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381  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: On IRC bootstrapping on: July 24, 2010, 08:28:32 AM
It is completely distributed. You just need a small list to start with.
The initial list is only required for the first run and if caches drop off or if there are new ones you simply update the list for the next version. Its not critical.

Its light years above the current IRC method. :p
Very light weight, simple and distributed.

"completely distributed" and "need a small list to start with" are mutually exclusive.  If you need a small list to start with, that's your single point of failure, and should those go down, you're completely locked out of the network.  Same with IRC.  It's EXACTLY like IRC, except that in IRC the list is a live snapshot of who's really on the network.

It's not any better than the current IRC method.  IRC is an extremely lightweight protocol to implement.

IRC is only used for the initial connection or two.  After that, it communicates with those it connects to in order to find more, exactly as described in your system.
382  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Legal Tender on: July 24, 2010, 03:27:55 AM
Well, I wasn't talking about people using the system.  That's a whole 'nother variable.  You can use the system without generating blocks.
383  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Pick 3 Lotto - Jackpot (239 BTC) - Evening Drawing 7/27/2010 (1 BTC Lotto) on: July 24, 2010, 03:26:16 AM
233
232
223
323
023
384  Economy / Marketplace / Re: FREE Microlotto / BingoLotto on: July 24, 2010, 03:24:52 AM
Starting to heat up, the pot is now almost 3 times what it started as. =P
385  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Pick 3 Lotto - Jackpot (239 BTC) - Evening Drawing 7/23/2010 **Winning No 608** on: July 24, 2010, 01:01:39 AM
680, then 608? >_>  *buys 068 086 806 860 608 and 680*
386  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Pick 3 Lotto - Jackpot (239 BTC) - Evening Drawing 7/27/2010 (1 BTC Lotto) on: July 24, 2010, 12:58:40 AM
Since I chose the same numbers for first and second lotterys, can I re-choose 5 different numbers? >_>
387  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is it supposed to take this long to generate some "phat coin"? on: July 24, 2010, 12:56:44 AM
We've still got 1060 something blocks to go before it readjusts difficulty.

Also, while I don't believe his claim on how MUCH BTC he got, I still believe he had the 1000 cores crunching on it.  Also, there's MAYBE 1000 cores generating BTC =/ The user base isn't THAT big yet.

So, did he generate ungodly amounts of BTC?  No.  Did he put enough CPU into the system to disrupt the difficulty process, which has yet to adjust back downward? Yes.
388  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: A lucrative attack on bitcoin? on: July 23, 2010, 08:43:03 PM
1. Acquire access of large botnet
2. Have bots join bitcoin.
3. Speculate against bitcoin somehow
4. Have all of you clients transfer huge amount of bitcoin to an account controlled by you using bogus blocks
Now either two of these will happen
*Massive loss of trust in bitcoin
  5. Profit from speculation
*Little or no loss of trust
  5. Profit from theft

Works?


Bogus blocks? o_O
389  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is it supposed to take this long to generate some "phat coin"? on: July 23, 2010, 08:13:00 PM
Yea, we still haven't gotten easier since nenold withdrew his 1000 cores.
That's because he never had them to begin with. Mainly because there are some members on this forum that have triple his claimed resources and they know how much he should be really generating if he did have that setup going for that long.

No, he had something.  Otherwise the difficulty wouldn't have increased so significantly.
390  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is it supposed to take this long to generate some "phat coin"? on: July 23, 2010, 07:33:01 PM
Yea, we still haven't gotten easier since nenold withdrew his 1000 cores.
391  Economy / Marketplace / Re: Pick 3 Lotto - Jackpot (239 BTC) - Evening Drawing 7/23/2010 (1 BTC Lotto) on: July 23, 2010, 06:48:38 PM
*crosses fingers* ^.^
392  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin that really decentralized, as you believe? on: July 23, 2010, 04:45:23 PM
...

You have a lot more patience than I do... >_>
393  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin that really decentralized, as you believe? on: July 23, 2010, 04:40:24 PM
... No, I don't get your point.  I'm done arguing with you, you seem to be incapable of processing information.
394  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoins and Philanthropy on: July 23, 2010, 04:22:16 PM
what? Who said I was donating anything?  I'm so confused XD

Also, there's nothing really from us all agree to start another blockchain if this happens.  It'd have to be a majority thing, and everyone would have to start "recognizing" the old block chain and rejecting it (it'd have to be hard coded), or refuse to communicate with old clients... It'd be difficult, but there's always a reset button if we REALLY need it and can all agree on it.
395  Economy / Marketplace / Re: FREE Microlotto / BingoLotto on: July 23, 2010, 04:11:33 PM
This might be more successful with a smaller range (1-10, or 1-20) etc.
396  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoins and Philanthropy on: July 23, 2010, 04:10:38 PM
Ah, yea, that'd work. =)

Feel free to donate money Wink  Lemme know, I'll sell you every coin I have.
397  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Defending Bitcoin against interventionists on: July 23, 2010, 04:09:36 PM
And when people start noticing that it's been hijacked, they'll make posts on forums, and that general knowledge will pass by word of mouth and people will stop using it.

Just because we're not trying to "prove" to you that it's valid/invalid doesn't mean we won't say "Uhhhh, I wouldn't use this anymore."

As less people use the client, it will become less valuable to use.  Thus, the people who DON'T listen to word of mouth will have no point to use it.
398  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoins and Philanthropy on: July 23, 2010, 04:01:01 PM
How would that work?  How do you distribute money over all existing bitcoins? >_>
399  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin that really decentralized, as you believe? on: July 23, 2010, 03:56:59 PM

Thank you for your answers.

Then my questions is:
1. What about attack against all or majority of developers, not just one person?
If someone launches a simultaneous attack on an entire community, there are larger concerns than bitcoin being compromised.  This would require government cooperation between at LEAST 5 countries (maybe more), operating with complete precision, outside the bounds of the law, and violating personal liberties.  Like I said, in that case, bitcoin would be the least of our issues.
2. What about attack, that involves only one person, but is based on the "plausible deniability"?
What does it matter if that person meant to or not?  If the code is bad, we don't accept it, regardless of if it was malicious or not.
What if a modification to the code is hard to identify as something evil in the first place?
Given that we have a complete history of the code, we can compare VERY specifically the areas that changed.  We know what it did before, and that specifically highlights the areas that changed.  It's unimaginably hard to hide something malicious in a couple lines of code under close scrutiny.
And after it is identified, it is hard to ever confirm someone's responsibility to the fact.
Yes, things like that sometimes happen in the real world. And even in the Open Source part of it.
Again, what does it matter who's responsible?  Bad code, don't use it.  If it happens repeatedly from the same person, just stop using their code base.
And what if it is a modification to the rules with some untransparent consequences, not visible to your code guards?
Again, see above.
Not saying anything in particular, just vague generalities.
That's my whole problem with your posts.  It's nothing but vague generalities, backed up by nothing but your own whim in creating fantastical and inaccurate situations in your head.
What if it will be accepted by the devs? Aren't they the central authority then, that can be silently hijacked?
Not everyone who reviews the code is a developer who supports the system.  Some people want to specifically see it fail, and are looking for any excuse to point out a flaw.  Again, see above about the simultaneous hijacking.
I am not talking about the interruption of the development team!
What about the well-planned impersonation of the development team of the Bitcoin software.
There is only one team. Well, I suppose, that would be difficult to catch just EVERY developer, but if we talk
about difficulty, then we should compare that to other difficulties, like cracking the SHA function, for example.
What method is less impossible, how do you think?
There isn't one dev "team".  I'm not on a "team" with satoshi any more than I'm on a "team" with the microsoft developers.  Just because we're both programmers doesn't mean there's "one team".

If you're going to follow that logic, isn't there only one "team" of people who use the software?  Doesn't that make everyone who uses it but ISN'T a coder a central authority?
400  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is Bitcoin that really decentralized, as you believe? on: July 23, 2010, 03:16:18 PM
Not so much angry, just irritated by your speech pattern.  You waltz in, claim that "we're not really decentralized" without understanding how it works.

EVERYONE has permission to modify the code, and EVERYONE has the CHOICE to choose what they run.    There is no "central authority".  There just happens to be one person right now who provides bitcoin source.  If that were interrupted, either the system would die, or someone else would take up that mantle.  That fact isn't "too obvious to discuss further", you're simply not understanding the idea behind Open Source Software.
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