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641  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 22, 2013, 03:58:50 AM
Ya I have two copies of my paper btc wallets hidden in different places. One is very hidden the other is in my fridge with instructions to anyone who cleans it out upon my sudden demise. But I think I am going to buy a letter/number punch and get my keys down onto metal.

Don't disclose this sort of information on a public forum! It's called security through obscurity for a reason.

Maybe he is trying to lure people into believing it's all that he has, who knows? Wink
642  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: 老端7月的时候说,买比特币的人会后悔 on: October 22, 2013, 03:50:34 AM
不是只知道怎么投资,就能理解比特币的。这个世界上太多自以为是的人了。
643  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 22, 2013, 03:32:38 AM
A good thing about Bitcoin is you can DIY your own duress-proof scheme, suiting your own needs and tastes.

If I am more worried about myself losing my mind and plead my friends to just cooperate with the authority, then about the reliability of the technologies I employed, I can well hide my paper wallet in a certain corner of a forest on a certain continent, where I can not get to until I am free, or just encrypt it and put it into the bittorrent sync so that it won't be lost. Or better still, If I am feeling adventurous, I could just well hide it in the background noise of a porn picture, and in Linus Torvalds' words, let the rest of the world mirror it. Wink The possibilities are endless.

You could also mixing up the schemes a bit, three signatures for the elves-infested forest, seven carved in the hall of stones, nine for your mortal friends,  then one last to rule them all, to find them and in the dark web bind them.
644  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 22, 2013, 02:44:01 AM

Yeah, so nobody knows they are yours, until you show a link between them and your real world identity(like they are in your safe or some bank vaults rented by you). Such anonymity is pretty useless in many situations.

Bitcoin, OTOH, provides reasonable pseudononymity/anonymity along with nearly indisputable ownership proof all at the same time.

I would not feel confident to evaluate the level of anonymity of Bitcoin until a lot more is known about both the system, and especially about the methods and capabilities of the attackers.

OTOH, the level of 'plausible deniability' of Bitcoin is outstanding because there have been so many losses, accidents, thefts, frauds, etc.  It would be completely believable to claim a loss of control of BTC through a lot of means.

In jurisdictions which do not rely on secret courts and summery justice, this 'plausible deniability' aspect of the system could likely be leveraged very effectively.



In jurisidictions relying on proper procedures, simply encrypting your password would be enough, as nobody can prove whether the encrypted content is Bitcoin wallet password or something else, thus unable to force you to reveal the password for the decryption.

In jurisidctions which would not hesitate to resort to coercion to open your mouth, Bitcoin can technically still be made much safer from confiscation than pretty much any other asset, by carefully hiding your trails and utilizing brainwallet or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deniable_encryption .
645  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Has the NSA already broken bitcoin? on: October 22, 2013, 12:59:46 AM
Breaking SHA256 is pretty unlikely, that being said I still think we may change the wallet address hashing into something like SHA256(XOR(PubKey,SHA256(PubKey))), that will make any preimage attack against SHA256 useless.
646  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 22, 2013, 12:16:17 AM
it doesn't matter who's right.

the point is, production and stock is fuzzy; and it always will be.  which is precisely why i switched to BTC investment back in early 2011.  Bitcoin is easily trackable according to the protocol by anyone. it's brutally defined.  and time is proving it's uncrackable.

just one of the many reasons i've been arguing to switch publicly since Gold: I Smell A Trap.

Very good point. You can't track the total supply of PMs world wide. You can only make estimations of the total.

Never thought of that until now.

This is why/how PM is anonymous, and Bitcoin isn't.

Anonymous until you want to claim your ownership, in which case Bitcoin is still more anonymous.
Claiming ownership?  Not sure what you mean.
Physical PM is always anonymous.  It is as anonymous as the change in your pocket.
Which is more anonymous than the bills in your pocket which are each uniquely numbered and easily tracked (easier even than bitcoins).

Yeah, so nobody knows they are yours, until you show a link between them and your real world identity(like they are in your safe or some bank vaults rented by you). Such anonymity is pretty useless in many situations.

Bitcoin, OTOH, provides reasonable pseudononymity/anonymity along with nearly indisputable ownership proof all at the same time.
647  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 21, 2013, 12:44:41 PM
it doesn't matter who's right.

the point is, production and stock is fuzzy; and it always will be.  which is precisely why i switched to BTC investment back in early 2011.  Bitcoin is easily trackable according to the protocol by anyone. it's brutally defined.  and time is proving it's uncrackable.

just one of the many reasons i've been arguing to switch publicly since Gold: I Smell A Trap.

Very good point. You can't track the total supply of PMs world wide. You can only make estimations of the total.

Never thought of that until now.

This is why/how PM is anonymous, and Bitcoin isn't.

Anonymous until you want to claim your ownership, in which case Bitcoin is still more anonymous.
648  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 20, 2013, 01:17:04 PM

Hudes says something about 140,000 tons of gold in vaults on Hawaii. Any merit to this?

She also says in the comments to this video:



Up to this point I estimated there to be around 160,000 tons of gold above ground and I think that's along the lines of other estimates.

If this turns out true, it'll be "Gold collapsing, Bitcoin UP" for real.


If it were true, FEDs would not have bought some hundreds of tons of gold right before its price topped.

So you believe that the FED is better than the Bank of England and Gordon Brown at timing these things?

Nah, just:
1.They have no such huge gold reserve, otherwise why bother buying it.

2.When you want to diversify from your fiats, PM is not a good option, central bankers still hold much more of them than you, and they know what they should do to keep their jobs(promoting fiats) if PM price skyrockets.

But to be honest I don't know what's with BoE and Gordon Brown.
649  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 20, 2013, 11:55:36 AM

Hudes says something about 140,000 tons of gold in vaults on Hawaii. Any merit to this?

She also says in the comments to this video:



Up to this point I estimated there to be around 160,000 tons of gold above ground and I think that's along the lines of other estimates.

If this turns out true, it'll be "Gold collapsing, Bitcoin UP" for real.


If it were true, FEDs would not have bought some hundreds of tons of gold right before its price topped.
650  Other / Meta / Re: Great Thing about Bitcointalk.org is the Freedom without alot of censorship on: October 20, 2013, 04:20:01 AM
I thought there wasn't enough freedom of speech, then I checked the alt-coin subforum, and I was like" maybe I am not there yet, better get used to the status quo."
651  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 20, 2013, 12:54:55 AM
...
oh and he has a message for us at the end:

Quote from: Rickards
The governments watching everything you do. So, if you're in bitcoin,... enjoy it, but don't kid yourself and think the government's not watching.


I'd trust Rickards on this one.  He's likely in a good position to know.  I've assumed this from (my personal) zero-day in Bitcoin-land.  For this reason, I plan to cross all my 'i's and cross all my 't's in any interactions.  Indeed, I am now only willing to do formal paper transactions for values in excess of $10,00.00 so I cannot be (falsely) charged with 'structuring' if the powers that be decide to bring the hammer down.

I bet that a lot of people who came out on top in Bitcoin speculation are going to throw away a good thing by trying to avoid the Feds and their maddeningly unfair but very real implementations of capital control.



In some senses, that's why need people like the Silk Road guys, though I personally do not endorse drug trading.

We are all too timid to test the robustness of our system, it's these people who actually went to the front-line, attracted some gunfire, making some real world experimental data available to us.
652  Economy / Exchanges / Re: MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering] on: October 19, 2013, 04:33:37 AM
i tried to withdraw 8 btc from mtgox this morning and now 8 hours later the transaction still hasnt being processed. 

is anyone else having this issue recently? bitcoin withdraw was always near instant for me usually only takes 30 mins or so.  I submitted a ticket to mtgox also


I being waiting 3 days for BTC withdraw

That's abnormally long...

No, it's just the traditional banking system which is unable to keep up with the thriving BTC economy... Oh, wait...

Maybe is just that Gox's huge volume is overwhelming their BTC wallet...

I am curious, what's the message Gox going to show you when the withdrawal cannot be made immediately?

653  Economy / Speculation / Re: What if Gox runs out of Bitcoins? on: October 19, 2013, 04:04:30 AM
I assure everyone I will "redistribute" some bitcoins once the price is considered high enough, FYI I can withdraw to a Japanese bank account, which has never been a problem Wink, now can we please end this FUD thread?
654  Economy / Speculation / Re: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. on: October 19, 2013, 01:45:30 AM
So Gox USD price broke the 6 month high, right before it is not. And the bitstamp price is offically above $150, during a weekend.

Did the bears finally realize it is not a drill?




655  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Feather-forks: enforcing a blacklist with sub-50% hash power on: October 17, 2013, 08:56:32 AM
Assume a miner dislikes something in the highest block, and is willing to spend on suppressing it.  He mines a parallel block also embedding a transaction sending a bounty to a trivial to redeem script.  All rational miner including him will be incentivized to mine on top of his alternative and claim the bounty for themselves. Only an altruistic miner would remain on the original or include a mempool transaction claiming the bounty.

Added: An unsuccessful attempt to suppress the highest block does not even cost anything, since if not successful the bounty transaction will not be existent in UTXO. A trivial to redeem transaction included by the miner practically adds to the fee offered for the block building on it.



If the malicious miner dislikes one transaction in the highest block, just one-up it will only delay, rather than foil his "enemy"'s attempt to send payments, because which transactions get to be included in the blocks afterwards in his alternative chain will still be decided by hashing power, if the malicious miner is willing to spend enough to incentivize all rational miners at every turn to make his enemy unable to send anything, then with such resource he probably should just buy enough hashing power to 51% attack the whole network.
656  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Feather-forks: enforcing a blacklist with sub-50% hash power on: October 17, 2013, 03:06:52 AM
Quote
So even if the rational miner finds a block and claims this fee, any subsequent miner would be mining at a lower effective rate to include it. In this circumstance, if every miner is rational, then no rational miner would include blacklisted transaction, regardless of the fee.

It could be argued that it's also rational behaviour to dislike uncertainty("He is targeting XYZ's payment this time, who will he target next time, maybe me?"), other miners could very well insist on mining at losses of their own effective mining rates to deter rule-breakers, it might also be interesting to see what would happen if a game theory facet is added to the analysis of this attack.
657  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: hardening brain-wallets with a useful blind proof of work on: October 17, 2013, 02:00:50 AM
Thank you Adam for the advice.

@oakpacific
U can invent super lovely functions for key
 stretching or for seeding password crazifying, but...

I think the dual point of gmaxwell's "BIP" was :
 a) If one will publish and standardize brainwallet's algo, then it will be open for attackers...
 b) If one will keep it secret and only for himself, then it can suffer from amnesia later... Wink
 Can U memorize all properties of your super function in mind for years with the same ease as your password/number/whatever used for brain keys generation ?

The function itself is supposed to be public knowledge, but the locations of the tough numbers are not, theoretically anybody can find out but testing every element is an infeasible task, and there should be no easy workaround, much like the situation of prime numbers. But as Adam has pointed out, this scheme has its own problems.
658  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2013-10-02 FBI Seize Deep Web Marketplace Silk Road, Arrest Owner on: October 17, 2013, 01:32:20 AM

We don't need to listen to what FBI has to say, we can just check for ourselves. Wink
659  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: hardening brain-wallets with a useful blind proof of work on: October 16, 2013, 03:13:10 PM
If the address where the $80m is stashed, or some of them are identifiable, they are effectively tainted as belonging to DPR / Ulbricht.

When he's finally free in 15yrs or whatever DPR maybe richer than Bill Gates, but with a lot of tainted coins.  Satoshi's coins are also tainted (not in a negative way but due to the linking bug).

Quote from: gmaxwell
Lot of good they're currently doing him (or likely to do him ever— considering the charges). I'd really rather not participate in a discussion where someone with charges like this is held up as exemplar, as it's too easy to go off on a insane tangent.

I dont think it matters so much the actual scenario the point is to find ways to improve bitcoin security (and security of data & auth keys generally).  As Ed Felten observed recently, no its not a good idea for judges to start thinking because they can issue subpoenas that internet physics and software architects somehow owes them data in a subpoenable form.  The reason is the design is the same whether you are protecting against theft, blackmail, extortion, corrupt insider, or subpoena - its all the same thing from a technology perspective.

https://freedom-to-tinker.com/blog/felten/silk-road-lavabit-and-the-limits-of-crypto/

Clearly whatever you think of the war on drugs, and personally I am against drug taking but also against governments in a free country removing individuals freedom to choose, DPR if the charges arent made up apparently tried to have someone assassinated which obviously is very uncool.

Anyway sometimes its fun to think about and articulate security problems in a james-bond-esque setting, over the equivalent but boring dining-cryptographers setting etc, but the techniques are the same if its a wealthy individual safe-guarding their money from extortion, or a normal level wealth protecting their bitcoin from theft physical or virtual.

Adam

Ha, it seems to me that cryptography was actually established to protect against evil villains, not your Grandma or roommate, who most likely don't even know how to view your files with hidden attributes. Wink


Now back to something more on topic, I wonder if it makes sense to imagine some key-stretching function f, which for different values of x, would take vastly different time to find y=f(x) or y=f(x,s) if we add a salt, like for x1 it would take 1 nanosecond to execute the calculation, but for x2 it would take 1 minute. The disparity in the time of computation must be so large that a small percentage of "tough" numbers will take up most of the computation time. With such a function at hand, and a statistical knowledge of the distribution of the "tough" numbers x_d, I can obtain an estimation of the time it takes to scan across a randomly selected range of numbers to find a "softie" number, which should contain a fair bit of entropy, the total scanning time/initial stretched key generation time should be long enough yet tolerable(like 1 day or so), while the stretched-key creation time with the initial key already known much shorter as the chosen x is a softie. Now for an attacker who has no information whatsoever about the seeding key being used, it will take him an infeasibly long time to brute-force to the number we use, due to those "tough" numbers on his way, as he has to start from zero and scan through a much larger range of numbers than us. I naively assume that if such a function can be created, it could provide us with a reasonable key initialisation time(hours or days), short key reconstruction time with seeding key known(seconds), and infeasibly long brute-forcing time, and relatively benign ket/salt entropy requirement.

Example: Let's say we have 2^64 elements to try, dividing into 2^32 sets, testing all 2^32 elements in one set will take approximately 1 day according to some statistics, with 99% of the time being taken up by testing against just 1% of the tough elements, so that instead of having a brute-forcing/normal enhanced key creation time of about 2^63, we could, hypotehtically make it much longer without increasing password complexity.
660  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer - MtGoxUSD wall movement tracker - Hardcore on: October 16, 2013, 01:05:20 PM
When this puppy hits $169 we'll be at $2 billion market cap.

Wouldn't $169 on Gox as 'market cap' be even less meaningful than before due to Gox's premium existing due only to choked fiat?

You can use Gox JPY price as a meaningful indicator, which is now close to $160.
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