sawdice the New Age of Dice - Let's play a game.

[yoloer808]

"Cannot withdraw this amount at the moment please try again later or contact the support team."

pls process withdrawal. i requested 11.5 btc to 1EaNG5BGQBbCBe74Y9WNgUJWNDECkZX11N.

I will leave this here for everyone to be able to check if youve sent it.

Well done yoloer nice job so you turned 0.1btc into 11.5btc for roll dice there so you have your lucky day so let us see how withdraw goes as i think they have enough funds into their wallet to process your withdraw request, OP shows an address labeled sawdice cold storage with 99.99btc, good luck OP and congratz to lucky player.

thanks. yeah its insane.

to be honest i just wanted to show support to a new site because i really liked how they've admitted that they messed up, cleaned up their act and then came back.

I was just degen betting, but after those two last bets my balance was just too large, had to stop

at least this will be definitive proof of their solvency.

[NLNico]

First of all, good that you like to improve your site.

Technically the cold wallet address is not yet proven. You should sign a message with it so others can verify it. It would be rather foolish to give a random address, so I do think it is from you, still would be better.

Besides that, with a 0.5% HE you are risking at 40x kelly with that max payout with a 100 BTC bankroll. Basically a highroller can easily win more than 100 coins and it seems that you cannot pay him out then. That would be obviously bad. IMO you should be offering around 0.25-0.5 BTC max payout dynamically based on the bankroll. Basically: [0.5x or 1x] * [house edge] * [bankroll]. I am not an expert in kelly criterion and/or risk of ruin theory, but pretty sure that is the practical side of it.

The provably fair implementation seems a lot better, but is unfortunately not really good yet. Since I would repeat myself from another thread I will just copy this here:

When a player changes the clientseed, you give a new serverseed. This means you could calculate bad results based on these seeds. The idea of a clientseed is that there is a variable in the calculation which the site doesn't know in advance and therefor cannot predict the results in advance. 2 options:

1.  When someone sets the clientseed, you should keep the same hash (and don't reset the nonce or else player can cheat.) And then there should be a separate button to "request new serverseed" that also resets the nonce.

2. OR show the "next serverseed hash" already when setting the new clientseed (that is actually what PD does.)

To give a practical example of how you (as site owner) could cheat: if a player is always betting 2x at high. You could generate a serverseed that has relatively a lot of low numbers based on the clientseed that you already got. Or some players like to bet at 9900x multipliers, you could easily generate a serverseed that doesn't hit that (in first hundred thousand bets.)

I know that might seem silly, but technically it could be possible and it is a reason why the implementation is not yet really good.



Besides that I only had a quick look so not sure if I missed something.

We will apply that as soon as possible. but also in our current system the user is not forced to generate a client seed he can click on change and insert a client seed manually which makes him make 100% sure that we do not select the randomized client seed 

You change the serverseed after they input their own clientseed. This makes the clientseed useless since you already know it when creating the serverseed. If someone is betting 9900x multiplier and inserts "imtheking" as clientseed, you can simply loop quickly a ton of serverseeds to see which one will make them not hit easily with that client+serverseed combination. I am not saying you are doing this, just that it's a possibility and therefor not the ideal provably fair implementation. Please re-read what I said in the previous reply for more details.

[waterpile]

Well done yoloer nice job so you turned 0.1btc into 11.5btc for roll dice there so you have your lucky day so let us see how withdraw goes as i think they have enough funds into their wallet to process your withdraw request, OP shows an address labeled sawdice cold storage with 99.99btc, good luck OP and congratz to lucky player.

thanks. yeah its insane.

to be honest i just wanted to show support to a new site because i really liked how they've admitted that they messed up, cleaned up their act and then came back.

I was just degen betting, but after those two last bets my balance was just too large, had to stop

at least this will be definitive proof of their solvency.

Daym, Nice win.. lets see how it goes from now, I hope they pay you up coz its time for them to prove that they have the money to stay for awhile

[yoloer808]

First of all, good that you like to improve your site.

Technically the cold wallet address is not yet proven. You should sign a message with it so others can verify it. It would be rather foolish to give a random address, so I do think it is from you, still would be better.

Besides that, with a 0.5% HE you are risking at 40x kelly with that max payout with a 100 BTC bankroll. Basically a highroller can easily win more than 100 coins and it seems that you cannot pay him out then. That would be obviously bad. IMO you should be offering around 0.25-0.5 BTC max payout dynamically based on the bankroll. Basically: [0.5x or 1x] * [house edge] * [bankroll]. I am not an expert in kelly criterion and/or risk of ruin theory, but pretty sure that is the practical side of it.

The provably fair implementation seems a lot better, but is unfortunately not really good yet. Since I would repeat myself from another thread I will just copy this here:

When a player changes the clientseed, you give a new serverseed. This means you could calculate bad results based on these seeds. The idea of a clientseed is that there is a variable in the calculation which the site doesn't know in advance and therefor cannot predict the results in advance. 2 options:

1.  When someone sets the clientseed, you should keep the same hash (and don't reset the nonce or else player can cheat.) And then there should be a separate button to "request new serverseed" that also resets the nonce.

2. OR show the "next serverseed hash" already when setting the new clientseed (that is actually what PD does.)

To give a practical example of how you (as site owner) could cheat: if a player is always betting 2x at high. You could generate a serverseed that has relatively a lot of low numbers based on the clientseed that you already got. Or some players like to bet at 9900x multipliers, you could easily generate a serverseed that doesn't hit that (in first hundred thousand bets.)

I know that might seem silly, but technically it could be possible and it is a reason why the implementation is not yet really good.



Besides that I only had a quick look so not sure if I missed something.

We will apply that as soon as possible. but also in our current system the user is not forced to generate a client seed he can click on change and insert a client seed manually which makes him make 100% sure that we do not select the randomized client seed  

You change the serverseed after they input their own clientseed. This makes the clientseed useless since you already know it when creating the serverseed. If someone is betting 9900x multiplier and inserts "imtheking" as clientseed, you can simply loop quickly a ton of serverseeds to see which one will make them not hit easily with that client+serverseed combination. I am not saying you are doing this, just that it's a possibility and therefor not the ideal provably fair implementation. Please re-read what I said in the previous reply for more details.

this can be solved simply by allowing the player to change the client seed at any time without changing the serverseed (which he does not see, only the hash is visible)...

[yoloer808]

Well done yoloer nice job so you turned 0.1btc into 11.5btc for roll dice there so you have your lucky day so let us see how withdraw goes as i think they have enough funds into their wallet to process your withdraw request, OP shows an address labeled sawdice cold storage with 99.99btc, good luck OP and congratz to lucky player.

thanks. yeah its insane.

to be honest i just wanted to show support to a new site because i really liked how they've admitted that they messed up, cleaned up their act and then came back.

I was just degen betting, but after those two last bets my balance was just too large, had to stop

at least this will be definitive proof of their solvency.

Daym, Nice win.. lets see how it goes from now, I hope they pay you up coz its time for them to prove that they have the money to stay for awhile

thanks. im a bit worried that i will not get paid, but we will see i guess

[yoloer808]

soemthing weird is happening with the withdrawal. tried to withdraw smaller sums to 1MDNgu9sWL5Rq8fErmjPaS6b1HZnKW2vf5. I was able to withdraw 0.6, but then i tried to withdraw 0.5 and the site said i am withdrawing too often - NO WITHDRAWAL WAS SENT, BUT MY BALANCE DECREASED. pls look into this. my balance now should be 12.28 btc, but it says 11.38.

I would also like to reiterate my request to withdraw 11.5 btc to 1EaNG5BGQBbCBe74Y9WNgUJWNDECkZX11N.

Ive also sent this message from the email ive registered my sawdice account, so there can be no question about my identity (yoloer808 on sawdice is yoloer808 on btctalk)

[subSTRATA]

soemthing weird is happening with the withdrawal. tried to withdraw smaller sums to 1MDNgu9sWL5Rq8fErmjPaS6b1HZnKW2vf5. I was able to withdraw 0.6, but then i tried to withdraw 0.5 and the site said i am withdrawing too often - NO WITHDRAWAL WAS SENT, BUT MY BALANCE DECREASED. pls look into this. my balance now should be 12.28 btc, but it says 11.38.

I would also like to reiterate my request to withdraw 11.5 btc to 1EaNG5BGQBbCBe74Y9WNgUJWNDECkZX11N.

everyone is now looking for this withdrawal to be confirmed; with that shaky start, if this withdrawal doesnt go through, and the balance problem solved, this site might as well be done. removed negative feedback as well for showing funds, but the < 100 BTC is nowhere near your initial claim.

[amiryaqot]

"Cannot withdraw this amount at the moment please try again later or contact the support team."

pls process withdrawal. i requested 11.5 btc to 1EaNG5BGQBbCBe74Y9WNgUJWNDECkZX11N.

I will leave this here for everyone to be able to check if youve sent it.

Congrats dude you made sawdice in great shock and they are still in that condition, that is unexpected win for them but it's weird they went silent after this post and no statement from them how they will deal this withdraw request.

[newcripto]

This is a test case for sawdice's legitimacy and will decide if sawdice is real thing or was trying to collect as many Bitcoin as could before anybody hits the big amount.It is quite possible that OP was not thinking of this win can take place so quickly.May be he is preparing to release the funds to the winner in coming hours.

[boopy265420]

Stunning win of nice amount , hopefully admin of sawdice will come out with announcement of releasing the payout to the winner.This can be great opportunity for sawdice to cash it as this will make huge and best publicity that sawdice is legit site and will release any amount in future in case of winning by anyone.All eyes are on the OP right now.

[subSTRATA]

Stunning win of nice amount , hopefully admin of sawdice will come out with announcement of releasing the payout to the winner.This can be great opportunity for sawdice to cash it as this will make huge and best publicity that sawdice is legit site and will release any amount in future in case of winning by anyone.All eyes are on the OP right now.

hopefully. it wont take a few days to process the withdrawal, im still skeptical as there still is no signed message from that address.

[yoloer808]

Stunning win of nice amount , hopefully admin of sawdice will come out with announcement of releasing the payout to the winner.This can be great opportunity for sawdice to cash it as this will make huge and best publicity that sawdice is legit site and will release any amount in future in case of winning by anyone.All eyes are on the OP right now.

hopefully. it wont take a few days to process the withdrawal, im still skeptical as there still is no signed message from that address.

havent got any reply for op yet and he has since been online, but the site is still up so im hopefull

[AccountTrader]

Stunning win of nice amount , hopefully admin of sawdice will come out with announcement of releasing the payout to the winner.This can be great opportunity for sawdice to cash it as this will make huge and best publicity that sawdice is legit site and will release any amount in future in case of winning by anyone.All eyes are on the OP right now.

hopefully. it wont take a few days to process the withdrawal, im still skeptical as there still is no signed message from that address.

havent got any reply for op yet and he has since been online, but the site is still up so im hopefull

Hopefully you receive your withdrawal, that was a nice win 0.1btc to 12+btc   OP can either pay and continue or prove the site is not holding to their end of the deal and do a runner prematurely. Be a nice redemption if you get paid imo few seconds after me you have your answer. Well done to you both..

[sawdice]

Stunning win of nice amount , hopefully admin of sawdice will come out with announcement of releasing the payout to the winner.This can be great opportunity for sawdice to cash it as this will make huge and best publicity that sawdice is legit site and will release any amount in future in case of winning by anyone.All eyes are on the OP right now.

hopefully. it wont take a few days to process the withdrawal, im still skeptical as there still is no signed message from that address.

havent got any reply for op yet and he has since been online, but the site is still up so im hopefull

Congratulations on the big win, wish you all the best.

Sorry for being late, as you noticed the site is new and we manually handling it, so things are running a little slow for now, but on the right direction, so better late than never.

Your withdraw request will be done in few hours.

[yoloer808]

Stunning win of nice amount , hopefully admin of sawdice will come out with announcement of releasing the payout to the winner.This can be great opportunity for sawdice to cash it as this will make huge and best publicity that sawdice is legit site and will release any amount in future in case of winning by anyone.All eyes are on the OP right now.

hopefully. it wont take a few days to process the withdrawal, im still skeptical as there still is no signed message from that address.

havent got any reply for op yet and he has since been online, but the site is still up so im hopefull

Congratulations on the big win, wish you all the best.

Sorry for being late, as you noticed the site is new and we manually handling it, so things are running a little slow for now, but on the right direction, so better late than never.

Your withdraw request will be done in few hours.

thank you, i understand completely.

please see my comment about the balance problems, as i believe i should have 0.9btc more in my account, due to when i was trying to withdraw lower sums and the system told me i was withdrawing too often. the withdrawal was not processed, nor did i make any further bets.

im glad youre taking this like a professional, wish you all the best.

[tspacepilot]

I'm perturbed. You just funded that. Which means that prior to yesterday, you did not have a cold wallet at all. That also leads me to consider you probably haven't secured the cold wallet properly.

You also claimed to have 4-figures of BTC before, then 3-figures. That cold wallet barely comes to 100 BTC.

I will hold my promise though, and remove the negative trust.

DC, but what's wrong with holding money in fiat?  Having a big bankroll is having a big bankroll and if you're worried about how they secured their bitcoin wallet, perhaps they were actually safer when their money was in a traditional bank (FDIC in USA, or whatever equivalent).  Anyway, I agree that they should sign a message from the address.  Just suggesting that these guys seem to be step-by-step, doing the right thing, and this situation, as it stand now, is much better than things looked a few days ago when everyone assumed they were long gone.

Looking forward to hearing back from yoler that he got he withdrawal.

[Dogedigital]

I'm perturbed. You just funded that. Which means that prior to yesterday, you did not have a cold wallet at all. That also leads me to consider you probably haven't secured the cold wallet properly.

You also claimed to have 4-figures of BTC before, then 3-figures. That cold wallet barely comes to 100 BTC.

I will hold my promise though, and remove the negative trust.

DC, but what's wrong with holding money in fiat?  Having a big bankroll is having a big bankroll and if you're worried about how they secured their bitcoin wallet, perhaps they were actually safer when their money was in a traditional bank (FDIC in USA, or whatever equivalent).  Anyway, I agree that they should sign a message from the address.  Just suggesting that these guys seem to be step-by-step, doing the right thing, and this situation, as it stand now, is much better than things looked a few days ago when everyone assumed they were long gone.

Looking forward to hearing back from yoler that he got he withdrawal.

If this became a standard to hold money in fiat, many sites would start to claim offline funds allowing for higher maximum bets.

BalloonBit did this and then there were many complications because they could not afford to pay out or at least delayed it until they could.  This isn't good practice.  Sites should be able to access funds and pay right away.  Having a transparent cold wallet address provides proof of funds and solvency. 

[boopy265420]

I'm perturbed. You just funded that. Which means that prior to yesterday, you did not have a cold wallet at all. That also leads me to consider you probably haven't secured the cold wallet properly.

You also claimed to have 4-figures of BTC before, then 3-figures. That cold wallet barely comes to 100 BTC.

I will hold my promise though, and remove the negative trust.

DC, but what's wrong with holding money in fiat?  Having a big bankroll is having a big bankroll and if you're worried about how they secured their bitcoin wallet, perhaps they were actually safer when their money was in a traditional bank (FDIC in USA, or whatever equivalent).  Anyway, I agree that they should sign a message from the address.  Just suggesting that these guys seem to be step-by-step, doing the right thing, and this situation, as it stand now, is much better than things looked a few days ago when everyone assumed they were long gone.

Looking forward to hearing back from yoler that he got he withdrawal.

If this became a standard to hold money in fiat, many sites would start to claim offline funds allowing for higher maximum bets.

BalloonBit did this and then there were many complications because they could not afford to pay out or at least delayed it until they could.  This isn't good practice.  Sites should be able to access funds and pay right away.  Having a transparent cold wallet address provides proof of funds and solvency.  

I second you funds must not be held by the sites owners in case of hitting big prizes.The concept of playing with Bitcoin and other digital coins is to deposit/withdrawals take place in no time.This is coming more and more to see the beholding of funds on name of different excuses.Yoloer did you receive your prize ? Please share the news with us after receive the funds.

[sawdice]

I'm perturbed. You just funded that. Which means that prior to yesterday, you did not have a cold wallet at all. That also leads me to consider you probably haven't secured the cold wallet properly.

You also claimed to have 4-figures of BTC before, then 3-figures. That cold wallet barely comes to 100 BTC.

I will hold my promise though, and remove the negative trust.

DC, but what's wrong with holding money in fiat?  Having a big bankroll is having a big bankroll and if you're worried about how they secured their bitcoin wallet, perhaps they were actually safer when their money was in a traditional bank (FDIC in USA, or whatever equivalent).  Anyway, I agree that they should sign a message from the address.  Just suggesting that these guys seem to be step-by-step, doing the right thing, and this situation, as it stand now, is much better than things looked a few days ago when everyone assumed they were long gone.

Looking forward to hearing back from yoler that he got he withdrawal.

If this became a standard to hold money in fiat, many sites would start to claim offline funds allowing for higher maximum bets.

BalloonBit did this and then there were many complications because they could not afford to pay out or at least delayed it until they could.  This isn't good practice.  Sites should be able to access funds and pay right away.  Having a transparent cold wallet address provides proof of funds and solvency.  

I second you funds must not be held by the sites owners in case of hitting big prizes.The concept of playing with Bitcoin and other digital coins is to deposit/withdrawals take place in no time.This is coming more and more to see the beholding of funds on name of different excuses.Yoloer did you receive your prize ? Please share the news with us after receive the funds.

Totally agree with you, the core of playing with Bitcoin is instant deposit/withdrawal and certainly this is not how it's going to work on our site in the future, as I said before we we still fixing some issues on the site as it's still in the first version, but as we move on everything will be smoother than the current situation.

[newcripto]

It is good to see OP is good listener and is very open to adopt suggestions.We can understand the timely unexpected issues sometimes interrupt some functions and then delays happen.What I like most is what OP stated in future all deposits and withdrawal will be instant and site will be more stable with minimum issues.Hopefully in few hours the funds will be released to the winner as fixing is done.