Bitcoin Forum

Edit of 04 Jun @ 1GMT:

Well...

30 days passed since Betcoin.TM was online:

Last Active:    May 02, 2016, 05:42:54 AM

In meantime they scammed few more people:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1496542.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg15063773#msg15063773
And so on on post in their topic.

I will not waste more of my time watching this topic. So I'm locking it. If somebody wants to add anything - PM me and I will unlock it of course.
Meanwhile I believe they deserve a lot more red trust from DT.



Edit of 21 Apr @10:35GMT:

Bitcoin.TM stated they are not for "few BTC", but current issues with them (at least I know only for those):

Owe @Me 8.35BTC
-> This topic

Owe @cwil (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=107656) 11BTC for >18 days
-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1437638.msg14600949#msg14600949

Owe camelson (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=377298) ?? cashback for over a month
-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg14550413#msg14550413

Owe OrangeSeller (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=450617) ?? cashback for over a month
-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1358728.msg14491697#msg14491697




Short:

Update on 20 Apr @22 GMT: They owe me 10.5+BTC. 11.25BTC - 2.9BTC initial deposit back = 8.35BTC

I have pending withdraws for a 10.5 for 9+ days now.  My account have 11.25+BTC

Screenshot of the account (https://i.imgur.com/Oan73Q9.png)

Before opening this scam accusation, I was contacting live chat on a daily basis. What happens? Every day the answer was similar to "i'm contacting them right now" /admins/, they will contact you in 24 hours. Of course nobody ever contacted me. Even Betcoin.TM (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=142573) user was online twice since then (on 6th and yesterday).



Long:

02 Apr: As I wanted to have some weekend fun, I contacted BetCoin.TM chat representative for their 5% bonus with 3-5x rollover. Everyone is getting a popup about it when visiting site to start chat and request it.

They offered me a bonus of 201% on a livechat session /actually to choose between 101%, 201%, 301% and 5% with just 5x rollover, I choose 201%/.
Also gave me a list of approved games for clearing the bonus:

This promotion is ONLY AVAILABLE FOR SOME GAMES! Make sure you use your
bonus only on these games:
a. Circle
b. Reels
c. Hilo
d. Dice
...

02 Apr: I made a deposit ot 2.9BTC and got 3BTC bonus. I asked them why it's capped to 3BTC and they don't told me before my deposit. But as I just want a weekend fun and not to rip them with bonuses, I accept it as 3BTC and didn't insist to be ~6BTC bonus.
Later on that day they apologized and gave me 0.1 Jadecoin as compensation without I asking for it.

02-06 Apr: Having fun, running good, chancing multiplies from 1.2x - 5x and bet size drastically - final result: unlocking the bonus with a total of ~0.22BTC in my account.

I made all of my bets on a. Circle and d. Dice. All with small bets, I don't have a single bet over 0.25BTC (0.01% of all bets), and >90% of bets are under 0.05BTC. So it's not like using the bonus to hit big with first few bets and then just make the turnover.

Unlocking the bonus 1 (https://i.imgur.com/MP1DH1z.png)

Unlocking the bonus 2 (https://i.imgur.com/nUDF2nI.png)


06 Apr: Made a withdraw and start waiting 24 hours review.

07 Apr: Start asking what happens? Usually the answer was similar to "Please be more patient dear because I regularly do a followup with admin"
08 Apr: Asking what happens? "i'm contacting our admin now regarding about your withdrawals"
09 Apr: Same, admin/supervisor will contact you
10 Apr: Same, told them if they didn't procced it in 48 hours I will open scam accusation
11 Apr: Same, admin/supervisor will contact you
12 Apr: Same, admin/supervisor will contact you
13 Apr: Same, admin/supervisor will contact you within 24 hours.


After I insist for admin mail or whatever for XX time, they wrote me:

Zoey (11:15:21): Your request is being processed now, there is just a long queue on the system for withdrawals but it will eventually go through . please give it a few more time to process, thanks and sorry for the inconvenience.
Na (11:17:31): I'm getting this exact answer for 4-5 day straight. This is unacceptable. Does your admins have an email, skype or other way to communicate with them or I should start filling my scam accusation in bitcointalk and Chinese forums?
Zoey (11:18:41): i'm contacting them right now.
Na (11:19:24): This is not working out for me. I got "i'm contacting them right now." for 4-5 days and it's not working. Without an answer, without a withdraw.
Na (11:19:36): As I said:
Na (11:19:42): Does your admins have an email, skype or other way to communicate with them or I should start filling my scam accusation in bitcointalk and Chinese forums?
Na (11:20:04): Because I said what I will do before more than 48 hours and after waited for few days.
Na (11:33:41): ?
Na (11:44:28): Now and you are not answering...
Zoey (11:45:16): im working on it my dear.
Zoey (11:47:26): i'm sorry for the inconvenience, at the moment i'm also assisting other client aside you. please bear with me.
Na (11:47:33): ok
Zoey (11:49:45): our team noticed some preliminary betting abnormalities in the first passthrough and now your account is being escalated to our specialist.


So what the fuck "preliminary betting abnormalities" mean on provably fair games from their site?! For me this is just an excuse to delay/refuse payment. Betcoin.TM site is even chancing client seed every bet automatically...

My guess is they are referring to my chancing bet size and multiplier and some point and hitting 5x from first one or two bets sometimes. But it's just pure luck. Many I didn't hit it.

And for matter of integrity and curiosity, yesterday I deposited on new account on PrimeDice and tried the same: result is in screenshots below: I made 20% for 300 bets, hitting on multiple occasion 5x multiplier on first one or two bets but on even more didn't hit it in 6-10 bets. Just luck. Or I "cracked" Primedice too!? :)

Primedice:

Hitting on 1st bet 5x with bigger bet size (https://i.imgur.com/DVEBuOB.png)

Well... it cannot happens every time (https://i.imgur.com/GgAehGl.png)

And continues to be hard to hit (https://i.imgur.com/yvOlHVe.png)

But.. sometimes it's just like a miracle. Nope, pure luck.  (https://i.imgur.com/gswpOk9.png)

Primedice account overview (https://i.imgur.com/AdJXNeF.png)


I have a list of all of my bets (literally thousand of bets, with amount, time-stamp, result, betid), chat transcripts, screenshots and even video how I'm unlocking the bonus. I just don't know is it appropriate to publish them now. But I could be uploaded upon request or if Betcoin.TM tells that written above is not accurate. And as I stated above, All with small bets, I don't have a single bet over 0.25BTC (0.01% of all bets), and >90% of bets are under 0.05BTC. So it's not like using the bonus to hit big with first few bets and then just make the turnover.

14 Apr: Of course nobody contacted me ever
15 Apr: Same, still nobody contacted me ever, so we've finished here - finally open this scam accusation.


In period 06-12 Apr I continued playing in their site, because I like their site and their dice fancy rolling, even I made almost 2BTC after I unlocked the bonus. As my point was to gamble and have fun.

In general I'm highly disappointed. Instead of using me as advertisement for a big winner, they are wasting my time day after day, holding my coins and forcing me to open this scam accusation.

But Donator or not, Betcoin.TM (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=142573) deserves to be red trusted till this get resolved!

Also I would appreciate if somebody with Mandarin could translate it or just write 1-2 sentences to post it in Chinese forums where they are advertising themselves. People should be aware.

Thank you.







Update on 20 Apr @22 GMT




Finally somebody to stand up for Betcon.TM.

I also liked them a lot with their fancy dice rolling... till thay scammed me with 11.25BTC -2.9 returned...

BUT. I'm not multi accouter and they don't have/cannot submit ANY prof of this. Just because I used only maruni as account with them.

And what about cwil, who never used a bonus, just won 11BTC on slots and still waiting for payment over 16 days?? Is he another hacker of their provably fair games??

--> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1437638.msg14600949#msg14600949

Also few other players complained that they are waiting for cashback promo over a month now.






I will update and OP:

You've said there will be a ONE day / 24 hours / review if I've get lucky to clear the bonus. Then you publicly said you are doing TWO WEEKS review. This mean every player could stuck for weeks with you. So guys, use your head wisely.

--> Pastebin of chat for 24 hours review and that I'm eligible for bonus (http://pastebin.com/LMsyw6xY)

"Angel (22:53:23): I see here that you are still eligible to have our 201% and 101% match deposit bonuses"




Yes, it was finally proceeded. I don't need to authorize it. Transaction is made to my public address from my profile...
Got at least 2.9BTC back. OP updated.




And what about the 2BTC I won, betting with my OWN funds - e.g. after clearing the bonus?? If I had lose, everything would be fine for you, right?






Please, as I was the initiator of this public scam accusation:

Please, explain in public how I violated the terms of service and as you are accusing me of multi accounting.
Do you have ANY proofs? No because this is just and excuse for not paying me. And you could do it with any player... So in my eyes you are still scammers.


--> Pastebin and of all my bets (http://pastebin.com/gpECLK0K). As you can see they are all made by their rules in previous pastebin about bonus, and they cannot submit any proof about their multi account accusation, because I've never used another account beside maruni with them.
Bets until jadecoin are for bonus, then I won another 2BTC with OWN funds, as every satoshi then is not a BONUS funds. I've I got lost, they would be happy as hell.

Edit:  2nd Pastebin for bets (http://pastebin.com/XLZAnzBm), as 1st one exceeded the free limit of 512KB/past

Granted they have paid out nearly everyone who had a complaint thread made in either gambling or Scam accusation board, they have a very shitty withdrawal system and weird "abnormal bets detecting system". I personally don't think you should play in their site, even though 10 days is a common waiting time for checking if everything is running normally for the mentioned amount to prevent another hufflepuff like situation.

Hope you get your BTCs

Sorry to hear this happened tbh I play on betterbets.io withdrew 12 btc instant and similar on primedice. Time to stick with sites that don't stop withdraw under 20 btc. Hope you get the btc though.

See my post referencing similar behavior https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg14250925#msg14250925 (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg14250925#msg14250925).  I've been owed about 11 btc for over a month. 

betcoin.tm is not really answering any tickets so im not suprised :(

You should talk to BetcoinTM Man. They never fail me on my withdrawals.
unless they have to review your game history.  

Thank you all. I'm playing there because I love their fancy dice rolling. The trill to not know the number to last dice rolling. But I will seriously reconsider will I play there anymore. Because their behavior it's not normal... And I will move to sites with insta withdraws.


Did read what I wrote?? I was contacting them day after day with no result... Just my patience is over now.

Try to PM this to Default Trust member if you want to give red feedback on betcoin tm account !

Actually Stunna earlier have give him netral trust so there are some warning about it
check this out https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=142573 and Lutpin afterward

So next time , you should check everyone's trust first before you try to deposit huge amount !

I had a good experience till now and they paid me few withdraw in the past without any problems and with short delays.
This is the reason why I was so patience with them, just asking what happens every day, day after day on their Live Chat.

But past behavior doesn't include future scams. Now they were telling me everyday that they forwarded my case to supervisor/admins, that they will contact me and so on... nobody contacted me, 9 days pending... I feel screwed and ignored. Also they are hurting my coin liquidity which is leading to additional loses to me.

So, let me get everyone caught up.

Yes, the above information is accurate - for the most part.

Let's break this down point by point:


1. The 3 BTC match amount.

Yes, we noticed that your account got credited a 'max' amount of 3 BTC as opposed to a 'max match' of 3 BTC and we credited your account the JadeCoin.

2. Yes, we do, in fact have an extremely long backlog of other customer concerns, so security reviews can take up to 2 weeks (especially for amounts above 5 BTC).

3. The reason your case is under special examination is that there is another user with a similar bet pattern who unlocked the bonus and has not requested a cashout, and has not complained, played, or requested a cashout. So we are looking into this possible connection, which takes a lot of time.


The amount of the cashout is not an issue, we are not interested in throwing away 3 years of being in business over a couple BTC.

If you were not contacted by a representative in regard to this issue, I am very sorry and that is completely uncalled for. I will update this thread once the matter in concluded - thank you nonetheless for alerting the community to your issue.

Even though this particular thread is at our expense, we do appreciate users who make this sort of effort to be extremely detailed to alert others to potential issues.


Thank you everyone and we will continue to look into this issue and post updates here upon conclusion. We won't be expediting this issues in our queue despite its public presence because doing so would be at the expense of other customers whose issues came before this.

Cheers,

BetCoinTM

That is a pretty shitty reason for putting the account under special scrutiny and your apparent inability to give any sort of timeline for this to be resolved, along with just BSing the guy for a week without giving anything resembling support is terrible.

Hello,

1st thank you - finally somebody contacted me /or at least replied here/.

2nd /bolded/ - You've credited me 0.1BTC in Jadecoin. Not the difference of ~3BTC. But this is just to clarify it. I'm not complaining as I said it before.

3rd. I don't care about other users. I'm not connected in anyway with any other, betting from a laptop with the same internet provider all the time. Even my browser is far from unique if you are smart enough to add such checks (https://panopticlick.eff.org/). But you are hurting my coins liquidity and this brings me additional loses.

And last - I didn't want to go public either and I like your site, but what would you do if you were me after those attempt on chat?
And even telling twice in interval of 4 days I will go public if ... you could check it in your system bu chat IDs - they are visible.

https://i.imgur.com/ESmlu0W.png

Regards

Yooo you know what to do, I've had a few issues similar to you, but if your a long standing consistent player, dont worry,  I don't know if you spoke with James, (I'm pretty sure he's the site owner)  but if you'd, PM me ill give you his email, he is the one to contact. 

Yes it can be annoying as shit! what your going through, but I've actually wagered like hundreds and hundreds of BTC's on that site over the course of 2 years, so im pretty sure you'll be straight.

Like i said, send me a message if you don't have James's email address, I'll give it to you, and he'll take care of it.  (i think)

I don't have any admin or owner email. I was asking for it on multiple occasions before this going public, but support refused to give it to me.

PMed.

Thank you.

Im telling you, don't worry.  Plus check out my last PM,    i think it'll calm your nerves... :)

Any word? 

I wrote James, Betcoin.TM is aware as he responded. I guess will need to wait a day and see...

What a shitty reply ? If someone manages to wins or get the bonus as described then you call it a cheating and needs special examination to verify how exactly this person won,we're only suppose to call it a contest but had not planned  to give away any actual money.This just seems like the most rigid casino ever made.I ignored a accusations against betcoin.tm thinking those are shills but your comment just changed everything.

Don't keep the stupid bonuses if you don't want people to win.Stop scamming money off descent people.Rather then paying the users ,you start investigating if they "actually" won the bonus which was not suppose to be paid anyway.You start examining your security flaws  ,what exactly went wrong ? Just shut down the damn website if you can't run it legitimately.

I would not recommend anyone to play here.This just means all those previous accusations against betcoin.tm were always true.

Dont worry bud,  its coming

I've read this scam accusation and I'm really surprised. I've worked for Betcoin.TM something like 4 months, and I've left my position almost 1 month ago.

I can tell you something in way to alert and relax you:

- They have BTC to pay you. Actually their Bankroll is approximatively to 200+ BTC.

- Chat support is managed by only one person, and this person is James. (Yes, I've discovered it a lot of time ago, that's impossible that everyone use the same writing style and when I asked for James on skype, sometimes James was instantly connected on skype after my request  ;D)

- Their site is really beautiful, but in any case, I don't advice you to play with it.

- Good luck with your withdraw, I don't think that he will not pay you.

- I'd have many things to say, but I prefer to stop here.

Exactly my point. With thousand of player there always be "the one" with similar betting pattern or whatever they comes up to with.
And if I want to abuse them, wouldn't I made an anonymous profile instead using this one, where at least few people on the forum have my real and and etc. due to trades and deals?




I will be comforted when I see my BTC in my address...




This makes things worst in my eyes. Because this will mean they are aware I will go on public for ~4-5 days before I open this topic. I wrote them on what once ~4 days before I open i and then ~36 hours. Also will mean they are ignoring me every single time on livechat.

Anyway I'm hoping for fast resolution on this, because this cost me money and it's not fun.

Thank you.

Your system isn't working.  There's no excuse for taking up to 2 weeks regardless of the amount.  Anything over 24 hours is unacceptable. 

At the very least, you should inform your players before they deposit that they may not get paid for weeks if they win.

Why are you making your players suffer because you don't have faith in your own software though?  You realize competitors are processing larger withdraws in under an hour right?
 
Why should it take longer for amounts above 5 BTC?  You're putting more effort into finding a reason a not to pay it seems.

---

That's nowhere near big enough for the limits they offer.  Hopefully you are wrong, but if you're right it would explain the delayed payments. 

I have left them a negative. If this gets resolved or if there is evidence that OP was cheating then I will gladly remove it.

I don't think it is fair that you would take this long to "investigate" cheating by your players.

I have some information that may be useful to you.

The support ARE admins.

They have admin access or at least hav eaccess to add and remove balances, I asked them to change my balance in a specific way and hey did so.

You know what I'm actually really amazed right now because the past four or five times ever since like I did email James and I talked to him and I cannot complain that everything good my withdrawals have been completely instant every single time now I got to withdrawal pending I am not really like nervous or anything I'm just so disappointed because the site was such a pleasure to play on when it was an instant

Now I'm confused!
What are you expecting to find?
Also, do you allow for compensating users for the time that your administration takes.

However, this does seem to a fairly good site and the fact that they ae still replying means that they are unlikely to scam.

Someone correct me if im wrong,  but the chance he gets "scammed" I think is almost none.   I've been playing on the site for to long to think that's possible

I'm happy to correct you.  They've owed me ~11 btc for over a month.

If this is true:


Then the real reason for the delay is that they are waiting for more deposits.  200 BTC is nowhere near the proper size bankroll for the limits they offer, and it will be only a matter of time...

Someone from the site should really respond,  I'm waiting on a withdrawal for almost 1BTC as well,  and I seem to be the only one responding in a positive attitude for you.   Someone needs to log on,  and explain what's going,  

And if you have been holding $4,000+ of this guy's money , there better be a better reason, than any I've seen so far.     Bc as of right now you obtained a sorry term, no interest. Payday loan that is waaaay over due.  

That money is not yours, and since it's not yours,  yet you have it,  you've stolen it.  That's how I see it.   I just sent James an email,  he "gave me his word" withdrawals will be sent twice daily.   Even my withdrawal, which is much less, has now lapsed your promise.  Now anyone with a pending withdrawal needs to be paid,  right now.  

Look at page 1, betcointm did respond.

It's not improbable for a "casino" owner to disappear wen large amounts of Bitcoin are owed.

Site runs a bit to fishy for my liking, supports sweetie talk felt like unnecessary flavoring.
Will stay clear till this is figured out.

I agree with you, especially since I have been playing on the site for almost 3 years, it does seem hard to believe,  But this cant be "policy" its totally unacceptable. 

Where is the site owner today?    And I've seen movement of funds among wallets they control, yet they arent checking cashouts? or emails?  I don't know, i do agree it seems far fetched, but this isn't normal

Has anyone processed a withdrawal successfully in the past 72 hours?  Maybe if one person had a successful withdrawal the past few days, i'd think different

i dont have enough to try yet [im trying ot make at least 0.5 BTC]

I would expect them to continue processing smaller withdraws as long as they feel it would increase the chances of getting more deposits.  Similar to a ponzi scheme.

Hi guys,

Thank you for you support!

I'm not happy at all about this situation, because they still didn't answer to my mail and Betcoin.TM still didn't shown online since his last reply.

But give them a chance to explain, if there is anything, why is this happen. And a chance to do the thing in the right manner for all users.

It was weekend and soon will a day time in Hong Kong (other users PMed me they are from there). At the and we are all People... or this guy James need to do all management alone. (but after another day or two without any reaction from them I will probably change my mind. And they will deserve a lot more red trust plus Mandarin translation of this topic, spread across Asian forums )

 James (owner) replayed me, promising resolution on next 48 hours ~till 14GMT time Wednesday.

 Will see.

The support seems lacking for this site,do not think I have had one email replied back to when I looked into using them. Live support took me into long ass discussion that was not needed.

Dear Valued User Maruni:


After our fraud prevention team spent hours reviewing your bets and account history, we have found beyond a reasonable doubt that your account (maruni) is associated with at least one other account, and that this association was produced for the sole reason of benefiting from our bonus offers.

Although our terms and conditions, to which you assented upon creating your account, mandate that all funds in offending accounts be confiscated - in this case we have decided to refund your deposit and ban your account from taking advantage of bonus offers for an indefinite period of time.

The account with which the user "maruni" was associated, has been disabled permanently.

Any future system abuse from maruni or any account associated therewith will be grounds for the permanent disabling of said accounts and immediate confiscation of all funds therein.

We thank you kindly for being patient during the review process, and your account balance reflecting the amount of your most recent deposit is now available in your account for withdrawal.


I was happy to hear via James that you would be communicating with us in the future regarding the testing of new product features and integrations with new providers, and we very much look forward to your feedback regarding these matters.


We appreciate your patience in regard to this matter, and apologize for the length of time the review took.

Good Luck and Good Fortune,

BetCoinTM

Some of this is accurate, some is not.

1. Our bankroll is enough to pay, and we've been in business 3 years. No one is looking to scam someone out of a few BTC - especially someone who I've chat with pleasantly before on this forum (unless my memory fails me).

2. We have several chat agents based all over. Sometimes I get on chat using the account "Elaine", who is a person that also works here (and is not me).

3. I'm glad you like the design of the site! However, many users don't like the red theme, so we are going through some changes :)

4. Gianluca was an excellent asset to the company and unfortunately things did not continue on either front.

5. Two people manage this forum account. The reason is that you guys are all intelligent and well-meaning folks, and we do not want to let a newbie on here to pacify you.

We will be posting some new bonuses soon. There is also a *slight* possibility of a hack-a-thon, where we will pay small amounts for bugs found on the site.

New features will continue to be rolled out, and we hope everyone gets a chance to check them out!

Good Luck and Good Fortune to all,

BetCoinTM

You know this is wrong and only an excuse to not pay me my coins. In this matter you may found "reasonable doubt" for every withdraw of your players without any proofs.

How do you suddenly make your findings after 14 days and after you've been red trusted??

Please goes public which is this account and so on with your accusations, because this is public topic about your scam attempts. I'm sure you cannot, just because this is not true.

And you took even the ~2BTC I made playing after the bonus, so my account have only 2.9BTC (which I immaterially submitted for withdraw of course).

This is very confusing still.
Recently in another post similar to this you seem to have said:
"No one is looking to scam someone out of a few BTC"
This means alone that you have enough funds to cover this person's aquired assets.

This is what is confusing me: If you want to keep up a good identity and it is (only) "a few BTC" then one would have thought you would have honoured this anyway.


BetcoinTM - could you please PM me ANY REASONABLE information you have for not paying this?

How many players have you freerolled like this Betcoin.tm?  Any idea?  Remember to count the ones who didn't cash out but still believe they would be able to if they tried.  Can someone share the terms of the bonus they are accusing OP of abusing.

If they are the ones I've seen, its ridiculous to accuse anyone of "abusing" them since they only reduce your equity if accepted before your first bet.

I'd like to point out that I didn't use any kind of bonus to win the 11 BTC they owe me.  I just played Gameart slots, which seem to have mysteriously disappeared from their site shortly after I won.

I assume their inability to lie about violating bonus terms is why they've chosen to ignore anything I post.

Clearly shows that betcointm has insufficient coins to payout... or maybe they do have enough but an amount like that would effect their 'bank roll'

Betcoin.TM address:

1BTPSjiSC1s3A5cqJrbDRi2LAHx3U88mKR
1Dhd2V19w7zLaXrK1zPp2eES6Km1cBVzDs
...
...


If you check this two address you'll find that this site moves many many BTC. Don't worry, they have money to pay, but they don't want to pay, it's different :)

well, moving a lot doesnt mean they have a big balance. Anyways, 10-11 btc is not a big amount for a casino to payout and as you said, they clearly dont want to pay out.

Even my withdraw from yesterday is still pending...

If we wanted to do this, then we would have 'magically solved' the problem as soon as the thread was created and avoided the red trust at all.

We have a protocol that we follow and when you have so many bets, we looked at every one. We cross referenced them with the other account and came to a conclusion - and the bets were not the only indicator of a second account.

No, we did not give you the winnings from the bonus money that we confiscated as you did not place those bets using your own funds.

Please post the terms of the bonus that he abused.

It is the sitewide policy that we do not allow users with multiple accounts to take advantage of bonuses.

Please post the terms of the bonus that he abused.  I don't think your bonuses are something that can be "taken advantage of" because of the insane terms.

I have explained that we do not allow users with multiple accounts to take advantage of any bonus, regardless of its specific terms.

We are not taking any money from debuni. We are returning his deposit in full.

It's been processed.

Will post tx id if you authorize it.

You freerolled this player.

Please post the terms of the bonus you claim he abused.

If it's a bonus that could be abused, you would be justified in freerolling him.

Thanks for your support - glad to have you as our player.

I do what is fair. In this case the user clearly violated our terms of service, but he is a good customer so I did not confiscate the funds as is clearly stated in our terms of service.

This issue is resolved. We determined without question on more than one fronts that this user has multiple accounts. We refunded his deposit and therefore did not 'scam' any money out of him. His funds are fully returned to him.

We have been in business for three years, catering mostly to clients such as jpoker who play amounts just like he mentioned, and continue to expand on all fronts, adding new features monthly with no signs of stopping.

Just to go over everything:

1. Debuni/Maruni has *all* of his original deposit back. Nothing was stolen or 'scammed' from him.
2. We admitted to taking a long time resolving the issue. We did not 'magically resolve' it when the thread was created, as someone mentioned.
3. The amount of this cashout is by no means small, but neither is it in the upper end of what we process. Size has nothing to do with this conversation. Debuni/Maruni violated the terms of service and appropriate action was taken.

Thanks for understanding.

PLEASE post the terms of the bonus this player cleared.

Why is this so difficult?

If its a Bonus that could be abused, I would understand why you freerolled him.

I don't understand how creating multiple accounts, and thereby directly violating of our Terms of Service, is not enough to answer your question.

Creating multiple accounts voids players from benefiting from ANY bonus.

Please, post the terms of the bonus you claim he abused.

I don't believe what betcoin.tm says because few months back i tried to play there.

Created only one account and suddenly was unable to play poker.they said i have more than one account when i just have one account.So maybe their system is retard or they?

https://www.walletexplorer.com/wallet/Betcoin.tm/addresses ~ 50BTC

Stalling is usual a sign they are not well funded and trying to figure out a way to get this issue dragged out so they are not overextended.

Violating T&C and gaining an unfair advantage are not the same thing.  Please post the terms of the bonus you claim was abused.

At one point we did not allow VPNs - and we still don't allow accounts using the same IP to play.

VPN restriction has since been lifted.

I never used Vpn and i don't know how to set up Vpn.
With this kind of stuff i leave your site but I thought you guys want to make better site but i was wrong sorry to say.There were lot of issue with withdrawal and still the same.

I think we're not communicating this properly:

When you create multiple accounts we do not allow ANY player to take advantage of bonuses.

When I say 'take advantage of bonus offers' I mean use and benefit from them - not the definition you are thinking of.

Does this make sense?

I have spoken to betcoin.tm for a significant amount of time & he has always been supportive & helpful.However, the multi account thing has been raised a lot of times in the past as well and it is not allowed for more than one person in the same house to play with the same IP's as there is no one to come & check them.The same applies for referral bonuses etc...It's common sense.

If you do as you like then the casino has the right to do as they like.This is if OP truly has several accounts.


Yes,It does.

Will you please post the terms of the bonus.  I'm not sure how else to ask this.


It would make sense if it were possible for a player to benefit from the bonus.  Which is what I'm trying to figure out.

You have a history with these casinos's and i dont.I wouldn't even come online for this but because i know this guy from months & he never seemed fishy.he is smart though.

user not violting the terms of the bonus is not the issue here but he has violated a general casino rule applicable for each & every game.You might be allowed to have 50 accounts but you certainly aren't allowed to abuse the bonuses/referrals with all of them.

Stunna banned the faucet farmers some months ago & he also neg-tagged eal for abusing his giveaways in the past.It is way too simple for one to understand but i know what you are doing here.

Good Luck to you but this is no way a scam accusation cause the OP has been refunded his deposited coins.

read more there..

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg13495319#msg13495319

Finally somebody to stand up for Betcon.TM.

I also liked them a lot with their fancy dice rolling... till thay scammed me with 11.25BTC -2.9 returned...

BUT. I'm not multi accouter and they don't have/cannot submit ANY prof of this. Just because I used only maruni as account with them.

And what about cwil, who never used a bonus, just won 11BTC on slots and still waiting for payment over 16 days?? Is he another hacker of their provably fair games??

--> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1437638.msg14600949#msg14600949

Also few other players complained that they are waiting for cashback promo over a month now.






I will update and OP:

You've said there will be a ONE day / 24 hours / review if I've get lucky to clear the bonus. Then you publicly said you are doing TWO WEEKS review. This mean every player could stuck for weeks with you. So guys, use your head wisely.

--> Pastebin of chat for 24 hours review and that I'm eligible for bonus (http://pastebin.com/LMsyw6xY)

"Angel (22:53:23): I see here that you are still eligible to have our 201% and 101% match deposit bonuses"




Yes, it was finally proceeded. I don't need to authorize it. Transaction is made to my public address from my profile...
Got at least 2.9BTC back. OP updated.




And what about the 2BTC I won, betting with my OWN funds - e.g. after clearing the bonus?? If I had lose, everything would be fine for you, right?






Please, as I was the initiator of this public scam accusation:

Please, explain in public how I violated the terms of service and as you are accusing me of multi accounting.
Do you have ANY proofs? No because this is just and excuse for not paying me. And you could do it with any player... So in my eyes you are still scammers.


--> Pastebin and of all my bets (http://pastebin.com/gpECLK0K). As you can see they are all made by their rules in previous pastebin about bonus, and they cannot submit any proof about their multi account accusation, because I've never used another account beside maruni with them.
Bets until jadecoin are for bonus, then I won another 2BTC with OWN funds, as every satoshi then is not a BONUS funds. I've I got lost, they would be happy as hell.

Edit:  2nd Pastebin for bets (http://pastebin.com/XLZAnzBm), as 1st one exceeded the free limit of 512KB/past

Ran into this multiaccount issue when I signed up and forgot the password. It kept telling me to sign from my bitcoin account that I had not linked to them yet,hell had not even used the account yet.
So I sent support 3 emails and no reply over a week.
Since I was most likely not going to play on the site anyways I thought maybe the account was never activated.
Keep in mind I used a affiliate link to join. Would not let me log in with the new account.
Finally I catch Angel on support live and she starts giving me the riot act but since I cam clean they would fix this issue.
Firstly it was two accounts that I had never used and still have not used and the issue was because I got no response from support. But she kept on in this manner and it was real off putting but made me think how easy they could pull this crap with established accounts and be scott free. She noted my account and that was enough for me to say bye bye!

Thats my whole dealing with the site,it smelled fishy from the start with the fake half clad women all over the site and the chat trying to act sexy.

I had nothing personal with the Both OP & Betcoin, Because I made many Exchanges with the OP Which went very well and smoothly without any Issue, and I also Earned few BTC From betcoin and Sometime I got issue about the Withdrawal which was cleared because of Betcoin here.

Today I got lucky to connect with betcoin on skype and I asked about the OP, Because OP was waiting for his BTC to exchange with me  ;D And I thought why Not ask from him [betcoin] about OP issue and here is His Reply
https://i.imgur.com/QSMGTQo.png
https://i.imgur.com/eRZMpB6.png

now what you say OP?

Please look at detailed post above - I don't have multiple accounts and I request them to prove it publicly. Because otherwise they can say this to ANY winner and took any coins.

As you can see, I wrote it nearly 2 days ago and they didn't reply just because they cant prove something which is false.

And what about other guys /stated in OP/ who are still waiting for their coins???




"now what you say OP?"

This is like I to wrote somewhere you are scammer or owe me XX coins or whatever without any proof and then to say to you - "now what you say OP?"...

Sorry about this second post, but forgot to ask you in previous. And as you moved from PM to the topic:

Could be kind to clarify, with a simple yes or no, are you now working for Betcoin.TM?

Thank you.

Im NOT Working for Betcoin, I had good relation with betcoin and i had his skype address, and usually talk with him when i have issues. And When I saw he is Not replying here, I thought why Not ask him by pming him at skype. And yesterday he respond me. Let me ask him to provide proofs about Multiaccount ISSUE.

Regards

Sure. Could you please ask him and why Betcoin.TM


Owe @cwil (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=107656) 11BTC for 20+ days
-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1437638.msg14600949#msg14600949

Owe @camelson (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=377298) ?? cashback for over a month
-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg14550413#msg14550413

Owe @OrangeSeller (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=450617) ?? cashback for over a month
-> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1358728.msg14491697#msg14491697

and those are only the public known.

They have Sent the Cashbacks yesterday, To these People.

But I will talk to him about you both people

Thanks

Good and natural development as those cashbacks were ~0.1 by my guess.

I had a very good opinion on Betcoin.TM before this case and if you check my posts you will see they are only positive. But past behavior doesn't prove there will be no problems in future.

And this is not only about payment issues. Because:

a) Do you think it's normal to tell me there will be 24 hours! review of my account /which is completely normal/ and then without any further communication to extent it to over 14 days and state this is there normal procedure. So every player could expect a 2 WEEKS block. I don't.  // pastebin of conversation is above

b) Do you think it's normal to asking every day, day after day, what happen, require back communication and nothing happens for 10+ days? I don't. // timeline is in OP

c) Do you think it's normal users like cwil to ask many many many times what happen with his 11BTC and to not get a single answer before this topic? I don't.

d) Do you think it's normal users to wait OVER A MONTH for cashback of a promotion?  I don't.

e) Do you think it's normal is normal constantly to have many communication and payment issues?  I don't.  // just check their topic

Do you think they deserve a good reputation now? I don't.


For me this is completely waste of time now. They have plenty of time to sort things right. They don't want to.
So for me this is nearly closed. I just hope at least @cwil will get his 11BTC.

Many people think them as clever and create multiple accounts to exploit bonus this may/May not be case with op , but still i feel that betcoin.tm will not ruin its reputation until there is fault from other side.
The only fact that lies now is either OP is a Liar or the accused , only you both knows.

I got your point.

But words should be proven.

And if you read all the posts, Betcoin.TM owe money and to other players like @cwil, who won 11BTC at slots and never used a bonus. Also in past months users waited for payments or answers much longer than a week, in multiple occasions. This is not right or correct to players in any way.

Could you please request from them and to prove solvency?
As this could be the main problem in their case and reason to not pay me, @cwil and others in time.

Because they stated every one could become a millionaire with them, but according to posts here, their bankroll is just between 50-200+BTC. With such a small bankroll, paying 20-30BTC could really be a problem.

And just to clarify, saying things like We are not for few coins, We can pay millions and similar are not valid proof of solvency.

Yes, I would like to be sent some watch-only wallet invites to prove that this is valid, however, this just stands as empty words.

This just makes me stay with known gambling sites thats been around for 2 years or more.

Deserving my btc deposits.. that sucks they wont pay out though..

If I had to gamble I would of just went with primedice.

Well...

30 days passed since Betcoin.TM was online:

Last Active:    May 02, 2016, 05:42:54 AM

In meantime they scammed few more people:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1496542.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1283187.msg15063773#msg15063773
And so on on post in their topic.

I will not waste more of my time watching this topic. So I'm locking it. If somebody wants to add anything - PM me and I will unlock it of course.
Meanwhile I believe they deserve a lot more red trust from DT.