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Bit_Happy
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July 24, 2015, 11:53:21 PM
 #101

This seems to be a big hot topic lately and I still can not understand it. ....

Because if continually, enough crappy non issues like this are tossed into the public arena, and they are told this is very important, nobody can ever get around to the real issues.

Like all the money they are printing.

+1 Trillion Dollars, for the truth:
I remember how much "gay marriage" dominated the 2004 election (Bush was frequently talking against it to rally "the base"), when they should have been debating more important issues. 

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July 25, 2015, 11:54:06 AM
 #102

You have none, and every time I ask for a scientific study you have either some personal attack, red herring, or other fallacy to talk about.


Beliathon works in mysterious ways, homeslice. Adapt.


I am not interested in adapting to your destructive dogmas devoid of scientific reason and backing. Get back to me when you learn how to read and understand peer reviewed studies.
What a crock of shit.  Personal attacks and other logical fallacies are the marks of a loser in an argument.

And what do losers do?  They lose.
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July 25, 2015, 07:16:13 PM
 #103

A transgender individual may have characteristics that are normally associated with a particular gender and identify elsewhere on the traditional gender continuum, or exist outside of it as other, agender, gender-neutral, genderqueer, non-binary, third gender, etc.
Transgender people may also identify as bigender, pangender, or along several places on either the traditional transgender continuum or the more encompassing continuums that have been developed in response to recent, significantly more detailed studies.
Furthermore, many transgender people experience a period of identity development that includes better understanding one's self-image, self-reflection, and self-expression.
More specifically, the degree to which individuals feel genuine, authentic, and comfortable within their external appearance and accept their genuine identity is referred to as transgender congruence.
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July 25, 2015, 07:22:21 PM
 #104

A transgender individual may have characteristics that are normally associated with a particular gender and identify elsewhere on the traditional gender continuum, or exist outside of it as other, agender, gender-neutral, genderqueer, non-binary, third gender, etc.
Transgender people may also identify as bigender, pangender, or along several places on either the traditional transgender continuum or the more encompassing continuums that have been developed in response to recent, significantly more detailed studies.
Furthermore, many transgender people experience a period of identity development that includes better understanding one's self-image, self-reflection, and self-expression.
More specifically, the degree to which individuals feel genuine, authentic, and comfortable within their external appearance and accept their genuine identity is referred to as transgender congruence.

That looks like a copy and paste. But now I am interested whats a "pangender"?

Would it be a crime if I say "Sir" if the transgender wants to be known as a female? Wonder if that will ever come about.
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July 25, 2015, 09:06:18 PM
 #105

I need 5 more dicks added to me by tax payers money and soon I will have them  Smiley
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July 25, 2015, 11:21:41 PM
 #106

For those just tuning in to the thread who may have missed it:


Remember Aaron Swartz, a 26 year old computer scientist who died defending the free flow of information.
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July 26, 2015, 01:07:52 AM
 #107

I need 5 more dicks added to me by tax payers money and soon I will have them  Smiley
Okay, just don't be a dick.
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July 26, 2015, 06:35:04 AM
 #108

A transgender individual may have characteristics that are normally associated with a particular gender and identify elsewhere on the traditional gender continuum, or exist outside of it as other, agender, gender-neutral, genderqueer, non-binary, third gender, etc.
Transgender people may also identify as bigender, pangender, or along several places on either the traditional transgender continuum or the more encompassing continuums that have been developed in response to recent, significantly more detailed studies.
Furthermore, many transgender people experience a period of identity development that includes better understanding one's self-image, self-reflection, and self-expression.
More specifically, the degree to which individuals feel genuine, authentic, and comfortable within their external appearance and accept their genuine identity is referred to as transgender congruence.

That looks like a copy and paste. But now I am interested whats a "pangender"?

Would it be a crime if I say "Sir" if the transgender wants to be known as a female? Wonder if that will ever come about.

Pangender is pretty much "Fuck it all, I'm everything, even genders we don't know exist yet".  Or for the technical definition:

Quote
Pangender (and/or Omnigender) is a non-binary gender experience which refers to a wide multiplicity of genders that can (or not) tend to the infinite (meaning that this experience can go beyond the current knowledge of genders). This experience can be either simultaneously or over time.

Being pangender does not require that one knows everything about all the established genders nowadays; being pangender goes beyond the known genders. Pangender can express gender fluidity or not; for example, a pangender person can manifest a genderflux, flowing from pangender to agender.

Panflux is a gender identity consisting of pangender + genderflux.

Pangender = binary genders (100% female and 100% male) + known genders + unknown genders.

Is it a crime to misgender somebody?  No, and it never will be (hopefully).  Is it dickish?  Yes, but that's your right as long as it's only words and nobody gets physical. 

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July 26, 2015, 04:30:33 PM
 #109

Is it a crime to misgender somebody?  No, and it never will be (hopefully).  Is it dickish?  Yes, but that's your right as long as it's only words and nobody gets physical. 
Words kill too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_among_LGBT_youth

Remember Aaron Swartz, a 26 year old computer scientist who died defending the free flow of information.
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July 26, 2015, 05:05:54 PM
 #110

Is it a crime to misgender somebody?  No, and it never will be (hopefully).  Is it dickish?  Yes, but that's your right as long as it's only words and nobody gets physical. 
Words kill too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_among_LGBT_youth

People have to be very unstable to feel like they should commit suicide if you call them the gender they were born.
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July 26, 2015, 05:31:31 PM
 #111

Is it a crime to misgender somebody?  No, and it never will be (hopefully).  Is it dickish?  Yes, but that's your right as long as it's only words and nobody gets physical. 
Words kill too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_among_LGBT_youth
Bullying among youth is a totally different issue, and shouldn't be treated different than bullying based on any other factor.  Unless it's reaching to the extreme of harassment or cyber harassment (which there are laws against for both adults and children), just send them to the principal's office and tell them to stop being a dick.  No need to get law enforcement involved.

Misgendering someone one time really isn't going to do anything.  Compared to some of the harassment transpeople get, it will be forgotten about in 5 minutes.  What we really need to focus on is the physical attacks, stalking and harassment cases, etc. 

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July 26, 2015, 05:38:55 PM
 #112

Is it a crime to misgender somebody?  No, and it never will be (hopefully).  Is it dickish?  Yes, but that's your right as long as it's only words and nobody gets physical. 
Words kill too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_among_LGBT_youth
Bullying among youth is a totally different issue, and shouldn't be treated different than bullying based on any other factor.  Unless it's reaching to the extreme of harassment or cyber harassment (which there are laws against for both adults and children), just send them to the principal's office and tell them to stop being a dick.  No need to get law enforcement involved.

Misgendering someone one time really isn't going to do anything.  Compared to some of the harassment transpeople get, it will be forgotten about in 5 minutes.  What we really need to focus on is the physical attacks, stalking and harassment cases, etc. 

Yes, there's a huge difference between calling someone the gender they were born, compared to those who attack, stalk, harass, bully, etc. Those are clearly wrong.
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July 26, 2015, 07:28:23 PM
 #113

Is it a crime to misgender somebody?  No, and it never will be (hopefully).  Is it dickish?  Yes, but that's your right as long as it's only words and nobody gets physical. 
Words kill too. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_among_LGBT_youth

Are there any studies demonstrating that LGBT suicides are a direct result of bullying and harassment and not from hormonal imbalances which are known to cause emotional problems? Oh that's right, you just make this assumption without scientific basis and those studies don't exist.
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July 27, 2015, 04:01:39 PM
 #114

I think it's kind of similar, an identity crisis of a sort where they can't identify with their gender. Their brain can't identify with the physical gender they've been born with and it mixes them up.
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July 27, 2015, 08:13:57 PM
 #115

I think it's kind of similar, an identity crisis of a sort where they can't identify with their gender. Their brain can't identify with the physical gender they've been born with and it mixes them up.
I've got a problem like this.  You see, I'm trans black.

It's a real problem, I can't identify with my physical whiteness and it mixes me up.

I'm also trans-college, trans-motorcycle, trans-acid-rock, and trans-zombie.
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July 27, 2015, 08:24:19 PM
 #116

I always thought "Trance-gender" was the sex of that purple "girl" in the TV series, "Andromeda."

 Cheesy

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July 27, 2015, 11:11:45 PM
 #117

I think it's kind of similar, an identity crisis of a sort where they can't identify with their gender. Their brain can't identify with the physical gender they've been born with and it mixes them up.
I've got a problem like this.  You see, I'm trans black.

It's a real problem, I can't identify with my physical whiteness and it mixes me up.

I'm also trans-college, trans-motorcycle, trans-acid-rock, and trans-zombie.
Come back when there's somebody that's actually depressed by the fact that their skin is white and they feel like they belong in a black body when they look at themselves.  Same with zombies.  You can make fun of the issue all you want, but the fact is nobody feels that so the point is moot.  Good luck leading a fulfilling life as a zombie anyway..

As for the other things, they just don't really make sense.  Nothing stopping you from riding a motorcycle, going to college, etc.  It's not going to affect the rest of your life (besides maybe a better job for the second..).  It's not a part of your core identity as a person that's always been there and is unchangeable without a long and hard process that makes your life do a 180.

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July 28, 2015, 12:08:42 AM
Last edit: July 28, 2015, 12:19:22 AM by Spendulus
 #118

I think it's kind of similar, an identity crisis of a sort where they can't identify with their gender. Their brain can't identify with the physical gender they've been born with and it mixes them up.
I've got a problem like this.  You see, I'm trans black.

It's a real problem, I can't identify with my physical whiteness and it mixes me up.

I'm also trans-college, trans-motorcycle, trans-acid-rock, and trans-zombie.
Come back when there's somebody that's actually depressed by the fact that their skin is white and they feel like they belong in a black body when they look at themselves.  Same with zombies.  You can make fun of the issue all you want, but the fact is nobody feels that so the point is moot.  ....
Sez who?

Where are these "crises" exactly?  They are not among the people I know who have such issues (eg gay or thinking about it, etc)

A real serious thing is, as an example, depression.  That causes suicidal tendencies in a great many people.  It has been well studied.  Many other "real" things.  Drug addiction.  Again, where exactly is this crisis and why should I worry about it?  And why right now, in the last 2 months, does it suddenly erupt as a "concern?"

NOTE:  This post may sound combative or something, I don't know.  It's not meant to be.  And it's serious.  Where are these "trans problems?"  Why should anyone be concerned with them and not other things?  Why is it suddenly "important?"  A quick look indicates about 0.3% of the population is "trans gender."   About one tenth of the gay/lesbian population.  A tiny, tiny number.

Here are some facts on axiety and depression.

Facts

Generalized Anxiety Disorder (GAD)
GAD affects 6.8 million adults, or 3.1% of the U.S. population.
Women are twice as likely to be affected as men.

Panic Disorder
6 million, 2.7%
Women are twice as likely to be affected as men.
Very high comorbidity rate with major depression.

Social Anxiety Disorder
15 million, 6.8%
Equally common among men and women, typically beginning around age 13.
According to a 2007 ADAA survey, 36% of people with social anxiety disorder report experiencing symptoms for 10 or more years before seeking help.

Specific Phobias
19 million, 8.7%
Women are twice as likely to be affected as men.
Typically begins in childhood; the median age of onset is 7.

Obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) and posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD) are closely related to anxiety disorders, which some may experience at the same time, along with depression.

Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD)
2.2 million, 1.0%
Equally common among men and women.
The median age of onset is 19, with 25 percent of cases occurring by age 14. One-third of affected adults first experienced symptoms in childhood.

Posttraumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD)
7.7 million, 3.5%
Women are more likely to be affected than men.
Rape is the most likely trigger of PTSD: 65% of men and 45.9% of women who are raped will develop the disorder.
Childhood sexual abuse is a strong predictor of lifetime likelihood for developing PTSD.

Major Depressive Disorder
The leading cause of disability in the U.S. for ages 15 to 44.3
Affects approximately 14.8 million American adults, or about 6.7 percent of the U.S. population age 18 and older in a given year.
While major depressive disorder can develop at any age, the median age at onset is 32.5
More prevalent in women than in men.

Persistent depressive disorder, or PDD, (formerly called dysthymia) is a form of depression that usually continues for at least two years.
Affects approximately 1.5 percent of the U.S. population age 18 and older in a given year. (about 3.3 million American adults).
The median age of onset is 31.1

Related Illnesses
Many people with an anxiety disorder also have a co-occurring disorder or physical illness, which can make their symptoms worse and recovery more difficult. It’s essential to be treated for both disorders.

Read on to learn more about the co-occurrence of anxiety and these disorders:

    Bipolar disorder
    Eating disorders
    Headaches
    Irritable bowel syndrome (IBS)
    Sleep disorders
    Substance abuse
    Adult ADHD (attention deficit/hyperactive disorder)
    BDD (body dysmorphic disorder)
    Chronic pain
    Fibromyalgia
    Stress

Children
Anxiety disorders affect one in eight children. Research shows that untreated children with anxiety disorders are at higher risk to perform poorly in school, miss out on important social experiences, and engage in substance abuse.

    See statistics for anxiety disorders among children from the National Institute of Mental Health.

Anxiety disorders also often co-occur with other disorders such as depression, eating disorders, and attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD).

    Childhood anxiety disorders
    Anxiety and depression
    Treatment
    Tips for parents and caregivers
    Anxiety disorders at school
    School refusal

http://www.adaa.org/about-adaa/press-room/facts-statistics
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July 28, 2015, 12:38:07 AM
 #119

I think it's kind of similar, an identity crisis of a sort where they can't identify with their gender. Their brain can't identify with the physical gender they've been born with and it mixes them up.
I've got a problem like this.  You see, I'm trans black.

It's a real problem, I can't identify with my physical whiteness and it mixes me up.

I'm also trans-college, trans-motorcycle, trans-acid-rock, and trans-zombie.
Come back when there's somebody that's actually depressed by the fact that their skin is white and they feel like they belong in a black body when they look at themselves.  Same with zombies.  You can make fun of the issue all you want, but the fact is nobody feels that so the point is moot.  ....
Sez who?

Where are these "crises" exactly?  They are not among the people I know who have such issues (eg gay or thinking about it, etc)

A real serious thing is, as an example, depression.  That causes suicidal tendencies in a great many people.  It has been well studied.  Many other "real" things.  Drug addiction.  Again, where exactly is this crisis and why should I worry about it?  And why right now, in the last 2 months, does it suddenly erupt as a "concern?"

NOTE:  This post may sound combative or something, I don't know.  It's not meant to be.  And it's serious.  Where are these "trans problems?"  Why should anyone be concerned with them and not other things?  Why is it suddenly "important?"  A quick look indicates about 0.3% of the population is "trans gender."   About one tenth of the gay/lesbian population.  A tiny, tiny number.

Here are some facts on axiety and depression.

Facts

*snip*

http://www.adaa.org/about-adaa/press-room/facts-statistics
When did I say anything about any other disorder?  Every thing you listed is a serious issue with it's own problems and should be dealt with.  Just because we haven't perfected everything doesn't mean we can't work on more than one issue at once.

For one, there's a massive rate of violence and sexual assault on the LGBT community.  If you check out the Anti Violence Project's study here, the numbers are pretty messed up.  This 3% of the population catches a lot of shit, so that's a nice reason to be concerned about it.  There wouldn't be so much coverage on the issues if everybody was free to just live their life.  

Quote
Transgender  women  were  4  times more likely  to  experience  police violence compared to overall survivors. 

Transgender women were 6 times more likely to experience physical violence  when interacting  with  the  police  compared  to  overall  survivors. 

Additionally,  transgender  women were  2  times  as  likely  to  experience  discrimination, 1.8  times  more  likely  to  experience  harassment, and  1.5 times  as  likely  to  experience  threats  and  intimidation  compared  to  overall  survivors.

Transgender  women were  1.8  times  more  likely  to  experience  sexual  violence  when  compared  with  other  survivors.

In  addition transgender  survivors  were  1.5  times  more  likely  to  experience  hate  violence  in  public  areas  and  1.4 times  more  likely  to  experience  hate  violence  in  shelters.

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July 28, 2015, 02:45:04 AM
 #120

.....
When did I say anything about any other disorder?  Every thing you listed is a serious issue with it's own problems and should be dealt with.  Just because we haven't perfected everything doesn't mean we can't work on more than one issue at once.

For one, there's a massive rate of violence and sexual assault on the LGBT community.  If you check out the Anti Violence Project's study here, the numbers are pretty messed up.  This 3% of the population catches a lot of shit, so that's a nice reason to be concerned about it.  There wouldn't be so much coverage on the issues if everybody was free to just live their life.  

Quote
Transgender  women  were  4  times more likely  to  experience  police violence compared to overall survivors. 

Transgender women were 6 times more likely to experience physical violence  when interacting  with  the  police  compared  to  overall  survivors. 

Additionally,  transgender  women were  2  times  as  likely  to  experience  discrimination, 1.8  times  more  likely  to  experience  harassment, and  1.5 times  as  likely  to  experience  threats  and  intimidation  compared  to  overall  survivors.

Transgender  women were  1.8  times  more  likely  to  experience  sexual  violence  when  compared  with  other  survivors.

In  addition transgender  survivors  were  1.5  times  more  likely  to  experience  hate  violence  in  public  areas  and  1.4 times  more  likely  to  experience  hate  violence  in  shelters.
(bolded) You didn't.  That's why I felt obliged to point it out.

Now let me address EVERY ONE OF YOUR TALKING POINTS about the 0.3% of the people you are focusing on.

You mean they have A FRACTION OF the violence, discrimination and so forth as blacks?

Wow....

I do not know what kind of case you have presented....
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