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1121  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: What the heck is Blockstream doing now? on: October 12, 2021, 05:26:47 PM
You can't really blame a company if it's looking to launch new products or take a new direction. Every company needs to evolve to stay in the game, otherwise it becomes a dinausor

I don't get it either.
It's a company that received funding from investors when they presented their plans, all that money was put in there with the hope of generating more money, not some utopian dreams, companies don't work like that if they would have gone only on nonprofit endeavors they would be long gone by now.
There are a lot of people around here that are insistent that everyone should work for free. IMO, it is utopian nonsense.

I personally think these tokens are tacky, but there is clearly a market for what they are selling, and AFAICT, they aren’t misleading anyone, so I don’t see an issue.

Further, most of their projects are on GitHub so anyone can fork/copy what they are offering if they think they can offer a better product.
1122  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: Binance's 'Un-Ethical' changes. on: October 12, 2021, 05:16:07 PM
The u turn from no KYC to full KYC verification before trading on Binance was expected. It was just a matter of time. I am surprised you took this long to realize this once they announced that they were making changes a few months ago.
I expect all major exchanges to require KYC in the near future. Bitcoin and crypto trading has become too big of a business for government regulators to ignore. An exchange that doesn’t require KYC is going to attract a lot of negative attention from the governments, which will inevitably lead to bad outcomes.

If you want to trade without KYC, you will most likely need to use some kind of DEX. I can see more coins adopting SW so they can be traded on a LN based DEX.
1123  Economy / Economics / Re: US with problems to raise the debt ceiling... again on: October 12, 2021, 02:09:34 AM
The game theory of the situation prohibits a default of more than a couple of weeks at the absolute most, and any default at all is always unlikely. If a default happened, very quickly the "bodies would start to pile up", so to speak, and the pressure would just continually build for the ceiling to be raised. Everybody would be running around with their hair on fire, with the temperature going up and up and the fire spreading more and more, and there'd really be no way to end it except for raising the debt ceiling. In this sort of situation, it's certain that either 10 Republicans would flip or all 50 Democrats would kill the filibuster: raising the ceiling is a foregone conclusion, one way or another. And everybody knows all of this, so the threat of default just isn't very good leverage.

Democrats have the ability to raise the debt ceiling via reconciliation with a simple majority vote. Senate rules limit the number of times reconciliation can be used, and Democrats want to use it for their $5.5 trillion spending bill. The senate rules can be changed with a majority vote, but doing so would be more difficult than getting the votes to vote for the crazy reconciliation bill currently being proposed. Raising the debt ceiling via reconciliation would also mean the bill would need to raise the ceiling to a certain limit rather than the debt incurred prior to a date, and would also mean that Republicans would be able to force Democrats to vote on amendments that take stances on things they don’t want to take stances on.

McConnell got the messaging wrong on the debt ceiling this time around. He has since made it clear that he will not deliver any votes to raise the debt ceiling in the future (he had trouble getting 10 votes to vote this time around). It is, or should be clear that Democrats need to raise the debt ceiling via reconciliation as a longer term solution.


Once the US defaults on its debt, meaning it doesn’t pay interest and/or principal of treasury securities on time, it cannot be reversed. In theory, the treasury could issue securities late at night in order to pay for interest and principal of bonds it needs to redeem that day. So a “default” of 4 hours would not actually be a default.   
1124  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: First Bitcoin, then Blockstream Satellite. How about we go fully decentralized? on: October 12, 2021, 01:23:46 AM



Immidiately after any of the examples you provide, the percentage of barter transactions tends to go way up. There tends to be less use for actual money, and more use for tangible goods used to survive, such as food, fuel, and water.

I don't think any kind of "mesh" network is going to work very well when there are many users involved, or when it needs to cover the entire globe (or even large parts of the world). A mesh network greatly increases the chances of a Sybil attack and makes detecting such an attack much more difficult. There are also privacy implications to using radios to use bitcoin, as it would become trivial for anyone in your area to know you are using bitcoin; this is compared to only your ISP knowing you are using bitcoin currently.
I agree with you about the barter part - but I think it's safe to assume that the levels of barter use go significantly up in these kind of events specifically due to the instant distrust in fiat/banking system. If Bitcoin was there to be used even fully offline, this would change.
Why do you think people start to distrust the banking system after a natural disaster? I would argue that barter transactions increase because people have less use for anything that can be described as a store of value -- people need actual goods/services that allow them to survive.
About the security & privacy of such an idea, I don't know much so thanks for underlining these issues. It's definitely not the most reliable thing, although perhaps there is one key solution we just haven't thought about yet.
If you are in a rural or even a suburban area, with a mesh network, it would take a very small number of dishonest nodes to pull off a Sybil attack that affects a large portion of the entire network, as all traffic is flowing through so few nodes. There is little reason to run a node in a sparsely populated area because it will connect to so few people.

Quote
We currently have Blockstream's Satellite
In many ways, this is centralized because the satellite is owned by a company (located in US!) and they can decide what services they provide and to whom.
My understanding is that the blockstream satellite will broadcast transactions to anyone whose "antenna" is pointed in the appropriate direction, and has no way of discriminating against a specific user.

Using a blockstream satellite alone will not allow someone to broadcast a transaction, which would be important in a power/internet outage. 
1125  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Can I just run a pruned node without downloading historical data? on: October 11, 2021, 05:33:04 PM
I suggested upthread that blocks contain a hash of the UTXO set. This could potentially be done via a softfork
Why does this hash need to be included in the block? While you're downloading your pruned node, you could calculate this hash on your own. I see no reason to increase the size of the blockchain by a soft fork for this.
Nodes do not calculate this hash presently.

Quote
A node can obtain the actual UTXO set as of block x from a third party, calculate the hash of the UTXO set it was provided, and compare this to the hash contained in block x it receives from its peers. The node will also look at subsequent blocks to see how the UTXO set changed according to the blocks, calculate the hash, and validate accordingly. As long as the node is not being subjected to a Sybil attack, I would confidently say the node has sufficient information to know if a transaction is valid or not.
You've kinda lost me here: what can you do with this information that you can't currenly do (assuming you have a pruned node with full UTXO information)?
Presently, nodes review information from each block starting from block 1 to keep track of all outputs, and if they have been spent. The only way to know if an input is valid and if it has been previously spent is to look at all blocks, or to use information derived from looking at all blocks. Nodes currently keep track of the UTXO set by storing it in RAM, but the only way they authoritatively know the UTXO set is because the node previously looked at every block.

For example, a node will know the following is part of the UTXO set:
txid,index,amount,block
2a6a13ffb7146ef05a009d65d83b08bf48d53b13c471d13113345b4c9953611b,1,13.55748202,704548

Nodes store the above information, along with similar information about every other unspent output.

If a node were to store the UTXO set in a very specific order, and in a very specific format, two arbitrary nodes would calculate the hash of this information and the calculated hash would be the same.

If the above hash were to be stored in blocks, someone could spin up a node, obtain the UTXO set from an arbitrary untrusted third party, and immediately know if an arbitrary transaction they receive is valid or not (assuming they know the current consensus rules). Your average user would not need to download and store the blockchain, nor would they need to wait for their node to catch up to the current tip if their node has been offline for a period of time.


I would also point out that dissenters who are using bitcoin will want to minimize their data use as much as they can. No amount of data use would be "safe", but being able use a full node after has been offline for days/weeks without having to download all blocks subsequent to the last time it was online would reduce the risk of using bitcoin, and would make it so they would not have to rely on third-party services to send transactions or verify if a transaction has been received.
1126  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: First Bitcoin, then Blockstream Satellite. How about we go fully decentralized? on: October 11, 2021, 12:02:31 AM
I think that one of the problems Bitcoin will be facing over the long term is the aftermath of some disastrous events. I'm talking about events leading to internet blackouts or power cuts. These events include but are not limited to strong cyber attacks, fuel shortage (see Lebanon), earthquakes and so on.

If power or the internet goes down, it's safe to assume that Bitcoin becomes practically worthless/useless in an instant for anyone who's living the aftermaths. We're talking about situations like the current one Lebanon is facing. Had this happened in a much larger nation like the US, I think Bitcoin would've confronted a huge sell-off and loss of interest/trust.
Immidiately after any of the examples you provide, the percentage of barter transactions tends to go way up. There tends to be less use for actual money, and more use for tangible goods used to survive, such as food, fuel, and water.

I don't think any kind of "mesh" network is going to work very well when there are many users involved, or when it needs to cover the entire globe (or even large parts of the world). A mesh network greatly increases the chances of a Sybil attack and makes detecting such an attack much more difficult. There are also privacy implications to using radios to use bitcoin, as it would become trivial for anyone in your area to know you are using bitcoin; this is compared to only your ISP knowing you are using bitcoin currently.
1127  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Can I just run a pruned node without downloading historical data? on: October 10, 2021, 11:40:56 PM
I suggested upthread that blocks contain a hash of the UTXO set. This could potentially be done via a softfork, for example by requiring coinbase transactions to have a OP_RETURN transaction with this hash. Nodes must already store the current UTXO set in order to check if a particular transaction is valid or not.
In my opinion, this is a more significant change than you might think. Lots of nodes might decide to use this method, leaving only a small number of nodes holding the entire blockchain. While with a perfect implementation of your above suggested idea, it might not be an issue if one day nobody has the whole blockchain anymore, I believe such a big change (and possible risk) can't be justified since HDDs are so, so cheap.
Storing the entire blockchain will provide businesses the opportunity to profit, for example by serving ads to users viewing transactions on a block explorer, analyzing previous transactions (similar to the work done by chainanalysis).

I think my proposal would remove nearly every barrier someone has to running a full node, and that people using light nodes would go down to nearly zero. I also think over the long run, if bitcoin were to see widespread adoption, it is going to see a much higher percentage of transactions conducted via their phone, either on-chain transactions or transactions on an L2 type network such as LN. I don't see any reasonable way to run anything resembling a full node on a phone without the ability to not download the entire blockchain.

Further, there is no reason why I need to know about someone buying coffee in 2014, or about every single transaction in the 2015 spam attack, or any other subsequent spam attack. The reason why I need to validate these transactions today is that these transactions must be validated in order to validate subsequent blocks.

I don't like to share too much personal information; in fact I don't even know myself what constitutes how much data usage. I'm not a Netflix subscriber though. I would like to watch more movies but I never have the time. However, there are many more data hogs apart from Netflix binge-watching. Non-exhaustive, generic list: video calls / meetings (they were a thing before COVID Grin), software updates, cloud backups, working via VNC, simply large file downloads like ISOs, watching documentaries, high-bitrate audio streaming, downloading games (modern games can easily hit 100GB each), playing those games, cloud-connected security cameras - just to name a few. I don't know how much this list applies to developing countries or how much their average bandwidth usage is, though, to be honest.
I think a lot of your examples would probably constitute "business" use, although most residential ISPs would probably not especially care if someone was doing any of the above except for the ISO files if they are downloaded on any kind of regular basis. Perhaps someone who is working from home might reasonably use 350 GB+ of bandwidth using his work computer, depending on the specific setup, and how much of his day is made up of meetings that must take place via video.

I think, for the most part, most of your above list is probably not very commonly used in third-world countries.
1128  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Can I just run a pruned node without downloading historical data? on: October 10, 2021, 10:45:15 PM
The cost of hardware is not the only cost of running a full node. Users must also have an internet connection that is sufficient to handle block downloads and the initial blockchain sync. For most of the "first world", this is not an issue as users will have an existing broadband connection they use and need for other reasons. There are "data caps" in some parts of the world that limit the amount of data a customer can transfer per month without paying an overage fee. If you have a data cap, there is a good chance the 350 GB initial blockchain download will exceed your cap, as there are very few legitimate reasons to need to download that much data in one month (the initial blockchain download is probably the only legitimate reason for most non-business users of an internet connection).
You're right; if we look at sites like https://bitnodes.io/ it is clear BTC full nodes should be more decentralized, especially in developing countries.
[img width=512 ]https://i.postimg.cc/nzrTR66C/image.png[/img]
https://bitnodes.io/

This is now going a bit off-topic, we could create a new topic for 'bringing BTC full nodes to developing countries' to gather ideas Smiley But a few thoughts:
If they don't run a full node (this topic is about pruned nodes), the decentralization is not really better; it's just maybe better for them (anonymity when looking up blockchain information). If there's no way to get an uncapped data connection, it might be an idea to sell / gift HDDs with blockchain sync on them to such countries. They should download Core and verify it themselves; then the software will verify all blocks when starting up, so the users don't really run a risk there of 'trusting someones IBD'.
A pruned node is technically a full node, although with slightly less functionality, such as the ability to rescan the blockchain for transactions.

When I purchase hardware with the intention of using it for anything to do with bitcoin/crypto, I will purchase hardware that could potentially be (and most often is) used by someone who is not using the hardware to handle bitcoin/crypto transactions. This reduces the risk of someone tampering with the hardware who is targeting someone who is a bitcoin user. If someone is selling HDDs with the blockchain pre-loaded, there is the risk to the buyer that the seller has put some kind of malware on the HDD designed to steal the buyer's private keys.

I suggested upthread that blocks contain a hash of the UTXO set. This could potentially be done via a softfork, for example by requiring coinbase transactions to have a OP_RETURN transaction with this hash. Nodes must already store the current UTXO set in order to check if a particular transaction is valid or not.

A node can obtain the actual UTXO set as of block x from a third party, calculate the hash of the UTXO set it was provided, and compare this to the hash contained in block x it receives from its peers. The node will also look at subsequent blocks to see how the UTXO set changed according to the blocks, calculate the hash, and validate accordingly. As long as the node is not being subjected to a Sybil attack, I would confidently say the node has sufficient information to know if a transaction is valid or not.


With regards to legitimate use of bandwidth: way back, when I started my first Bitcoin node, I checked my family's monthly data consumption to see if it would jump up significantly with a node running, and it was ~300GB of all legitimate data Grin So it's not unreasonably much. There are also schools, student dorms etc. which share a connection and go terabytes per month at least. But I agree; some places indeed don't offer unmetered, so we need a solution for that, which still allows people to have the full blockchain locally.
I am not sure where you live, or how big your family is. My guess is that a big chunk of your data usage is from various streaming services. Streaming a video in 720p (HD) uses about 0.9 GB per hour, and streaming in 2k (higher quality HD) uses about 3 GB per hour. That works out to about 2.7 hours of 720p per day (assuming a family of four), or around 50 minutes of streaming per day at 2k. I don't think spending 2-3 hours/day watching Netflix is something I would want to be spending my time doing, but I also don't think it would be totally unreasonable.

I don't think there are a lot of people in third-world countries spending $14/month on Netflix though.

1129  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Can I just run a pruned node without downloading historical data? on: October 10, 2021, 10:34:32 AM
Also part of the problem is that as we have discussed in other threads, you can put a complete node together for well under $200, NEW.
Used PCs and stuff are much much less. https://www.ebay.com/itm/284407553576
At what point does doing the lets try 100 different things so you don't have to download the entire blockchain or have that extra storage space not worth it because if you ever want to do anything else with the node you are going to have to download it anyway and all you did is waste time and effort to get to the same place you were going to wind up at anyway.
I agree; some people are ready to fully trust 3rd parties, while others want to change the Bitcoin protocol itself.... for what? For impatience and / or not wanting to save up for a few pieces of basic hardware (which can always come in handy in case you abandon the full node project).
If price is really such a big concern, they can even get hardware for free, like look on eBay & similar for trashed laptops where mostly the screen is broken - there you go, saved 100 bucks off a Raspi setup. SSD / HDD you might want to buy new, but at that point it's just one single component left to buy. If you can't afford an SSD, 1TB HDDs are dirt cheap in 2021 and people might give them away too, if you ask around. I find them used everywhere for 20€.
The cost of hardware is not the only cost of running a full node. Users must also have an internet connection that is sufficient to handle block downloads and the initial blockchain sync. For most of the "first world", this is not an issue as users will have an existing broadband connection they use and need for other reasons. There are "data caps" in some parts of the world that limit the amount of data a customer can transfer per month without paying an overage fee. If you have a data cap, there is a good chance the 350 GB initial blockchain download will exceed your cap, as there are very few legitimate reasons to need to download that much data in one month (the initial blockchain download is probably the only legitimate reason for most non-business users of an internet connection).
1130  Other / Politics & Society / Re: The vaccination issue is not bipolar on: October 10, 2021, 02:15:19 AM
For the overwhelming majority of people, they should get the Covid vaccine (and most other vaccines). But it should be their choice to do so. Government mandates are wrong and are not going to convince many people to get the vaccine.

In order to increase confidence in the vaccine, the costs (potential side effects and their prevalence) should be clearly disclosed, along with the chances of preventing various types of instances of the disease it is preventing, and the potential negative outcomes for people who are unvaccinated and catch the disease it is preventing. This information can be customized for an individual’s specific condition. For almost everyone, the above information will indicate the person should get the vaccine, but again the individual should be the one to decide.

For Covid specifically, if you don’t get the vaccine, you are almost certainly going to get Covid.

The description of how vaccines work in the OP is incorrect.
1131  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Where to get large amount of testnet coins? (~2.5BTC) on: October 09, 2021, 02:38:16 PM
Is there any good reason why so many miners are apparently mining it?
They must have an incentive. I can't really believe that paying the hosting of a faucet website plus the mining costs are less than the ad revenue, but they must have a profit somehow, otherwise they wouldn't mine. That profit may not be translated into money.

My best guess is that testnet is used to test custom mining software, and any improvements and/or bugfixes to mining software. It may also be used to test things intended to reduce orphaned blocks of the miner.
1132  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: The Lightning Network FAQ on: October 09, 2021, 01:11:45 PM
and there’s almost no high volume Bitcoin services/exchanges that accept it.
Here I think you're wrong, if nothing changed in the last weeks then we have the following popular exchanges accepting LN:

- Bitfinex (see here)
- OkEx
- Bitnovo (leading Spanish exchange)
- FixedFloat - Changelly-like exchange
- HodlHodl - P2P
- Paxful - P2P

OkEx and Paxful have added it in the last months, while Bitfinex accepts it since 2019 or 2020. There are a lot of other smaller exchanges and services, see this list (in Spanish) and this website. Kraken seems to be in process of adopting it, although I'm not up to date about the current progress.
Bitrefill also accepts LN payments.

Exchanges accepting LN will result in more traders engage in arbitrage, and I don't think will result in a lot more adoption of LN. Services and merchants accepting LN is what will really drive adoption.
1133  Other / Meta / Re: How to buy a membership on the forum? on: October 09, 2021, 02:32:15 AM
The OP clearly wants to buy a copper membership. No one is going to spend almost $3 million to obtain features on a forum they just registered an account on.

Since the OPs question was answered, we can lock this thread.
1134  Economy / Speculation / Re: Summer dip?!, December price outcome? ---> JOIN and guess the price GO! on: October 08, 2021, 03:19:05 PM
Prediction overview

158. $12,200 PrimeNumber7
...

249. $68,655 tweetious

250. $70,000 philipma1957

251. $72,046 theymos



...

341. $420,000 pooya87

<>

I see this as
 
69328 to 71022  I win

I know that pennies can alter what I am saying, but I wanted to understand basic rules for the winner.


I calculate your winning range to be between $69,237.51 and $71,022.99, so yes you are correct.
1135  Economy / Economics / Re: Do you think Bitcoin will be added to the VIX? on: October 08, 2021, 02:10:07 PM
The VIX is an index of options that measure the expected volatility of the S&P 500 index. The VIX does not measure any individual stock price or even the options price of any individual stock.
1136  Other / Meta / Re: Merit cycling club? on: October 07, 2021, 10:12:26 PM
I think Foxpup will only let people who have tons of merit "join" the "club" (in the top x in terms of merit received). All that is involved is that those who are members are paid to wear an avatar. I am fairly confident no actual merit is exchange.

TBH, the "club" is an example of someone who has way more money than they know what to do with, that gets spent trolling someone who in all likelihood has left the forum.
1137  Bitcoin / Mining speculation / Re: 2021, time for a new general & diff speculation thread... on: October 07, 2021, 01:39:14 PM

Well they state their stats are only about 1/3 of the global hash rate, and assume that all other 2/3 of mining is distributed the same.
Clearly incorrect:

So BitFury's own mining farms, for example, match those 4 pools they listed? No.
There are plenty of block finders that are specific to their region, and in no way distributed like the 4 pools they use.

Someone clearly had a deadline to produce results and simply extrapolated the 1/3 they were only able to get ...
Do you have some specific data point(s) to suggest that these pools are not representative of the entire population of miners?

BitFury is one entity that is not representative of the network as a whole. The same is true for any other individual miner.

In terms of the number of blocks found in any given difficulty period, those pools are statically significant to all blocks found. 

It is very unusual to survey an entire population to find out authoritative information about a population.
1138  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Can I just run a pruned node without downloading historical data? on: October 07, 2021, 12:50:12 PM
Forgive me, Toxic Maxis, but is there an implementation of Bitcoin Core where I can only download the most recent 2GB of blocks?

Furthermore, I have another idea.

Is it possible to build a full node that stores only the latest UTXO set and the latest 2016 blocks for difficulty adjustment?

If I store all current UTXOs and the latest 2016 blocks, is it to all intents and purposes, the same as storing the entire 350GB block chain?
No, this is not possible.

Each new block that is found is a derivative of the previous block, and every block before it. In order to validate if a block is valid or not, you need to know if all inputs spent in that block are valid, and the only way to know if an input is valid is by at one point looking at all previous blocks. If your node has never looked at all previous blocks, it will have no way of knowing the UTXO set.

One solution might be to change the bitcoin protocol so that blocks must contain a hash of the UTXO set so that someone has the ability to run a full node without processing the entire blockchain.

Quote
the pruned blockchain contains data relevant to your wallet
hence other nodes cannot really give you "filtered" data

Do I have to start a new wallet in order to run Bitcoin core?
What if I just want to use Bitcoin core as a block explorer?

I just want to run a full node where I can just type in a certain public key, and it tells me which UTXOs are associated with this key. Basically a local version of blockchain.com/explorer
If you want to use a full node as anything resembling a block explorer, you must store the entire blockchain. When you run a pruned node, you are disregarding the history of all transactions, and are keeping a list of all unspent outputs that can be part of a block, plus a portion of the recent blockchain in case of a reorg.

If all you want are unspent outputs, you can run a pruned node, but this will omit a lot of information that pretty much all other block explorers provide.
1139  Other / Meta / Re: LoyceV's: Follow users on Bitcointalk.org (posts and/or topics) on: October 07, 2021, 12:31:13 PM
"Hmm. We’re having trouble finding that site. We can’t connect to the server at loyce.club."
I just noticed this, and I don't know why Sad
It seems that all your services are down. Your 'home page' and search page for viewing unedited posts are available, but all pages with actual data are inaccessible.
1140  Other / Meta / Re: Hit 120 Activity, Still Remain "Member" on: October 06, 2021, 07:47:27 PM
wow, it looks like I have to farm merit now.

any tips?
Don't try to farm merit. That is frowned upon around here.

You should put effort into your posts, and make interesting posts. If you do, you should receive merit over time.
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