I hope IceDrill can compete.
Good Read, AM will likely be #1 again soon if they can fit 50TH worth of GEN1 Boards into a Shipping Container and save 97% of even just cooling costs (If I read this correctly) I think you misread. It lowers their COOLING cost and power draw. While this is an IceDrill thread so I won't be replying to AM talk anymore after this, Power consumption costs are next to nothing where FC has these hosted.
There is no derailing. Someone posted they "hoped" icedrill could compete. I corrected their and your errors in reading. And the last FYI, electricity in china for industrial use is MORE than most US houses pay. It is only slightly better in HK but it is still 15-18 USA cents per kWh. So, your last post is also incorrect. And, it is NOT easy to get more electricity, there is a long process to apply and get govt approval. So, just clearing up some FUD. Thank you for your contribution, I believe most will do their own research. |
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Good Read, AM will likely be #1 again soon if they can fit 50TH worth of GEN1 Boards into a Shipping Container and save 97% of even just cooling costs (If I read this correctly) They are already working on their 40nm or 55nm technology which will likely at the very least double that capacity to 100TH (I figure they can probably get up to 4x more due to density) so 200TH per Shipping Container. Some people have an eye for the future while others are stilling trying to figure out where they stand now. I think you misread. It lowers their COOLING cost and power draw. Think of what kind of power you need for 50TH of their blades. And all the fun stuff you get to buy from APC to distribute it. Think of how much those cool things cost that APC does not post prices on. There is a saying 'you can polish a turd, but it is still a piece of ..." You cannot fix gen 1 blades, they will run a long time, but not make shareholders rich. While this is an IceDrill thread so I won't be replying to AM talk anymore after this, Power consumption costs are next to nothing where FC has these hosted. That also being said, Power Consumption doesn't even come into play until around 5B Difficulty I believe. And then once more, by that time their Gen2 will be out and if Bitfury can get <1W/GH at 55nm and FC is going to 40nm, if they did a full custom then they won't need to worry about power consumption for much much longer than that. Not to mention when you are the manufacturer and have a basically endless supply of these boards/chips you can underclock them and save on power if that becomes an issue. Again look at the future, not now. |
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Good Read, AM will likely be #1 again soon if they can fit 50TH worth of GEN1 Boards into a Shipping Container and save 97% of even just cooling costs (If I read this correctly) They are already working on their 40nm or 55nm technology which will likely at the very least double that capacity to 100TH (I figure they can probably get up to 4x more due to density) so 200TH per Shipping Container. Some people have an eye for the future while others are stilling trying to figure out where they stand now. |
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With the usual ~70 Day turn-around for Chips that puts you a little past mid January for your first silicone. They're having breast implants done?  I saw it  Just don't feel like fixing it. But good one! |
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With the usual ~70 Day turn-around for Chips that puts you a little past mid January for your first silicone. |
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Words between us doesn't change the current situation or the math behind it, keep calm and carry on.
Agree with your. So now that you are talking in civilized manner, will you please show me what your math says one can do with HF refunded BTC better than free MPP 1.6-2TH? Excluding keeping that BTC in wallet to grow to enormous Fiat currency heights. At this exact moment, the only available hardware is ASICMiner and maybe some Bitfury https://megabigpower.com/shop/index.php?route=product/product&path=59&product_id=53No one else has given December Pricing that I am aware of. Bitfury is delivering their October orders currently (little late) but for $8,000/400GH you could just about get 800GH for 50BTC right now which will probably be delivered sometime this month. Bitfury also has decent power consumption too. I don't like using unverified pre-orders like Cointerra, BitMine, or especially BFL to compare what you "Could Get", but if I must. Bitmine looks like one of the only people still MAYBE on track but they only have January Rigs on Pre-Order https://bitmine.ch/?product=coincraft-rig$15,000 for 2TH (Less than 50BTC currently) Once Bitfury, KnC, ASICMiner start having december pricing then we can make a much better prediction but even based on todays pricing it's looking like you could have more in hand, sooner. Disclaimer: I actually was almost certain that HashFast would deliver in November (I didn't order any units but still had a couple very good talks with their team) I am actually baffled a tad that they are delayed this long. |
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IceDrill should just buy the rest of the November KnC Jupiters lol
Though it seriously does make sense for anyone seeking hash at the minute, a gigahash in the hand is worth 10 in vaporware development hell. Please stop advertising your Reseller link all over the forum in posts. Have some courtesy! |
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Actually all of my miners were running at <50% for the first 3-4 days I received them.
Then they got fixed and one died,
Then it got replaced and about 3 patches later another died which also got replaced.
That is what happens when your unit is already in their house ready to be repaired, the whole reason I choose hosting since I'm in the USA and shipping units/modules/parts back to get RMA'd would be an expensive and time consuming task.
I had my share of problems, all were fixed within a reasonable time frame. I understand not everything can go 100% perfect and am satisfied with the service I received.
However this is just how I saw things on my end, I can't be sure if units actually DIED or if Firmware ACTUALLY fixed them as Hosted customers don't have access directly to the boxes.
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I'm just trying to help you fix you delusional state of mind with current actual facts.
Yes, trying with "actual facts" that one can buy the same KnC hashrate with refunds, and when pointed out with fact you actually can't reverting to personal insults. Not to mention stating that KnC is not overclocked from 400 to 500-550 GHs because "they are using normal heatsinks". It's a laugh, here's a video of KnC owners bragging about advertised hashrate (250-400) and actual (500-550): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFOcI8nK2xIPlease spare me with your arrogant style insulting everyone who doesn't agree with you. You sure do get hung up on the strangest things. Hopefully even though you appear completely hostile to anything I say you read it and took it in. Words between us doesn't change the current situation or the math behind it, keep calm and carry on. |
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Hell ASICMiner is selling a "30GH - 38GH "Overclocked" for 1.99BTC - http://www.wtcr.ca/catalog/product/bm-ambec-01 - Ships Approximately November 14th For the 50BTC you spent, you could be getting 750GH - 950GH in November already! Somehow I still think you will miss the point. Yeah, and you know the best. Comparing apples and oranges, ASICMiner Gen 1 witch will be turned off in the first half of 2014 cause of power consumption with 28nm energy efficient chips which will mine long after that. You've missed the point of my post, but keep spreading "information" in the thread for hardware you haven't even bought at all. Don't let the "information" you've spread in TerraHash thread change your useful contributions. As DeathandTaxes once said, don't shoot the messenger. I'm just trying to help you fix you delusional state of mind with current actual facts. I won't get into your "Mining Long After That" when you are talking about Satoshi Dust, Again, don't let my facts get in the way of your pity party. No matter how upset you might be the math is clear and never wrong. |
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To survive, if the whole model of the citizen-miner survives, these companies are going to have to do things differently and develop non-hateful relationships with their customers. KnC seems to be leading the way. HF is working to follow. At least that's my bet.
The road to customer goodwill for Hashfast seems pretty clear to me: 1) Offer full refunds to batch 1 customers. ... They may as well do that and many on this thread would be surprised with the results. Accepting the refund means you are giving up additional 2TH for free on Feb 1st. Good luck buying those 2TH with refunded BTC for less, considering end of Jan/beginning of Feb delivery. Maybe the refund is safer way, but I bet many people would not accept refunds. They bought miners in the first place because they don't want BTC sitting in their wallets. Announcing MPP starts Oct 30th changed many things. You are giving up 1.6TH for Free, it's 4x 400GH Modules Baby Jets were ~50 BTC when they went up for sale I believe (Can't remember for sure) That 50 BTC is now $15750 - $315 Exchange price on Coinbase You could literally buy 3x KnC 500-550 November Jupiters for that and have ~1.5TH in November and you don't think that end of Jan/Beginning of Feb Delivery will get you much much more at that time? Wrong, KnC November is sold out and there probably will not be new batch since they never announced anything but going to new technology. You can try Cointerra but that's uncertain also. Regarding 1.6 or 2TH hashrate of 4 modules it's yet to be seen. Would be very surprised if they can't be overclocked like 500-550 Jupiters you've mentioned. They were 400 nominal also. They literally sold out this morning What world are you living in that you believe KnC won't have a new batch? The Jupiters are not overclocked LOL (they are using normal heatsinks) They are 500 Nominal (Most should be above this slightly) (Even though they advertise 550GH on their product page) I don't personally care if you order from KnC, Bitfury, BFL, or anyone that point is that you are spreading much misinformation and that 1.6, 2, even 3TH by End of January will be cheaper than the baby jet was in terms of BTC more then likely. Hell ASICMiner is selling a "30GH - 38GH "Overclocked" for 1.99BTC - http://www.wtcr.ca/catalog/product/bm-ambec-01 - Ships Approximately November 14th For the 50BTC you spent, you could be getting 750GH - 950GH in November already! Somehow I still think you will miss the point. |
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The good news is that november Jupiter and Saturn's are no longer available.
According to the website.
Wooo now they might release their next pricing  |
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To survive, if the whole model of the citizen-miner survives, these companies are going to have to do things differently and develop non-hateful relationships with their customers. KnC seems to be leading the way. HF is working to follow. At least that's my bet.
The road to customer goodwill for Hashfast seems pretty clear to me: 1) Offer full refunds to batch 1 customers. ... They may as well do that and many on this thread would be surprised with the results. Accepting the refund means you are giving up additional 2TH for free on Feb 1st. Good luck buying those 2TH with refunded BTC for less, considering end of Jan/beginning of Feb delivery. Maybe the refund is safer way, but I bet many people would not accept refunds. They bought miners in the first place because they don't want BTC sitting in their wallets. Announcing MPP starts Oct 30th changed many things. You are giving up 1.6TH for Free, it's 4x 400GH Modules Baby Jets were ~50 BTC when they went up for sale I believe (Can't remember for sure) That 50 BTC is now $15750 - $315 Exchange price on Coinbase You could literally buy 3x KnC 500-550 November Jupiters for that and have ~1.5TH in November and you don't think that end of Jan/Beginning of Feb Delivery will get you much much more at that time? |
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In all honesty, if it was somehow possible to get a refund (Next to zero chance).
IceDrill should just buy the rest of the November KnC Jupiters lol
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Ignoring the Oct 25th to Oct 31st difference, if that scenario played out and at the end of January HF sends out one extra module because hey, a BabyJet would have earned 25BTC between Oct 31st and Jan 29th they will have a lot of pissed off customers. The calculation for how much you have earned is based on the shipping date. By the letter of the program it is the first 90 days, that would mean if it ships 30 days late your MPP window is also extended 30 days which obviously makes the program a worse deal. Many people complained it would be fairer if the MPP began when the units should have shipped so customers are not double penalized for late delivery. HashFast seems to have agreed. Still the earnings are based on when what a shipped unit would earn each day up to 28 JAN. They way I read it (and I may be wrong) if your unit ended up costing 50 BTC, they ship it on say 15 DEC and between 15 DEC and 28 JAN you earn*: > 50 BTC = no additional boards > 25 BTC & <50 BTC = 1 additional board > 16.7.5 BTC & <=25 BTC = 2 additional boards > 12.5 BTC & <16.7 BTC = 3 additional boards <= 12.5 BTC = 4 additional boards Maybe Hashfast can confirm or correct me. * "you earn" is based on the value of daily value of 400 GH/s (like using a mining calculator but looking backwards) not your actual mining which may be more or less (luck, downtime, pool problems, unit gets stolen, etc).400GH earns - ~0.39 BTC per day at current difficulty. In the 47 Days from 15 DEC to 28 JAN at TODAY'S difficulty you would make ~18.5 BTC It should be safe to assume that by Mid December the difficulty should be up quite a bit more, I think 4 boards should be expected. |
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hashslow is already announcing delays, so give it up already
We know one share of IceDrill is worth 12MH/sec in mid- NovDec at earliest. With No Miner ProtectionWe don't know how many MH/sec a share of ACTM represents, nor when it will be online. You can redeem 120,000 shares of IceDrill for a 1.2TH Sierra with mid- NovDec delivery at earliest. With No Miner ProtectionYou can't redeem 120,000 shares of ACTM for any amount of ASIC, with or without mid-Nov delivery. FTFY Always bet on Ice™ lol.... HashFast Production UpdateWe want to update our customers on the progress of our machine production. Producing a rig as powerful as the Baby Jet or Sierra requires coordination with a host of fabricators and designers — like the machines themselves, it's a lot of moving parts, and fluid timelines. This is the situation: Silicon Wafer Fabbed Out SuccessfullyThe silicon wafers have completed fabrication. The silicon is the core of the chip, and the complicated etching process that creates the circuitry on the silicon is finished. Now the process is starting of taking this silicon, with its complete circuits, and packaging it into finished chips. The wafers are en route to San Jose, where they will be cut into individual die. We’ll get photos for you soon. Substrate UpdateWhen we designed our substrates, we knew they'd be one of the most unpredictable segments of the chip's production. Substrate production has a lot of risk — at high power, a substrate can overheat, causing a rig to underperform. While rerunning simulations in Cadence, we saw some concerning currents in some of the vias in the substrate. In order to address that, we've been working closely - every day - with both our substrate designers and our manufacturing house. We’ve made key improvements to the design that can be incorporated even into those substrates that are already in manufacturing. Even so, the latest delivery estimates for the modified, improved substrate design are three weeks from today. This means that we would be shipping our first rigs mid-December. Obviously this is an incredible concern to us, and to you. So for the last several weeks, we've been engaged with an additional team to work on an additional substrate, simultaneous with our existing fabricator. Essentially, we now have two teams racing to produce the best and fastest substrate. As soon as that is done, we'll marry the substrates to the finished wafer and begin assembly of the rigs. Miner Protection ProgramFor those of you covered under the Miner Protection Program™ ( https://hashfast.com/miner-protection-program/), this delay will not affect the starting point from which benefits are calculated. For First Batch Baby Jets, the start date of the program will be retroactive to October 30th. We want to make sure a delayed ship date does not reduce the value of the program. A lot of smart, hardworking people are working incredibly long hours to improve our production schedule. If we are able to ship rigs sooner than expected, we'll do so. And, of course, we'll let you know as we receive further information from our production line. - The HashFast Team |
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HashFast Production UpdateWe want to update our customers on the progress of our machine production. Producing a rig as powerful as the Baby Jet or Sierra requires coordination with a host of fabricators and designers — like the machines themselves, it's a lot of moving parts, and fluid timelines. This is the situation: Silicon Wafer Fabbed Out SuccessfullyThe silicon wafers have completed fabrication. The silicon is the core of the chip, and the complicated etching process that creates the circuitry on the silicon is finished. Now the process is starting of taking this silicon, with its complete circuits, and packaging it into finished chips. The wafers are en route to San Jose, where they will be cut into individual die. We’ll get photos for you soon. Substrate UpdateWhen we designed our substrates, we knew they'd be one of the most unpredictable segments of the chip's production. Substrate production has a lot of risk — at high power, a substrate can overheat, causing a rig to underperform. While rerunning simulations in Cadence, we saw some concerning currents in some of the vias in the substrate. In order to address that, we've been working closely - every day - with both our substrate designers and our manufacturing house. We’ve made key improvements to the design that can be incorporated even into those substrates that are already in manufacturing. Even so, the latest delivery estimates for the modified, improved substrate design are three weeks from today. This means that we would be shipping our first rigs mid-December. Obviously this is an incredible concern to us, and to you. So for the last several weeks, we've been engaged with an additional team to work on an additional substrate, simultaneous with our existing fabricator. Essentially, we now have two teams racing to produce the best and fastest substrate. As soon as that is done, we'll marry the substrates to the finished wafer and begin assembly of the rigs. Miner Protection ProgramFor those of you covered under the Miner Protection Program™ ( https://hashfast.com/miner-protection-program/), this delay will not affect the starting point from which benefits are calculated. For First Batch Baby Jets, the start date of the program will be retroactive to October 30th. We want to make sure a delayed ship date does not reduce the value of the program. A lot of smart, hardworking people are working incredibly long hours to improve our production schedule. If we are able to ship rigs sooner than expected, we'll do so. And, of course, we'll let you know as we receive further information from our production line. - The HashFast Team Please update us Will on what HashFast is doing for it's $2M + customer to rectify this huge delay. |
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So on January 28th, everyone in Batch 1 will receive 4 more modules if I understand this correctly.
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for once croppo, i agree with you.
Funny, I always thought it was the person who got it late because they were last in line saying "Fuck you, you got yours". Wait *Looks back in this thread*, nope I seem to be correct. Hell even when Bitcoinorama comes on here and personally says he will help someone, they still throw sarcasm, pessimism, and are still a jerk regardless. Enjoy the service you get. Please, could you be so kind as to elaborate on that? I ordered my unit like every other customer before they opened payment, I paid per bank transfer and was logged in the first week like everyone else. I got a day2 production date and got my units shipped a freaking 15 days after you. Is that your definition of last in line? I call that bullshit. Even the units I bought privately off forum members for a premium came earlier than my first oder from KNC. Guess I should change my line, Funny, I always thought it was the person who got it later then someone before them saying "Fuck you, you got yours". As far as your "Day 2" order, you can blame the people posting pictures of their caps popping ensuring that KnC had to hold off on all production to make sure this issue was firmly resolved. However if it makes you feel better (which it probably won't) I would have given compensation to you for those "15" days you were delayed in some sort from being a confirmed day 2. Then only compensation for anyone after the 15th of October. Got mine on the 9th of October, so you got yours on the 24th? (15 Days you say) |
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for once croppo, i agree with you.
Funny, I always thought it was the person who got it late because they were last in line saying "Fuck you, you got yours". Wait *Looks back in this thread*, nope I seem to be correct. Hell even when Bitcoinorama comes on here and personally says he will help someone, they still throw sarcasm, pessimism, and are still a jerk regardless. Enjoy the service you get. |
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