What makes you think that MtGox will waive the withdrawal limits in order for people to do this? Expecting a business to forego two weeks of revenue is a pretty big ask.
That's why the proposed audit is a period of two weeks. Plenty of time for withdrawals. |
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I would like to hope that MtGox has been 100% trustworthy with the BitCoin market.
However, we bitcoiners should never assume, but hold every exchange accountable
from time to time.
I'm calling (proposing) all traders to take a break from mtGox starting Sept 25th
for a period of two weeks. In that time, withdraw all bitcoin and other money
depositing it into the next exchange of your choice. Or you could trade on various
exchanges which I do (not all eggs in one basket).
I will be withdrawing all my funds from mtgox during this period. If all funds are
available to all those who withdrew and there's no evidence of manipulation in
the mean-time then I will be happy to have the majority of my trading to
continue to occur on their platform.
Please join with me! For the long term health of bitcoin.
Please help announce this audit on all other forums and bitcoin related sites.
I have nothing against MtGox and I hope they succeed.
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Something definately smells real fishy.
This is utter BS, just look at these numbers:
MTGOX report high in the last 24 hours: $12.50
Tradehill reported high in the last 24 hours: $6.70
You are going to tell me that investors are going to plow from $6.70 clear up to $12.50 without even considering
markets that are half off. I COULD STILL BE WRONG that there was no manipulation - maybe the order books were very bearish and there was some very bullish buyers. But this is definately worth investigating.
10 BTC Bounty from Allten to the person who can prove this to the community with numbers and factual evidence!!!
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How funny. I heard about it right around when it peaked at ~$30.
Did I loose some money? Yes.
Do I feel bad about it? No, it was the best money I have ever invested!
Bitcoin potential is so huge. When I invested, my faith was not in the price going up forever, but for many things that are comming and will come from this.
The funny thing is, I just bought another 70 BTC, but I think the price is still way too high for current demand vs. the rate of new money comming in.
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Maybe... I honestly believe that if it makes it to 2013 then it's going to much smoother... the problem is now and 2013 ... literally printing 1.5 million worth of BTC every 4 weeks and not having a corresponding investment in it is causing such an extreme inflation rate that it's becoming a problem.
This thing should go down every year not every 4 years.... the total output by 2140 would be identical, but every 4 years it's going to have a major boost then correction.
Hi FlexCoin. Thanks for your study and assessment. As a newly created BitCoin only Bank, I can clearly see why this concerns you so much. I'm hoping it will inspire you to create something the bitcoin community desperately needs: a bitcoin investment bank. I will PM you for details. |
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Need some general direction to start an exchange.
I haven't coded web pages or PHP for a very long time.
I was thinking a long the lines of a LAMP server.
Is that a good idea? I assume its security is as good as it is set up.
Problem is, I've never done it before.
Any input appreciated to get me started in the right direction.
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Bought 70!  . I have another 1K if the price drops below $6  |
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I can't speak for the entire Bitcoin community, but for me it's a tool of freedom and that makes it priceless.
I beleive and strongly desire a goverment based on the original principals of some of the great U.S founders (i.e. Jefferson).
It was called a Republic and the people were at the top of the food chain; however, with the creation of central banks,
and especially the Federal Reserve, it has taken that power from the people. Now power follows the flow of money.
Basically, we went from a republic and turned it into an empire. Bitcoin, a little more inconvient, is
a great tool to carry on commerce and return some of that power back to the people.
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I agree with the OP that eventually the stability of bitcoin won't matter. Most people won't hold significant wealth in BTC (unless speculating) and services that guarantee funds @ certain external currency will spring up.
i.e.
1) merchant wants to sell a widget for $16.
2) Realtime exchange rate API puts exchange @ $8:1BTC and thus price on website is 2BTC.
3) Customer buys widget for 2BTC and wbsite API immediately locks in $16 USD for 2 BTC with "guarantor service".
4) Merchant is guaranteed funds in dollars regardless of how market moves.
Added bonus - speculators can now make money two ways (one currency moves & collecting fees on locking in exchange rates)
This doesn't address the issue that if the market moves up, it'll turn out my 2 bitcoins were worth more then 16 usd next week, and I'll feel I paid more then my widget was worth. If for example, the BTC value for me the day my widget arrived was $10 : 1btc, I'll feel that I could have had 4 more dollars, if I waited a week. This happens gradually with any currency, but when I'm looking at BTC price histories, I'm seeing pricechanges by over a dollar a day, and not infrequently. Your right about day to day (even week to week) price fluctation being annoying for buyer and/or seller. To me this is simply a symtom of this new currency being adopted world wide. It is going to take some time for these day to day bumps to smooth out, but I'm confident it will eventually happen for short term fluctations. My speculation is that it will take serveral more years. |
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I agree with the OP that eventually the stability of bitcoin won't matter. Most people won't hold significant wealth in BTC (unless speculating) and services that guarantee funds @ certain external currency will spring up.
i.e.
1) merchant wants to sell a widget for $16.
2) Realtime exchange rate API puts exchange @ $8:1BTC and thus price on website is 2BTC.
3) Customer buys widget for 2BTC and wbsite API immediately locks in $16 USD for 2 BTC with "guarantor service".
4) Merchant is guaranteed funds in dollars regardless of how market moves.
Added bonus - speculators can now make money two ways (one currency moves & collecting fees on locking in exchange rates)
Thanks for the post. That is pretty much how I see it working in the future. |
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BTC should be worth whatever the buyer/seller wants to trade them for.
I think that makes them more unstable then saying they're worth a fixed price. As I said before. (b*r)/(2500000-d) = (144004*50)/( 2500000- 1777774.4820015) = 9.9694622 That should be the current price, but it is slightly off Last Price: 7.89859 High:8.467 Low: 7.8 Volume: 21694 Weighted Avg: 8.0884 about $2 high. I'm sorry, but this equation can be infinity. Here is a new one that will keep the price under control (144004*50)/((2500000*( 144004/140000))-1777774.4820015) or (b*r)/((c*(b/m))-d) b = block r = reward c = control = 2500000 m = another control = 140000 d = difficulty Give me a BTC Address, you may have just officially solved all of Bitcoin's price stability problems. Just sent you a donation. [Edit]: Still need to figure out how to modify m. Thank You so much. That means a lot. I will work on m. After watching a few blocks pass and setting up a script to calculate the price with current data, I found that the price should go like this. Price jumps high or low at difficulty change, but lowers about $0.01 every 100 blocks, then jumps suddenly to a new price at the difficulty change. That is the theory based off 3 data points, and my intuition. So people would sell off bitcoins after the new difficulty if it was higher, otherwise, they would buy. Then as it nears the change of difficulty the exact opposite would occur. This provides a stable trading market for everyone! So, what's the new formula? Wait a minute. My brain is working. m=140000*(a/e) a =average block generation time since last difficulty change in minutes out to 2 decimals e = expected generation time in minutes = 10 This is very interesting work. Thanks for sharing. It definatly deserves a new block chain and I hope one is started. After thinking about your work, Moore's Law came to mind. More or less it states that computing power will increase by a factor of 2 every 18 months. So, it will cost half as much in capital and electricity in 18 months to mine. Just another thought as you "hash" out your formula. Good luck, please let me know how it goes. I would definatly mine some on a new block chain if it was started. |
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After pondering BitCoin for some time, I've came to the conclusion that the price will never be stable. But I do not think it matters for the success of BitCoin. I also believe (could be wrong) that it would be impossible to come up with a CryptoCurrency that would be stable in price without sacrificing its decentralized virtue. And if one was supposedly made, it would always be open to manipulation out side the free market to the advantage of a few (in my opionion).
To understand my conclusion on BitCoin price, let's look at a currency backed by the commodity gold.
If deflation becomes a problem, the demand and price of gold goes up relative to the entire market. This lowers the threshold for gold miners to make a profit and so production is expanded accordingly. The reverse case is also true. If inflation become a problem, the threshold for gold mining profitably is increased and gold mining production is cut-back. In other words, the rate of new money injected into the economy is dictated by the free market and always adjusts accordingly making the gold currency VERY STABLE.
BitCoin on the other hand has the RATE of money injected into the market fixed in its algorithm. Weather the market needs more money or not does not matter. 50 BTC (or 25, 12.5, 6.25, etc.) is always injected into the market every 10 minutes. If the amount of non BTC money (usually Fiat currencies) comes into the system to purchase BTC at the same rate BTC is generated, then you get stable price; however, that has hardly been the characteristic of the BitCoin free market.
As stated at the beginning, this should not matter for BitCoin and the future of its success. The solution to this issue is found in the services that will most likely will spring up (if they haven't already) for merchants. Because BitCoin is SO VERY EASY to exchange, a merchant can except payment for a product or service in bitcoin and simultaneously be guaranteed the money-of-choice by an exchange service. In other words, the so called price instability weakness of BitCoin will be completely masked out by one of its many strengths.
Comments and input appreciated.
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In the spirit of BitCoin grass roots promotion My home is officially up for Rent and I will only accept BTC. First announced here on bitcointalk.org. My home is located in Mesa AZ. Cross streets are Warner and Signal Butte Price will be ~90BTC (That value could obviously change) Rent price is below market value for any bitcoin takers. More details to come. I'm still in the process of moving and preparing my home for new renters. We are a large family and needed a bigger home. Very busy right now so it may take time before i respond again with more details. anticipated FAQ: Q: Are you trolling? A: No, I am not. Q: Your joking right? A: No, I am not. I really want to see Bitcoin succeed and this is just my way of doing it. Q: Is this your pathetic attempt to get out of "newbie jail" A: No, it is not, but it would be nice to get out and have this thread posted else where.  |
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My opinion:
Before they can outlaw BitCoin in supposedly a free country like USSA, the Main Stream Media will need to mold a decent portion of public opinion to be in favor of its destruction. I don't think it will be easy for them to make it illegal, but you'll know they are pushing for it when there are big stories on national TV demonizing the currency.
I believe they are still banking that it will fail on its own or it will never achieve the potential that many of us see in it.
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Mining
Investing
Plan on doing a local Brick and mortar exchange as well with the BTC I've purchase/earned so far.
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