Usagi: falsifying NAVs, manipulating share prices and misleading investors.

[BCB]

usgai,

you are sperging again.

it will NEVER end....

just produce the documents.

CAN YOU DO THAT?

this is not about your education


this is not about where you grew up

this is not about your attitude

this is not about your gender identification preference

this is not about your age

this it not about what planet you may or may not be the king or queen of..


This is about the simple fact that you can not respond to simple question and identify simple facts about your business.

That is why we are calling you a scammer.

[BCB]

Does anyone else find it highly unusual that none of usagi's shareholders have bothered to weigh in here?

I assume most people, like me, find the scammer forum pretty ridiculous.  Only low level scammers get a tag and then there are countless accusations against some other people, usually to do with securities, that claim misapropriation of funds.  Instead the inevestor should have looked hard at their investment decisions.  Business failure due to incompetence or bad decisions do not, in my opinion, due to constitute a scammer tag.  Many people will have a failure, but that does not make them a scammer.  In the real world, people are protected by limited liability agreements.  If there is no agreement in place specifying what kind of liability then that was a bad investment decision and just goes to show the though the manager of the investment put into when they created their investment.  If they knew what they were doing they would have covered all their risks before opening the business.

I bet there would be a lot less pointless posts in the scammer forum if there was a requirement for the accuser to pay a moderator 10 bitcoins for a scamming accusation.  That accuser can be given back their 10 bitcoins if the mediator determines a scammer tag is warrented or bot the accuser and the accused come to a mutually agreed resolution.  If there is not enough evidence a scam took place then the accuser loses their 10 bitcoin deposit.

There is a reason why people in real life get to face their accusers, judged by a jury of their peers, and the prosecution has to pay heavy filing and court fees to initiate a suit.  This is because anyone can make false or exaggerated claims without proof.

Is this post a defense of usgai?

[vampire]

My attitude: I have a right to be angry because for months I have had to put up with insults and derogatory comments from people like vampire, whose allegations have now been proven false. You think about that for a moment before you criticize me for my attitude.

You proved me wrong? I was not posting, but YOU PULLED ME BACK IN.

Also your attitude got me involved in the first place. If you weren't an asshole and didn't twist the words (or just outright lie) when you accused EskimoBob I wouldn't be posting right now.

Here is the timeline:

• Puppet questions your NAV being off by 20-50%, and calls it's a scam - PROVEN
• You say it's an average and then you post the formula that is the complete opposite - PROVEN
• That formula wasn't anywhere, it was NOT mentioned in your Sept 23 press release to the investors. And you claimed that you did - PROVEN
• Then you go and edit the spreadsheet and modify them AFTER the accusations and AFTER Sept 23 release - PROVEN

Falsifying NAV is just ONE of the accusations.

References:

1) Puppet's accusation
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=112443.60

2) Proof that usagi is using creative formulas, calls an average while it's far from being an average

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113708.msg1228703#msg1228703

3) Sep 23's release doesn't mention the formula at all, it simply says an automatic script. No where it says that the scripts is using a formula that is 20-50% off from the reality. You could have done the same by using this formula: usagi_price = mtgox_price * 1.5

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113708.msg1429162#msg1429162

4) Proof that usagi modified the documentation AFTER accusations

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=113708.msg1428420#msg1428420

edit: I am gonna go through all the posts and find the earliest accusations of manipulating NAV.

Sep 23 accusation: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110350.msg1214957#msg1214957
Sep 26 accusation: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110350.msg1222190#msg1222190

[BCB]

update:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.new#new

[Deprived]

Hmm.

If you are admitting you are pursuing a scammer tag against me because of my attitude, and ex.

Your response - and the attitude you had - convinced me there was something very dubious going on.
...
So maybe next time you call someone a noob and tell them to get lost you may want to reflect on just how well that tactic worked on me.

...then you are admitting you have no evidence. Look, I'm sorry I called you a noob. But that does not make me a scammer. Right now I'm a little unsure of how I should proceed with this. BCB screwed this up very badly; I've asked some people I respect for some advice. I'll get back to you. Till then, what do you think of the settlement idea that has been discussed?

First off I wasn't admitting I had no evidence - I was explaining what motivated me to put effort into looking for evidence in the first place.

As far as getting the situation resolved here's my PERSONAL stance - some others may agree, others will likely disagree.

1.  Scammer tag.  I couldn't much care whether you get a scammer tag or not.  It doesn't achieve anything, it doesn't get handed out to lots of people who deserve it, it's not particularly clear what it even means.
2.  Reparations to investors.  This is a trickier one - would assume most investors don't even have a clue what half the arguing is about or understand some of the things you've done that broke contracts or caused them loss (some of which haven't ever been mentioned yet).  But right now main priority is to get funds back to investors which THEY believe are fair - personally I'd take the view that if you offer them some extra in full and final settlement of any errors/wrong-doing by you to date (i.e. NOT carte blanche to mess up during close down) then if they accept it that's issue ended as far as liability gos.
3.  Going forward.  If you attempt to run new businesses on here then I'd definitely point them to this thread.  I wouldn't go out of my way to cause hassle for you - but if you attempted to misrepresent my position as being that I accepted you were innocent (when, to my mind, paying a settlement is tantamount to acceptance of some degree of guilt) or had no evidence (I have plenty of evidence) then I'd point that out.

FWIW majority of things I've seen that I believe you did wrong (in the sense of morally/culpably wrong, rather than just inept)  relate to dealings between your multiple companies - not to decisions made where you only had to consider the interests of one company (some of those were pretty bad - but in no way worthy of scammer accusations).  Had you only been running one company it's unlikely I'd be making any scam accusations (other than, possibly, over the issue of one computer which appeared to be on BMF's asset list but is now claimed to be your own).

[greyhawk]

You people are wasting the usagis valuable time embroiling it in scammer tag debates all day every day. The usagis time would be much better spent in winding down it's various so-called "companies" so that it can finally get banned afterwards.

[usagi]

You people are wasting the usagis valuable time embroiling it in scammer tag debates all day every day. The usagis time would be much better spent in winding down it's various so-called "companies" so that it can finally get banned afterwards.

It's possible that's what the plan is. But then why not give me a scammer tag now then, just to shut people up?

Tell you what, greyhawk. Since you think I am a scammer, can you put a number on the bitcoins you feel I scammed? Just saying maybe if you could put a number on it we could discuss who I had to pay off to end the massive crap which is being spewed at me. I'm considering something like 100 bitcoins paid to BMF investors, 100 to CPA, and 100 to NYAN.A/etc. it would take me a while to buy that many bitcoins, and maybe sell some of my personal possessions, but at this point that is more valuable to me than allowing you to lob accusations at me with no chance to defend myself or make repairs. Think about it.

[BCB]

update: 

usagi continues to prove his inability to answer to even simple queries.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.new#new

[greyhawk]

You people are wasting the usagis valuable time embroiling it in scammer tag debates all day every day. The usagis time would be much better spent in winding down it's various so-called "companies" so that it can finally get banned afterwards.

It's possible that's what the plan is. But then why not give me a scammer tag now then, just to shut people up?

Tell you what, greyhawk. Since you think I am a scammer, can you put a number on the bitcoins you feel I scammed? Just saying maybe if you could put a number on it we could discuss who I had to pay off to end the massive crap which is being spewed at me. I'm considering something like 100 bitcoins paid to BMF investors, 100 to CPA, and 100 to NYAN.A/etc. it would take me a while to buy that many bitcoins, and maybe sell some of my personal possessions, but at this point that is more valuable to me than allowing you to lob accusations at me with no chance to defend myself or make repairs. Think about it.

I don't think you're a scammer. I have absolutely no opinion on that, because to form such an opinion I would need to read all through your drivel and that's something for people more masochistic than me.

What I do think is you're a pretentious dramaboat that dunning-krügered itself way too deep into uncharted waters and thats only value lies in occassionally bopping its bow back up to the surface brandishing a huge sign saying "Book your delicious adventure cruise now. We're totally not sinking.", then gets knocked down below again by the angry sea while releasing a swath of meltdown-induced bubbles. So that's kinda entertaining in a way.

[vampire]

It's okay. My name isn't Oliver either ;-)

Oh usagi are you still refusing to acknowledge your name? How's your wife W. doing?

I have a complete proof that your name is Oliver and isn't Serena.

[kjj]

It's okay. My name isn't Oliver either ;-)

Oh usagi are you still refusing to acknowledge your name? How's your wife W. doing?

I have a complete proof that your name is Oliver and isn't Serena.

I would really prefer that crap like this not show up here.

You can hardly fault the guy for wanting to keep a bit of privacy by obfuscating his name or address.  His customers had no problem dealing with an unknown entity calling himself "usagi", so bringing up the details of his personal life now seems petty and vindictive; hardly evidence of dishonesty.

[vampire]

It's okay. My name isn't Oliver either ;-)

Oh usagi are you still refusing to acknowledge your name? How's your wife W. doing?

I have a complete proof that your name is Oliver and isn't Serena.

I would really prefer that crap like this not show up here.

You can hardly fault the guy for wanting to keep a bit of privacy by obfuscating his name or address.  His customers had no problem dealing with an unknown entity calling himself "usagi", so bringing up the details of his personal life now seems petty and vindictive; hardly evidence of dishonesty.

This guy and his henchman doxed Bitcoin OZ (a shareholder) also tried to dox EskimoBob (a shareholder):
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=128630.0

Also don't forget he was claiming to be a girl named Serena, this is just shows that he has no problems lying to people.

Usagi next time you try to dox anyone again, think twice. I have all of your relatives on file in Canada / Taiwan.

[repentance]

Also don't forget he was claiming to be a girl named Serena, this is just shows that he has no problems lying to people.

Serena is the English name of the Sailor Moon character Usagi Tsukino.  Usagi is a female character in the series so I'm not sure that using "Serena" is any more indicative of claiming to be a girl than using the name "Usagi".  Whether he has the whole otherkin thing going on and believes he is in some way bonded with that character is a whole different can of worms.

[vampire]

Serena is the English name of the Sailor Moon character Usagi Tsukino.  Usagi is a female character in the series so I'm not sure that using "Serena" is any more indicative of claiming to be a girl than using the name "Usagi".  Whether he has the whole otherkin thing going on and believes he is in some way bonded with that character is a whole different can of worms.

Ok, I see.

[stochastic]

Does anyone else find it highly unusual that none of usagi's shareholders have bothered to weigh in here?

I assume most people, like me, find the scammer forum pretty ridiculous.  Only low level scammers get a tag and then there are countless accusations against some other people, usually to do with securities, that claim misapropriation of funds.  Instead the inevestor should have looked hard at their investment decisions.  Business failure due to incompetence or bad decisions do not, in my opinion, due to constitute a scammer tag.  Many people will have a failure, but that does not make them a scammer.  In the real world, people are protected by limited liability agreements.  If there is no agreement in place specifying what kind of liability then that was a bad investment decision and just goes to show the though the manager of the investment put into when they created their investment.  If they knew what they were doing they would have covered all their risks before opening the business.

I bet there would be a lot less pointless posts in the scammer forum if there was a requirement for the accuser to pay a moderator 10 bitcoins for a scamming accusation.  That accuser can be given back their 10 bitcoins if the mediator determines a scammer tag is warrented or bot the accuser and the accused come to a mutually agreed resolution.  If there is not enough evidence a scam took place then the accuser loses their 10 bitcoin deposit.

There is a reason why people in real life get to face their accusers, judged by a jury of their peers, and the prosecution has to pay heavy filing and court fees to initiate a suit.  This is because anyone can make false or exaggerated claims without proof.

Is this post a defense of usgai?

While I can't defend usagi's management of CPA, NYAN, or his other business, I can vouch that he keeps his word.  I had a middleman dealings with usagi about a logo project and he fulfilled his end of the contract just fine.  As payment for the services usagi offered me shares in CPA but I declined because of his overly defensive attitude when confronted by questionable business practices.  I feel that usagi's response should have been more professional and from this attitude he will get unprofessional attacks.  I know in the bitcoinland climate that scams happen very often and many people ferociously attack any potential scammer, but I think some of the accusations toward usagi were overly aggressive.  I think a better response to mismanagement is to be a teacher rather than an accuser.  Teach someone how to correctly calculate the value of a fund.  I would agree with people that some people should not run funds or business, but this whole thing is a big experiment.

I do not think mismanagement should be deemed a scammer in this situation as it has not been done in the past.  Zhoutong and many others have not been given a scammer tag for mismanagement.  I do think mismangement is a potential liability, but that should be worked out with the parties that lost value due to mismanagement. 

One problem that I feel is wrong with the scammer forum is that administrators of this forum have already made it clear that a scammer tag will not be given to people that deny liability after the fact when something goes wrong.  Also, I also don't think there should be a single decider of who is or is not a scammer.  Mediation between the accuser and the accused is fine with one person, but that person needs to be unbiased and have not potential gain from the outcomes of mediation.

Furthermore, the reason why there is so many post about if usagi should get a scammer tag or not is because there is no clear rules on who should or who shouldn't be given a scammer tag.  There is also no consistency on who gets one and who does not.  If the scammer tag is not just applied to obvious scammers like pirateat40 but to anyone, even if they make a mistake but won't accept liability, then I think the scammer tag will be more beneficial to the bitcoin ecosystem.  A scammer tag can always be removed once the liability is cleared by the tagged scammer.  This means that a scammer tag would be applied to anyone that commits obvious fraud, mismanages a company, violates their own terms of service, or anyone that might behave in an unacceptable manner.  The important thing is that the decision to tag a scammer is done in a way that is just and follows acceptable procedures.  Since there are no acceptable procedures now, you get the cluster fuck that we see today.

A better way a scam accusation procedure could be done is that a group of people volunteer to be a pool to randomly select a mediator and/or deciders of a scamming judgement.  The accuser would contact the scamming moderators and make their accusation.  The scamming administrators would then select a mediator who would then randomly select the volunteers from the pool to decide if the accused gets a scammer tag and what would can be done to avoid or remove the tag.  The mediator would allow for public posting of the accusation and would decide if information by the accuser or the accused should be included in the discussion.  The deciders then get to discuss the scam accusation privately and come to a decision.  While the pool of volunteers is known, the ones that are randomly selected should be kept confidential.

[Zeeks]

Also don't forget he was claiming to be a girl named Serena, this is just shows that he has no problems lying to people.

Serena is the English name of the Sailor Moon character Usagi Tsukino.  Usagi is a female character in the series so I'm not sure that using "Serena" is any more indicative of claiming to be a girl than using the name "Usagi".  Whether he has the whole otherkin thing going on and believes he is in some way bonded with that character is a whole different can of worms.

Wait, what? This is all mostly gibberish to me...

[usagi]

It's okay. My name isn't Oliver either ;-)

Oh usagi are you still refusing to acknowledge your name? How's your wife W. doing?

I have a complete proof that your name is Oliver and isn't Serena.

I would really prefer that crap like this not show up here.

You can hardly fault the guy for wanting to keep a bit of privacy by obfuscating his name or address.  His customers had no problem dealing with an unknown entity calling himself "usagi", so bringing up the details of his personal life now seems petty and vindictive; hardly evidence of dishonesty.

This guy and his henchman doxed Bitcoin OZ (a shareholder) also tried to dox EskimoBob (a shareholder):
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=128630.0

Also don't forget he was claiming to be a girl named Serena, this is just shows that he has no problems lying to people.

Usagi next time you try to dox anyone again, think twice. I have all of your relatives on file in Canada / Taiwan.

Lol, so you're threatening to harm an innocent third party because I won't tell you my name?

I didn't dox anyone. Augustocroppo did and at the point he posted that one of the last things I told him was, I didn't need his help.

This is exactly why I want to remain anonymous. People like Vampire are unstable and unpredictable. Augustocroppo, someone whom I have little to no relation doxes two people and I have to pay for it? This is why I get so pissed off. Vampire you're a real asshole. I thought you were going to stop posting and let me make reparations to shareholders? How long do you plan on bothering me when it's clear I've done what I was supposed to do?

[BCB]

restored deleted post
The Crimson Permanent Assurance

Full Contract

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.new#new

[BCB]

"Augustocroppo, someone whom I have little to no relation..." - usagi

Usagi you know this guy is your only defender right now??

Also I have meet Vampire in person and can personally vouch for his stability and integrity.

Please have someone on this board vouch for you stability and integrity.

and answer a few simple questions.

would you please.

[vampire]

Lol, so you're threatening to harm an innocent third party because I won't tell you my name?

I didn't dox anyone. Augustocroppo did and at the point he posted that one of the last things I told him was, I didn't need his help.

This is exactly why I want to remain anonymous. People like Vampire are unstable and unpredictable. Augustocroppo, someone whom I have little to no relation doxes two people and I have to pay for it? This is why I get so pissed off. Vampire you're a real asshole. I thought you were going to stop posting and let me make reparations to shareholders? How long do you plan on bothering me when it's clear I've done what I was supposed to do?

So you're denying.. Oh wow.... That third party is you. I won't the release the information to the general public.

And yes, you doxxed Bitcoin OZ.. As my post shows.. Liar. Do you pay augosto? Did you have any monetary dealings with him?