5 »  All
  Print  
Author Topic: How does ancap deal with an oil spill?  (Read 4908 times)
CoinDiver
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 779


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 03:50:03 PM
 #61

Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.

Fucking Statist. Your condescending replies are indicative of your pretense of knowledge.

http://mises.org/daily/3229
BTC:1PEyEKyVZgUvV4moXvCD5rQN21QETGPpLc
1481177385
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1481177385

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1481177385
Reply with quote  #2

1481177385
Report to moderator
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 03:53:59 PM
 #62

Isn't the answer to this obvious? The government!
Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.
Character assassination? I would expect nothing less!

Here's some information I was able to find within a few minutes (do note that I have not actively researched this area):
http://rense.com/general72/oinvent.htm
http://www.broandrew.com/suppression.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dfj1O45qZ5U

Please tell me about Frederick Seitz, the tobacco companies, and the oil companies, if you wish to get some insights into how certain organizations operate and who the real instigators might be.
Explodicle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 947


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 04:12:19 PM
 #63

Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.

[idiot]
It's a good thing there isn't a big militaristic government out there that
  • invades country after country to control the oil supply,
  • forces everyone to exchange oil using their currency, and
  • protects oil-using polluters from retaliation
... All at taxpayer expense, and by "taxpayer" I mean everyone who trades using their currency, which is quite a few because every country needs at least some oil.
[/idiot]
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 04:21:22 PM
 #64

Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.

[idiot]
It's a good thing there isn't a big militaristic government out there that
  • invades country after country to control the oil supply,
  • forces everyone to exchange oil using their currency, and
  • protects oil-using polluters from retaliation
... All at taxpayer expense, and by "taxpayer" I mean everyone who trades using their currency, which is quite a few because every country needs at least some oil.
[/idiot]

I personally don't wish to trade one set of idiots (American War Machine) for another (Libertarians).

I personally want intelligence and knowledge coupled with long term thinking.

I get neither with the former, and neither with the latter.
Explodicle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 947


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 04:55:47 PM
 #65

Really? You're an idiot. The government is giving money to Tesla Motors and others. Sorry, you libertarian clown (and I mean that collectively), as usual, your one line retorts are neither indicative of thought, knowledge or research, but as usual, knee jerk reactions.

[idiot]
It's a good thing there isn't a big militaristic government out there that
  • invades country after country to control the oil supply,
  • forces everyone to exchange oil using their currency, and
  • protects oil-using polluters from retaliation
... All at taxpayer expense, and by "taxpayer" I mean everyone who trades using their currency, which is quite a few because every country needs at least some oil.
[/idiot]

I personally don't wish to trade one set of idiots (American War Machine) for another (Libertarians).

I personally want intelligence and knowledge coupled with long term thinking.

I get neither with the former, and neither with the latter.

Oh ok I thought you were saying the current system prevented more oil spills than AnCap would, my mistake.
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 05:04:34 PM
 #66

Oh ok I thought you were saying the current system prevented more oil spills than AnCap would, my mistake.

I think your mistake is putting the cart before the horse. Why don't you take a year off from slapping your favorite pet political ideology on everything you see, and just educate yourself? When you come back from your sabbatical, with a fresh and newly primed mind filled with more knowledge than it currently stores, you can reevaluate the notion of your political beliefs.

What could it hurt? Stop insisting your political ideology is golden, and instead, just study the depth of the world's problems. Who knows what you'll discover?
finkleshnorts
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 336



View Profile
July 20, 2012, 05:32:26 PM
 #67

Remember when DOW had that plant explode in India? Lots of outrage, but no reparations were made.
myrkul
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 532


FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM


View Profile WWW
July 20, 2012, 08:08:32 PM
 #68

It's a waste of time arguing with statist trolls. I'm just gonna ignore them from now on.

FirstAscent is the only one I haven't bludgeoned to death with sense and logic... Primarily because he's yet to nail down his position. He just whines about ours.

BTC1MYRkuLv4XPBa6bGnYAronz55grPAGcxja
Need Dispute resolution? Public Key ID: 0x11D341CF
No person has the right to initiate force, threat of force, or fraud against another person or their property. VIM VI REPELLERE LICET
Explodicle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 947


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 08:50:38 PM
 #69

Oh ok I thought you were saying the current system prevented more oil spills than AnCap would, my mistake.

I think your mistake is putting the cart before the horse. Why don't you take a year off from slapping your favorite pet political ideology on everything you see, and just educate yourself? When you come back from your sabbatical, with a fresh and newly primed mind filled with more knowledge than it currently stores, you can reevaluate the notion of your political beliefs.

I already DID take time to reevaluate my beliefs and it led me from socialism to here. What makes you think I won't make the same mistakes again? Uneducated empty-minded idealogues like myself reach the wrong conclusions on their own, so I need environmental/political/philosophical experts like you to set me straight.

If this activity is below you, my ignore button is to the left of the page.

What could it hurt?
If you're right, then it wouldn't hurt anyone.
If I'm right, then a better world will come an hour later and someone will die because of my failure to act.
CoinDiver
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 779


View Profile
July 20, 2012, 08:51:54 PM
 #70

...mind filled with more knowledge than it currently stores, you can reevaluate the notion of your political beliefs.

What could it hurt? Stop insisting your political ideology is golden, and instead, just study the depth of the world's problems. Who knows what you'll discover?

You look like a complete idiot arguing "knowledge" and "beliefs" with an ancap. You pretend you can know enough to predict outcomes. It's mighty pompous of you. You want someone to spend a year, when you wont take 10 minutes to read the most profound speech on economics ever given. Yeah, good luck with that.

http://mises.org/daily/3229
BTC:1PEyEKyVZgUvV4moXvCD5rQN21QETGPpLc
Stardust
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 190


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 07:06:01 AM
 #71

The work in particular that I was referencing was a short pamphlet called Agrarian Justice (1797), which supported property taxes funding a universal basic income.

The work is based on the contention that in the state of nature, "the earth, in its natural uncultivated state... was the common property of the human race"; the concept of private ownership arose as a necessary result of the development of agriculture, since it was impossible to distinguish the possession of improvements to the land from the possession of the land itself. Thus Paine views private property as necessary, but that the basic needs of all humanity must be provided for by those with property, who have originally taken it from the general public. This in some sense is their "payment" to non-property holders for the right to hold private property.

You can probably find a free e-book of it (and his more popular works) but I really like this hardcover collection: http://www.amazon.com/Thomas-Paine-Collected-Writings-Pamphlets/dp/1883011035/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1342679094&sr=8-4&keywords=thomas+paine

Thanks, I'm going to read it. Though it's disappointing that he proposes property taxes. Perhaps a better solution would be to consider only man made things property, like houses, cars, factories, etc. The rest should be available to everyone. I think American Indians thought like this.
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 07:12:58 AM
 #72

...mind filled with more knowledge than it currently stores, you can reevaluate the notion of your political beliefs.

What could it hurt? Stop insisting your political ideology is golden, and instead, just study the depth of the world's problems. Who knows what you'll discover?

You look like a complete idiot arguing "knowledge" and "beliefs" with an ancap. You pretend you can know enough to predict outcomes. It's mighty pompous of you. You want someone to spend a year, when you wont take 10 minutes to read the most profound speech on economics ever given. Yeah, good luck with that.

It's mighty pompous of me to suggest that knowledge is better than ignorance? It's mighty pompous of me to think that a ten minute read of a document isn't enough to address so many of the complex issues involving resource depletion, exploitation and collateral destruction that we see in the world today? Okay.
CoinDiver
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 779


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 02:49:26 PM
 #73

It's mighty pompous of me to suggest that knowledge is better than ignorance? It's mighty pompous of me to think that a ten minute read of a document isn't enough to address so many of the complex issues involving resource depletion, exploitation and collateral destruction that we see in the world today? Okay.

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman

Your arrogance is astounding.

Regardless, I understand where you are coming from. I too once believed there was an answer to the ultimate question of life, the universe, and everything. Some day you may realize Government causes more trouble than it will ever solve. When you do, you will stop trying to figure out how one can enforce prosperity.

http://mises.org/daily/3229
BTC:1PEyEKyVZgUvV4moXvCD5rQN21QETGPpLc
nevafuse
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 248


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 03:41:17 PM
 #74

What happens? Who pays to clean up? Who pays reparations to all of the people affected (e.g. fishermen who just lost their jobs)? Would their be any concern for all of the life destroyed?

Why wouldn't it be in the oil company's best interest to cap the well?  If I'm losing money every day because of it, I'm going to repair it ASAP so I can continue making money off of it.  Even if my company is too broke, I'd sell it to another company for a price that would make it worth salvaging.  An oil spill is also bad press.  I don't want people to stop using my product because I've ruined their beaches.  There are a lot of incentives for the company to fix it as soon as possible.

Assuming the explosion makes it unsalvageable and I don't care about my reputation because my company is broke or I'm in a remote area, then there is a higher likelihood the problem would not be fixed.  But the citizens of the beaches that are affected could come together and donate money to an operation to try & cap the well or filter the water coming into the beach.  Or companies could buy the beaches, filter the water, and charge a fee to use it.  I believe natural oil spills occur as well where there is no one to blame & the same problems would arise.

The only reason to limit the block size is to subsidize non-Bitcoin currencies
Explodicle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 947


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 03:50:31 PM
 #75

(This post assumes you haven't clicked my ignore button, and thus agree to actually address what I'm saying instead of condescendingly suggesting another year of study.)

So back on topic... first you say the status quo doesn't stop me from driving electric cars. I gave you the benefit of the doubt and explained why it does. Then you say oh I don't support the status quo,
I personally want intelligence and knowledge coupled with long term thinking.

So how? How do you suggest we ensure that the most informed people are in a position to set policy? You don't support the status quo, you don't support AnCap, so I really want to hear your idea.
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 04:00:39 PM
 #76

Regardless, I understand where you are coming from. I too once believed there was an answer to the ultimate question of life, the universe, and everything. Some day you may realize Government causes more trouble than it will ever solve. When you do, you will stop trying to figure out how one can enforce prosperity.

It's actually you claiming ten minutes spent reading a document provides all the answers.
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 04:03:13 PM
 #77

So how? How do you suggest we ensure that the most informed people are in a position to set policy? You don't support the status quo, you don't support AnCap, so I really want to hear your idea.

Let's start by having you (and anyone you know) getting informed. How does that sound? Is that too much? Obviously it doesn't go against what I have been saying. Tell me when you're ready, and I'll recommend sources for you to gain knowledge of things you don't know. From there, you can make further decisions on your position regarding AnCap.
Explodicle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 947


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 04:27:19 PM
 #78

So how? How do you suggest we ensure that the most informed people are in a position to set policy? You don't support the status quo, you don't support AnCap, so I really want to hear your idea.

Let's start by having you (and anyone you know) getting informed. How does that sound? Is that too much? Obviously it doesn't go against what I have been saying. Tell me when you're ready, and I'll recommend sources for you to gain knowledge of things you don't know. From there, you can make further decisions on your position regarding AnCap.

Ok, then I'm ready. Post a source to this thread that explains your answer to the question I just asked. I will expect you to actually defend the position taken by this source.

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." - Einstein
FirstAscent
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 812


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 04:35:29 PM
 #79

So how? How do you suggest we ensure that the most informed people are in a position to set policy? You don't support the status quo, you don't support AnCap, so I really want to hear your idea.

Let's start by having you (and anyone you know) getting informed. How does that sound? Is that too much? Obviously it doesn't go against what I have been saying. Tell me when you're ready, and I'll recommend sources for you to gain knowledge of things you don't know. From there, you can make further decisions on your position regarding AnCap.

Ok, then I'm ready. Post a source to this thread that explains your answer to the question I just asked. I will expect you to actually defend the position taken by this source.

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." - Einstein

I didn't provide an answer to your question. I suggested that you (that means you - not someone else) should gain more knowledge before promoting AnCap. However, the material which I might suggest you read does offer suggestions regarding your question, but more to the point, it will increase your knowledge to the point that it would probably cause you to seriously challenge your ideals.
Explodicle
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 947


View Profile
July 26, 2012, 04:49:20 PM
 #80

So how? How do you suggest we ensure that the most informed people are in a position to set policy? You don't support the status quo, you don't support AnCap, so I really want to hear your idea.

Let's start by having you (and anyone you know) getting informed. How does that sound? Is that too much? Obviously it doesn't go against what I have been saying. Tell me when you're ready, and I'll recommend sources for you to gain knowledge of things you don't know. From there, you can make further decisions on your position regarding AnCap.

Ok, then I'm ready. Post a source to this thread that explains your answer to the question I just asked. I will expect you to actually defend the position taken by this source.

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough." - Einstein

I didn't provide an answer to your question. I suggested that you (that means you - not someone else) should gain more knowledge before promoting AnCap.
No shit.

Quote
However, the material which I might suggest you read does offer suggestions regarding your question, but more to the point, it will increase your knowledge to the point that it would probably cause you to seriously challenge your ideals.
Awesome. Post whichever source best answers my question.
Pages: « 1 2 3 [4] 5 »  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!