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Author Topic: All crypto with an IPO/ICO is trash - no exceptions. Just launch fairly.  (Read 3003 times)
mining1
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March 15, 2016, 12:44:53 PM
 #41

@jeanne0012 just skip his posts,dont read them at all.Thats what i do and it works.Also do the same for other guy called bitcoinltclitecoin or whatever his name is.You'll thank me for it.
americanpegasus (OP)
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March 15, 2016, 01:15:25 PM
 #42

understood your concern. So investing in the ICO/IPO is really risky. Especially for the average ppl, they don't have the inside information and any thing about the projects except the campaign materials provided by the so called teams. So if you cannot tolerate the associated risk, you'd better go away with it.

That's like saying "If you can't tolerate the risk of scam penny stocks, you'd better stay away from it" 
 
Those things aren't trying to build a real and lasting company that provides value to the world - they are trying to extract wealth from suckers.  Ask yourself, is your blockchain startup trying to create something real or extract wealth from suckers?

Account is back under control of the real AmericanPegasus.
TPTB_need_war
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April 01, 2016, 01:38:35 AM
Last edit: April 01, 2016, 02:18:35 AM by TPTB_need_war
 #43

Those who purchased Rimbit via Indiegogo should be demanding a refund from their credit card company now, because the campaign violated Indiegogo's Terms of Service on Prohibited Perks, thus the tokens will now be scorned and worthless.

This $151,806 loss for Indiegogo and huge number of chargebacks jeopardizing their merchant account relationship with the credit card companies, will hopefully incentivize Indiegogo to take legal action against Marcelo Karlsson. Hopefully they will also report him to the SEC so they can hopefully begin an investigation into the investments scams in crypto currency.

I have an inkling this smallish scam may be the one that ignites the fire that brings down the entire ICO altcoin ecosystem.

Edit: the SEC has recently warned about those who are getting involved in these crypto-currency scams and I hope Indiegogo takes the SEC warning seriously.

iamnotback
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October 30, 2016, 05:12:47 AM
 #44

Re: All crypto with an IPO/ICO is trash - no exceptions.  Just launch fairly.

PoW is superior, but even more superior if it is being mined by the users and not by those who (HODL or) dump their coins to those few in the powerlaw distribution of wealthy who want to stack (HODL) coins.

The only valid role of crypto currency is not as a "better gold" (such a concept is oxymoronic, because gold is as evil as fiat ... ask me to teach you!) but not as a store-of-value rather as a more degrees-of-freedom unit-of-exchange.

PoW ends up as a power-law distribution also:

Currency is always distributed according to the power-law distribution1, regardless of the methodology which you use to distribute it (e.g. mining versus sales).

1 A. Dragulescu and V. Yakovenko. Exponential and power-law probability distributions of wealth and income in the United Kingdom and the United States.

The problem with an ICO is that it is not a free-market competition, because the issuer has an asymmetric advantage because he/she can buy tokens from him/herself at 0 cost. @smooth was the one who pointed this out to me, which I then regurgitated:

1.No ICOs: ICOs enable insiders to buy from themselves, creating a non-free market distribution of the money supply, thus manipulating all the market parameters and effects creating a controlled, non-free market.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1524111.msg15340159#msg15340159
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1413819.msg15343686#msg15343686

The controlled, non-free market result applies to the exchange price manipulation (and ecosystem investment) because the money supply is more concentrated than a typical power-law distribution, i.e. there are too few whales competing with (and distrusting) each other. But note this does not require necessarily that the consensus system is centralized.

It is a shame because PoW is unable to transfer any of the investment capital (of those competing to mine the money supply) to the developers. Rather it is expended on electricity and hardware rental.

However, there is another option. And that is to distribute the bulk of the money supply by some other objective means (other than PoW, or even by PoW) and only ICO a small enough portion that it can't become a concentrated control. Bingo!

@smooth is your mouth agape?  Shocked
Spoetnik
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October 30, 2016, 09:15:55 AM
 #45

Your missing the point bud.. your reaching to make excuses for ICO's

I have said 1,000 times that having a reserved pile of funds in your control or the rights to them etc on the start is functionally more valuable then you all ever realize.

Why do banks pay you interest to hold money ?
Why would holding 5% of all FIAT for 24 hours be valuable ?

Imagine if there was an offer to hold 10 trillion dollars for 1 day.. sound appealing ?

Reason 1,0000000000000000 why ICO's are scammy.

FUD first & ask questions later™
iamnotback
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October 30, 2016, 01:18:04 PM
 #46

I have said 1,000 times that having a reserved pile of funds in your control or the rights to them etc on the start is functionally more valuable then you all ever realize.

Reason 1,0000000000000000 why ICO's are scammy.

Spoetnik doesn't want unregulated stock markets.

I guess he prefers Goldman Sach's TBTF dick up his ass than the freedom to speculate with your money without a middle-man underwriter-gatekeeper taking everything:

ICOs are pretty much unregulated and almost always revolve around anonymous entities (not that publicly known people never scammed others) therefore there's not even a shard of insurance present.

Unregulated is good. Regulation means Wallstreet (the underwriters, etc) is taking all the gains and selling you up river.

But even if I disregard that and accept that you don't need any insurance

Insurance as a stability of income is guaranteed failure. No risk, no reward. Period. That is an inviolable mathematical fact. Sorry this is a high IQ point and I won't be able to take time to detail it right now.

The only time that insurance is valuable is for long-tail distribution risks (i.e. black swans).

It's a massive sea of scams with some rare gems...

Sure, you won't throw money at every ICO but even if you disregard the most obvious scams, the ratio is still terrible.

Not for those with the necessary discernment skills. But for most of you readers, you will lose. That is the nature of speculation. The smart speculators eat the less smart ones.

And of course it's a sea of massive scams because there are people who make it profitable. Just like why some people create wallets with malwares inside - because some people doesn't practice security.
And the victims of both will definitely won't help popularizing crypto due to their terrible experience.

No one is victim, because no one forced you to play.

Life is a competition. Everyone is trying to find a way to get theirs. You can hide in your closet if you want. Or you get out there and compete. The choice is yours.

Note I don't buy shit technology, so I wouldn't buy most ICOs. But I am learning that if I were speculating, I should buy ICOs with good attributes even if the technology is bit off. For example, I knew from the start that ETH's technology was flawed. I even told Charles Hoskinson that before he launched Ethereum. But I have since learned that marketing communication is worth a $billion market cap (which is not at all the same as a $billion cashed out!).

You want a world where everything is stable and fair. I explain in my audio recordings why that world can't exist (else nothing would exist). If you think you have created a uniform environment (e.g. "equal opportunity" bullshit), you've actually obfuscated that someone is raping you without you realizing it. I hope you take the time to learn, but it is unlikely given your ideological stance, that you would be open-minded to the natural law math and physics that I explain.
Propagandalf
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November 02, 2016, 12:10:38 PM
 #47

Why don't we get a list of legitimate, non-premine, non-ICO/IPO coins and put it in the OP?  If I miss any, let me know.  Off the top of my head I can think of things like Bitcoin, Litecoin, Namecoin, Primecoin, Monero, Aeon, Boolberry, Dogecoin....

Burst belongs in such a list. No premine, no IPO/ICO. The POC algo also enables a distribution that is fairer than most, and it also has a green footprint: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1323657.0.
jacafbiz
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November 02, 2016, 01:35:44 PM
 #48

Your argument is fallacios, you can just come out with that bold statement and say All, ok, how would you classified Zcash and again from experience most of the coins that are been mined are scam coins when compares to ICO coins

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