Freedom is ...

[FirstAscent]

I guess you don't understand how small things summed in aggregate become big things. Have a good day.

And you never understood that in AnCap, all small things will aggregate into big things. Anarchy is not "everyone for themselves," it's "everyone for freely choosing their alliances." If you can't understand the larger implication of this then you can't understand AnCap.
(Yes, even if those alliances form some sort pseudo-totalitarian, taxing authorities that control and tax whoever lives on their territory)

I believe you missed the point. Small things, virtually unnoticed, go unenforced. But in aggregate, create monstrous problems.

Wouldn't they also go unnoticed in a regulatory society, and thus will go unenforced? What do government regulators have that people who are involved with a person doing those things directly don't?

A law requiring enforcement.

[FirstAscent]

Freedom is being able to protect myself however I want to and to be able to make as much money as I want to without anyone telling me how I can or cannot do it.

That works when there is no causal relationship between you and the rest of society.

What do you mean by "causal relationship?"

A causal relationship is when one variable causes a change in another variable. X causes a change in Y.

X = your actions.
Y = society.

EDIT: what the fuck did you think it meant?

[sega01]

A law requiring enforcement.

How is it freedom when you are forced to pay somone else to upload laws which ensure your freedom? Doesn't this imply that you're enslaved to the law's enforcers and that you don't naturally have freedom without them?

[FirstAscent]

A law requiring enforcement.

How is it freedom when you are forced to pay somone else to upload laws which ensure your freedom? Doesn't this imply that you're enslaved to the law's enforcers and that you don't naturally have freedom without them?

Better that than lose the freedoms removed from unregulated activities.

[sega01]

What freedoms do I lose when I, and others, participate in unregulated activities? I've yet to knowingly experience this.

[FirstAscent]

What freedoms do I lose when I, and others, participate in unregulated activities? I've yet to knowingly experience this.

I think your comment solidifies the notion that you're not too well read in science, the environment, politics or economics. Would you like some recommended reading?

And by the way, have a great holiday!

[phelix]

the room IN BETWEEN you and the law

[gopher]

One is free when one takes responsibility for ones actions, satisfy ones own needs, when one is able to exist fully independently of others.

[Rassah]

Freedom is being able to protect myself however I want to and to be able to make as much money as I want to without anyone telling me how I can or cannot do it.

That works when there is no causal relationship between you and the rest of society.

What do you mean by "causal relationship?"

A causal relationship is when one variable causes a change in another variable. X causes a change in Y.

X = your actions.
Y = society.

EDIT: what the fuck did you think it meant?

I was just confused that you seem to have thought that it's possible to make money without any " casual" relationships.

[Rassah]

Wouldn't they also go unnoticed in a regulatory society, and thus will go unenforced? What do government regulators have that people who are involved with a person doing those things directly don't?

A law requiring enforcement.

How would that help if the act goes unnoticed though?

[FirstAscent]

Wouldn't they also go unnoticed in a regulatory society, and thus will go unenforced? What do government regulators have that people who are involved with a person doing those things directly don't?

A law requiring enforcement.

How would that help if the act goes unnoticed though?

Excellent observation. That's exactly the problem in an AnCap type of society. There's a much less consistent noticing of such things, unlike a society which enforces such things through seasonal inspections and such.

[Rassah]

Wouldn't they also go unnoticed in a regulatory society, and thus will go unenforced? What do government regulators have that people who are involved with a person doing those things directly don't?

A law requiring enforcement.

How would that help if the act goes unnoticed though?

Excellent observation. That's exactly the problem in an AnCap type of society. There's a much less consistent noticing of such things, unlike a society which enforces such things through seasonal inspections and such.

okay, I'll grant you that one.

[Dalkore]

A law requiring enforcement.

How is it freedom when you are forced to pay somone else to upload laws which ensure your freedom? Doesn't this imply that you're enslaved to the law's enforcers and that you don't naturally have freedom without them?

Then by that reasoning you are only as free as you can defend.  I believe this to be true and that is why people decided to form governments so they weren't ruled by RANDOM THUGS.  This is why a step back away from a form of government is regressive in fact.

I would much rather know my thugs and have checks and balances.   You all complain that they don't work, look at us now, HOW MANY OF YOU actually do something like protest, go to your reps office, write an actually letter (not email), call a TV station?   Very few and it shows, most people care more about themselves and their oh so important social lives.  Doesn't matter.  It is coming to a head soon and we will see where people stand and what they will do.  

[CountSparkle]

Doesn't matter.  It is coming to a head soon and we will see where people stand and what they will do.  

Can't wait! 

[Anon136]

so what is liberty? liberty is the *freedom* to pursue your own ends free from coercion but not using the term 'coercion' to apply to paying taxes, levies, fees, rents, tariffs or payments if you are using infrastructure to which those payments apply so long as your means are not responsible for coercing other individuals or affecting other individuals in a negative way.

FTFY

rofl

But true. I have since edited it further.

oh you weren't joking, thats even funnier!

[FirstAscent]

so what is liberty? liberty is the *freedom* to pursue your own ends free from coercion but not using the term 'coercion' to apply to paying taxes, levies, fees, rents, tariffs or payments if you are using infrastructure to which those payments apply so long as your means are not responsible for coercing other individuals or affecting other individuals in a negative way.

FTFY

rofl

But true. I have since edited it further.

oh you weren't joking, thats even funnier!

No, I wasn't joking. If you would like to present an argument against it, feel free to do so.

[Anon136]

so what is liberty? liberty is the *freedom* to pursue your own ends free from coercion but not using the term 'coercion' to apply to paying taxes, levies, fees, rents, tariffs or payments if you are using infrastructure to which those payments apply so long as your means are not responsible for coercing other individuals or affecting other individuals in a negative way.

FTFY

rofl

But true. I have since edited it further.

oh you weren't joking, thats even funnier!

No, I wasn't joking. If you would like to present an argument against it, feel free to do so.

time is to short to be wasted on a lost cause

[FirstAscent]

so what is liberty? liberty is the *freedom* to pursue your own ends free from coercion but not using the term 'coercion' to apply to paying taxes, levies, fees, rents, tariffs or payments if you are using infrastructure to which those payments apply so long as your means are not responsible for coercing other individuals or affecting other individuals in a negative way.

FTFY

rofl

But true. I have since edited it further.

oh you weren't joking, thats even funnier!

No, I wasn't joking. If you would like to present an argument against it, feel free to do so.

time is to short to be wasted on a lost cause

Excellent. I'd rather not debate your ethereal fantasy that exists nowhere in the world, whereas my description of how things work exists everywhere in the world multiple times over. Have a good day, and thank you for saving me the time of bickering with you about your nonsense.

[Rassah]

so what is liberty? liberty is the *freedom* to pursue your own ends free from coercion but not using the term 'coercion' to apply to paying taxes, levies, fees, rents, tariffs or payments if you are using infrastructure to which those payments apply and not using the term 'coercion' to apply to regulations which prevent uncaring, greedy or ignorant persons and their motives from destroying or negatively affecting others so long as your means are not responsible for coercing other individuals or affecting other individuals in a negative way.

FTFY

The irony is that you are basically saying that "Freedom is free to do such and such, BUT DON'T DO THAT!" I mean, why shouldn't someone be free to use the term "coercion" however they wish? (aside from it hurting your feelings or something)

[FirstAscent]

so what is liberty? liberty is the *freedom* to pursue your own ends free from coercion but not using the term 'coercion' to apply to paying taxes, levies, fees, rents, tariffs or payments if you are using infrastructure to which those payments apply and not using the term 'coercion' to apply to regulations which prevent uncaring, greedy or ignorant persons and their motives from destroying or negatively affecting others so long as your means are not responsible for coercing other individuals or affecting other individuals in a negative way.

FTFY

The irony is that you are basically saying that "Freedom is free to do such and such, BUT DON'T DO THAT!" I mean, why shouldn't someone be free to use the term "coercion" however they wish? (aside from it hurting your feelings or something)

Twisting things, are you? We both know what you're doing. You're implying that we're talking about one's freedom regarding word usage. Even Anon136 understood the meaning. We're talking about a description of freedom, and how it's desirable that one not be coerced, with the exception of certain things that a certain crowd here likes to label 'coercion'.

Attack the meaning, not the structure of the sentences. It's always tiring to encounter such arguments.