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Question: Bitcoin fork proposal by respected Bitcoin lead dev Gavin Andresen, to increase the block size from 1MB to 20MB.
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Author Topic: Bitcoin 20MB Fork  (Read 154258 times)
davout
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February 06, 2015, 12:08:14 PM
 #661

Should read it entirely and not take offense personally, be more mature.

So not wanting to wade through a bog of cheap shot point scoring scrawl to extract the real content is immature?

Mmmmmmmm.....  Cheesy
 

Well, you're kinda reading bitcointalk, which is trolls and derpage all the way down, so...

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Buffer Overflow
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February 06, 2015, 01:43:57 PM
 #662

Should read it entirely and not take offense personally, be more mature.

So not wanting to wade through a bog of cheap shot point scoring scrawl to extract the real content is immature?

Mmmmmmmm.....  Cheesy
 

Well, you're kinda reading bitcointalk, which is trolls and derpage all the way down, so...

Well there's a time and a place but yeah good point. Can't argue with that. Cheesy

RoadStress
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February 06, 2015, 02:29:55 PM
 #663

Initial examples of sidechains will probably be out in a few months.  Long before the 1MB becomes a problem (if it ever really would.)  A properly implemented two-way-peg makes a sidecoin an excellent proxy for a bitcoin and offers a true potential to both scale and to keep Bitcoin lite and defensible.
...
As it is, all you bloatchain guys are doing is herding a bunch of drooling sheep with simplistic fundamentalism, faith-based decentralization, nebulous claims about scaling, scare tactics and such-like.  That's how I see it.

So you support having a properly implemented two-way-peg, but you don't support the research and development of a proper pruning method? Where is the logic behind that? Do you really think that the developers are incapable of finding a solution to the bloatchain problem before it actually becomes a problemHuh

Why do I always get the impression that the anti-fork people wear horse glasses? Why do they think that all the potential issues that might arise will not find a solution in a decent amount of time? You forget that this is the first developing consensus network and that changes need to happen and challenges must be faced. This will make the network grow and learn from mistakes in the same time. By closing ourselves in an bubble we also deny our evolution.

If the minority end up using the 1MB chain, it will become just another altcoin. To my knowledge Gavin doesn't actively engage in destroying altcoins that I'm aware of, unless others know different.
Of course if the minority choose the 20MB, that will become the altcoin.

Sure, but the good part is that if the 20MB fork becomes better then you will still have coins on the new hip-chain and everyone that will switch from the 1MB to the 20MB chain will be an early adopter. So it's a win win for everyone  Wink

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bambou
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February 06, 2015, 02:31:45 PM
 #664


before it actually becomes a problemHuh


this is FUD.

you no better than her:




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RoadStress
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February 06, 2015, 02:34:57 PM
 #665


before it actually becomes a problemHuh


this is FUD.

you no better than her:


And this is useless post.

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sardokan
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February 06, 2015, 02:35:48 PM
 #666


before it actually becomes a problemHuh


this is FUD.

you no better than her:





The her is a him
mayax
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February 06, 2015, 03:38:00 PM
 #667

Will you be supporting any efforts to kill off the 1mb chain after the fork?

If the minority end up using the 1MB chain, it will become just another altcoin. To my knowledge Gavin doesn't actively engage in destroying altcoins that I'm aware of, unless others know different.
Of course if the minority choose the 20MB, that will become the altcoin.

I would do that if I were a developer like this "Gavin". I would create Bitcoin 2.  what can be wrong in that? BTC should be like any other "currency". right? BTC 2 = other "virtual currency". it's like you will use USD and EURO Smiley
RoadStress
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February 06, 2015, 03:42:22 PM
 #668

Gerald Davis is wrong. Here's why:

http://trilema.com/2015/gerald-davis-is-wrong-heres-why/

To fork or not to fork? That's not even the question.. Grin

MP is a sensationalist and he likes drama and attention. In my view in business and in ecosystems there are no people, there are only ideas. Starting his article mentioning the person behind the idea is simply bad intended from the start. Right after that he starts praising MPEx which again has absolutely nothing related to the main idea and to the main subject of a bigger block size.

After filling half of the article with useless nonsense about MPEx he reverts to a journalistic move in order to divert the attention from the subject which is to reveal something sensational and he chose to reveal that regular users will need 914TB of storage in order to pay for their coffee. I have already answered to this stupid and non-existing issue. We will develop a way of not needing that amount of storage for regular coffee buyers.

Afterwards he starts pushing his view of the blockchain. For a decentralized thing people trying to limit things their way isn't so good. Gavin is only trying to not limit things and to have large open doors for everyone. Keeping a 1MB block limit is a bad intended and limiting move.

In the end of the shit article MP closes with:
Quote
If Bitcoin can't pay for its own security, it is best to find this out sooner rather than later.

Bitcoin security will be insured by the services running on top of it and allowing services to run on top of Bitcoin by increasing the block size limit will definitely insure security no matter what.

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mayax
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February 06, 2015, 03:44:01 PM
 #669

Gerald Davis is wrong. Here's why:

http://trilema.com/2015/gerald-davis-is-wrong-heres-why/

To fork or not to fork? That's not even the question.. Grin

MP is a sensationalist and he likes drama and attention. In my view in business and in ecosystems there are no people, there are only ideas. Starting his article mentioning the person behind the idea is simply bad intended from the start. Right after that he starts praising MPEx which again has absolutely nothing related to the main idea and to the main subject of a bigger block size.

After filling half of the article with useless nonsense about MPEx he reverts to a journalistic move in order to divert the attention from the subject which is to reveal something sensational and he chose to reveal that regular users will need 914TB of storage in order to pay for their coffee. I have already answered to this stupid and non-existing issue. We will develop a way of not needing that amount of storage for regular coffee buyers.

Afterwards he starts pushing his view of the blockchain. For a decentralized thing people trying to limit things their way isn't so good. Gavin is only trying to not limit things and to have large open doors for everyone. Keeping a 1MB block limit is a bad intended and limiting move.

In the end of the shit article MP closes with:
Quote
If Bitcoin can't pay for its own security, it is best to find this out sooner rather than later.

Bitcoin security will be insured by the services running on top of it and allowing services to run on top of Bitcoin by increasing the block size limit will definitely insure security no matter what.

there are MANY other ALTCOINS who are not limited as BTC. why don't  you use them ?
bambou
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February 06, 2015, 03:46:48 PM
 #670

Gerald Davis is wrong. Here's why:

http://trilema.com/2015/gerald-davis-is-wrong-heres-why/

To fork or not to fork? That's not even the question.. Grin

MP is a sensationalist and he likes drama and attention. In my view in business and in ecosystems there are no people, there are only ideas. Starting his article mentioning the person behind the idea is simply bad intended from the start. Right after that he starts praising MPEx which again has absolutely nothing related to the main idea and to the main subject of a bigger block size.

After filling half of the article with useless nonsense about MPEx he reverts to a journalistic move in order to divert the attention from the subject which is to reveal something sensational and he chose to reveal that regular users will need 914TB of storage in order to pay for their coffee. I have already answered to this stupid and non-existing issue. We will develop a way of not needing that amount of storage for regular coffee buyers.

Afterwards he starts pushing his view of the blockchain. For a decentralized thing people trying to limit things their way isn't so good. Gavin is only trying to not limit things and to have large open doors for everyone. Keeping a 1MB block limit is a bad intended and limiting move.

In the end of the shit article MP closes with:
Quote
If Bitcoin can't pay for its own security, it is best to find this out sooner rather than later.

Bitcoin security will be insured by the services running on top of it and allowing services to run on top of Bitcoin by increasing the block size limit will definitely insure security no matter what.

there are MANY other ALTCOINS who are not limited as BTC. why don't  you use them ?

+1 go away

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davout
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February 06, 2015, 03:51:58 PM
 #671

In my view in business and in ecosystems there are no people, there are only ideas.

That's exactly what imaginary worlds are, only ideas.


We will develop a way of not needing that amount of storage for regular coffee buyers.

"Let's increase the size of blocks now and create problems, for which we may or may not find a solution, later. But that's ok, later is not now, right?"

DooMAD
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February 06, 2015, 04:05:15 PM
 #672

We will develop a way of not needing that amount of storage for regular coffee buyers.

"Let's increase the size of blocks now and create problems, for which we may or may not find a solution, later.

As opposed to "Let's never address future problems and almost guarantee that the network won't be able to cope with the number of transactions later by crippling it with an arbitrary limit. But that's ok, later is not now, right?"  

Fork sounds good compared to falling behind on purpose.

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February 06, 2015, 04:09:46 PM
 #673

Cheesy

I think he is loling at you not with you.

Yeah I know that.
I did consider pushing the "time and place" for my defense angle, but thought better to just admit defeat on that one as I can think of a few scenarios I could of been dug into a hole.

Win some, you lose some.
*shrug*


gustav
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February 06, 2015, 04:14:54 PM
 #674

Did you still not managed to blow it up?

Why does this take so long?
RoadStress
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February 06, 2015, 04:19:18 PM
 #675

In my view in business and in ecosystems there are no people, there are only ideas.

That's exactly what imaginary worlds are, only ideas.

Sure, but the history of D&T is not needed when discussing this subject. MP's intro is useless and is only there in order to add to the wow factor. His only argument against the fork is the big storage space needed which is not an issue. I was expecting more from MP and I consider that this particular post is bad PR for him.

We will develop a way of not needing that amount of storage for regular coffee buyers.

"Let's increase the size of blocks now and create problems, for which we may or may not find a solution, later. But that's ok, later is not now, right?"

Not finding a solution is out of the question. Period.

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altcoin hitler
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February 06, 2015, 04:20:57 PM
 #676


King of the real Bitcoin Foundation https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=934517.0
davout
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February 06, 2015, 04:27:18 PM
 #677

Not finding a solution is out of the question. Period.

Just don't create more problems.

bambou
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February 06, 2015, 04:52:23 PM
 #678

Not finding a solution is out of the question. Period.

Just don't create more problems.



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February 06, 2015, 04:56:01 PM
 #679

Not finding a solution is out of the question. Period.

Just don't create more problems.

while ignoring the current problems? Nice.


Lucky the world didnt follow your advice otherwise we would still transport goods with camel.
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February 06, 2015, 05:11:18 PM
 #680

You are running in circles. There won't be consensus with this community of greedy and selfish basdards everywhere.

Gavin should just release his Gavincoin on the open market as new chain and everyone is happy. (it's going to die within months and rest with the other shitcoins)

What's that cult you have there about that btc-chain?
Blockchains aren't scarce. It's totally overpriced. People are so stupid to buy these expensive coins and make such a upheaval about it.

Just release altcoins and hype them! It's the same. There is no significant difference between Bitcoin and all the other shitcoins. NONE. Never will be.

Sidechains?
Will be in altcoins immediately too.

Hashrate?
Merge mining gives you all the hash you want

Gavincoin bloat?
Nobody wants it so it won't occure in altcoins - if it turns out to not kill BTC a better version of it will occure in an altcoin

so what the fuck are you all about this bitcoin-chain like a tribe of apes?

The only problem here is: Gavin can't handle high marketcap. He needs to have a very low marketcap because he's got no clue about his investors.
Give that guy some shitcoin to play with. Bitcoin is likely too expensive with this management. They can't handle it and don't know how to treat investors.
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