I love it when people argue points that were never made. I didn't say it was impossible. I don't see any of the three companies making a decent product anymore. They all seem to be in over their head. They could all go bankrupt trying to get something that works, and can be mass produced easily.

your worried about sending out a couple hundred coins by error when you have profited how much off your investors? $100,000 $250,000? $500,000, Get real

the real question is how did they get our real names in the first place I thought the database was destroyed in the hack?

just because the different asic companies don't like each other doesn't mean they aren't scammers, nor does it mean they are competent enough to design something that never has been done before.

seems to imply to me that he won't be buying bonds back, just another scammer who will continue to mine on the 150ghash we helped him buy


or he could always just put the bonds on another exchange wait a few days for the price to collapse to almost nothing and then he will buy them back

So someone starts a passthrough, they are responsible just as much as pirate but those who invest in said passthrough are not? what sense does that make? at least be consistent

6.5 shipped 74110

so when do payouts occur?

So does every company that is running today, so how do you differentiate a valid business vs a ponzi. What does one use as proof? If particular one like our's with no tangible product or place of business. Every company eventually collapses.

Which brings me back to my original idea, when the select few profit too much, that will increase the chance of collapse. Just take a look at hostess they gave the executives 300% raises and lowered the workers pay.

The fact is if mining rewards stopped tomorrow, one of two things would happen. (a) Bitcoin would just about die except for extremists who will mine without a profit, or (b) miners would only accept transactions with high transaction fees. There goes transferring money for almost free across the world. Whether miner income is from transaction fees or inflation the end outcome is no different, just a different way of marketing it (similar to buy 3 get 1 free vs 25% off only reversed) Miners have already decided on what they are willing to work for regardless of technology.

What I'm looking for is a way to reach out to people who think bitcoin is a scam. Not try to convince myself it is not. A large amount of the tech community thinks bitcoin is still a scam/ponzi and I think they are possible the best place to reach out and start increasing our user base.

I also believe bitcoin mining should be used as a marketing tool to get people interested, it should be easy to use, like bitminters client with easily available hardware, not asic devices which will probably be backordered until they are no longer profitable. Then when people have them we need great services to spend them with, but people are unlikely to buy bitcoins when they can use cash or credit card instead. At least until vendors provide discount for bitcoin or only sell via bitcoin. Amazon could start accepting bitcoin tomorrow, and little increase of demand for bitcoin would occur, other than purely speculation based.

What I'm trying to do with this thread is warn people that this thought "ASIC is going to make me filthy rich in just months" does not make our endeavors look more legitimate to the general public, in fact it does just the opposite. Its obvious to me that bitcoin is attracted many more fraudsters and thieves based on this idea of getting rich, than would exist in other circles.


yes but those people who power down are more likely to be small time miners, who once they stop won't look back at bitcoin any time soon.


I understand what your saying here, that mining doesn't matter. But realistically I think it is a very idealistic answer. Its like saying the fed only exists to keep the economy more stable and prevent bubbles/recessions. People do not have a good reason right now to use bitcoin. Most people don't have a problem with paypal/credit cards. Most people do not notice inflation of their fiat currencies. Most do not need to send money half way around the world, and if they do will probably do it at walmart.



I should have clarified I was speaking about price/difficulty not the price directly

my $129 sapphire models from newegg (7/2011 I believe) were dead at the beginning of summer. But since I redid thermal paste to fix heat issues, no warranty.


but back to the op try lower clocks if you still can't get a stable clock try 0.95v and 600 mhz I was able to run one of mine a few more months at those speeds

I think the average person is less interested in the exchange rate and don't think any of my post referred to that. More people are interested in the "free money" idea. Right now the general public is mostly blind to the inflation going on in this and many countries. When we see more hyperinflation, which won't surprise me, more people will care about the exchange rate.

I don't think you understood me at all. I think it will be almost impossible for anyone to mine at a reasonable profit. The hardware is too much of a jump that after the people who "know someone" profit (didn't mean to single out Inaba was using him as an example) the difficulty will be too high for me and you to make our investment back in a reasonable time. Most people are not attracted to bitcoin because of making anonymous low fee transactions. When bitcoin falls again to almost break even mining rates, like November of last year, its bad news. Bad mining returns equals less people learning about bitcoin which is in the end bad for bitcoin. People then think the free money is over, therefore bitcoin is over. Just like they were saying when profitability rates were low last year

that is the exact one I have, wonder why its not on their website. just in case you are wondering I haven't seen any plastic chip off of mine, I'm sure it could happen eventually but nothing to be concerned about unless you move your system all the time

There is no good reason for the asset lists to not have materialized yet. asset holders will pay back their "friends" who they trust and that will be the end of that, just like bitcoinica

even if nefario actually did provide all the asset information, there WILL be asset holders who say they didn't receive it. and then who will you believe

yep, and when I asked why their system would be delayed behind the bitcoin network, I received the same email again, lol

Hello,

Thank you for contacting us. Before we may action your request we require the following information:

Mt.Gox Username:
Sending Address:
Receiving Address:
Amount:
Date/Time of Transfer:

Please be aware that:

When withdrawing or depositing bitcoins into your Mt.Gox account there may occasionally be a delay (1~24 hours) depending on network congestion, your internet connection speed and the time required to get 6 confirmations on the network. If you're sending to your computer's wallet, it's good practice to keep your bitcoin client running so it can download the block chain. For those that may not know the block chain is the complete history of all transactions made on the bitcoin network, and as such it can take some time to update and download the most current block and see the bitcoins in your wallet.

If you aren't seeing the funds after either withdrawing/sending to Mt. Gox from your bitcoin program, please wait 24 hours before contacting us. If your transfer has still not occurred within 48 hours, please lodge a support request so we may begin the process of tracking your bitcoins and reinitiating the transfer.

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. If you have any further enquiries, please do not hesitate to contact Mt.Gox Support either by responding to this email (should the enquiry relate to this ticket) or by using the following support request form:

https://mtgox.zendesk.com/entries/20256702-contact-us

Thanks,

MtGox.com Team

If your like me, you probably first heard about bitcoin because you could earn money with your computer.  Although I don't think bitcoin is a ponzi scheme, I think it does make some sense to see it that way. Just take the last few weeks for instant. In anticipation of the block reward halving prices have mostly stagnated but difficulty has skyrocketed. As if after block halving there will be no more money to be made, like the end of a ponzi. People seem to be mining every coin they can in anticipation of the end and although some are hoarding it seems many are selling to recoup quickly while they still can. Now I understand alot of that is because of anticipation of new hardware.

But if as many asic devices have sold as vendors and some others would like us to believe, I can only see that after a few months people will be dumping coins to make up for the huge increase in difficulty and struggling to make their investment back. Creating a very similar cycle to where we are now, a panic. Which I believe will continue until the cost of asic devices becomes much cheaper and people see it as a good investment again and not something that will only benefit early investors. Unless a discounted used market or major competition between vendors causes a huge price decrease shortly after release it seems to me that we are heading for another several bad months like the end of last year. I think increasing the power of bitcoin mining devices so quickly will cause a bubble in what a miner can earn as profit, I don't think the bitcoin market will be able to handle, short term, terrahashes getting into the hands of someone like Inaba. (does anyone seriously think he will not be the first one to have a bfl asic?)

well just so you know its pointless emailing gox about it, they will send you some automated email about btc deposits taking up to 48 hours. But I've seen deposits take up to about 12 confirms as well.