IOHK Research and Scorex ARE NOT working with Waves

[Come-from-Beyond]

No more time to waste on these losers.

Finally. I hope this mood will last much longer than for 2 days.

[TPTB_need_war]

Not sure how you can live in the Philippines with that US supremacist attitude, but I wouldn't go as far as telling it to the locals. It would be the worst place to do it just right before a crypto-currency forum.

Could you be more specific as to what you are threatening to pay someone to do to me?

Btw, the filipinos love the USA and agree it is supreme. Most all are dreaming to go there. And millions have.

I like the filipinos just the way they are. I lowered my standard-of-living and lived with them in a squatter village and gained all their infections and suffering so that I could be one of them. And they know now I am one of them. Just like them I learned to survive on rice and salt. I learned how to not have $1 to buy food with. Yeah I really did. Still to this day, if I return to that squatter community, they call out my name. Adults who were little kids when I used to live there, and old poeple who were adults then. They remember me because even I had nothing, I would make a huge Christmas party with as much food as I could buy and the entire village would come eat and party. And I would dance in the mud with them. And I was just like them. Not higher.

I personally don't admire the USA much. But one thing I do admire is our technological chops and our ability to get things done and take pride in doing the right thing.

[traumschiff]

Not sure how you can live in the Philippines with that US supremacist attitude, but I wouldn't go as far as telling it to the locals. It would be the worst place to do it just right before a crypto-currency forum.

Could you be more specific as to what you are threatening to pay someone to do to me?

Btw, the filipinos love the USA and agree it is supreme. Most all are dreaming to go there. And millions have.

Oh, wow. Yeah, they love how everyone has money and they would love to have a proper income and better life conditions.

I've been to a lot of asian countries and this is the worst thing you could say.

Just shows how much of a racist clown you are IRL.

[From Above]

Way too much stupidity going on here

Gladly we have individuals like TPTB_need_war here who r actually able to transform utter stupidity into an intellectual and fruitful conversation.

~CfA~

[reRaise]

Charles is the best thing that has happened to Waves.

[From Above]

Charles is the best thing that has happened to Waves.

Also Waves might even be teh best thing that happened to Charles lately
now we all know about IOHK woohoooo i wouldve never even seen this ever

~CfA~

[hmachado]

Has Charles responded to your request to meet?

There was no request. You can try to read the thread again and I understand if English is not your native language. I'd be delighted if you quote the post you misunderstood (I know of course exactly what you are referring to).

I find it hilarious if you are implying that I need to ride on Charles' coattails. I am quoting this for posterity which we can look back on retroactively.

This was where you lost it. That guy should have gone to the ignore list.
Look at where the topic was before and look at it now.

Your input was great and i was very interested on how it would develop, but then the subject that really matters was buried under a pile of bullshit by those trolls.
The usual gangbang when they dont like whats going on.

[traumschiff]

Your input was great and i was very interested on how it would develop, but then the subject that really matters was buried under a pile of bullshit by those trolls.
The usual gangbang when they dont like whats going on.

Like when he fuds a project because it doesn't compile (but tbh it probably would pass as grey area, he just stated that he thinks it wouldn't) to US laws while the project wasn't marketed as "US citizens please buy"? Or when he speaks as if this forum was US only? Or when he calls Russians scammers while the developer of wave is well known in the crypto community?

Seemed like a legit discussion until he entered.

[TPTB_need_war]

Has Charles responded to your request to meet?

There was no request. You can try to read the thread again and I understand if English is not your native language. I'd be delighted if you quote the post you misunderstood (I know of course exactly what you are referring to).

I find it hilarious if you are implying that I need to ride on Charles' coattails. I am quoting this for posterity which we can look back on retroactively.

This was where you lost it. That guy should have gone to the ignore list.
Look at where the topic was before and look at it now.

Your input was great and i was very interested on how it would develop, but then the subject that really matters was buried under a pile of bullshit by those trolls.
The usual gangbang when they dont like whats going on.

Ah no worries. Secret weapon is coming soon to turn them into pixie dust.

[From Above]

Shelby would u please consider not turning Charles valuable topic into a youtube link posting session ?

Lets get back on topic here!


I quote the last important post

There is no gesture to show. One of my employees was listed on the Waves website and represented as a Waves employee. Marketers responsible for pumping waves where posting IOHK whitepapers on the ethereum reddit.

I posted a clarification and then members of the Waves marketing team decided to post links about me leaving ethereum, the head of waves lied about Alex continuing to consult with Waves (he will not continue if he ever did to begin with) and then called me delusional.

As far as I'm concerned this is a closed matter. We have clarified our position and Waves has clarified theirs. If they decide to represent my employees as members of their team in the future, then we will take legal action. I'm sure that won't happen. I wish the project luck and for the sake of the investors hope it all works out

~CfA~

[kushti]

My (wild guess) opinion/speculation follows. I can read between the lines too, as many of you probably did also. Kushti is friends with Sasha. Kushti is a Russian who isn't hung up on formalities of laws we have in the West and is primarily interested in developing the code and having enough money to afford better lighting in his dingy apartment (this is a joke for anyone who has seen the Waves Hangout video). I guesstimate that Kushti doesn't have an ethical stance against ICOs and he probably thinks it was all just hunkydory.

Boy I dont' quite know whether you're conscientiously wrote down that shockingly stupid and pretty racist crap or you're just a mindless zombie repeating stereotypes got during Crappy Nonsense Network (CNN) or other media paranoia consumption. Anyway I would like to suggest you to get rid of the brainwashing. I'm pretty sure my advise will be ignored though.

---------------

As I already mentioned we (me & Sasha, then Sasha & Charles, then three of us) had some calls. After the third one we also had an internal meeting and decided to wait for concrete tech requirements. Based on them that was my responsibility to make a report to Charles on whether it is reasonable to help Waves in some way or not.

I still don't know why my photo was on the team page. I was offline those days due to a baby delivery, and mostly offline now, so had no call with Sasha yet. Well, I'm in IOHK Research anyway.

[smooth]

My (wild guess) opinion/speculation follows. I can read between the lines too, as many of you probably did also. Kushti is friends with Sasha. Kushti is a Russian who isn't hung up on formalities of laws we have in the West and is primarily interested in developing the code and having enough money to afford better lighting in his dingy apartment (this is a joke for anyone who has seen the Waves Hangout video). I guesstimate that Kushti doesn't have an ethical stance against ICOs and he probably thinks it was all just hunkydory.

Boy I dont' quite know whether you're conscientiously wrote down that shockingly stupid and pretty racist crap or you're just a mindless zombie repeating stereotypes got during Crappy Nonsense Network (CNN) or other media paranoia consumption. Anyway I would like to suggest you to get rid of the brainwashing. I'm pretty sure my advise will be ignored though.

---------------

As I already mentioned we (me & Sasha, then Sasha & Charles, then three of us) had some calls. After the third one we also had an internal meeting and decided to wait for concrete tech requirements. Based on them that was my responsibility to make a report to Charles on whether it is reasonable to help Waves in some way or not.

I still don't know why my photo was on the team page. I was offline those days due to a baby delivery, and mostly offline now, so had no call with Sasha yet. Well, I'm in IOHK Research anyway.

Please help clear up any lingering confusion that may exist by answering the questions I posted earlier:

@kushti Did you ever have any formal or informal agreement to serve as an advisor or in any other role on the Waves team, either individually, as a Nxt developer, or as an employee of IOHK? (The latter seems clear from previous posts but best to clarify.)

If not, did you engage in any communications with the Waves team or founders which could reasonably have led them to believe you would serve in such a role?

[thoth-Atlantian]

My (wild guess) opinion/speculation follows. I can read between the lines too, as many of you probably did also. Kushti is friends with Sasha. Kushti is a Russian who isn't hung up on formalities of laws we have in the West and is primarily interested in developing the code and having enough money to afford better lighting in his dingy apartment (this is a joke for anyone who has seen the Waves Hangout video). I guesstimate that Kushti doesn't have an ethical stance against ICOs and he probably thinks it was all just hunkydory.

Boy I dont' quite know whether you're conscientiously wrote down that shockingly stupid and pretty racist crap or you're just a mindless zombie repeating stereotypes got during Crappy Nonsense Network (CNN) or other media paranoia consumption. Anyway I would like to suggest you to get rid of the brainwashing. I'm pretty sure my advise will be ignored though.

---------------

As I already mentioned we (me & Sasha, then Sasha & Charles, then three of us) had some calls. After the third one we also had an internal meeting and decided to wait for concrete tech requirements. Based on them that was my responsibility to make a report to Charles on whether it is reasonable to help Waves in some way or not.

I still don't know why my photo was on the team page. I was offline those days due to a baby delivery, and mostly offline now, so had no call with Sasha yet. Well, I'm in IOHK Research anyway.

What a TPTB tool

Laws in the west? where?

Laws are only applied to the poor

[TPTB_need_war]

I see mprep (moderator) deleted a lot of the noise from the thread (including my responses) as I requested that he do. I had reported the ad hominem attacks which were devoid of any information, and asked the moderator to delete my replies and the attacks.

My (wild guess) opinion/speculation follows. I can read between the lines too, as many of you probably did also. Kushti is friends with Sasha. Kushti is a Russian who isn't hung up on formalities of laws we have in the West and is primarily interested in developing the code and having enough money to afford better lighting in his dingy apartment (this is a joke for anyone who has seen the Waves Hangout video). I guesstimate that Kushti doesn't have an ethical stance against ICOs and he probably thinks it was all just hunkydory.

Boy I dont' quite know whether you're conscientiously wrote down that shockingly stupid and pretty racist crap or you're just a mindless zombie repeating stereotypes got during Crappy Nonsense Network (CNN) or other media paranoia consumption. Anyway I would like to suggest you to get rid of the brainwashing. I'm pretty sure my advise will be ignored though.

Trying to discern statistical facts is not racism. If I say that blacks in the USA are much more likely to commit murder, that is a statistic fact. It doesn't make me a racist. I attended an elementary in Baton Rouge where my sister and I were the only non-negro kids in the entire school. Your racism attack won't stick on me. Find another excuse.

I already stated upthread that my sample size is too small to draw conclusions, but that my first exposure to Russians and Eastern Europeans has come in crypto-currency (and in my attempt to hire a virtual programmer via Upwork.com). I had the same experience at Upwork as David Zimbeck explained recently which is they basically scam you the employer. I see these Russian and Eastern European developers creating these centralized MLM marketing scams such as Iota, Waves, Nxt, etc.. Then again, we do have the Larimers as an American outlier with the Bitshares MLM scam, but I could see early on in my forum discussions with Daniel and Charles back when they were both on Bitshares that Daniel was always proposing designs that were the antithesis of decentralization such as his long-standing crap about paying a net dividend to token holders.

Yesterday I happenstanced across the following statement from Martin Armstrong who was the world's largest hedge fund manager ever, managing some $2 trillion or so for the Japanese Postal fund and others.

Many argue you cannot do business in Russia or China because they still lack the RULE OF LAW. I am sorry, but so does New York City. When I asked a lawyer in New York why the government never charges bankers; his response was telling: “You do not shit where you eat.” There is simply no hope to save the system anymore without a complete crash and burn.

So kushti I hope and think you are an exception and perhaps with Charles' guidance, or that my sample size was too small and that most Russians and Eastern Europeans have a law abiding culture. I am lacking enough data but I have not been thrilled with experience thus far interacting with people from your side of the globe. And your reaction here adds to that bad experience. Why not just be more frank with yourself and admit you made the mistake of associating with a guy (Sasha, or a group?) who is pushing some scammy ICO on Western investors because for sure he can't sell that shit in Russian to Russians, and ostensibly without them breaking his legs after the crap implodes down the line.

I know there is a lot of highly educated people in your corner of the world, and I think it is damn shame if they can't use that skill productively without trying to take advantage of others in zero-sum games.

It seems you are trying to do something productive and honest with Charles' lead and if so, then I applaud your effort. And you have my best wishes. But please cut out the bullshit and be honest with yourself. Don't blame your poor discernment on me. You should have seen from the getgo that Sasha was trouble and avoided him. He is apparently not very technically talented and is a mere promoter and talker.

I hate bullshit. Just state the way it really is.

One of the very important lessons to learn in life, is that the people you don't keep far away from you, can be your more devastating mistake. In running a business, selecting the right people to associate with is critical. Associating with fly-by-night Russian pumpers is obviously not going to reflect very well on IOHK's prospects for the future. First we have Charles associating with the Russian Vitalik who has wasted $15 million and then ETH has been pumped on some hype that breaks Nash equilibrium, to raise more $millions to waste.

I was commending Charles' on making a solid decision to not have his company associated with those who occupy the gutter and have no respect for international legal issues. If Charles doesn't want to be associated with my frank comments, so be it. I don't mince my words. I am a straight shooter.

[TPTB_need_war]

I want to make one clarification. I stated upthread that I had not attempted to communicate with Charles since we last had some regular communication back when he had left Bitshares and was searching for his next major project. I want to clarify that I have sent some PMs to Charles, such as recent one with a link to a more detailed summary of the health saga I went through since 2013. Also I sent him a recent message commending on one of the points in his recent January presentation about the importance of block chains. My point upthread in alluding to that I am close by to IOHK's Hong Kong office is not a request to meet. It is just saying hello and btw I am nearby.

I also had sent Charles one incoherent message some months ago in Skype and he responded "what is this?" and I said "related to my health and apologies just ignore it because I know your busy" or something close to that.

Some background information is important for readers (and Charles) to understand my thinking. Originally back in afair 2014 before he formed Ethereum, I briefly text chatted with Charles about my ideas for a crypto-currency project, but I informed Charles I wasn't ready to launch a project that would raise a lot of money and be a big thing with so many mouths to feed. I told him I wanted to prod along by myself for the time being or maybe with one other engineer, but not some big production.

When I saw what was happening with Ethereum, I was so happy I hadn't gone that direction. I and many others here knew that was going to a clusterfuck waste of money. So for the longest time, I felt that I would not want to work with Charles because I don't like that style of developing a software company. You don't put a 20 year old guy in charge of $15 million. Duh. And surround him with so much overhead. Cripes I created Neocept WordUp at that age all by myself in my bedroom coding night and day and sleeping under my desk with no funding until after I shipped the software.

So while I remained what I consider friendly with Charles despite no ongoing communication, I had this wariness about whether I would ever get involved professionally with Charles, although I also respect some of his insights and the way he presents talks. And I also like Charles from what I remember he is a very amiable and also an intelligent, honest person.

So recently when I discovered Charles had tried to advise Ethereum to blacklist USA non-accredited investors and when they refused he left Ethereum, my respect for him rose immensely. And I started to think, "hey maybe I could work with Charles, he has good ethics".

At the moment I am not speaking as the CEO of any company, thus I don't need to be diplomatic. I can speak frankly as a person. Of course I understand Charles has to be concerned with political interpretations and thus is more careful with his words. If he is offended by my frank statements herein, so be it. My work is continuing and I can't see any reason I need to be associated with IOHK. I was just saying hello.

My posts in this thread reflect my true angst about crypto-currency being seen as nefarious by the mainstream. We can't get out of that gutter unless we stop making excuses for scammers. I am also pissed to see that crypto-currency speculation has enabled a means by which those who come from places that have less respect for the rule of law can scam westerners on the other side of the globe. This is all setting up for a globalized regulation, which is coming...

Yet I also see a former research scientist from Microsoft involved in selling AMP vaporware tokens for Synereo. It is the new wild west of laissez-faire capitalism. But it does appear to be quite illegal. We will see how it all comes crashes down and who ends up with jail time years down the line.

[traumschiff]

I see mprep (moderator) deleted a lot of the noise from the thread (including my responses) as I requested that he do. I had reported the ad hominem attacks which were devoid of any information, and asked the moderator to delete my replies and the attacks.

My (wild guess) opinion/speculation follows. I can read between the lines too, as many of you probably did also. Kushti is friends with Sasha. Kushti is a Russian who isn't hung up on formalities of laws we have in the West and is primarily interested in developing the code and having enough money to afford better lighting in his dingy apartment (this is a joke for anyone who has seen the Waves Hangout video). I guesstimate that Kushti doesn't have an ethical stance against ICOs and he probably thinks it was all just hunkydory.

Boy I dont' quite know whether you're conscientiously wrote down that shockingly stupid and pretty racist crap or you're just a mindless zombie repeating stereotypes got during Crappy Nonsense Network (CNN) or other media paranoia consumption. Anyway I would like to suggest you to get rid of the brainwashing. I'm pretty sure my advise will be ignored though.

Trying to discern statistical facts is not racism. If I say that blacks in the USA are much more likely to commit murder, that is a statistic fact. It doesn't make me a racist. I attended an elementary in Baton Rouge where my sister and I were the only non-negro kids in the entire school. Your racism attack won't stick on me. Find another excuse.

I already stated upthread that my sample size is too small to draw conclusions, but that my first exposure to Russians and Eastern Europeans has come in crypto-currency (and in my attempt to hire a virtual programmer via Upwork.com). I had the same experience at Upwork as David Zimbeck explained recently which is they basically scam you the employer. I see these Russian and Eastern European developers creating these centralized MLM marketing scams such as Iota, Waves, Nxt, etc.. Then again, we do have the Larimers as an American outlier with the Bitshares MLM scam, but I could see early on in my forum discussions with Daniel and Charles back when they were both on Bitshares that Daniel was always proposing designs that were the antithesis of decentralization such as his long-standing crap about paying a net dividend to token holders.

Yesterday I happenstanced across the following statement from Martin Armstrong who was the world's largest hedge fund manager ever, managing some $2 trillion or so for the Japanese Postal fund and others.

Many argue you cannot do business in Russia or China because they still lack the RULE OF LAW. I am sorry, but so does New York City. When I asked a lawyer in New York why the government never charges bankers; his response was telling: “You do not shit where you eat.” There is simply no hope to save the system anymore without a complete crash and burn.

So kushti I hope and think you are an exception and perhaps with Charles' guidance, or that my sample size was too small and that most Russians and Eastern Europeans have a law abiding culture. I am lacking enough data but I have not been thrilled with experience thus far interacting with people from your side of the globe. And your reaction here adds to that bad experience. Why not just be more frank with yourself and admit you made the mistake of associating with a guy (Sasha, or a group?) who is pushing some scammy ICO on Western investors because for sure he can't sell that shit in Russian to Russians, and ostensibly without them breaking his legs after the crap implodes down the line.

I know there is a lot of highly educated people in your corner of the world, and I think it is damn shame if they can't use that skill productively without trying to take advantage of others in zero-sum games.

It seems you are trying to do something productive and honest with Charles' lead and if so, then I applaud your effort. And you have my best wishes. But please cut out the bullshit and be honest with yourself. Don't blame your poor discernment on me. You should have seen from the getgo that Sasha was trouble and avoided him. He is apparently not very technically talented and is a mere promoter and talker.

I hate bullshit. Just state the way it really is.

One of the very important lessons to learn in life, is that the people you don't keep far away from you, can be your more devastating mistake. In running a business, selecting the right people to associate with is critical. Associating with fly-by-night Russian pumpers is obviously not going to reflect very well on IOHK's prospects for the future. First we have Charles associating with the Russian Vitalik who has wasted $15 million and then ETH has been pumped on some hype that breaks Nash equilibrium, to raise more $millions to waste.

I was commending Charles' on making a solid decision to not have his company associated with those who occupy the gutter and have no respect for international legal issues. If Charles doesn't want to be associated with my frank comments, so be it. I don't mince my words. I am a straight shooter.

You are being racist again because you take your past experiences on Russians and make a direct relevancy to this case. Also I'm not sure if you actually know what MLM means, since there every shareholder profits from the one below, I'm not profiting in any way from the people who invested after me or from the people who I refer to the project (since there are no direct referal links in any form, I can just point out the investment opportunity/website to them).

Just because you went to a school, which was populated by african-americans doesn't make you not hate them or not dislike other races. The reason why you took the MLM approach to this "Russian investment" is because MLM and Ponzi games are popular in that geographic area, that's known, but this has nothing to do with an MLM/Ponzi structure, but still you accuse them with this, because the lead dev is Russian? Really?

Your brain is starting to downgrade in a heavy pace, sorry to tell you this. Told you, nothing you say can make you look better since you went way 2 deep already with your US supremacy bullshit a few comments back.

Edit: anyway I'm out of the convo, not going to reply again.

[traumschiff]

My (wild guess) opinion/speculation follows. I can read between the lines too, as many of you probably did also. Kushti is friends with Sasha. Kushti is a Russian who isn't hung up on formalities of laws we have in the West and is primarily interested in developing the code and having enough money to afford better lighting in his dingy apartment (this is a joke for anyone who has seen the Waves Hangout video). I guesstimate that Kushti doesn't have an ethical stance against ICOs and he probably thinks it was all just hunkydory.

Boy I dont' quite know whether you're conscientiously wrote down that shockingly stupid and pretty racist crap or you're just a mindless zombie repeating stereotypes got during Crappy Nonsense Network (CNN) or other media paranoia consumption. Anyway I would like to suggest you to get rid of the brainwashing. I'm pretty sure my advise will be ignored though.

---------------

As I already mentioned we (me & Sasha, then Sasha & Charles, then three of us) had some calls. After the third one we also had an internal meeting and decided to wait for concrete tech requirements. Based on them that was my responsibility to make a report to Charles on whether it is reasonable to help Waves in some way or not.

I still don't know why my photo was on the team page. I was offline those days due to a baby delivery, and mostly offline now, so had no call with Sasha yet. Well, I'm in IOHK Research anyway.

What a TPTB tool

Laws in the west? where?

Laws are only applied to the poor

Going to agree with this and here he comes with his US laws bullshit on  crypto-currency forum to a project which didn't market to the US, but marketed in English. From this he made the direct connection that the Russians want to take US money again with MLMs and Ponzis.

[edmundduke]

Shelby would u please consider not turning Charles valuable topic into a youtube link posting session ?

Lets get back on topic here!


I quote the last important post

There is no gesture to show. One of my employees was listed on the Waves website and represented as a Waves employee. Marketers responsible for pumping waves where posting IOHK whitepapers on the ethereum reddit.

I posted a clarification and then members of the Waves marketing team decided to post links about me leaving ethereum, the head of waves lied about Alex continuing to consult with Waves (he will not continue if he ever did to begin with) and then called me delusional.

As far as I'm concerned this is a closed matter. We have clarified our position and Waves has clarified theirs. If they decide to represent my employees as members of their team in the future, then we will take legal action. I'm sure that won't happen. I wish the project luck and for the sake of the investors hope it all works out

~CfA~

@kushti Did you ever have any formal or informal agreement to serve as an advisor or in any other role on the Waves team, either individually, as a Nxt developer, or as an employee of IOHK? (The latter seems clear from previous posts but best to clarify.)

If not, did you engage in any communications with the Waves team or founders which could reasonably have led them to believe you would serve in such a role?

Pumping this up because every other post has been useless.

STOP TRYING TO BURY THE IMPORTANT POSTS FFS

[sasha35625]

Charles If I were you I'd delete this post completely or make it self-moderated, at least.

[nikster]

TPTB,

I took you seriously and read for hours about this subject, which mostly lawyers can come up with answers to.
First of all, you lost all my trust when saying, "even the filipinos agree the US is supreme"
So, YOU ARE NOT SUPREME, when I see americans I see stupidity, this is the truth for the young generation where I come from.
You have idiotic presidents, corrupted to your source, and think your'e better than all,
And MAYBE you are in some ways (and so are budahists) , but as soon as you think that and say it, you become less than all humans.
BUT saying that is racist, even IF someone thinks so. Its offending for 200 million people.
And when your'e saying US is supreme, its offending 6.8 BILLION people.
See my point?

So after researching this law issues that you mentioned.
I see that you were/are hurt in some way, and want scammers to begone in someway,
So you fight "the good fight". which you maybe doing..

To conclude your'e a little right but alot more wrong.
crypto ICO's are GREY area and will remain so for much longer time, and when that time comes (years),
There will not be a witchhunt like you imply, cause this is a worldwide phenomenon and as long as these companies will use the funds to pay devs and developments,
And those coins/token will be used on the platforms for various actions, There aint nothing wrong with it, for now.
And if there will be, it will be taxing not prosecuting, imho.

Why dont you say DASH will be prosecuted for instamine, and bitcoin as well for that matter?
this is a word (instamine) gone from our community, and its better this way.
If we had it your way, there wil be nothing, as devs need to work 2 jobs to develop a service.
Sorry but none of us can afford not to work,
and I think you fail to understand that its a funding to the project's salaries for years to come.
Grey funding, but still not ilegal.
If it's illegal in the us, so your citizens must be responsible for their actions.
Not knowing your law doesnt relieve you from punishment.
The world doesnt have to comply to US' all the time, right? if you came from a different country, you would talk diffrently.


Disclaimer: IANR / IANA (im not russian, im not american)  

I wish you all the best, TPTB, and for you to find some greater truth than what you see.
and remember not to fight the wars of The powers that be, by mistake.