Good News, I finished the front-end for a darknet ANC/BTC exchange. I expect to have something online before the ZC mainnet  Outstanding! |
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I'm just trying to understand what motivates you (and others) who spend so much effort posting and reposing to this and other threads. If you have no faith in this coin why even bother following the developments and reading the the thread? Why not move on to something you think will succeed? I just don't get it. I can think of a dozen coins I think are complete shit, but you couldn't pay me to spend my time posting in their threads arguing with the various bagholders. What motivates you to spend your time in this thread?
I wouldn't worry about it too much. I think it is the same group of shills that have been attacking Monero. My guess is that it is an organized effort from another Cryptonote coin, Darkcoin, or Bitcoindark to discredit other anonymous cryptocurrencies. +1 If these idiots actually knew anything they would put it out here instead of the vague 'this is shit,' and 'what are this guy's qualifications?' kind of bs. Given many opportunities to demonstrate any kind of actual knowledge about the things they are trying so desperately to discredit, they have done nothing but post the same stupid repetitive crap. 'This is not suitable, or that won't work,' is all they say but they have absolutely nothing to back up the claims. They have no idea at all regarding the things they are claiming. They are most likely cut and paste copycats who are afraid that someone else actually knows what they are doing, and that the scam coins they have forked will be absolutely worthless when ANC's devs current project is complete. If they hold any ANC it's because they know they are fools who are very likely to fail, and they are holding as much of everything else that they can on the off chance that one will hit big and they will finally be able to move out of their moms' basements. My guess is that they are everything they accuse others of being. One thing I have noticed in life is that very little people tend to try to knock others down in order to feel bigger. |
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What are the facts?
The facts are that all you can demonstrate is that there have been unexpected delays, which is common in software development, particularly when new tech is being invented or fine tuned. We all know about the delays. As to your other claims, you have shown no evidence whatsoever. But you did troll with a pic from a very traumatic accident which I personally remember very well. That in itself speaks volumes regarding your character... as if all the unsubstantiated negativity towards Gnosis and his work wasn't enough. I will waste no more time with you... you are ignored. |
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trolling deleted
You have offered absolutely nothing to back up the denunciations you call 'observations.' I have nothing to prove to you. I will not feed you. I merely refute you for the sake of new and/or casual readers. Everything I have read is easily obtainable- if you actually cared to get some facts on ANC. Most relevant info has been placed within a few clicks by those who care to contribute, and are able. What you fail to realize, or choose to ignore, is that if you want to get any traction with the people here, YOU are the one who must prove something. So far you've done the opposite. In fact, your shrill desperation only serves to reinforce the views already held by myself, and I would wager most others here as well. |
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Sheep, looks beyond the tip of your nose, Darkcoin will be open-sourced by the end of the month.
And now we see what's up. Not that we hadn't guessed from the start. |
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All this talk about "vouchers" and other things seems way more confusing than using Zerocoin the way it was originally intended to be used.
I understand that people would like Zerocoin transactions to be as simple to use as possible. I would like to emphasize that:
It will be as simple as possible, and NO SIMPLER.
If you care about anonymity, unfortunately, you need to know what a zerocoin is, how to buy it and how to redeem it. You will need to check that there are sufficient number of zerocoins for the denominations you buy to assure anonymity. You will need to make sure that you don't buy and then redeem immediately the same number of coins, as this will look suspicious in the blockchain. The user is responsible for using zerocoin correctly, and you can not expect the Anoncoin client to just blindly do all this for you. I am sure that the developers can add warnings in the client when you do something stupid, but this will probably not work for every single case.
Such is the nature of Zerocoin.
If you want an idiot proof anonymous system, the only one I am aware of is Zerocash, but as we've discussed many times here before, there is a problem with setting up the security parameters using trusted third parties.
Nobody is suggesting changing the ANC/ZC protocol, just the terminology, for clarity. This would be an attempt to lesson confusion and boost marketing by using a term like 'ANC voucher' in place of 'zerocoin'. Because a zerocoin isn't really a cryptocoin, it's just a place holder in the mixer used to create the anonymity. Also, the word 'zero' has negative connotations. We don't want to change the mechanics, especially when so close to implementation! Some of us just want to make things more clear to all the new people who will want to use ANCs after ZC is on line. As you pointed out, it's not going to be automatic, and therefore anything which make make using the protocol easier or more easily understood would be a good thing. |
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We are trusting Gnosis et al to kick arse here and they will, so get real, stick with us and own some ANC, else do your own thing elsewhere !
Yes trust him. You will need much trust to retrieve your minted zerocoins. I hope for you he is not paid by the NSA to put backdoors on the accumulators! Well, all of us that are suspicious can look at the code ourselves and check that there's no monkey business before we compile it and use it in the network; the beauties of open source. And, if your not able to do it yourself then you need to trust someone else :-) That's why cash is better for some ! You seems to don't understand how will work zerocoin. Gnosis will setup 13 accumulators using the trustless RSA-UFO to choose P and Q. He removed the small factors to increase the probability to have two large prime numbers. All is based on probabilities that no one will find these 13 RSA UFOs. RSA-1024 have been already broken (not publicly because NSA want all the control safely). It will be just a question of time to someone break these 13 RSA UFOs and generate infinite ANC. Source: https://wiki.anoncoin.net/RSA_UFOThen, PLEASE, Meeh, I know you agree with me  If you believe on ANC, please STOP this stupid project and find another way. I can see the sheep screaming at troll but NO this is a serious problem for ANC in the long run if we implement zerocoin. All these sheep want to get money with the pump and dump. They don't care about ANC. EDIT: Another point is that no one know if Gnosis will really use RSA-UFO to setup these 13 accumulators. What if he generate these RSA-UFOs himself to know P and Q and generate infinite ANC in the future? Yes, PLEASE! Meeh! For the love of God! For the little children! Don't destroy DarkCoin and all the other pretenders by creating a truly anonymous cryptocoin! Think of all the poor fools who trusted those devs who will never go open source! |
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An "Anon-coupon" I like,
Or why not "Anon-voucher" then  A coupon is something you receive for free to win discounts! We are speaking about a technological product. We are not in the supermarket! You are correct, I have a girlfriend who works as a consultant marketing psychologist for big global corps, and i discussed the idea with her a while back but, basically, ZKPs, it's a great but you cannot sell something with "zero" in it, it will not sell, zero implies nothing/loss and so humans feel no desire to be there. We need a catch-phrase that emits positive vibes, alternatives like Voucher or Coupon, imply value and usability, even if they're a bit corny, we need some more head-banging/brainstorming here. I'll be having have her 'round tomorrow night and that's on the menu ... +1 here. Test marketing 'zerocoin' among friends and acquaintances reveals the same results. Perhaps 'vANC,' for Anoncoin Voucher would work well. Although I will say that once the tech is proven, the name will most likely be insignificant. If cokezero hadn't been shit, the name would have changed what 'zero' means in pop culture. |
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An "Anon-coupon" I like,
Or why not "Anon-voucher" then A coupon is something you receive for free to win discounts! We are speaking about a technological product. We are not in the supermarket! You are correct, I have a girlfriend who works as a consultant marketing psychologist for big global corps, and i discussed the idea with her a while back but, basically, ZKPs, it's a great but you cannot sell something with "zero" in it, it will not sell, zero implies nothing/loss and so humans feel no desire to be there. We need a catch-phrase that emits positive vibes, alternatives like Voucher or Coupon, imply value and usability, even if they're a bit corny, we need some more head-banging/brainstorming here. I'll be having have her 'round tomorrow night and that's on the menu ... +1 here. Test marketing 'zerocoin' among friends and acquaintances reveals the same results. Perhaps 'vANC,' for Anoncoin Voucher would work well. |
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Interesting how you can create a new account, challenge the qualifications of a proven dev and even come right out and claim ANC is a scam without ever once saying anything about who you are or what your qualifications are. And we should take you seriously, troll?
Another interesting thing is how my auto-mechanic's tool set, which I use to work on my Mazda, has several tools perfectly suited for solving problems on my Yamaha- even though it nowhere says any of the tools were designed for working on a motorcycle.
Do you know anything at all about mathematics or computer coding? You seem completely ignorant. You seem to be a frightened little man trying desperately to protect the coin you have chosen and which you are now afraid will be eclipsed by the real thing.
So reveal to us, if ANC is a scam. which coin is better?
a) You are trying to build a consensus by distorting my position. I never said, nor implied that anc was a scam. The zerocoin implementation is extremely flawed and touches the level of scam. b) Apparently Meeh felt pressured to implement a more marketable anonymity. He either walked or was led into a sort of trap. By now he understands no doubt that the zerocoin algo is not what he thought. c) Gnosis certainly has competence in some areas, not in others. His final motive is not yet clear. Very obviously he is not a supporter of anc per se, but whether his intent is malicious is not clear. My best guess is that meeh mistakenly offered him a job that was misguided. Most people, if you offer to pay them well for something out of their league will happily agree. Offer a 5 year old a nickel to perform brain surgery and he will say "but i don't have a knife". d) I am a long term holder of anc. I hesitate to sell what I have because I think it is a good coin, despite poor choices by meeh and others. I think anc developers are ahead of most others. What is needed at this point is for the main developers of anc to step up. Stop pretending that zerocoin is going to be some great solution. If you want to choose a more anonymous algo then do it. If you want to develop one or pay to have one developed then do it. But the zerocoin nonsense has become farcical. Let gnosis continue to play with those who want to play but do not let him bleed money from the simpler amongst anc supporters. He will continue accepting donations as long as the anc devs continue letting him pretend to be running the show. .Anc supporters need to get off the short bus, stop being so stupid. Use common sense. Hm, well I know Meeh had some issues with the math being used. Interesting thought though. So you do believe that there will be no working testnet and if it might be a flawed tech which is not anonymous as described? Keeps me thinking, though I trust.. and I like to believe. This troll (btcseller2b) ignores request after request for any kind of personal qualification to make the judgements he makes all the while calling into question the qualifications of others. This guy hasn't made me think once, but Gnosis- has caused me to google and read and research. This guy claims not to have implied that ANC is a scam even though the clearly said zerocoin is a scam.... thereby implying ANC is also a scam. This guy claims to hold ANC while doing all he can (and quite feebly) to discredit it. This guy is a liar and a charlatan, and I demand satisfaction with proton canons at 5000 meters! |
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The problem with metaphors is they don't address any specific issues, rather they just amplify fears that understandably exist for all new systems. I suggest metaphor is a poor tool for your argument.
People should do what they want but some additional advice you might offer is to be cautious of people (such as yourself) who are obviously not newbies writing criticisms on one coin page under newbie accounts.
Fair?
The problem you cite with metaphors is your own issue. If you don't understand it you have the choice of jumping on the bandwagon and criticizing or asking for clarification. You choose the bandwagon. Fine. Zerocoin's development process with regard to anc is deeply flawed and there is very little likelihood any resdulting algo will actually be implemented for any significant length of time. It starts with a project that was abandoned by some fairly competent people then adds a patch that is ridiculous. There are scam warning signs all around this project starting with the absurdity of rsa ufo's. It's almost funny how stupid people can be. Zerocoin is a scam. It may have started with good intentions but anyone who has looked through it knows what is going on. Make some money on the pump if you like. No doubt someone has been making money placing trades based on news about zerocoin. Interesting how you can create a new account, challenge the qualifications of a proven dev and even come right out and claim ANC is a scam without ever once saying anything about who you are or what your qualifications are. And we should take you seriously, troll? Another interesting thing is how my auto-mechanic's tool set, which I use to work on my Mazda, has several tools perfectly suited for solving problems on my Yamaha- even though it nowhere says any of the tools were designed for working on a motorcycle. Do you know anything at all about mathematics or computer coding? You seem completely ignorant. You seem to be a frightened little man trying desperately to protect the coin you have chosen and which you are now afraid will be eclipsed by the real thing. So reveal to us, if ANC is a scam. which coin is better? |
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Well, obviously you used a tool created by someone else for some other specific purpose.
huh? What... don't you read btcseller2b's wisdoms? |
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Where did I go wrong here?  Well, obviously you used a tool created by someone else for some other specific purpose. |
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Imagine a tool that made horses run faster. Maybe something that when you flick a switch on the saddle it activates something that compresses the horse's nuts. A very useful invention for jockeys.
If someone comes along wanting to adapt that invention to cars you should hesitate. Not because the device could not be adapted to cars but because the person is adapting a tool rather than developing one.
This is actually fairly entertaining. So, to carry the idea into practical terms, you are saying that engineers who use calculus to solve problems shouldn't be trusted because they haven't created their owns mathematical tools for solving engineering problems, right? |
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It's great you are being cautious. Here's how I see it:
1) Gnosis has already delivered on the RSA UFO project.
2) Meeh vouches for him and has hired him to do other work for him.
3) He has been contributing code for months (see github).
...I trust that he can pull this off, but I understand your hesitance.
1) The rsa ufo project is nonsense. 2) Could meeh provide some details? Work gnosis has done? Qualifications? 3) Seen the github. Not impressed. Yeah.... if you posted on your real account, someone might take you seriously. Who the hell are you and what are your credentials/qualifications? Why would anyone care about what you have to say about rsa ufo? Why would we care whether you are impressed? Good luck with whatever scam coin you are worried about. |
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You did not answer a single one of my points.
I don't feed trolls. |
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Some things to think about 1) People are pinning all their hopes on one person's work. What kind of track record does that person have? What have they actually produced? 2) Many other individuals, and groups are working on anonymous coins. It is very safe to say that many of those people are more experienced with altcoins and cryptography than gnosis. 3) It is silly for such a fuss about others stealing zerocoin from anc when anc took it, nearly complete, from others with no negotiation nor respect. Hello all, I am Gnosis, the new member of the Anoncoin team; I will be implementing Zerocoin in Anoncoin. ... We are very grateful for the excellent work of the Zerocoin people in developing the original Zerocoin, however they have apparently chosen to ignore our communications, for unknown reasons. Fortunately, I have the knowledge needed to implement this without their help.  4) Also what happened to the idea of copyleft and similar supposed values? Anc basically has an undelivered algo, by an unknown developer, which will be ready at an unknown date, and people are pretending it is some prize that must be protected? Of course if it turns out to be a useful product people will copy it, just as anc has copied extensively from others. That is not the problem. Rather the problem is that anc seems to have little other than this long awaited zerocoin. Is there something else that anc has? There are good pirates and there are bad pirates. LMAO! What's the matter? Are you holding a bag full of pretenders? Thanks for demonstrating the fact that ANC is on the verge by creating a new account in order try to push ANC down. I suggest you dump all your DRK now and get into ANC while you still can. Or you can hope that we do not prevail upon the devs to hold the source just long enough to keep wannabes from stealing it before ANC is on the main net. Do you feel something great about to happen? |
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This being an open source project. If I would very much prefer to build from source whatever experimental anonymity project I would be testing. If the devs of the clone coins were serious about building a superior ZC implementation they would have collaborated with the Anoncoin team. There is nothing but paranoia and a very unhealthy fear cloning that is feeding this lunacy.
Even if somehow a different team managed to complete an accelerated implementation of our work, one month is an insignificant time to gain a strong lead in building the infrastructure to support it. Anoncoin already has the respect from the i2p community and a flawless reputation. Lots of of anoncoin supporters are programmers that will jump on the chance to build infrastructure for a vibrant community. the reality is that other copy cats will be supported by shills and traders and will follow the classic PnD trajectory.
It is not fair and a bit insulting to refer to the concerns of long time supporters as 'lunacy'. We may not understand everything, but attacking us is.... well... lunacy.  lol. maybe were all lunitics . I personally bought my first anc coins back in December. i would consider myself a bonnified Anoncoin bagholder. One of my main wallets: AQDnusZcbFXNpvcNoK8p9mpJjBJxDhynB9 I don't mean to attack anybody. I simply think that the cloning phobia is overhyped. Will it happen yes. will it be detrimental to the future of ANC, that remains to be seen. The only way i see a clone outpacing us is if they create a better implementation. Either way if someone forks the testnet implementation and makes a separate coin it will readily apparent in the source and will be taken at face value, ergo, a PnD. Such a fork will be taken as such by those in the know. At ZC release to main net, the first ZC released will be seen as the 'real' one by the masses. |
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I agree with you. I don't think anyone wants ANC to be closed source after main net launch. We are talking only about the current period before and during test-net. During that period trust is not an issue because main-net remains unaffected. We just don't want anyone to launch before us. Launching after us based on our code is both okay and unpreventable.
I think all of us agree that ANC should be completely open source once Zerocoin reaches main net.
This. The ZC release is about being first. If ANC releases source code and runs it on test net for a while someone with no ethics will copy/paste and skip the whole test phase simply to be first. It's possible that it will fail, not being tested, or it can succeed. But there is no reason to give a typical ponzi scheme pump n dump coin this advantage. Once it's put on main net it should be open source and by then anoncoin will be recognized for being first mover and clones will fade into obscurity as ANC rises. Also, gnosis, post your BTC, ANC addresses please This. +10 |
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This being an open source project. If I would very much prefer to build from source whatever experimental anonymity project I would be testing. If the devs of the clone coins were serious about building a superior ZC implementation they would have collaborated with the Anoncoin team. There is nothing but paranoia and a very unhealthy fear cloning that is feeding this lunacy.
Even if somehow a different team managed to complete an accelerated implementation of our work, one month is an insignificant time to gain a strong lead in building the infrastructure to support it. Anoncoin already has the respect from the i2p community and a flawless reputation. Lots of of anoncoin supporters are programmers that will jump on the chance to build infrastructure for a vibrant community. the reality is that other copy cats will be supported by shills and traders and will follow the classic PnD trajectory.
It is not fair and a bit insulting to refer to the concerns of long time supporters as 'lunacy'. We may not understand everything, but attacking us is.... well... lunacy. |
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