I have no plans to change anything else that deals with rewards or things of that nature. The only exception will be the change to allow stakes to mature and being staking after 1 day.  I thinking about getting that out as version 2.1 for EOY and have the hard fork set for 4 or 5 months later. Like April 2018 ish. But I have some other changes I want to get to first.



Volume is only what we make of it. I try to buy and sell just about every day to help out both side.

Who is going to be the developer, admin, coin swapper for any of this? 

Hint, it's not me...


Is there anyone who cares about CAPs that has any experience with actually doing any development work? Other then myself?  Speak now..

So this will fork off the current bitcoin chain 15.1? And integrate PoS with it?

Lots of challenges with this one, but it could be a top 10 coin if done correctly. What PoS technology will you use? PPC  or something different?

Yes just a double spend attack. Cryptopia shares some of the blame by only getting 20 confirmations.

Any one got any plans to Fork BTC 15.1 fro PoW + PoS Coin? with entire block chain and air drop like BCH.

5% Yearly Stake, 10 min block time, SHA256 I guess?

I think it would take a top 10 spot in no time.

Nope, no 30% correction, maybe a 10% at the best, but it is def taking off!

I am looking at each of the times BTC "bubbled"


#1 From a base of .80 to a high of $35, back a new base of $5-10  (2011)

#2 From a base of $15 to a high of $200, back to a new base of $100-110 (2012 13)

#3 From a base of $100 to a high of $1150, back to a new base of 500-600 (2013-14)

#4 From a base of $800 to a high of 8000?( I actually guess 10k), back to a new base of  4k? (2016-17)

#5 From a base of 5k to a high of 50K back to new base of 30k? (2019 -21?)??

No, you only need to be able to generate blocks faster then the main chain, in your own private side chain. Then introduce those blocks into the main chain after you have sent funds and traded them. This will cause orphans that will back out your transactions that were sent. Just have to be sure you shut off the wallet that sent the funds, so it will not roll back and re-send like the rest of the honest clients. Then you restore from backup and re-sync to the "new" main chain. Wash, rinse and repeat.

Thank you!

I will try to find some time to figure out the best way to fork and credit. I have some ideas but getting a workable copy that all clients everywhere can agree on could prove difficult. But we'll see. Absolutely no promises on time lines or even if. But I will give it some of my current brain allocation.

Can someone reach out to Cryptopia and figure out exactly how much they are down? Also if they will give it, the CAP address used to deposit the funds and the BTC wallet used to withdraw.

I'll check back tomorrow or Friday.

Here the thing guys. I have very little vested interest right now in CAPs. I own less then a mill.  A fork will such as this will take many many hours to code and coordinate. And even with a higher confirmations an attack is still possible due to the lower difficulty.  Unless the checkpoint server is revived.

I'm not looking for a hand out. Just being realistic here.

I would much rather have someone else get their hands dirty, and I will help guide and review their work.

Here are the raw transactions that are stuck in memory pool likely some are from the attacker.


22:32:54

[
"10f7a80fe72e5ad48d5d172a1a904b6fa40012e0cf1cfb5bf1467af3ca07d195",
"1289f0f88003755ee7ce273921e38261dc0f06ac9a4ed416b9d831ed465bf17c",
"3acca49ed0a83d629aeaf9f37c942bb782067b45f88ca8513e6a78fe9d6244ae",
"4a9614f40c799844bc8f94bdecb9e89eceb53fbd7438e4099a34d29b60fe87df",
"666ebc2a44807dca473bf4a1d8dee2f4c93e2ee7fb649b95a376629b5363faed",
"7e88dfab3869e1e3b72083a2095abb6786180f9b23dfed9a381db4f51cfb1bf3",
"84699f32090e9be0a33fa43d2bffce25492e7e16033d702e65395632326f93df",
"986191ffece0d83201d7a02fc1fecf92120d3048b3dcac3ad6b08581f421d012",
"99da090238fb02c5fdd8d0ac8213db06aac1175a18e33e5d6bdb398362f70980",
"9a1fedf937ee9e9552829e0bf53f8cf2f0429eac0511ab30c74b6c5dcd98e503",
"9e85c2eb93e044e0cf4fd8a1f176735e01f970e835bbf12ceccb41be5e14544f",
"a49e55e6727af24ec7daf020b55d3a58a7dc3b6d077600b989b77647a1645241",
"beeafc90892c3e784596c6b43adc03f0a4caf049fe485721f1641af94e82bf0c",
"ca960049fbeb55cd43dc2d18616ebacba3b9efe84df567d0da8c700a20cf48f4",
"cacd94ec0c1ffc567829cc9b36433bc62098521d1c20846ec44230990982763c",
"de0b4c4b4854f7fce8b4ee7fb4db30f5d97ed67dcd1d3fb0cf0c092efdff062b",
"f6e3a2a7f284aec8728396d5af457d292869ddcd8c6d1adf10e48162a6494f85",
"f837b7bbf9ce772789101c04a45d3d9f2d58e9ac3d0373e591972ebb95577f15",
"fac00f435ff915fe37630a044d5068cda793ed0f8828869f446cd6c9e6560552"
]

You can get more info on these by using


22:29:05

gettransaction 1289f0f88003755ee7ce273921e38261dc0f06ac9a4ed416b9d831ed465bf17c


22:29:05

{
"txid" : "1289f0f88003755ee7ce273921e38261dc0f06ac9a4ed416b9d831ed465bf17c",
"version" : 1,
"time" : 1510072305,
"locktime" : 0,
"vin" : [
{
"txid" : "031eb913ceaf82d7e1211feae13c0ca220e4d164b2b31cf4ba474bef351845a2",
"vout" : 1,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "3044022026c5c4fb8a0ec2075dda4980eb0c2fce365f5809187a05dd6de9a59fd4af1f27022055b 5fbc2b6fff5df78244364723be74a86b71610091740ae801c693d4ce52b0d01 03347bd018538c3cda1f6dbccb920e0757d2ca1a39eb532580a39fec189474eff5",
"hex" : "473044022026c5c4fb8a0ec2075dda4980eb0c2fce365f5809187a05dd6de9a59fd4af1f2702205 5b5fbc2b6fff5df78244364723be74a86b71610091740ae801c693d4ce52b0d012103347bd01853 8c3cda1f6dbccb920e0757d2ca1a39eb532580a39fec189474eff5"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "25722ddc08f6912121b4ccb100653f3e7fc1be1f47d1cc2101320aace62452ad",
"vout" : 1,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "304502210092d46600035b6704006b511653069996b864d0d0a43105eb0bdf4703aa0e750d02201 95ed9afe70c6e3910565c3b036dd255bb239a5e63e0c52f68a6b2b3ae6d6be701 03fe273b60c4a5efb606e82fdbccc59a3e3f64f3a6458c5088ac7abedd711b1a86",
"hex" : "48304502210092d46600035b6704006b511653069996b864d0d0a43105eb0bdf4703aa0e750d022 0195ed9afe70c6e3910565c3b036dd255bb239a5e63e0c52f68a6b2b3ae6d6be7012103fe273b60 c4a5efb606e82fdbccc59a3e3f64f3a6458c5088ac7abedd711b1a86"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "add88e6f76f41968bd5e52612987258cfe5e5d1b864f636c3634860a96ec9183",
"vout" : 0,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "304502204601e2b6179619d518e5521af6de71c26eb6d64e6b1a7c56d9dbd7984cb50d37022100b 11d885b939bd1e2d589dd01241c9fb7cf29acc55cbb2148e2acd283c5919d8e01 039c099389f7346eb9924776ec404d50d2dde4718bae1c6fdea6a6da2ae9342da9",
"hex" : "48304502204601e2b6179619d518e5521af6de71c26eb6d64e6b1a7c56d9dbd7984cb50d3702210 0b11d885b939bd1e2d589dd01241c9fb7cf29acc55cbb2148e2acd283c5919d8e0121039c099389 f7346eb9924776ec404d50d2dde4718bae1c6fdea6a6da2ae9342da9"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "fecd8410bf752101415a0e6035da6d1d65d1e8e1b02f6a9419c567f95987e779",
"vout" : 0,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "304502207554b4d02e595a397833e94bba88dcc941f3214b9b9e75a6c1390390e0969406022100c 945fc33f7a3eeb6b80df6b496cc1d964e6004bf32c07dd50380778a794a0dfc01 03347bd018538c3cda1f6dbccb920e0757d2ca1a39eb532580a39fec189474eff5",
"hex" : "48304502207554b4d02e595a397833e94bba88dcc941f3214b9b9e75a6c1390390e096940602210 0c945fc33f7a3eeb6b80df6b496cc1d964e6004bf32c07dd50380778a794a0dfc012103347bd018 538c3cda1f6dbccb920e0757d2ca1a39eb532580a39fec189474eff5"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "35cd4a7255045b77d3362609e8c03e59875042cb3e98cd7757b316625a40a17d",
"vout" : 1,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "3045022100c3216d33cc1fbdde4d8deb9d47a4059dc44188521d1931a818e25a27e4915ccb02207 eac75f72de4b9c102db49884fe776791695f22fa26221cbeae1a343de8404d901 02d8af2f9226bfe0ad65cdf87457e90a2301b762d9377c1a15af738dd94ab3436e",
"hex" : "483045022100c3216d33cc1fbdde4d8deb9d47a4059dc44188521d1931a818e25a27e4915ccb022 07eac75f72de4b9c102db49884fe776791695f22fa26221cbeae1a343de8404d9012102d8af2f92 26bfe0ad65cdf87457e90a2301b762d9377c1a15af738dd94ab3436e"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "fae100ac8b26552c66d618092ce5ee413cbfcba276888c922ed66e5481180457",
"vout" : 0,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "3045022100f9e72052da6a6aa69cd5ec19dc336494061497d6c88aaaf855132d9ff21bb17202206 278ff8fc02a4042d614d9132762f569dee16a77464425c43b634a492ecd96a001 039c099389f7346eb9924776ec404d50d2dde4718bae1c6fdea6a6da2ae9342da9",
"hex" : "483045022100f9e72052da6a6aa69cd5ec19dc336494061497d6c88aaaf855132d9ff21bb172022 06278ff8fc02a4042d614d9132762f569dee16a77464425c43b634a492ecd96a00121039c099389 f7346eb9924776ec404d50d2dde4718bae1c6fdea6a6da2ae9342da9"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "bce42e28964feac869d48a65495f9910234d0d7d3c09c8a83a47db8100417fc2",
"vout" : 1,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "3045022073fc59f54e57b7acc53b51cecd43c16ef4ea2cfe8514c6972dbaf5fe9c2863be022100a 02bf568ddd9b41d70265366802522ac89c7d8cfca476c6942ab83c91b867c0201 03347bd018538c3cda1f6dbccb920e0757d2ca1a39eb532580a39fec189474eff5",
"hex" : "483045022073fc59f54e57b7acc53b51cecd43c16ef4ea2cfe8514c6972dbaf5fe9c2863be02210 0a02bf568ddd9b41d70265366802522ac89c7d8cfca476c6942ab83c91b867c02012103347bd018 538c3cda1f6dbccb920e0757d2ca1a39eb532580a39fec189474eff5"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "41f360c327e4fd619f153b8ef5c9c89d9abfb41cb8892e488459d873d7423a2d",
"vout" : 0,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "304402206d9fcb0f3aa0b32e50873e2e545c0ba8029e5bcd7a175ad5fb03d4c3e2d7ee8402205cc f05a728c688d830485fd2b84635bbbd83a5e643b9ba196e4ce5869a67cf9601 03fe273b60c4a5efb606e82fdbccc59a3e3f64f3a6458c5088ac7abedd711b1a86",
"hex" : "47304402206d9fcb0f3aa0b32e50873e2e545c0ba8029e5bcd7a175ad5fb03d4c3e2d7ee8402205 ccf05a728c688d830485fd2b84635bbbd83a5e643b9ba196e4ce5869a67cf96012103fe273b60c4 a5efb606e82fdbccc59a3e3f64f3a6458c5088ac7abedd711b1a86"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "dbe369d8e1ae4d0f1703ef5464b63a6e1cddf9e805feeb2d8e0c06034172c6e9",
"vout" : 0,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "3045022100dfbe535cf4ed8e9bad27228412518aa253a7798bdb1c3c8723859e50f10c7ee702206 d244710b2ef847ee31e505006277649cd3fed1e3a81426074b88debbc1b54c601 02d8af2f9226bfe0ad65cdf87457e90a2301b762d9377c1a15af738dd94ab3436e",
"hex" : "483045022100dfbe535cf4ed8e9bad27228412518aa253a7798bdb1c3c8723859e50f10c7ee7022 06d244710b2ef847ee31e505006277649cd3fed1e3a81426074b88debbc1b54c6012102d8af2f92 26bfe0ad65cdf87457e90a2301b762d9377c1a15af738dd94ab3436e"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
},
{
"txid" : "4f3a7cc45100c8e11005d4c30f49d7983d54fc9320485ec6248a4a0ecac17dee",
"vout" : 1,
"scriptSig" : {
"asm" : "3044022031edd51d464f039de570723430ea198d73a435d20f7a66947ab1a026bf2e97f502206b0 f7a1708e4942423560daa32621a937b5eda4b981c65a05a16aae36f20555401 02d8af2f9226bfe0ad65cdf87457e90a2301b762d9377c1a15af738dd94ab3436e",
"hex" : "473044022031edd51d464f039de570723430ea198d73a435d20f7a66947ab1a026bf2e97f502206 b0f7a1708e4942423560daa32621a937b5eda4b981c65a05a16aae36f205554012102d8af2f9226 bfe0ad65cdf87457e90a2301b762d9377c1a15af738dd94ab3436e"
},
"sequence" : 4294967295
}
],
"vout" : [
{
"value" : 3629093.35064800,
"n" : 0,
"scriptPubKey" : {
"asm" : "OP_DUP OP_HASH160 ba8412a59986e98cd36b576cf379a10680e3f6aa OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG",
"reqSigs" : 1,
"type" : "pubkeyhash",
"addresses" : [
"EyViNxLswJm8Ar8KT3MTPm6hfMrjXHmtCW"
]
}
}
],
"confirmations" : 0
}

Here is what I see

11/06/17 17:57:59 REORGANIZE: Disconnect 42 blocks; e35445fd1cf134cdb6b2..8a1aa1295cbc8d4da03c
11/06/17 17:57:59 REORGANIZE: Connect 42 blocks; e35445fd1cf134cdb6b2..68eedbe6232c3dbe800e

11/07/17 16:55:53 REORGANIZE: Disconnect 40 blocks; dea9d90d049f7381f04d..c1aea3fa17ce6a1e086f
11/07/17 16:55:53 REORGANIZE: Connect 38 blocks; dea9d90d049f7381f04d..f121db98fe160a3e9fad

11/07/17 20:22:06 REORGANIZE: Disconnect 66 blocks; 2984fa933fb73634e09f..209d73a5b25f85abd668  <-- more information below. Start attack block 3257195, end at 3257306
11/07/17 20:22:06 REORGANIZE: Connect 55 blocks; 2984fa933fb73634e09f..95ffbad623fef04e9979

11/07/17 23:13:54 REORGANIZE: Disconnect 53 blocks; cac1f4c801c794d16128..c754c0acb61553f96742
11/07/17 23:13:54 REORGANIZE: Connect 52 blocks; cac1f4c801c794d16128..6f41da4021c1b9dce626

Some of the addressed that orphaned 50+blocks are:
EzxZVKo35FZ635GBmDe5vj4bcAKvuMwEaR
EoaP4PUJ4jYcjQ5E6C9ZUwC5HKp5hGXDyP
EoEpzd2m5XAqBF9rJr9PuwJiSAc5hTqUxH
EkNeTRq3JsVXAgidZzfGP5nQ1RpdhZuKRg
Ez4A1NGN5wgViDrdG6QhWH4zFxyfHWYANb
EsYcK6Xx4M71EeZuPC5QSmEgP66jQYVWEA
Eyj1spUYKZiA5Te9gvQdPkVCrAYSKSkFhi
EzxZVKo35FZ635GBmDe5vj4bcAKvuMwEaR
F3f3QMuWsMR2f2R8cv3VkFvyqgFE5WwNTU
EqkNZUYbHEcxUyN6Gk3MZXYNRvmeFFSBVV
EzxZVKo35FZ635GBmDe5vj4bcAKvuMwEaR
F57UgaqSw5B7wqiYBnVBaxDU6LZPo9siYG
F5cUki3P2jnUTcy9kUZdB7ULrabz4fTJWw
EpYAChLfAUZtfavH7NTq3qoaMhxGYhogAg
F5AU5NWzVcL5iGaokoHTjqMKCk1CsK1zkz
EsjUkMTHVBehJ8K3tbtxyHY7gUU7Z2p5Ab
Exwgm8rCZhqb6gsYRR7ZRtBVHawxANj6K3
...

All blocks were 9,000 and aged ~28 day.
11/07/17 20:25:36 SetBestChain: new best=1323d756f7a135020f0e  height=3257263  trust=177422596823199  date=11/07/17 20:07:47
11/07/17 20:25:37 SetBestChain: new best=ca1d308d01aae34ed0b1  height=3257264  trust=177422879602637  date=11/07/17 20:08:15
11/07/17 20:25:38 SetBestChain: new best=b776461c5584989f354e  height=3257265  trust=177423163694096  date=11/07/17 20:08:12
11/07/17 20:25:38 SetBestChain: new best=127907630a1fc53785b3  height=3257266  trust=177423447785555  date=11/07/17 20:08:27
11/07/17 20:25:39 SetBestChain: new best=8e76a6b932d9dea1090c  height=3257267  trust=177423733733907  date=11/07/17 20:08:53
11/07/17 20:25:40 SetBestChain: new best=e0f77d510de2ddd9f697  height=3257268  trust=177424021092258  date=11/07/17 20:09:09
11/07/17 20:25:41 SetBestChain: new best=5db4bb9360c8da60a441  height=3257269  trust=177424310286999  date=11/07/17 20:09:26
11/07/17 20:25:42 SetBestChain: new best=2d80db92a880a103c2db  height=3257270  trust=177424601287589  date=11/07/17 20:09:24
11/07/17 20:25:43 SetBestChain: new best=be22bae6a9c67fcf769f  height=3257271  trust=177424892288179  date=11/07/17 20:09:40
11/07/17 20:25:44 SetBestChain: new best=964175e8a86608285a41  height=3257272  trust=177425185148389  date=11/07/17 20:09:17
11/07/17 20:25:44 SetBestChain: new best=7cb5debab368fb10156b  height=3257273  trust=177425478008599  date=11/07/17 20:10:23
11/07/17 20:25:45 SetBestChain: new best=fc43194fff4ca8436870  height=3257274  trust=177425770615513  date=11/07/17 20:10:45
11/07/17 20:25:46 SetBestChain: new best=32cc9d3dd09bbcdb6806  height=3257275  trust=177426064835819  date=11/07/17 20:10:57
11/07/17 20:25:47 SetBestChain: new best=9b8f3b3dff02ba06ff7c  height=3257276  trust=177426361108427  date=11/07/17 20:11:20
11/07/17 20:25:48 SetBestChain: new best=7c64ce8508d6bb797c21  height=3257277  trust=177426658971533  date=11/07/17 20:11:32
11/07/17 20:25:49 SetBestChain: new best=222d80c603b2fca0c546  height=3257278  trust=177426958912367  date=11/07/17 20:11:48
11/07/17 20:25:50 SetBestChain: new best=ea6c36f11f9c296804ea  height=3257279  trust=177427260769976  date=11/07/17 20:11:08
11/07/17 20:25:50 SetBestChain: new best=24221c53cbef9a42ae06  height=3257280  trust=177427562627585  date=11/07/17 20:12:19
11/07/17 20:25:51 SetBestChain: new best=ad36da80cdedbda91a7a  height=3257281  trust=177427864006854  date=11/07/17 20:12:10
11/07/17 20:25:52 SetBestChain: new best=a8ff5aeaea378a2a5fa0  height=3257282  trust=177428165386123  date=11/07/17 20:12:52
11/07/17 20:25:53 SetBestChain: new best=5ac90196cf70a1fb4566  height=3257283  trust=177428467550279  date=11/07/17 20:13:23
11/07/17 20:25:54 SetBestChain: new best=86c033b0ed8ccbc9159b  height=3257284  trust=177428770984485  date=11/07/17 20:13:34
11/07/17 20:25:55 SetBestChain: new best=f78d467bb9c8c4a67505  height=3257285  trust=177429076579793  date=11/07/17 20:13:03
11/07/17 20:25:56 SetBestChain: new best=8fd75a1ec9833cfb90bc  height=3257287  trust=177429673078549  date=11/07/17 20:20:41
11/07/17 20:25:57 SetBestChain: new best=7a639579712cc9631eff  height=3257288  trust=177429964486757  date=11/07/17 20:20:57
11/07/17 20:25:58 SetBestChain: new best=11c16bc919120073226d  height=3257289  trust=177430257757065  date=11/07/17 20:21:26
11/07/17 20:25:59 SetBestChain: new best=3da3ad324ba1b1bfddde  height=3257290  trust=177430552345344  date=11/07/17 20:21:24
11/07/17 20:26:00 SetBestChain: new best=8e889dcda69241f049b8  height=3257291  trust=177430846933623  date=11/07/17 20:21:39
11/07/17 20:26:00 SetBestChain: new best=6b40fc591f3226df1207  height=3257292  trust=177431143447486  date=11/07/17 20:21:21
11/07/17 20:26:01 SetBestChain: new best=484755eef698bbe57c0b  height=3257293  trust=177431439961349  date=11/07/17 20:21:43
11/07/17 20:26:02 SetBestChain: new best=b69c27867ca372ecfb55  height=3257294  trust=177431738110306  date=11/07/17 20:22:46


I'm sure someone with some slopping could figure out where the coins were sent and by whom.

Not much I can do to help.

Options are:
- To roll back the chain past the first attack. We are looking at a loss of multiple days, most client will have issues will cause a lot of stress.  But damage is already done.
- Create a fork, that will credit Cryptopia address the coins that were lost. Assuming they were the one targeted.

To prevent this, we need a checkpoint server or much higher confirmations and difficulty.

I can run a checkpoint server, but I can't foot the bill for a VPS to run it. So I would need the community to help with that, or I can give the key to someone else to run. But if that someone does not understand the security,responsibility and how to safety use it, it could kill the chain.

Hmmm  Getting closer.. ?? :-)

The Chain is available on hobonickels.info if you want to save time. It will take you up to about 3 or 4 weeks ago.

So I did look at a few other wallets. All of them use getblance the same way. When a coin is actively staking it is not part of wallet balance.  Which does make sense, as during this time, it is not spendable, until it is fully confirmed or orphaned.

I don't know how you handle this with other coins, but I would be glad to have a look and make adjustments if it is appropriate to do so.

Looks like an error in the qmake file. I see if I can get it corrected here soon.

In the mean time, since you already compiled the headless version you have the leveldb library in place.  So you should be able to comment out that line in the qmake. Then once it creates your Makefile you should be able to just do a make.

The reason they may consider them broken is because I turned off flash miming. So they can't just send 100% hash power can expect to get all the blocks.  Anyway looking at the explorer I still see about 15-20% of blocks coming from PoW. So it still work fine, especially for solo!!

BTW. Since the block chain is much slower now, PoW will exist for about 1 more year. So plenty of time to put a GAW miner or 2 on the network and just let em go.



IMHO the only thing that keeps some people away is the memory usage. I have plans and a road map to address this. Not an easy fix, and won't happen overnight. But it is in my sights for sure.

Also that last month or 2 has been totally dominated by real work. Huge projects going on and all extra time has been spent on that. It is starting to come to a close, so I should be able to get back into more wallet development here soon enough.

But things have been looking pretty good from the network and wallet perspective. So I've been watching that to see how things will go.

Thanks for this!

a6adc45e7b11a6d4ec6f9f395019c1fb38f962e9b5edee6d9d958959197c75d2

hmm ok, thanks I will look into the bug report.

I'll check at some point and figure out why getbalance doesn't show staking.  Fairly sure it is the same as other staking coins, but I will take your word for it, that it is different.

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