My response to the community

[Matthew N. Wright]

I have reported this thread twice to mods.

I'm sick and tired that one mans ego shall be flaunted in one single thread.

There are many ppl making bitcoin great, at this point in time, Matthew is not one of them.


Everybody that agress should report this thread, and ask having it moved to off topic.

I don't see any good in continuing this thread either. The people involved in the bet have a different thread to communicate in about the actual settlements. I support your motion to move it to somewhere more fitting.

[TheKoziTwo]

So much drama here - when I was a kid we used to say, "Money talks, bullsh*t walks".

We need secure BTC escrow services - then we'll never have to endure these 40-page docu-dramas...

+1 for money talks bullshit walks... 

[JoelKatz]

PS What backs bitcoin? (Been dying to hear your answer.)

Nothing. Bitcoin behaves more like a commodity than a currency. What backs gold?

[organofcorti]

I have reported this thread twice to mods.

I'm sick and tired that one mans ego shall be flaunted in one single thread.

<snip>

Delete your posts from the thread, then it won't bother you anymore.

[Herodes]

I have reported this thread twice to mods.

I'm sick and tired that one mans ego shall be flaunted in one single thread.

<snip>

Delete your posts from the thread, then it won't bother you anymore.

I am more concerned with the community as a whole. I think threads in the bitcoin sub forum, which is the main forum on this site, should contain mostly useful threads, not gossip, drama and drivel. It's not about my personal incovenience.

[Lethn]

lol That's what all the mob inciters say

[Herodes]

lol That's what all the mob inciters say

Que ?

[sublime5447]

How quickly you guys say a post isn't relevant. This is one of the best that I have seen. There are great lessons in this post. Leave it up. This post has it all greed, shame, anger, regret personally I think everyone should read it especially the younger members. It is important that people treat the coins like cash and not just internet play money they need to know what can happen if you play games, ... that you could get seriously hurt with btc.

[nikkisnowe]

Why is this is referred to as a bet?  To me, I would view this as a contract of suretyship.  I don't know all of the details involved with the specific individuals that contracted with this guy but there seems to be sufficient evidence that this guy created a contract Which meets all of the statute of frauds for most jurisdictions.  When reading through these posts, I was literally shaking my head at his own postings since they could destroy him if someone sued him.  He has noted that he is naive.  Is he ever.

[Rassah]

So... does this mean that this entire thread is a lesson that "The Internet is a Serious Business?"

[Herodes]

Why is this is referred to as a bet?  To me, I would view this as a contract of suretyship.  I don't know all of the details involved with the specific individuals that contracted with this guy but there seems to be sufficient evidence that this guy created a contract Which meets all of the statute of frauds for most jurisdictions.  When reading through these posts, I was literally shaking my head at his own postings since they could destroy him if someone sued him.  He has noted that he is naive.  Is he ever.

Then those who think that all this betting business holds legitimacy should run Matthew to a court of law. Seriously, I don't think anyone would ever get to that point, and they wouldn't even win. It would had to be proven without reasonable doubt. Impossible.

The posts at this forum doesn't even hold any kind of legitimacy. If it was matthew in person who wrote all the posts, or someone hacking his account, impossible to prove. By IP-adress ? What if there was a trojan on his computer ? Not plausible, yes - but impossible ?

To me, this is just similar to 'bar-talk'. You know that guy you know ocassionally from somewhere, and meets you at the bar and he goes on and on about the great business you're going to create togheter, or how he's going to visit you with his wife and kids, or how he's going to donate to your chairty of choice. We all know that by the end of the weekend, all that is forgotten, it was only drunk talk. No intentions to ever go through with the promises. Same here. Who could expect that somebody in a distant part of the world, actually would have the financial means, and the will to actually pay foreigners with whom he had no formal contract ?

Sure, some people may put in a legit bet of 10 BTC, or whatever they can afford, but it isn't stopping anyone from claiming that they want to bet 500 BTC. Then if they lost, we'd never see any payment at all. There simply was no downside, apart from damaging the rep of a forum account.

Now, if proper betting was to be done, the full amounts would have to be paid in advance by both parties and held in escrow till the bet is settled, and of course it could not be declared void because of some technicality. You didn't want to put 500 BTC in escrow ? Ok, then that's not a amount you wanted to bet then, bet something you can afford to lose, or don't bet at all!

As much as Matthew have been a drama queen, he's under no obligation at all to pay to anyone. Perhaps some would say he's under a moral obligation, but the legal resposibility and moral obligation usually doesn't sit together. If anyone is 100% sure that Matthew is legaly obliged to pay, then by all means sue him. The court will just laugh the case off. Hi, what - a stranger gave him his word on the internet ? Yeah, sounds like a legally binding contract.

I do not defend his actions, as I think they were just as idiotic as anyone else thinks, but I'm just being realistic here. And if Pirate actually did pay up, how many would honour their bets ? 10%-20%, I'm not sure, but I think the percentages would've been very low.

So - sue or shut up!

[bg002h]

Why is this is referred to as a bet?  To me, I would view this as a contract of suretyship.  I don't know all of the details involved with the specific individuals that contracted with this guy but there seems to be sufficient evidence that this guy created a contract Which meets all of the statute of frauds for most jurisdictions.  When reading through these posts, I was literally shaking my head at his own postings since they could destroy him if someone sued him.  He has noted that he is naive.  Is he ever.

I believe the terms were something  like "I'll double the money you didn't send me or accept a scammer tag". He met the terms...he took the tag.

[JoelKatz]

I believe the terms were something  like "I'll double the money you didn't send me or accept a scammer tag". He met the terms...he took the tag.

That's ridiculous. This was the provision:

"Anyone (including myself) who renigs on their bets will be labeled a scammer on the forums. Theymos will retain the IP addresses of everyone who has committed here and as you are marked a scammer for not paying, you will also be reported to the bitcoin police and tracked. For this reason, it is important that you do not bet more than you can afford to lose. Considering the high probability of fraud from newbie sockpuppets, only established 250+ post users will be allowed to participate, unless they participate through an escrow who will hold their coins. This is up to them to find the escrow although many posters in this thread have agreed to act as such."

That clearly says that getting a scammer tag would just be one of the consequences for failing to make payment. It does not give him, or anyone, the option of accepting a scammer tag in lieu of making payment.

[TheKoziTwo]

Then those who think that all this betting business holds legitimacy should run Matthew to a court of law.

What if one does not believe the law holds any legitimacy?

So - sue or shut up!

Even silence speaks

[Herodes]

What if one does not believe the law holds any legitimacy?

Surely, if you think the law doesn't hold any legitimacy, then do whatever you think is right, but if you would do something that conflict with what's legal, then you have to be a man enough to face the consequences.

For instance if somebody scammed you of 5K BTC, and you think that the police and legal system is something that you do not care about, and will not use, and then you proceed to beat the crap out of said scammer singlehandedly or with the help of some thugs, don't be surprised if it's you that end up in jail.

I'm not defending the current system, condoning it, neither am I condoning that you commit acts of violence, the only thing I am saying is that you need to pay attention to reality, and reality is that if you do something that's considered illegal, you may face consequences.

[TheKoziTwo]

What if one does not believe the law holds any legitimacy?

Surely, if you think the law doesn't hold any legitimacy, then do whatever you think is right, but if you would do something that conflict with what's legal, then you have to be a man enough to face the consequences.

So those who happens to be gay in Iran should be "man" enough to have their head cut of ?

For instance if somebody scammed you of 5K BTC, and you think that the police and legal system is something that you do not care about, and will not use, and then you proceed to beat the crap out of said scammer singlehandedly or with the help of some thugs, don't be surprised if it's you that end up in jail.

I'm not defending the current system, condoning it, neither am I condoning that you commit acts of violence, the only thing I am saying is that you need to pay attention to reality, and reality is that if you do something that's considered illegal, you may face consequences.

Who said I would be doing something illegal?

[Herodes]

What if one does not believe the law holds any legitimacy?

Surely, if you think the law doesn't hold any legitimacy, then do whatever you think is right, but if you would do something that conflict with what's legal, then you have to be a man enough to face the consequences.

So those who happens to be gay in Iran should be "man" enough to have their head cut of ?

For instance if somebody scammed you of 5K BTC, and you think that the police and legal system is something that you do not care about, and will not use, and then you proceed to beat the crap out of said scammer singlehandedly or with the help of some thugs, don't be surprised if it's you that end up in jail.

I'm not defending the current system, condoning it, neither am I condoning that you commit acts of violence, the only thing I am saying is that you need to pay attention to reality, and reality is that if you do something that's considered illegal, you may face consequences.

Who said I would be doing something illegal?

You're stretching it - but okay. In some countries, being an atheist is a crime. Then you just disguise yourself as a christian whatever, and shut your mouth. You could of course try to change the laws, and take all the heat that comes with that.

As for being gay in Iran, moving from that country would be a great option, as living somewhere where the leaders tell you that you cannot be who you were born to be, is kind of idiotic. So you either move, or keep shut about it. If you go openly about it, and it's against the law, then face the consequences. That's reality, even if it is wrong.

For the last statement, I didn't know this discussion was about you. As for how to get money back, I'm sure there are many people with good ideas.

[TheKoziTwo]

What if one does not believe the law holds any legitimacy?

Surely, if you think the law doesn't hold any legitimacy, then do whatever you think is right, but if you would do something that conflict with what's legal, then you have to be a man enough to face the consequences.

So those who happens to be gay in Iran should be "man" enough to have their head cut of ?

For instance if somebody scammed you of 5K BTC, and you think that the police and legal system is something that you do not care about, and will not use, and then you proceed to beat the crap out of said scammer singlehandedly or with the help of some thugs, don't be surprised if it's you that end up in jail.

I'm not defending the current system, condoning it, neither am I condoning that you commit acts of violence, the only thing I am saying is that you need to pay attention to reality, and reality is that if you do something that's considered illegal, you may face consequences.

Who said I would be doing something illegal?

You're stretching it - but okay. In some countries, being an atheist is a crime. Then you just disguise yourself as a christian whatever, and shut your mouth. You could of course try to change the laws, and take all the heat that comes with that.

As for being gay in Iran, moving from that country would be a great option, as living somewhere where the leaders tell you that you cannot be who you were born to be, is kind of idiotic. So you either move, or keep shut about it. If you go openly about it, and it's against the law, then face the consequences. That's reality, even if it is wrong.

For the last statement, I didn't know this discussion was about you. As for how to get money back, I'm sure there are many people with good ideas.

Oh okay... so if people in north korea don't like how the country is run they can just move. Makes sense, except from that part where they are being shot while crossing the border. But hey, if they don't like getting shot in the back while moving they will always have the FREEDOM to shut the fuck up and do as they're told.

[Matthew N. Wright]

But hey, if you they don't like getting shot in the back while moving they will always have the FREEDOM to shut the fuck up and do as they're told.

Speaking as someone living in South Korea, we all wish they would stand up for themselves. They need to overthrow their own government and not depend on outside nations to help. </completely off-topic>

[redbeans2012]

Can anyone explain to me what this BET was?  I've been gone for a while.. seems like I missed something.