How does the stake will fall? I do not quit day-trading for entering in a "expensive and high-staking-is-over" world... When will the stake go down?
If you go to the console in your wallet and type getdifficulty, you'll see the proof of work and proof of stake difficulty scores. Right now POS is low because there aren't many coins out there with even fewer staking. Inevitably, more will stake and increase the difficulty thus lowering your stake reward, which I believe could drop to 1%/year, theoretically. Hopefully we'll all be rich by then.  Therefore if I were starting today, I would not so much worry about the price because future increases plus compound interest will still reward you handsomely. Thanks for this very satisfying answer. So, interest rate is unrelated to mining difficulty, but more to absolute number of staked coins? I still have a hard time believing that a coins lunched 6 months ago still has so few staking. Unrelated: does cryptsy have a "24h volume" indicator, like Poloniex or Mintpal? I can't believe how unreadable Cryptsy is - if it was not for the huge amount of coin they have, I think they would have ceased business long ago. |
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It's expected that prices move in both directions. It doesn't change anything for me, since I'm in for the long run! I still believe Tranz is doing great work with constant new releases of code. And the community here is one of the best I know so far. People here are more mature and I like that. True. The worst immaturity level I found was Blackcoin. I hope the people that got in at a higher price point were long term investors, if so this price drop won't affect them as much. +1. That's why I am waiting to buy some TEK. I will buy at half the current price, because 22k seems to be the "natural" price for TEK (or even less, I'd love to be able to calculate a median price out of Cryptsy's charts. For HBN, it is harder to tell, the natural price seem to be growing, but I'd say around 20k, so presently it is a bit overvalued (I bought yesterday, at around natural price though). The upside is that new investors can now find a cheaper entry point. the rich list top 10 addresses didn't move much so I guess that the "big" investors are still holding for long term returns. Top 10 are usually exchanges. People might be looking for an "antidote". The harsh reality is that there is none! Like with anything and everything, for things to go up in value (without any pump/dump actions) is through consistent work and dedication. Innovation is also a key factor to adding value. I believe this is achievable with HBN. Since the people involved tend to be in for the long term and consistent work factors. Innovation comes once in a while! Question: how come that newer coins get pagination in the hundreds (or thousand, in the case of blackcoin), whilst long-timers with an active (or very active) market like HBN and TEK have only pagination in the ten? TEK is particularly worthy of note: two pages from 2013 to April 2014, then pagination decuples. I am the Mintcoin manager and it has 700+ posts in less than four month (by the way, if you looking for a coin with almost no volatility, MINT is a top contender - not that most holders are happy with that). A closer look and people realized it was an organized pump, search the forum for the thread. I can't find that thread. You are reading it right not  It is just that the "organisation" is not usual. This was not a malicious pump (except if we delve into conspirary theory and consider tokyoghetto is the malicious pumper, covering it with seemingly genuine posts, but I don't buy it). It was a "natural" pump: good posts about a coin, people gaining confidence thanks to quality. But this makes me somewhat pessimistic, because the way I see it: Malicious intentions: pump & dump Benevolent intentions: pump and dump Sad, hey? Maybe tokyoghetto and (other quality posters for other coins) should had something like"it is very possible that my post are read by numerous people and this will raise the price. In that case, if you plan to invest, please be careful about when to invest. Either you plan to keep it for very long and in that case it doesn't matter much or wait for the prices to go down. I would hate to be responsible for you holding the bag". Why I feel people always try to find conspiracy theories? The same way people have gambler's fallacy or consider the casino are rigged: they try to find a pattern and when they cannot find it (either because it is beyond their reach or because it really is random), they scapegoat on conspiracy. That's human nature: we fear the unknown. The counter this fear we look for explanation and when we can't find one, we invent one (lightning in the sky, losing 6 times in a row, buying high...) Can't you be objective about the actual work and progress going on with HBN? I considered Picasso's Guernica ugly until someone explained it to me. "Ugly" is emotional. Explanation is rational. Same goes with price. Most people (me included, but I am trying to help myself on this) have "epidermic" reaction. I some weeks ago read a paper about the importance of the amygdala in our financial reaction - why we tend to repeat the same mistake even though we know that it is wrong). The text was in French but you can read about Amygdala hijack, it gives some insight (although less than the French text) about this anthropological issue. Plus, the Aversion to loss, another deeply rooted mammalian reaction (maybe some birds too, not sure), easily triggers the amygdala hijack. By the way, rationalists tend to overlook these parts and have an arrogant discours about average people (I'm not implying this is your case, it is just a general observation). This is related to the "Willpower is king" or "weak hands" concept, themselves, I believe related to the old concept of "mind over body". But I derail |
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Hi everyone,
I wanted to buy TEKcoin but with such an outragrous price, I will buy HoboNickel instead. I'm done with day-trading, I lost to much real money woth this. Just buy, keen enjoy. Time to settle down. And maybe, in time, I will get my money back :-)
Tranz, I wanted to thank you for the multiwallet. I am escrow for Mintcoin and I would really need a wallet - unfortunately, dev on mintcoin is not as was as it could be, so I'm stuck with guessing. Maybe one day the multiwallet will be ported to MINT.
I would like to ask a question: both TEK and HBN date from 2013 and still the forum doesn't have that much post (not even 100). Newer coins have pagination in the hundred (700 for MINT, already almost 300 for SHARE, 1500 for BC...
How do you explain that? I know this is not lack of popularity so what? New coins, new mindsets?
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I should have ask the question about TEKcoin privately. Now the price as skyrocketed, no way I can buy any at this price. If it continues, it will soon be as expensive as monero. Too bad, I really like the concept (peace of mind) but at such a price, it is a steal.
Maybe the price will go down. But since I heard the interest rate of TEKcoin will fall too, I getting dubious.
That was too good to be true :/
Fortunately, HBN is getting low in price, time to buy, I guess (although it is still more expensive than before the bubble).
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I can't find information about CENT.
I understood it is a POW/POS currency with higher interest rates than even TEKcoin. Could someone confirm?
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I wanted to buy tekcoin but I changed my mind. With such a price, there is no way. I will buy HBN, TEKcoin is a steal at this price. It was at 36k last time I check and now at 48k. Almost as expensive as monero  Too bad, I really wanted to buy this. Maybe next week... |
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TEK is moving up nicely A bit too nicely for me :/ and stake payouts falling How does the stake will fall? I do not quit day-trading for entering in a "expensive and high-staking-is-over" world... When will the stake go down? |
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- Download source code and untar from the link from presstab
- qmake-qt5 tekcoin-qt-linux.pro && make Thank you. It worked for me. But now, I have the issue of the wallet not synchronising. It did not sync on my Windows VM, but now it does on my Manjaro physical machine. |
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1. i can understand your frustration about day trading. I sometimes day trade cryptos, but then I find myself missing sleep, being anti-social and basically having no life. One way you can build up a "set and forget" portfolio would be to use Hobonickels as a financial tool to build up funds, then invest those funds into other dividend producing assets. You still get to keep your initial HBN core position, and sell some PoS mined coins to invest the BTC in other projects. It doesn't have to be limited to coins. You can buy shares for exchanges like Crypsty, buy shares into mining companies like Petamine, or more traditional investments that pay out dividends in BTC like Rental Starter.
full disclosure: I own shares in Cryptsy and Peta-mine. I do not hold a position in RentalStarter
The reason why I believe high interest works with PoS is because the coins are generated by the network algo, not from other investors. If coin developers want to entice investors, you need to provide the investor with a reason why. High interest also offers investors protection against price fluctuations. Most coin devs are good at only that, coin development. they are not marketers (hence all the shitty named coins) and they are not finance or economy majors ( hence coins with shitty characteristics like coin count and interest). That is why diversifying into places where professionals know what the hell they are doing is crucial to a "set and forget" portfolio.
The bigger your portfolio grows, the more time you will have for yourself.
2. Its hard to compare HBN and TEK, as they are two different asset classes. One big difference is that the higher the interest, the less liquid the asset is, resulting in high volatility. At least in the early stages of the coin. Eventually these coins will lower the interest rate so that it can keep in line with the distribution model. In about a year HBN should lower itself to about 90%, which is still pretty attractive but not as aggressive as 100%. TEK is a beast that should not be taken lightly. Lack of liquidity can make it very difficult to exit large positions, which can result in substantial losses. Trade accordingly.
full disclosure: I own TEKcoins. Thank you tokyoghetto. As usual, your answer is even more interesting than I expected. So, mining companies are worth it? Have to check this. I did know this correlation between interest rate and liquidity. But with such a huge interest, for me price fluctuation is basically a non issue if you in for the long term - and TEKcoin, with a 30 days minting process, is definitely for long term. |
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Je suis le 82ème a avoir rejoint NEM (onglet final list sorted in time of joining)  Et vous ? Moi, j'étais dans la première fournée. 40 page du premier passage. Tiens comme monnaie première (parce que c'est quand même ça, le thread, il y a Bytecoin, le première monnaie Crytptonote. Bon, préminée comme Ixcoin et Tenebrix, mais première quand même. Me fais penser que je devrais mettre Monero comme monnaie avec du potentiel. |
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The four logo I like: 1. The Esperanto-inspired logo, because it relates to something. Other just "look cool" (or not) without any explanation behind it. I don't like the logo itself though, Just the idea to give some meaning to the logo (here, Esperanto is a good idea)  2. "The illusion of a M", for its creativeness. But I looks bulky, heavy, not something I'd like to see in a currency (except if you are talking of the currency of ancient Sparta, which was deliberately difficult to handle) 3. This one is esthatically the one I like the most, but it looks like a superhero logo. Not that kind of feeling I want to convey on a curency  4. Finally, the more classic is the one I am considering the most, at the moment. Granted, it could be refined (you can get a nicer font, a sans-serif would be more adapted  So, to sum it up; - Logo with a meaning - Not "in-your-face" logo. This is a currency, not a videogame - Try to make it creative, like the "illusion of a M" On top of this: this is only about the logo. You can propose a slogan, but it won't be part of the choice and if the logo is adopted, the slogan could not be - and the other way around,n a slogan could be adopted without the logo to accepted). |
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Depends on your version, can't compile it on my ubuntu server since it uses lboost-atomic which isn't available in 1.53 The script is supposed to make a manual install, not to use apt-get. Could you confirm you actually ran the oneliner and it did not work? In that case, I would ask Quanttek to try to improve his own script (the oneliner calls upon a script). |
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My answer here, in order not to derail the main Monero thread: Also IMHO, closed source on the PoW algorithm would be best until several weeks of ramp up is complete so clones are too far behind. Did you read what happened three days ago? Angry community. Look at all coins that suffered of the word "premine" even when the premine was actually used for good things. Same goes for closed-source and accidentel instamine. Crypto holders have been abused so often they do not have much patience for mistakes. The technology behind a project is nothing without a community, something a lot of experts trapped in their ivory tower fail to capture. We can lament this, but that's how it works. Open source good for refining not for innovating Agree, like a lot of major OSS proponents. Not that it is an impasse, though. Not being good doesn't mean being unable - Apple's proprietary' OS X boasted about compressed RAM in Maverick; Linux had it two years before it. So, that's a trend, not a rule. For example, how do you plan to decentralize pools? You will need some innovative leadership on an algorithm for that, lest you end up same as Bitcoin with two pools controlling greater than 50% of the network hash power. Asking tough questions is part of the open source idea. So thank you to highlight the issue. We should have a collaborative feature list somewhere - done Ditto making mining easy enough for grandma to do. Etc. The Monero one-liner is a step in this direction. A script (a mere encapsulation) will soon follow, then porting it to other Unixes and finally to Windows. And finally a GUI. Does anyone know of any innovative project (created many new killer features) that was created by open source (and not open sourced after those innovative features were completed)? Reminds me of something... Thus, almost everything is imitation. The idea of The Persian Letters was taken from The Turkish Spy. Boiardo imitated Pulci, Ariosto imitated Boiardo. The most original minds borrowed from one another. Miguel de Cervantes makes his Don Quixote a fool; but pray is Orlando any other? It would puzzle one to decide whether knight errantry has been made more ridiculous by the grotesque painting of Cervantes, than by the luxuriant imagination of Ariosto. Metastasio has taken the greatest part of his operas from our French tragedies. Several English writers have copied us without saying one word of the matter. It is with books as with the fire in our hearths; we go to a neighbor to get the embers and light it when we return home, pass it on to others, and it belongs to everyone. If the leader (lead developer) of an anonymous coin which successfully threatens the banksters' global hegemony over fiat, is not also anonymous, then he can be coerced by the powers-that-be in numerous ways (e.g. tax audit, trumped up criminal charges on something since there are so many laws everyone of us is breaking a federal or EU law every day, etc). You assume that we are important to the coins. We are not. We are by now by virtue of not having a lot of people in. A good leader is an expendable leader. That's how the guerilla movement work, by the way - you can't cut the head because either there is no head of, like the Lernaean Hydra, another head growths when one is severed. In system administration, we call it SPOF - single point of failure. As long as leader remind they are expendable, there is no single point of failure. Wikileaks would survive the demise of Assange, monero, given enough momentum, would survive the demise of the present team - it happened in the past. You are still right on one point: the leader must be proactive in reminding they are expendable. Otherwise, it would lead to sacralization and this is not good (private interest over general interest). |
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This coin sounds pretty cool.
Can someone explain ring signatures to me?
Thanks eizh made quite an interesting answer on reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/24u04w/how_does_this_compare_to_other_anonymous_and/I wrote a bit about this in the main post on bitcointalk. Reproduced below. It's mildly technical. If you have questions just ask here and I'll answer.
Ring signatures originate from the work of Rivest et al. in 2001 and the implementation in CryptoNote relies in particular on Fujisaki and Suzuki's work on traceable ring signatures. There are two other anonymity implementations currently available or in development. One is ZeroCoin/ZeroCash's use of zero-knowledge proofs. The others are based on gmaxwell's CoinJoin idea (such as mixing services for Bitcoin or the altcoin DarkCoin).
You can read about zero-knowledge proofs here. This is research-level cryptography that hasn't been subjected to years of cryptanalysis, so exploits may emerge down the road. Other issues include the RSA private key used to initiate the accumulator, which must be trusted to be destroyed by the generating party. It also obscures the entire economy, not just sender/receiver identities. This can be problematic if there are bugs that lead to inflation or manipulation because the damage is hidden from everybody.
MRO is more qualitatively similar to mixing implementations like CoinJoin. The differences arise in the departure from the Bitcoin protocol, which allows MRO to use new cryptography to provide decentralized and trustless mixing. The critical problem with mixing services is the need to trust the operators. As an example, blockchain.info's mixer gives the following disclaimer: "However if the server was compromised or under subpoena it could be force to keep logs. If this were to happen although you haven't gained any privacy you haven't lost any either."
The CoinJoin-inspired DarkCoin performs mixing with selected "masternodes" since it still uses ordinary signatures that can be mapped one-to-one. This is an improvement over a more centralized mixing service since a randomly-selected node is less likely to exhibit bad faith (such as keeping logs). However, this approach still relies on the health and good behavior of the nodes, which MRO's more fundamental approach is not vulnerable to.
MRO's ring signatures are also vastly more secure and convenient than CoinJoin because they mix outputs not transactions. This means a transaction doesn't involve waiting around to mix with others. Nor is a user restricted to mixing only if others are spending exactly the same amount. Arbitrary amounts can be sent at any time without the participation of others. This feature makes a timing analysis of the blockchain useless for mapping identities. The degree of anonymity is also a choice rather than decided by the protocol: do you want to be hidden as one among five or one among fifty? The size of the signature grows linearly with the ambiguity so greater anonymity is paid for with higher fees to miners. Also see the ANN How does this compare to other anonymous solutions?Ring signatures originate from the work of Rivest et al. in 2001 and the implementation in CryptoNote relies in particular on Fujisaki and Suzuki's work on traceable ring signatures. There are two other anonymity implementations currently available or in development. One is ZeroCoin/ZeroCash's use of zero-knowledge proofs. The others are based on gmaxwell's CoinJoin idea (such as mixing services for Bitcoin or the altcoin DarkCoin). You can read about zero-knowledge proofs here. This is research-level cryptography that hasn't been subjected to years of cryptanalysis, so exploits may emerge down the road. Other issues include the RSA private key used to initiate the accumulator, which must be trusted to be destroyed by the generating party. It also obscures the entire economy, not just sender/receiver identities. This can be problematic if there are bugs or exploits that lead to inflation or manipulation because the damage is hidden from everybody. MRO is more qualitatively similar to mixing implementations like CoinJoin. The differences arise in the departure from the Bitcoin protocol, which allows MRO to use new cryptography to provide decentralized and trustless mixing. The critical problem with mixing services is the need to trust the operators. As an example, blockchain.info's mixer gives the following disclaimer: "However if the server was compromised or under subpoena it could be force to keep logs. If this were to happen although you haven't gained any privacy you haven't lost any either." The CoinJoin-inspired DarkCoin performs mixing with selected "masternodes" since it still uses ordinary signatures that can be mapped one-to-one. This is an improvement over a more centralized mixing service since a randomly-selected node is less likely to exhibit bad faith (such as keeping logs). However, this approach still relies on the health and good behavior of the nodes, which MRO's more fundamental approach is not vulnerable to. MRO's ring signatures are also far more secure and convenient than CoinJoin because they mix outputs not transactions. This means a transaction doesn't involve waiting around for other senders to mix with. Nor is a user restricted to mixing only if others are sending the same amount. Arbitrary amounts can be sent at any time without anyone else's participation. This feature makes a timing analysis of the blockchain useless for mapping identities. The degree of anonymity is also a choice rather than decided by the protocol: do you want to be hidden as one among five or one among fifty? The size of the signature grows linearly as O(n+1) with the ambiguity so greater anonymity is paid for with higher fees to miners. |
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Hi David, funny you post here now, few hours ago i had a look at your recent activity, in order to recommend a friend to buy some Mint, nice to see you active. Palmdetroit gave me already an interesting answer on this topic: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=292720.msg6174748#msg6174748Also the price of PHS over month shows the interest of stake is neither the same inflation as we know it or interest of a classic bank, more a kind of hybrid, still hard to imagine and no consensus in all the PoS coins. It may more personal choice right now, first i judged Mint also as too high, now i feel good with 50% (i am going to donate this interest for others anyway). I see also Hobo did an interesting way by setting it dynamic, this one, another logarithm or a decision by the community could be the way in a long term (as far i understand palmdetroits statements, the interest can technically changed all the time?). If you look at the current ammount of BC (75mill) and PHS (2mill), the 50% are a good solution to avoid too many coins at early project phase. Only broader adoption over time can help us out or a genius economic mind... Thanks for the link and thanks for your encouragement - ATM, I am busy struggling with the French administration regarding the creation of the Mintcoin Fund . Now I understand better the idea behind MC2 (unrelated to EMC2), to have a variable interest rate - this is something hobonickel did before. Still, I can' seen any reason to favour another coin over TEKcoin (please, don't see it as an agression, PHS holders - I am trying to understand. |
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Sharing has ended. 1,000 + person have got the shares. There will be more person get Mini What does it mean, get Mini? |
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Despite being team manager of Mintcoin, I am new to very high stakes. I thought Mintcoin was crazy high with 20%, I now realise this is not the case.
So pardon my ignorance. Why would you invest in Hobonickel if TEKcoin has an even higher interest? Granted, it goes high but it can also go low. And if your goal is not to sell, why does it matter?
If I can choose with my bank, an offer at 10% interest and another at 15% and that both are equally risky (or risk-free), why would I ever consider the 10% (except fear of a scam)
Probably I misunderstand all of this, thank you to clarify.
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