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2381  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: On bitcoin's very long term future without miner rewards on: January 07, 2021, 10:46:32 AM
it doesn't seem optimal to depend wholly on price, as is the case with the large block size/low fee revenue model. as block rewards drop and drop, miners will become increasingly sensitive to price changes, potentially leading to large swings in hash rate.
There is a glimpse of hope that by the time we get to that phase, the market would've matured enough such that huge price movements would be less common. It would also signify that miners are just having a thin profit margin and shutting down the bulk of their equipment would be more worth than just keeping it running to earn a marginal profit.

this is the early adopter phase when the block subsidy is still relatively high. how about in......12 years or 16 years? then the issue of block size will be extremely important because fees will be the primary source of mining income.
I see block rewards as a way to distribute the coins but as the block subsidy decreases, the adoption rate would've increased. Currently, the main offchain scaling solution is LN. If the only time the on-chain transactions are needed is to open and close the channel, I would think that the total on-chain fees would increase while still having the same or even more utility.

For the fees to completely replace block rewards, assuming current levels should bring the fees about x6 more expensive and/or x6 increase in transactions/block. I would think that given time, the problem could be resolved. There is still a few years until block rewards would form a big bulk of the miner's profit.
2382  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Should I switch to a hierarchical Deterministic wallet? on: January 07, 2021, 10:16:12 AM
I'm using a Bitcoin Core wallet, a full node.

Then there isn't really a negative to this. You still need to secure the wallet.dat, just that you don't have to do it every 1000 transactions.

By running your client with upgradewallet flag, it will dump all the used addresses into the wallet.dat and future addresses will be generated from the seed. AFAIK, it doesn't automatically sends the funds to a new address generated using the HD seed so you shouldn't really need to transfer the funds.
2383  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Should I switch to a hierarchical Deterministic wallet? on: January 07, 2021, 09:23:12 AM
When you have an HD wallet does that mean you're safe as long as you have your seed saved somewhere? Also how often do you have to extend the seed if at all?
HD wallets allows for the generation of addresses from a single seed. As long as you have that seed, you just need to make a single backup. There should be virtually no limitations on the amount of keys that could be generated from a seed.
I'm thinking of converting my wallet to an HD one, I'd probably have to pay a decent fee to consolidate my funds but I'm sure it's worth it for the extra peace of mind.
You can always consolidate when the fees are lower. HD wallets do provide much more convenience over older wallets and you won't have to make frequent backups to your keys as well.

If there's an option for seed phrase, even better. Paper backups would be even easier.


What wallet are you using now?
2384  Economy / Speculation / Re: Will Bitcoin even crash more than 20% in 2021? on: January 07, 2021, 09:16:40 AM
I've been waiting for a long time for a price drop so I can cash in my funds. It doesn't seem like it'll be very likely for any significant corrections in the near future. It's not like the past few bubbles, they were mostly a result of more companies accepting Bitcoin as a payment method. In this case, institutions are buying Bitcoins and they're sustaining the price more than any adoption could possibly do.

I could see a huge price drop if some bigger countries once again outlaws Bitcoin but that seems unlikely as well.
2385  Other / Meta / Re: Multiaccounting? on: January 07, 2021, 04:47:27 AM
I understand now what you guys are saying about positive things with multi-accounts. But it seems to me that this is very abused on this forum. I have been a member of some other forums for many years and on most of them multi-accounting is explicitly forbidden to reduce spamming.

For example, I read this thread in the Reputation section, and I can see that many members spend a lot of time identifying and publicly denouncing abusers. It seems like a futile job.
Most forums also bans scammer after sufficient evidence but this forum instead relies on the community's enforcement to warn others.

It's inherently difficult to accurately determine alt accounts and it's difficult to enforce. For every detected alt accounts, there's possibly many others which can't be linked. Banning those alt accounts would just eliminate those who are careless and would probably not eliminate most of the other alts who are more careful. Might as well leave it as it is.
2386  Bitcoin / Hardware wallets / Re: Encrypting the hardware wallet seeds on: January 07, 2021, 03:20:39 AM
You can encrypt BIP39 with a passphrase. It's defined in the standards as written in the BIP[1].

Obfuscating the seeds to hide it isn't always the best method.

[1] https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki#From_mnemonic_to_seed
2387  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: ⚡Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index - does Bitcoin boil the oceans? on: January 06, 2021, 04:09:09 PM
According to some relevant research, the total electricity consumption for BTC mining is a maximum of about 0.2% of the total world consumption - so for anyone who has mastered elementary mathematics, such research really does not make sense.
Given it's scale, it still does have some possible environmental impacts. I think it warrants some sort of research to alleviate the concerns.

Something else will boil the oceans, and it certainly won’t be a BTC that uses at least 50% of its energy from renewable sources. If people weren't wasting resources, life on planet earth might be a lot more enjoyable today - but who cares about standby power?
I don't see Bitcoin mining as something that could directly harm the environment but there could be other environmental impacts like ewaste and opportunity cost from using renewable energy.

The site is very insightful and nice to look at.I skimmed through their collection methodology and it's decent. There's really no need to be so cynical. Doesn't hurt to have something like this.

I also don't think they meant to boil the ocean literally, that would literally not make sense. It's just a way to phrase their research.
2388  Bitcoin / Electrum / Re: Anyone has any information on nLocktime in Electrum on: January 06, 2021, 04:03:10 PM
I tried the link https://coinb.in/#newTimeLocked
Keeps on saying invalid date or pub addy...i changed multiple times..no luck. Can you try?
I think you're using your Bitcoin address instead of your ECDSA public key. Go to your Address, Right click and Press Details there should be a public key. If you're unsure of the redemption process, I recommend you to test it out first with a smaller amount to get a better understanding.

  I plan to make multiple ones on paper. So say if i have 1 btc in my Trezor...and i create 5 of these with 0.2btc on each....since they are not broadcast on blockchain...willntrezor wallet show 0 btc balance or 1btc until such time the tx is broadcast in the future? I mean the btc has not moved so i am assuming it will still say 1btc. How do i get around this that i do not accidently spend the locked in time btc.
1BTC. Remove the seed/wallet associated with the seed in the wallet.
If i use electrum as source of btc...will electrum recognize this raw unbroadcastx and deduct from the remaining btc balance?
No.
2389  Bitcoin / Electrum / Re: Anyone has any information on nLocktime in Electrum on: January 06, 2021, 03:48:39 PM
So if i used trezor tied in with electrum...then your saying there is a chance the btc used for this timelock can be spent? If so how does one prevent that from happening?
If someone has access to your seeds, they can construct a transaction and spend your funds anytime they want. Your timelocked transaction cannot be in the mempool until it's expiry. This also means that your timelock funds won't be truly bounded to the time unless you:
1) Destroy all traces of private key/seed after creating and saving the transaction.
2) Ensure that no one else can have access to your keys or seeds.


In gist, the only way for you to spend the funds within is only with that nLockTime transaction. The nLocktime only sticks with your specific transaction and not to the funds in your address.

For that reason, I prefer the P2SH method. It ensures that the funds within that address are only spendable at that specific date or block.
2390  Bitcoin / Electrum / Re: Anyone has any information on nLocktime in Electrum on: January 06, 2021, 01:45:40 PM
My case would be to make a few that can only be transacted in a few years...what better way to hodl?

     Kinda like these..  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5228739.0
Ah okay, fair enough. nLocktime could suit you as long as you can take care to not lose your receiving address then I guess you can just use Electrum's UI and export your own raw transaction.

If you'd like, you can try exploring OP_CheckLockTimeVerify P2SH addresses. You'll be able to create a scripthash address which will lock your outputs till the block/time. Afterwhich, you can just create and sign your transactions as per usual. Benefit of that is that you can send to whichever address you want in the future and won't be restricted to that address specified in the nLockTime transaction.

See: https://coinb.in/#newTimeLocked for a nice UI to create your nLocktime address. You'll just need to keep the redeem script safe but to be fair, you can generate the redeem script anytime you want, just use the same public key and the same nLockTime date/block.


I won't (put) large amount of my funds into any nLockTime transactions. I prefer having some form of control over when to spend most of my coins. Perhaps just a bit locked in there as a fun experiment.
2391  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: I'm searching for binaries of older versions on: January 06, 2021, 01:22:30 PM
Thank you I hadn't seen that. Unfortunately, it has the binaries until 0.11.1, but that's okay. Where can I find versions prior 0.11? Are they available on the internet?
They're mostly located here: https://bitcoin.org/bin/insecure/.

I'm not sure why you need pre-compiled binaries that old. Unless you compile it yourself, there isn't really anywhere you can find trusted precompiled binaries anymore.

But, here's 0.1.0 and 0.1.3 for what it's worth: https://satoshi.nakamotoinstitute.org/code/, they contain the executables.
2392  Bitcoin / Electrum / Re: Anyone has any information on nLocktime in Electrum on: January 06, 2021, 12:49:40 PM
Thanks.....I would use it to create a raw transaction that can only be executed when that block number has been reached or passed..that what I meant by locked.

         Thanks for the input..cheers
Non-final transactions are not accepted by mempool as it'll allow for cheap mempool flooding. What's your use case for timelocked transactions? Would OP_CLTV work better for you? It's a P2SH address with inputs that is only spendable at certain height/time.

Electrum allows you to set a custom nLocktime but you cannot broadcast the transaction as nodes will not allow it. However, you can save it and send it to whoever you link.
2393  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Old story. Exchanges get profits from users' withdrawal fees. on: January 06, 2021, 10:05:30 AM
They over-charge on miner fees because if they didn't, they would be overwhelmed with questions like where is my bitcoin? My bitcoin hasn't arrived in over an hour, etc.
Well, depends on how you look at it. For the amount of withdrawal fees paid, they should have a quick confirmation but it's true that not all of the fees paid are used to pay for the actual transaction fees. I guess it would be justifiable if a larger portion of their withdrawal fees are used for the actual transaction fee which is usually not the case.

Would be great if they could have variable fees for the user to choose and perhaps give them a notice about how the confirmation time would be longer etc etc. I'm sure most would choose to have a lower fees than have to overpay for it. I'm not sure how difficult it is to really implement that though.

2394  Bitcoin / Hardware wallets / Re: Secure Element in Hardware Wallets on: January 06, 2021, 09:19:36 AM
We should not trust any devices that contain secure elements either, we can't rely on SE because the information stored in these elements can be obtained in other ways. For example, hackers don't need to get physical access to our SIM card, instead, they can easily convince mobile phone employees to clone the SIM.
That is because your SIM Card contains the information required to authenticate with the cell towers. Operators can permit an alternate SIM card to use your number but that doesn't mean that the SIM card has failed it's purpose. It's primarily purpose is to resist any bruteforce attacks to get the keys and CMIIW, most modern SIM card bricks itself during a bruteforce attacks.


Our payment cards have all sensitive information written on them, which makes them vulnerable to phishing, hacking, stealing, etc. If you were to lose it or get robbed, you wouldn't rely on SE to protect your funds, you would block your card instead thus making it completely useless.
The secure element on a debit card is used to protect against cloning attacks. It is difficult to clone the chips in an EMV cards while it is easily to clone the magnetic stripe cards. The scenario that you present isn't the point of EMV cards in the first place, it's designed primarily to combat swiping attacks. When I lose my hardware wallet, I trust that the secure element can resist the attacks until I can transfer my funds out.

The one time you can rely on the secure element is when the information that you need is inside the secure element itself. There is no one else to do social engineering to get the information within the SE unless the owner chooses to reveal it himself. When used properly, the secure element will not reveal the information held within and that is it's primarily purpose inside a hardware wallet, and inside a sim card, payment cards etc. For the scenario as stated, HW wallets containing SE still provides an additional layer of security.
2395  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: PSA: Fees are cheap right now on: January 06, 2021, 08:59:22 AM
Mempool is not much congested like 2017 scenario but still some wallet's wrong estimation is pushing the fees higher when there is no need if it. So if you are going to make a transaction just check what ks the actual fee should be used, don't trust your wallet estimate it is now showing wrong calculation even in Electrum - Mempool feature.
Are you sure? My Electrum is telling me 9 sat/vbyte for 1MB from tip which is what the mempool estimation sites are also telling me, within a very small margin of error.

The only time it can be regarded as inaccurate is their ETA feature. It's designed to intentionally overcompensate so that the user's transactions can confirm within the specified period of time.
2396  Other / Beginners & Help / Re: Old story. Exchanges get profits from users' withdrawal fees. on: January 06, 2021, 08:53:56 AM
i'm not just talking about that transaction. what about their consolidation transactions---the ones which allow 74 withdrawal outputs to be sent from a single input? exchanges process lots of small deposits, more so than withdrawals, because customer deposits are free and withdrawals are not. at the very least, you should be including the fees paid in these transactions in your accounting of their "profit". arguably, the cost of their entire wallet infrastructure should be included as well.
That's a fair point. Gemini can afford to allow (10) free withdrawal per month though, but I guess it's not really an apples to apples comparison.

Binance consolidates their transaction in large denominations and users typically send the funds in large transactions. Take this transaction[1] for example, it has a transaction fee that boils down to roughly 0.00012BTC per deposit. Note that the network was fairly congested at that time. This means that, for the exchange to start losing money, each user has to do up to 3 deposits per withdrawal for it to be worthwhile.

I can't wrap my head around how most exchanges won't try to optimize their consolidation habits to reduce the transaction fees. For starters, allowing Segwit addresses would have resulted in a huge fees savings. Choosing a more optimal time for consolidation would result in better fees rate as well. Perhaps there might be some rationale related to their operations for this so I would hold my pitchforks for the consolidation part.

There really isn't a fair way to estimate the profit/loss an exchange makes when users deposit/withdraw. I think the point still stands, there are ways to lower the fees but the exchanges wouldn't really care because the fees are typically being passed down to their consumers.

[1] https://blockchair.com/bitcoin/transaction/3fc2176aba09fdaaebabfb39685ce1521dcda84bdb58ac8621decebf7e1105a5


Well, I bet some people are just sat stacking as well. Not making any crypto deposits and only making crypto withdrawals. The only way this can be fair is if they start lowering the withdrawal fees and start charging for deposits which IIRC was a practice for some exchanges previously.
2397  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: The gambler who manages to beat the casino through cheating on: January 06, 2021, 07:16:34 AM
Surprisingly, you didn't mention one of the most high profile cheating incident in Bitcoin's gambling history.

Hufflepuff cheated Primedice 2,400 BTC a few years ago by exploiting a glitch that allows the reuse of secret seeds[1]. At today's value, that's worth 84 million dollars. I was skeptical of the winnings when I came across it on the forum and I was sure no one would be able to beat the house that way.


[1] https://medium.com/@Stunna/breaking-the-house-63f1021a3e6d
2398  Bitcoin / Wallet software / Re: Concerns about dark wallet on: January 06, 2021, 05:56:56 AM
Although the dark wallet wasn't really completed it inspired many other anonymity projects like the Samourai wallet and Electrum wallet which gave users part of what the dark wallet promised.
Electrum was developed very early on. Certainly a few years before 2014.

Dark wallet was an underground site that needed the software to be installed in either the chrome or Firefox browsers, once installed a new digital wallet will be created with a wallet key phrase. The wallet comes equiped with with three parts which are spending, business and savings and with no limits to the number of user created parts. Each part has it own shealth address from which Bitcoin transaction could be made
If you have to install something in your web browser to use it, I wouldn't trust it. Browser extensions are notoriously insecure when used. I would rather use something that doesn't require me using a web browser to use it.

The last commit was years ago on the official repo. The wallet was dead before the site went down.
and what is your opinion on wasabi, do you use it, and are you satisfied with it
I am thinking about wasabi, but did not make up my mind about installing it, and trying to figure out how reliable is it, but did not found many users that are sharing their experience
it is not intended for large payments, or even enhanced privacy, just looking for another wallet to use
The main benefit of Wasabi Wallet is the privacy features since it bakes CoinJoin and various other privacy methods into the client. It functions like other SPV wallets but with much more privacy features.
2399  Other / Meta / Re: Strange looking post history. on: January 06, 2021, 05:42:54 AM
It's a known issue and it has made my post history a bit weird[1], it only happens with code tags presumably because the formatting has to be specific and wouldn't allow for line breaks.

It can be quite annoying to scroll all the way to the right to properly see the posts. If the max width can be enforced on the actual post, I'm not sure why it would break on that page itself.


[1] https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=334898;sa=showPosts;start=3140
2400  Bitcoin / Electrum / Re: Wallet file on: January 06, 2021, 04:03:54 AM
I have .rar file to restore wallet from it ..should i use old version or must extract the .rar file?!
Extract it. Electrum has never used any compressed format to backup their wallet files. It should be backwards compatible, please download and verify the latest Electrum version before using it.
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