That is it. Bitcoin is totally unpredictable. This market is fake.

[MatTheCat]

This Bullshit aint the work of an aggregate market.

This is just a few players with the power to defy all time learned principles of market mechanics, in order to deprive the maximum of unsuspecting punters of their USD and Bitcoins, but mostly USD.

This market is fucked.

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[gentlemand]

Or it's as true as can possibly be as there are no limits on how people can act. Either way it's not very helpful. The only thing that can sort it out properly is a tsunami of true demand. That's likely to continue to be scared away by the actions of the few.

[MatTheCat]

Or it's as true as can possibly be as there are no limits on how people can act. Either way it's not very helpful. The only thing that can sort it out properly is a tsunami of true demand. That's likely to continue to be scared away by the actions of the few.

Well, that alone, has proven to me that it is futile trying to read these markets, sure it might work, but market indicators and all the most meticulous TA in the world are like a straw fence standing against the steam roller of a whale's whim.

Had the whale who initiated that pump to $356 on Stamp earlier not immediately dumped right afterwards, then the market would be shooting up right now. The whole thing on Stamp was done within a couple of minutes, the pump, the dump, a pause, and then about 10 minutes later, the panic sell-offs, no doubt from the victims who had their Stop Buys activated in the channels above the consolidation triangle. The other markets all quickly followed suit, but stopped and paused on the dump, and then followed Stamp down on the panic sell off. Despite what any technical indicator points towards, all that is required to send this market hurtling in either direction is a whale to move in and pump, or dump, and these events tonight prove that beyond any reasonable doubt.

Where this market goes, is entirely down to the discretion of very few players, and that is not a comforting thought to any small time investor.

As if the 3 day pump to $500, and crash back down to $300 wasn't enough, this single action has emphatically underlined the fact for me that these markets are just not to be traded. People say that Forex is a feeding pool for sharks, but I bet you that nothing even close to the bullshit we see in Bitcoin happens on Forex...currency markets are just far too huge.

[adaseb]

I don't understand why you are complaining. The reason why price "crashed" down to $300 is because there was a huge upmove that there was absolutely no support until the ~$300 area.

This move wasn't caused by a large group of shorts being squeezed it was caused by real money traders buying from the $250 area all the way up to $500. It had to pullback at some point.

If $300 breaks, then I would worry and complain.

[adaseb]

Or it's as true as can possibly be as there are no limits on how people can act. Either way it's not very helpful. The only thing that can sort it out properly is a tsunami of true demand. That's likely to continue to be scared away by the actions of the few.

Well, that alone, has proven to me that it is futile trying to read these markets, sure it might work, but market indicators and all the most meticulous TA in the world are like a straw fence standing against the steam roller of a whale's whim.

Had the whale who initiated that pump to $356 on Stamp earlier not immediately dumped right afterwards, then the market would be shooting up right now. The whole thing on Stamp was done within a couple of minutes, the pump, the dump, a pause, and then about 10 minutes later, the panic sell-offs, no doubt from the victims who had their Stop Buys activated in the channels above the consolidation triangle. The other markets all quickly followed suit, but stopped and paused on the dump, and then followed Stamp down on the panic sell off. Despite what any technical indicator points towards, all that is required to send this market hurtling in either direction is a whale to move in and pump, or dump, and these events tonight prove that beyond any reasonable doubt.

Where this market goes, is entirely down to the discretion of very few players, and that is not a comforting thought to any small time investor.

As if the 3 day pump to $500, and crash back down to $300 wasn't enough, this single action has emphatically underlined the fact for me that these markets are just not to be traded. People say that Forex is a feeding pool for sharks, but I bet you that nothing even close to the bullshit we see in Bitcoin happens on Forex...currency markets are just far too huge.

The reason why price went back down is because there is huge resistance and supply at the $350 area and today there aren't many market participants because its the weekend.

One whale alone can't move the market past $500. Don't trade on weekends with no liquidity.

[STT]

An unpredictable market would make it more realistic not less.  If everyone knows whats going to happen thats when the dynamic is probably false.    Seems any normal market is one guy trying to get one over someone else for a profit, thats plain simple capitalism and yet a useful price is found for all market participants and its still more positive then fixed or controlled prices like a government system creates

So long as most news is kept open and known to all then its fine, if theres any false accounting or giant reserves of bitcoins somewhere (or hidden buying as China has used with T-bills and gold) then we're in trouble

[dinofelis]

This Bullshit aint the work of an aggregate market.

This is just a few players with the power to defy all time learned principles of market mechanics, in order to deprive the maximum of unsuspecting punters of their USD and Bitcoins, but mostly USD.

This market is fucked.

This is also known as the Efficient Market Hypothesis.

[Wexlike]

Ugh, you started trading again ?

[futurebit640]

This Bullshit aint the work of an aggregate market.

This is just a few players with the power to defy all time learned principles of market mechanics, in order to deprive the maximum of unsuspecting punters of their USD and Bitcoins, but mostly USD.

This market is fucked.

If your in bitcoin market for long time then you should be knowing that these bitcoins are not backed by any big institutions or governments. So it is easily manipulated by any big players so you should take the opportunity to sell when prices are high and if you had made some decent profits. If you target for very high price then you should go through all these fluctuations. Definitely the recent up move was to trap new people into bitcoin.

[Ibian]

SSS+buyback on dips. Doesn't matter which way the market goes with that strategy.

[1Referee]

Is this something you just found out?  The market hasn't been anything other than unpredictable and manipulated since its existance. As traders I can't complain at all. There is plenty of room for profit throughout the years with Bitcoin.

[Spaceman_Spiff]

This Bullshit aint the work of an aggregate market.

This is just a few players with the power to defy all time learned principles of market mechanics, in order to deprive the maximum of unsuspecting punters of their USD and Bitcoins, but mostly USD.

This market is fucked.

If you really believe so, then deal with it.  Stop using leverage, and stop trading short-term movements.  If it is manipulated far below "fair value", buy BTC, if it is manipulated far above "fair value" sell BTC.  The End.  Simple.

(disclaimer: being a somewhat degenerate speculator, I won't follow this advice though.  Also because I think the amount of manipulation is probably not that high.)

[Meuh6879]

This market is fucked.

[MatTheCat]

The reason why price went back down is because there is huge resistance and supply at the $350 area and today there aren't many market participants because its the weekend.

One whale alone can't move the market past $500. Don't trade on weekends with no liquidity.

The reason it went crashing back down, was because the whale pushed Bitcoin high enough to trigger a bunch of Stop Orders, into which he would no doubt have been mass selling and when that burst had run out of juice, he dumped the remainder of what he had acquired from the pump.

There may well be large resistance at $350, but it would have been broken through, had this whale had the desire to see the market go that way. The big players can pretty much manipulate this market anyway they want, sell where they want, and buy where they want. Bitcoin is a trading shark's wet dream.

[barbs]

I mean the move was nothing more than market makers clearing the way for their next move.

They've ran the numbers and that move is what they needed to execute their next strategy.

One incision here and it's off to the races.

They just reorienting the table in the way that works for their next move.

[disclaimer201]

That is it. You made a wrong move and got screwed over. The market is fine, as volatile as it has ever been with Bitcoin. Very simple trading rule, never sell lower than you bought, even if the price movement scares the shit out of you. Most bad traders give up after a couple weeks or further down movement. This is wrong. And if you trade with money you don't own and need to get back, don't blame the market. You are the only one to blame.

[smith coins]

Really i am a bit disappointed when i check how much cost a bitcoin.
I also think that the market is fake and the chinese people know how to pump/dump the price.
Market is really being manipulated and we know this bad fact

[MatTheCat]

Ugh, you started trading again ?

Yep.

I learned important lessons about controlling impulse, exercising discipline, keeping emotions out the equation, and done some meticulous TA, and concluded that the market was far more likely to go down, than go up. My first likely resistance point was $315, however, I suspected that wouldn't hold and that the floor will be found more in the $280 zone. The more I looked at the charts, the more I became convinced of a correction....so I SOLD! I left my computer for a bit, and unfortunately for me, I return just as this whale was pumping. Now, knowing what a vigorous break above a consolidation range normally means, I panic bought, at some $6 more than I orginally sold for, and witnessed the shit that was to follow. So now I am back in Bitcoin, at a higher price than which I exited the market (after having already taken horrendous losses on pump n dump), and totally against the momentum of the market, which I happened to have correctly read.

This recurring theme of reading the market correctly, but somehow not trading it, and then trying to compensate for missing out by placing wrong trades, really fucking pisses me off. So in the end, I resolved to be a hapless holder of Bitcoin, I am not only missing out on this move down, but I am being punished by it, because despite having forecast it correctly on this occasion, the splashes of the whales have frozen me in my tracks, cos I know with these fuckers about, Bitcoin can go in any direction, without any warning, and is totally unpredictable.

I can't reasonably expect to be able to play these markets with all these unpredictable X-Factors hovering around the exchanges, so I am either a holder of Bitcoin long term, or I get the fuck away from it.

I am currently a holder of Bitcoin, and am now watching the market do, what I predicted it was going to do, before getting all flustered by the whale's splashes and reversing my position, and I can tell you, after having lost the amount of Fiat I have lost allowing emotions to taint my market outlook, it is fucking galling having to witness this, again.

Incidentally, Bitcoin needs 'traders' in order to provide liquidity. If the whales continue to scare traders away, then their aint no liquidity, except for them. That isn't a healthy market and not a market which is likely to grow. As in other markets, I think the Bitcoin exchanges need to make it public knowledge, who is making trades on their platforms, that way, we can see who is doing the big buying and selling, and we can see when there is blatant market moulding going on.

i.e. Entity A, erects Massive Bid Wall, 5 minutes later, entity A devours own Bid Wall. !0 minutes later, Entity A erects massive Ask Wall, etc etc....that kind of shit needs to be transparent.

[vuduchyld]

This Bullshit aint the work of an aggregate market.

This is just a few players with the power to defy all time learned principles of market mechanics, in order to deprive the maximum of unsuspecting punters of their USD and Bitcoins, but mostly USD.

This market is fucked.

This is also known as the Efficient Market Hypothesis.

Actually, I'd say that this is the exact OPPOSITE of an Efficient Market.  In an efficient market, news and events are equally available to all and all factors are priced int at any given point in time.  Bitcoin is an inefficient market.  Information is asymmetrical.  There are market makers and bigger players who can manipulate or at least influence prices.

We don't have equal and symmetrical information about the ASSET, even, as there are no 10K's or 10Q's.  Prices are not based on underlying fundamentals such as earnings or revenues. 

Spaceman_Spiff says:

If it is manipulated far below "fair value", buy BTC, if it is manipulated far above "fair value" sell BTC.  The End.  Simple.

This is EXACTLY right.  It's the only way to be involved.  You better have some method of figuring out what the "fair value" is to you.  Personally, I do it based on money supply.  I've made some estimates of usage and velocity for the year 2020, then I discount it back to present value (at a pretty aggressive discount rate, I might add, because there is a lot of risk).  I buy if it's below and sell if it's above.  I should add that bitcoin has a tendency to overcorrect massively, so I buy when I think bitcoin is about 30% BELOW vuduchyld's "fair value" and I sell when I think it's 30% above.

Oh, and finally, you have to realize this is a speculation, not an investment.  Use the appropriate piece of your portfolio reserved for high-risk and hopefully high-reward plays.
 

 

[HarryKPeters]

How can this be suprise? After 1 year of analysing i stopped following the analyze 'guru's' with their fibonacci etc.

It is manipulated > yes
Is that bad > no

With every price rise more and more people get into bitcoin. And now it is just about waiting...

If only 1 multinational will 'do' something with bitcoin others will follow and more people will adopt it. Hence the market will be supply & demand without big whales making the market.