SCAMMER: caradenada

[BitcoinINV]

I do have that, and the thing is when a merchant gets a charge back they will be firing questions at you like crazy. The fact that you responded means he should have told you exactly what the problem is. Even after someone files a charge back it takes 2 weeks to process through the visa/mc system before they notify the merchant. First thing the merchant will see is a Charge backfee on there bank account then a letter in the mail with reasoning for the charge back. The merchant should be willing to share this info with you if he wants to get his money back and Visa/MC want this type of resolve its written in most Merchant Contracts. He wants to beat the charge back so he can get that fee they charged him back and keep his chargeback rate down. If you pay him these things will still effect him, so lets figure out what really happened it will be good for all involved.

[cointell]

I do have that, and the thing is when a merchant gets a charge back they will be firing questions at you like crazy. The fact that you responded means he should have told you exactly what the problem is. Even after someone files a charge back it takes 2 weeks to process through the visa/mc system before they notify the merchant. First thing the merchant will see is a Charge backfee on there bank account then a letter in the mail with reasoning for the charge back. The merchant should be willing to share this info with you if he wants to get his money back and Visa/MC want this type of resolve its written in most Merchant Contracts. He wants to beat the charge back so he can get that fee they charged him back and keep his chargeback rate down. If you pay him these things will still effect him, so lets figure out what really happened it will be good for all involved.

Well, I can ask for more info.  However, if it really was a stolen credit card, then the merchant is not going to win the chargeback.  Cara de Nada seems to be unwilling or unable to cancel the chargeback.  I've already given him more than two weeks to resolve this.  And furthermore, he lied to me about it.  He said he would contact entropay about the chargeback.  I now know that the card number wasn't from entropay.

Would you disclose the merchant that this happened with?

I'm a bit hesitant to do that as I do not want to invite fraud.  This merchant apparently accepted a credit card from a different country with a clearly non-matching billing address.

[caradenada]

I asked you the same thing they asked here in forum, to send me some proof that the chargeback exists. I told you more than once time, that if it exists i will solve anyway it, even if i have to send you the money back, but accept that you didnt do anything to show any proof of the acussation you made here.

[BitcoinINV]

The merchant should be able to tell you what bank the card was and if it was a level 1,2 or 3 card. This means if it was a personal, business or gift/prepaid card. This merchant does not have fraud protection? Most CC processors have fraud filters that will stop a card from being used if I.P. and billing zip do not match or name to name on card. If you are not from Argentina where the card was issued from that should have flagged the purchase right there and held it for the merchant to review. I'm just guessing here cause I see whats going on, but my guess is the Merchant Processor ran the card it was held for review. This is what caused the first cards to be declined. The merchant sent the goods out, then noticed the payment was held. When the merchant when into his processor and clicked process it declined it. Like I said get all the info you can.

[cointell]

I asked you the same thing they asked here in forum, to send me some proof that the chargeback exists. I told you more than once time, that if it exists i will solve anyway it, even if i have to send you the money back, but accept that you didnt do anything to show any proof of the acussation you made here.

You know exactly which card number it was, the date, and the amount.  I gave you that info more than two weeks ago.  Quit cluttering up this thread with frivolous denials.

[caradenada]

Send or paste here the email telling you about the chargeback, as you were requested before by other users. I need to know the chargeback exists, so send the prove of that, thats info only you and your merchant should have. I dont need the date, card number or amount

[cointell]

The merchant should be able to tell you what bank the card was and if it was a level 1,2 or 3 card. This means if it was a personal, business or gift/prepaid card. This merchant does not have fraud protection? Most CC processors have fraud filters that will stop a card from being used if I.P. and billing zip do not match or name to name on card. If you are not from Argentina where the card was issued from that should have flagged the purchase right there and held it for the merchant to review. I'm just guessing here cause I see whats going on, but my guess is the Merchant Processor ran the card it was held for review. This is what caused the first cards to be declined. The merchant sent the goods out, then noticed the payment was held. When the merchant when into his processor and clicked process it declined it. Like I said get all the info you can.

It might have been flagged for review, but it's at the discretion of the merchant.  I was a repeat customer with no history of chargebacks, so they may have allowed it.

Bugging the merchant for more info really isn't going to help me here.  I want them to forget about it and leave me alone.  Making them look up lots of info about a credit card that was probably stolen isn't going to achieve that.  If there's something simple and straightforward that I can ask them, then I'll do that.

[cointell]

Send or paste here the email telling you about the chargeback, as you were requested before by other users. I need to know the chargeback exists, so send the prove of that, thats info only you and your merchant should have. I dont need the date, card number or amount

Since you know the date and the amount, you can just look on your credit card statement.  Oh.. you can't do that because it's not your credit card.  I forgot about that.  How silly of me.

[augustocroppo]

Order of events:

On October 7, caradenada made a post which I replied to. We negotiated a bit, then the next day I sent 20 btc to 1LkHDNFqv1DR1yUmbMDncjdwciG3rqfM5k. On October 9, I bought a virtual credit card. The payments went to 1LkHDNFqv1DR1yUmbMDncjdwciG3rqfM5k and 1JVn66Sq4EHSSE1NhjdD9G7v9PrB26Dz1a. Cara de Nada gave me a card number which began with 406742... and told me that there was a 290 USD balance. I made a purchase with this card.  I did not tell the merchant that this was an entropay card.  I just entered the card number and my shipping info as usual.  The purchase was approved, and apparently was not charged back. The following day, October 9, I attempted to use the card again.  It did not work, even though there should have been a remaining balance.  I complained to caradenada about the card not working.

http://blockchain.info/tx-index/29005553/fc31cdd7007e5ac02a0aa80fab82bdd3359f4944f7286af58d0c304e65a03a36

1GvKaut8jX8pmEgd95fvy4Gg4oLmbdbE7W --> 1LkHDNFqv1DR1yUmbMDncjdwciG3rqfM5k
Received Time: 2012-10-08 01:05:05
Estimated BTC Transacted: 20 BTC

He gave me another card number, this one starting with 498401...  This card number appears to not be from entropay, but I didn't know that at the time. This merchant apparently accepted a credit card from a different country with a clearly non-matching billing address. I used the card, and got a complaint from the merchant about a chargeback on November 16 (He gave me the second address in November, but I discovered the chargeback before I sent any money there). On November 16, the merchant complained of a chargeback. All I know is that the merchant complained of a chargeback. They sent me an email saying there was a chargeback.  They gave me the date of the original order, and the amount.  That's all they told me, but it was sufficient to identify which charge it was. The email from the merchant said: "We received a chargeback from our bank today regarding the order below. The reason stated was that the charge was not recognised" and gave the order number. "Charge not recognized" is the closest you'll get.  I have offered to repay the merchant for the loss I got the merchandise, and a chargeback was made.  I'm now going to have to pay back the money that caradenada stole. It may not be possible to prove the chargeback, but if a moderator/admin is able to look at the private messages caradenada sent me, then it should be possible to confirm that he did in fact give me card numbers with different BINs.

The visa card numbers caradenada gave me began with 406742, 418044, 498401, and 498431.  Not all of the cards worked, and when I complained he gave me different ones.

The chargeback isn't against me, it's against the merchant. I contacted caradenada and asked him to withdraw the chargeback.  He repeatedly denied making the chargeback. The chargeback was not resolved. He claims to have contacted entropay, but there wouldn't be any reason to contact entropay if the cards came from elsewhere. I asked the merchant if the situation was resolved, and their reponse was no, and that there was a second chargeback on December 4. On December 4, I received another chargeback notice for a different purchase.

[cointell]

The summary that augustocroppo posted is a bit jumbled, but it is accurate.

Here's a somewhat more concise summary:

First purchase Oct 8, card number 406742...  Successful, no chargeback.
Attempted purchase Oct 9, card number 406742... declined.
Second purchase Oct 9, card number 498401...  Initially successful, chargeback Nov 16.
Third purchase Oct 18, card number 498431...  Initially successful, chargeback Dec 4.
Attempted purchase Nov 14, card number 498431... declined.

It was on November 14 that he gave me the 1JVn66... address.  The first chargeback hit two days later, before I sent any money to this address.

[augustocroppo]

Send or paste here the email telling you about the chargeback, as you were requested before by other users. I need to know the chargeback exists, so send the prove of that, thats info only you and your merchant should have. I dont need the date, card number or amount

Do you deny or do you accept that you sent that credit card numbers to Cointell?

[augustocroppo]

The summary that augustocroppo posted is a bit jumbled, but it is accurate.

Here's a somewhat more concise summary:

First purchase Oct 8, card number 406742...  Successful, no chargeback.
Attempted purchase Oct 9, card number 406742... declined.
Second purchase Oct 9, card number 498401...  Initially successful, chargeback Nov 16.
Third purchase Oct 18, card number 498431...  Initially successful, chargeback Dec 4.
Attempted purchase Nov 14, card number 498431... declined.

It was on November 14 that he gave me the 1JVn66... address.  The first chargeback hit two days later, before I sent any money to this address.

What happened with the card 418044?

[cointell]

What happened with the card 418044?

He told me to use that one if 498431 didn't work.  I never used it.

[augustocroppo]

What happened with the card 418044?

He told me to use that one if 498431 didn't work.  I never used it.

All right.

What are your terms to settle a deal with Caradenada? How much loss you had and how much you want from Caradenada?

[cointell]

What are your terms to settle a deal with Caradenada? How much loss you had and how much you want from Caradenada?

Assuming there will be no chargeback for the October 8 purchase, and I reimburse the merchant for the two chargebacks, my loss is about $500.  There is no way he can repay me for all the trouble he caused.

[caradenada]

In the card statements it doesnt say anything about chargebacks, thats why i asked you that are the one who accused me, to show me the proves that the chargebacks exists, you have to find a way to get it by yourself. I dont care how you do it, but untill now you dont have nothing more than words. After you used the cards, i deleted that cards from my account, to not confuss and sell to another customer again. I only have the card screenshots, not an statement. Anyway, as i told you before, if you are so sure of what you are saying and still have no proves to show here, go to justice. I will only respond to that "damage" you mentiones, after you show me an email or someother proof that the chargebacks existed, you have to prove that, you are the one who accuses me, so find a way to prove your sayings, ok?.

[cointell]

I can't prove that the chargebacks exist because I don't have access to the bank statements.  I believe that the merchant is telling me the truth, but I have no firsthand knowledge.

What is plainly clear is that you are lying.  You lied about these being entropay cards.  These are not entropay card numbers.  When I complained about the chargeback, you lied and said you would contact entropay.  You obviously didn't contact entropay, since the cards didn't come from entropay.  And now you are lying again.  You couldn't have deleted that card from your account because it was never on your entropay account.

The evidence of your lying is right here on bitcointalk.  The admins should look at it, and give you a scammer tag.

[caradenada]

No my friend. I have deleted the cards, but previously i have made the screenshots, which i have stored in my computer. These are entropay cards, i told you before and i repeat now. You are the liar here, because in more than a month you cant show a single proof that chargeback exists. You can ask your merchant to send some info, but you didnt do it, you go for the easy way of make this public unsostained acussation without proves. Stop lying, and show proves. Yesterday you were requested to send at least the header of the email from the merchant, but you didnt do that neither, because im sure that that email doesnt exists neither. Who is the liar here then?

[cointell]

No my friend. I have deleted the cards, but previously i have made the screenshots, which i have stored in my computer. These are entropay cards, i told you before and i repeat now. You are the liar here, because in more than a month you cant show a single proof that chargeback exists. You can ask your merchant to send some info, but you didnt do it, you go for the easy way of make this public unsostained acussation without proves. Stop lying, and show proves. Yesterday you were requested to send at least the header of the email from the merchant, but you didnt do that neither, because im sure that that email doesnt exists neither. Who is the liar here then?

What should I ask the merchant?  There are two possible things I could ask:

The merchant should be able to tell you what bank the card was and if it was a level 1,2 or 3 card. This means if it was a personal, business or gift/prepaid card.

The merchant should be able to go right into his Merchant account and pull the Charge Back up with the Ref # Date and Reason Code

I could ask the merchant what bank the cards came from.  I have no reason to do that, since we already know it is Banco do Brasil.

I could ask the merchant for the chargeback reference number.  This is totally useless, since no one here would be able to verify this info.

All you are doing is wasting people's time.

[caradenada]

You made the post without having proofs, you used the people lying them, so you make people waste their time, little idiot. Send the email you received from the merchant, PROVE THE CHARGEBACK EXISTS!!!