Bitcoin was created because the founder satoshi wants to make peer to peer payment system.
He would use bitcoin as the peer to peer currency, so it is not a 'nonsense invention', it is make sense for me.
But i still wonder about the value of btc, why it's value is so expensive.

I don't think the existence of bitcoin is meaningless. The main thing for what it is created-to change the existing financial system and to secure it. If the whole world accepts digital currency it will be very useful for all of us.

And I believe that bitcoin is one of the most useful inventions of the 21st century. The main thing now is to start using it correctly, not just as an investment tool. If you use it for its intended purpose, it will become clear all the benefits and uniqueness of bitcoin and cryptocurrency in general.

Not necessarily. When you own the game you're already entertained and you have to own that additional stuff. You are able to play without it, but people are spending money to buy ingame currencies and items which exist only on a server owned by Blizzard or some other developer.

On the other hand, you've just admitted that entertainment is something. Intangible value?
If Bitcoin is buying financial freedom, safety, an ability to distance myself from fiat currency and people who print it, a way to own something that cannot be taken from me by corrupt politicians, cops, thieves, it is something. Something I'm willing to pay for.

Bitcoin is good investment and helped a lot to earn then wht you said bitcoin is a system for turning into nothing? I think you need to learn more about it. I also think it depends on how you accept bitcoin,on your beliefs and understanding the meaning of bitcoin.For me bitcoin is for everything.

lol
firstly i have apple shares. but i would never say i am the CEO of apple. .. as you say its a "representation"
firstly i have some fiat.. but i would never say i own debt.. as you say its a "representation"

secondly with shares, Apple can dilute the shares even without their "representative" owners consent
secondly with FIAT, banks can inflate the currency even without their "representative" owners consent

but bitcoin is different. it cant simply just change the rules without its owners consent
bitcoins blockchain actually is so transparent you can follow every transaction back to its mined block reward. you cant do "digital manipulation" in bitcoin.

i have a many bitcoin hoarded. but lets just say i have bitcoin address that i play with daily and i can guarantee you that you will not be able to stop me doing things with my coins. you cant:
freeze my funds
destroy my funds
take ownership of my funds behind my back
dilute my coins
inflate my coins
counterfeit my coins
destroy the transparent trail back to its source
destroy the relay effect that allows spending

the coins i own i own. not by representation. but by actual ownership.

now with that said..
as long as bitcoin has a purpose/utility. then it has value.
and bitcoin does have purpose/utility.

so i do own bitcoin which has value. which means i do own something.

1. you cant take Apple shares into an Apple store declaring you already own the products to just take them away.
    you cant take Apple patent for a certain chip into an Apple store declaring you own the products to just take them away.

2. bitcoin is an asset.
        this is because just like a patent, share, brand its not tangeable(physical object) but intellectual ownership.
        to say bitcoin is nothing is the same as saying brands, patents, shares are nothing.

3. the OP can make the same argument that fiat is nothing. that people need to convert products/services into value measured in fiat for fiat to have value.
bitcoin is the same it has an actual cost to its creation and people use it for products and services and vice versa

the argument can be expanded into anything tangeable(physical) and non tangeable(not physical). take cow manure. many think that it has no value and is nothing. yet if a farmer wants to give it utility by using it as fertiliser. then it gains utility which gives it value.

unlike 99.9% of PoS coins that have no coin creation costs and no infrustructure to sustain utility. bitcoin has both cost of creation and utility.

4. here is an argument that the OP should consider and understand and agree with

its all about cost of creation, utility.
this is why its important that bitcoin remains a medium of exchange. as oppose to just becoming a store of value for the sake of only being a store of value. as that would then make bitcoin worth nothing.
without a medium of exchange, miners wont want to use their costs to create it to then find they cant use it.
people wont want to buy it if they cant use it for anything
thus the cost of creation depletes as miners withdraw. as the utility will be gone that gives it some of its value in the first place. so thinking of bitcoin as becoming just a "store of value" without utility. will be a downfall of bitcoin.

but to suggest bitcoin is nothing. is to ignore its cost of creation and its medium of exchange currently

I'd like the maker of this video to explain to me what is happening when I'm buying an item in an RPG game, or an ingame currency, or a CS weapon skin. Am I buying nothing? Let's compare to Bitcoin. When I buy Bitcoin I own it and nobody can take it away. I can also take it with me on a plane, or a train. When I buy an item in a game, I can't take it with me, it doesn't belong to me. It's still owned by the company that is hosting the game and can be wiped at any moment. My account in an online game can also be banned, rolled back, and so on.

The main statement of the video that in first time in human history we are exchanging something for nothing has just been proven wrong.

OP I will give you 1$ for 1 Bitcoin, so you get something and I get nothing

I think bitcoin is not a discovery, but someone's creation, so that they know that someone's creation can develop. but indeed the fact that bitcoin is able to grow rapidly, because the longer the bitcoin enthusiasts are already quite a lot, to the point that sometimes we cannot count them.

Never new that nothing could at one point cost 20k$. We are living in a digital age my friend , all of our time is spent on the internet and most of our daily life matters are run through it.  A car for example is given that value because of the prices of its parts with the commision of the company , same goes for for bitcoin , many computing power goes into mining a bitcoin thus give it a price of the electricity and the time of the miner , yes it might be overpriced but atleast it's something .

Bitcoin was created because the founder satoshi wants to make peer to peer payment system.
He would use bitcoin as the peer to peer currency, so it is not a 'nonsense invention', it is make sense for me.
But i still wonder about the value of btc, why it's value is so expensive.

Yes I did, apparently you don't see the correlations so we're done. Good luck.

You want a free lesson in economics on a bitcoin chat board?
Your points simplified:
Banks don’t keep your money, they only have to keep a fraction of it, then they lend out the rest.
No problem, right? Because in the US our deposits are insured by the government.
-A government that is trillions of dollars in debt and our deposits are backed for a reason: because there were actual times historically when people couldn’t get their money out of banks.

And fiat is a medium of exchange with the US dollar being backed by nothing but “the full faith and credit of the US government” since it was taken off the gold standard in 1971---never mind how much less you can buy with that dollar every year since its inception.

Everything’s market value is worth what a willing and able buyer believes it to be and at this moment bitcoin is worth about $3753. Per coin whether you agree or not.


If you don’t understand the concept of intangible assets AND you are posting your assertion on a chat board, on the internet (just worthless strings of code): what can anyone tell you?

You seem to have the desire to know about banking, economics ect.
Do some reading: depressions/recessions, Adam Smith, Keynes, Milton Friedman, hell… read Karl Marx or Google.

fxsurfer,
Ever heard of fractional reserve banking?

^ FAIL
when you sell a car for FIAT. you dont own FIAT. you hold FIAT. but the FIAT is not yours.
its under licence by a government. they can take it from you without notice. they can freeze accounts they can tax it. they can do what they like, because its theirs.

with bitcoin you own the private key that secures that you have full ownership control of the bitcoin linked to the private key

i dare you to have a bitcoin private key and a bank account. and truly ask yourself. who controls what
go on try to move your fiat out of an ATM for more than $500 amount.

try spending a substantial amount ($10k) fiat via a bank account without the bank asking questions.
you do not own FIAT. they are just letting you handle it under their licence terms

try crossing a state/country border with $10k see how much FIAT you get to own without question

---

as for saying bitcoin is a nothing value.

bitcoin has a cost value.
im not talking about speculative price of the volatile market. im talking about the underlying value. the cost of its creation.

PoS coins for instance have no underlying value. as the underlying cost is zero. but bitcoin does have a underlying value.
you might wanna research that.

FIAT (not talking about market rate of loaves it would buy or rate compared to other currencies on forex) fiats underlying value is of the cost in its creation too. which is things like yes the debt (mortgage/credit agreement) that created the promissory note. but also the minimum wage laws that value a $7.50 as being an hours worth of sweat labour

.. one thing i do find funny.
a patent /copyright is just an idea. yet you argue people do have ownership of something. even if its just an idea.. but then try to say bitcoin idea is not real........ pick a hypocrisy and stick with it. you cant be right on both sides of a table especialy if a patent/copyright may not even come with any creation cost

In fact, in our world there are no useless things as the creation of one technology leads to the creation of another and bitcoin is an example. Bitcoin start chain industry which is developing rapidly. I do not believe that bitcoin is useless.

I was thinking the same or that maybe this thread was created to open discussion
and draw in the people who can argue bitcoins existence and who truly have an
understanding of crypto and economics and by that way the OP is showing the non
believers or doubters the viability of bitcoin through other members posts.......

But then the OP's last post discounts my idea, they really dont get it.



You cannot compare bitcoin to a ponzi scheme, how many times has this been
explained, can you not really understand this? Because 99% of people on this
forum can make the difference.

You need to go and read Franky1's first post!

They get something out of it though, they can buy back when price dips after this post. The most nonsensical invention is worth more than $3000, anyone in the right mind would think its nonsensical is obviously talking shit. You don't even need to be technical here with the economic terms. Bitcoin will be worth more than $20k later on but these guys will remain thinking its not useful.