Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[BobLawblaw]

You drunk mate?

TBH, experimenting with Delta-8 stuff today.

It's really fun!

EDIT: But yes. Also, beer. Cheers, brothers.
EDIT2: Sheeeeeiiit increasing as number go down

[1714867690]

1714867690

[1714867690]

1714867690

[1714867690]

1714867690

[Elwar]

Some comments on vit regimens: if you take a large dose on any vitamin, especially water-soluble like vit C, other vitamins will be removed by kidney together with it, so at the minimum take some vit Bs with it.
1g of vit C/hour is a horse size dose anyway, but to each their own. For myself, 0.5g/once a day when i feel under weather is enough.

Definitely, it was a one day thing to knock out COVID so all was well. I was under the supervision of my friend who lives on Vitamin C research. She gave me her super fancy stuff that's supposed to absorb better or whichever. Either way, I went from my lungs feeling like when I was in high school after running a 100 meter sprint (after the slightest amount of activity) to being completely fine.

I think there is something to the Vitamin D thing though. They are finding people with higher melanin are dying at higher rates than those with lower melanin levels. Lower melanin level folks tend to process Vitamin D easier. Though, anecdotally my wife is melanin enhanced and she was just fine...just a little tired those days. Though she's more apt to walk around outside than me.

[Biodom]

$58, $59k, $60k, $61k, $60k, $59k..... seriously?

It's my fault, sorry.
Any time I open CMC to look at stuff, btc is at a highest of the day and keeps going down afterwards  
However, I help ya'll by going to sleep...it pops up then, lol

[LFC_Bitcoin]

$58, $59k, $60k, $61k, $60k, $59k..... seriously?

Would like to know who’s selling. Now is literally one of the worst times to sell. We’re coiling, ready for a big break upwards, why the hell would you sell now.

[JimboToronto]

why the hell would you sell now.

To drive the exchange price down in order to buy much larger amounts off-exchange?

[bkbirge]

It's the Battle of Thermopylae for every $1000 gain.

[JayJuanGee]

Similar to the recent subject about when should we start to measure BTC's price because of course, one of the very first transactions to buy two pizzas for 10k bitcoin might not be as representative as prices a few months down the road when larger numbers of trades are allowed and even locations for conducting such trades become more common.. so in that regard, there is a kind of product of the number of transactions and maybe the passage of time, and I do have some troubles gravitating on any price analysis that uses 2010 data because it seems so sporadic.. but it seems by the time that we are getting to 2011, even if the BTC price discovery is relatively immature, it seems fair enough to start to use that data rather than waiting for 2013 or some further down the road date - at least in my thinking.

I'd agree. I think that, barring contrary evidence, that is perfectly fine to consider as the seminal event in the price discovery for Bitcoin. I've always been wary of wanting to throw out data because it doesn't fit a narrative.

When JJG drops baby talk, agreeing becomes easier.

Hahahaha  I will take this petition based on an assertion of cause and effect into consideration.... of course, no guarantees... because sometimes certain ways of expressing ideas brings funzies.

By the way, I doubt that either Richy_T or I are disagreeing for the mere sake of it.  Not completely sure because I consider some of Richy_T's Bigblocker ideas to be a bit ridiculous and maybe even deserving of some baby talk to ridicule those talking points more, but if Richy_T and I were to be talking about some more narrow point issue that might be more purely just about BTC in terms of how to measure BTC's price performance, then we might end up coming to very similar conclusions - but if we were to go into details and then start talking about the extent to which the altcoin market has affected BTC's price performance, for example, then we might end up getting into combative territories again..

So I have my doubts about whether the employment or non-employment of "baby talk" should be considered as materially and substantively significant in the whole scheme of things, and if some peeps are having trouble identifying some important, substantive and/or material points because they are getting distracted by word choice (or perhaps tone) then they mights be too sensitive to the varying meandering ways of the interwebs, including some proddings that might seem to go overboard from time to time... or maybe even some annoying patterns that might come out (I surely get sick of myself, so I am not too surprised that others might, too).

Chartbuddy is currently under contemplation.

Would be an interesting development... and surely no straight forward thing to keep going... concededly beyond my pay grade..

Yes Richy, come on give us that back. It will be more useful than bigblocking, at least around here. In diz here parts, peeps like the discussening of the actual King Daddy that is, not dee one that could have been. Amirite?

(Back to baby talk for the sake of pluralism - so you can feel free to disagree with me.)

Hey!!!!!!!!   U fuck-i-tie-fuck... stop be steawwing dee baby talkenings.


Something is not right about how this is coming out.

[JayJuanGee]

I mean that there are a lot of angles we could work this tire analogy, and if the tire really were flat, then I have no problem acknowledging it, but if the tire is merely low on air pressure or if it is starting to get worn and might need replacement, those are different variations in which the some attention or precaution might be needed to keep using the tire under that condition, but it would not necessarily mean that the tire cannot be used, but it might not be adequate for some purposes but still be adequate for other purposes and before winter comes it will be update or before going on a long trip air will be added.

Yes, that's kind of the point of the analogy. You can certainly drive on a flat tire and you may even reach your destination. You can also argue that it's not the tire that it's something else or even that cars are supposed to go thud-thud-thud-thud. Perhaps it's beneficial in scaring away deer?

It seems to me that we are really not getting anywhere with the use of the analogy, and I have made my points but you keep wanting to assert it as if the way that you set it up (or have been expounding upon it) actually applies to bitcoin.

Yes, that's kind of the point of the analogy. You can certainly drive on a flat tire and you may even reach your destination. You can also argue that it's not the tire that it's something else or even that cars are supposed to go thud-thud-thud-thud. Perhaps it's beneficial in scaring away deer?

A better analogy would be the sound of the car running and you're the 3 year old in the back seat complaining about it.

Yes, it's supposed to do that little guy.

Hahahahaha

Actually, I like this rolling analogy. it is great.. and guess who the 3-year old in the back is?

 

Would be an interesting development... and surely no straight forward thing to keep going... concededly beyond my pay grade..

In truth, I could just switch him back on. The main issue with keeping him going was that the gathering of data would fill my hard drive space. Since I never switched off the gathering of data, this is an issue I took steps to take care of (mostly by increasing hd space). I think his output could do with a freshen though. There's also the issue of after a long absence, whether people would really want him back. People complained and fussed when I introduced him to the other forum and did a bit on this one too when he was first introduced. We may need a poll.

I was going to say something about the long absence potentially being an issue.. but I doubt that you used a poll the first time around in order to figure out whether to test it out, and members got used to it, but sure, if you believe that a poll could be helpful to inform your decision regarding reactivating such bot member, then I am pretty sure that Infofront would be willing to run such a poll in this thread - especially since the current thread seems to have been answered in the past 15 hours or so...

Alternatively, if you wanted to monitor the poll a bit better, then maybe another thread could be helpful, and surely you might even consider that members should be active in the WO thread for their vote to count..

Although if you want a quickie number, having Infofront update the poll of this thread for such would give you a pretty quick result to see if there is division or a clear leaning in one direction or another...

[Sayeds56]

Similar to the recent subject about when should we start to measure BTC's price because of course, one of the very first transactions to buy two pizzas for 10k bitcoin might not be as representative as prices a few months down the road when larger numbers of trades are allowed and even locations for conducting such trades become more common.. so in that regard, there is a kind of product of the number of transactions and maybe the passage of time, and I do have some troubles gravitating on any price analysis that uses 2010 data because it seems so sporadic.. but it seems by the time that we are getting to 2011, even if the BTC price discovery is relatively immature, it seems fair enough to start to use that data rather than waiting for 2013 or some further down the road date - at least in my thinking.

I'd agree. I think that, barring contrary evidence, that is perfectly fine to consider as the seminal event in the price discovery for Bitcoin. I've always been wary of wanting to throw out data because it doesn't fit a narrative.

When JJG drops baby talk, agreeing becomes easier.

Hahahaha  I will take this petition based on an assertion of cause and effect into consideration.... of course, no guarantees... because sometimes certain ways of expressing ideas brings funzies.

By the way, I doubt that either Richy_T or I are disagreeing for the mere sake of it.  Not completely sure because I consider some of Richy_T's Bigblocker ideas to be a bit ridiculous and maybe even deserving of some baby talk to ridicule those talking points more, but if Richy_T and I were to be talking about some more narrow point issue that might be more purely just about BTC in terms of how to measure BTC's price performance, then we might end up coming to very similar conclusions - but if we were to go into details and then start talking about the extent to which the altcoin market has affected BTC's price performance, for example, then we might end up getting into combative territories again..

So I have my doubts about whether the employment or non-employment of "baby talk" should be considered as materially and substantively significant in the whole scheme of things, and if some peeps are having trouble identifying some important, substantive and/or material points because they are getting distracted by word choice (or perhaps tone) then they mights be too sensitive to the varying meandering ways of the interwebs, including some proddings that might seem to go overboard from time to time... or maybe even some annoying patterns that might come out (I surely get sick of myself, so I am not too surprised that others might, too).

Chartbuddy is currently under contemplation.

Would be an interesting development... and surely no straight forward thing to keep going... concededly beyond my pay grade..

Yes Richy, come on give us that back. It will be more useful than bigblocking, at least around here. In diz here parts, peeps like the discussening of the actual King Daddy that is, not dee one that could have been. Amirite?

(Back to baby talk for the sake of pluralism - so you can feel free to disagree with me.)

Hey!!!!!!!!   U fuck-i-tie-fuck... stop be steawwing dee baby talkenings.


Something is not right about how this is coming out.

[Richy_T]

Right now, it's a complicated scenario where everything is pretty uncertain. We don't know what kind of other variants of the virus will appear, we don't know what the long-term effects are post-infection but we don't know those of the vaccine either.. it's all just an uncertainty and I think the worst thing I can do right now is take rushed choices..

👍

[BobLawblaw]

why the hell would you sell now.

I have special needs 

[Richy_T]

Yes, it's supposed to do that little guy.

Whatever you say...

[Richy_T]

Although if you want a quickie number, having Infofront update the poll of this thread for such would give you a pretty quick result to see if there is division or a clear leaning in one direction or another...

First step might be just to see if there are any objections. For anyone unfamiliar, Chartbuddy would post 3D depth charts once an hour. To get an idea, you can go back about 4 years and see.

[cAPSLOCK]

A cAPSLOCK Saturday Long Post brought to you by COFFEE, "the liquid that keeps me going".

Why Layer 2 and Sidechains will do "All The Things"

According to Scott Adams our brains are "Pattern Recognition Machines".  I think he's on to something.  But like him, I also believe we are not really very good ones.  AI and the like will end up running circles around us in the end.  People get stuck in some of those patterns.  We process our world using allegories.  It's why memes work.  We have a top-40 station playing our patterns to us in our heads all day long.  The ones we have learned.  The ones that benefit us and give us mental handles to manage what we do, and how we think.  And the ones that trap us. The old patterns we all fight to overcome.  And I do not think it's obvious how deep these patterns go.  

For example... take driving.  If you are old enough to remember the days before maps on your smart phone, you remember using a paper map, or just knowing your way around town.  When I have to go to the airport there is a set path I follow.  It's worked great for all the years I have used it, and I have never missed a flight on account of being late.  It is a GREAT route!  It has worked for YEARS. Perfectly! IT IS THE ROUTE I USE. IT IS PERFECT.

Well...  Then one day I decided to let Google tell me which way to go since it can help route around traffic.  That's helpful tech right there.  And it turns out it was a slow traffic day.  Nothing to route around.  But Google suggested a route that was one of the most ass-backwards things I have ever seen.  It was taking me way further south, and then west than my more sensible PERFECT route that I have been using forever.  Why on Earth would it do this?  Why have me wind through all those intersections, and take a highway that is literally going the wrong direction for a while?  Why on Earth?

Turns out the answer is simple.  That route takes 10 minutes less time than the one I have used for so many years. For 30 years I have been adding 10 minutes to my trip to the airport without knowing it.  It has added up to hours in the car I could have otherwise spent doing something better like making another pot of coffee.

Wow!  Thanks Google.  Actually one small way you guys stuck to "Don't be evil"!  But then this deeper thought hit me like an avalanche.  Driving is one thing... I mean, who really cares if I have been going the long way.  It's no big deal.  But how many other ways do I have of processing the world that are sub-optimal?  How many "routes" does my brain take that are really not the best choice?  How many patterns have I deeply burned into my mind and muscle memory that I actually think are the best possible way to do or understand something, when in fact they are trapping me?  Limiting me?  Holding me back?  Time to put some whisky in the coffee.  Damn.

Well understanding money is a fundamental aspect of living in the world that we have all gotten really good at.  Or bad, depending how you look at it.  And understanding Bitcoin is one level more abstracted since it is mostly novel.  

We all know from trying to explain Bitcoin to a friend or relative how it's kind of hard to understand, even though it's not an overly complex concept.

We use patterns to try to figure it out.  Allegories to communicate what it is, and how it might be different than what we are used to. "It's like the 'email of money'".  "It's like PayPal, but without a trusted third party".  It is "Peer to peer electronic cash" (The book of Satoshi 1:1).  NO!  It's "digital gold!". NO!!! PEER TO PEER DIGITAL CASH!  Nuh uh!  GOLD!

We have been going back and forth for the last 7 years or so on that last one.  And it has driven the narratives to this day.  And we have pitted those two concepts against each other like roosters in a cockfight.  "Since the community has chosen the 'digital gold narrative', small transactions will be too expensive. BUT ALL HAIL NGU TECHNIOLOGY!".  Saint Saylor has sworn upon a stack of White Papers that Bitcoin cannot threaten the dollar because it is just "digital gold", not transactional.  Roger has frothed and almost popped his eyes out of his head insisting that 'Bitcoin Core' is broken and if we do not use it as cash (BCH Please!) then Africa will burn and babies will die!!!  I'm sorry if I get worked up.. I JUST REALLY CARE ABOUT THE BABIES! OR:  "The banks have infiltrated Blockstream and set us on the path to the new world order which is just the same old one in disguise."

But here's the thing... are we really taking the best route to the airport?  Or are we stuck in our same old patterns?  Are we arguing about what Bitcoin really, really fundamentally IS?  Or are we really just letting two memes fight to the death in the land of narratives designed to help us understand a NEW thing using our OLD concepts?

We can't count on layer 2 to solve the problems!  We are stealing revenue from the miners and giving it to Blockstream!  Lightning is kludgy.  We will never be able to open enough channels to make it work.  Liquid is TRUSTED!  They just use the word "federated". PayPal and Square are evil and if you let them hold your coins you will likely never see them again! If we don't scale on chain we are going against the Holy Scriptures.

This tech will never work.  Things we already know how to use are better.  It does not fit into the tried and true systems we already use.  These damn horseless carriages are going to spook all the horses on the road.  It will never work.  There are too many problems to solve.

In my lifetime I have seen many technologies emerge.  The Internet.  Pocket super computers.  Digital music.  And the old guard fought it, tried to capture it, and eventually learned to live in harmony with it in each case.  The smart ones have even started to make money again in spite of it.  One thing I have seen over and over is technology will find a way.

In the early days of the internet there were arguments about how the network should scale that will seem very familiar to us today.  The original TCP protocol contained both datagram transmission and routing, but some early tech folks, who could see a little further than their peers, began to realize it would be important to move the different parts of the protocol into separate layers for it to work well. Jon Postel, an early internet pioneer, was extremely prescient to point out:

We are screwing up in our design of Internet protocols by violating the principle of layering.

And TCP evolved into TCP/IP.  It was sort of the "Segwit" of 1973.  And now not only can we send rudimentary text messages back and forth to people around the world, but we can watch a HD video documentary about the birth of the internet using protocols LAYERED on top of that very network itself!  Nifty!  Oh and thanks, Jon.

Water finds the easiest path from the mountain to the sea, and technology finds a way to scale.  All our mental pictures we try to use to explain it all will not make one WHIT of difference to Bitcoin in the end.  Is it digital Gold?  Yes.  Peer to Peer Electronic Cash? Yes.  Expensive to transact in?  Yes.  Almost free to transact in?  Yes.  Something powerful organizations will try to control?  Yes.  Will it help the babies?  I bet so, yes.

Here is a little tool that just begins to pull the hood back on the future:  https://coinos.io

That's just another web wallet cAPS.  True.  It's also custodial!  Yuck! True.  What's so special about it?  Glad you asked!

You can send and receive Bitcoin to and from this wallet.  Nothing new there.

You can send to a bitcoin address like:

Code:

bc1q9dfmmzc9c7hz9e74fd5hdkf74gpzzd7ue7rtt3

Or you can send to a Liquid address like:

Code:

VJLDLJLuxKMM42UzRkZEYE67ygngd6nQKShuULyUa3zKy4VthbPMwsWZdvy557wRjzPKu3coZaQL8r6Z

Or you can even use a lightning invoice (or lnurl!) like:

Code:

lnurl1dp68gurn8ghj7cm0d9hx7uewd9hj7mrww4exc0m3856rqcmpxpskvvekxfnxxvnpxa3nzc3e8y6rqdpnvyur2wfhx3skzenxxdnxgctp8y6nvwp4vejnscmzx3nrsv3sx4nrwef5v33njcecul6hcr

(feel free to load those up... I promise it will go to a good cause (beer/coffee/whiskey))

And then you can send value OUT of it using any of those three systems as well.  It does not have to do any calculations... it's all just Bitcoin.  Send it 0.0013 BTC (~$75 today) and you can send that out on any of the three layers.  Base/LN/Liquid.  Does not matter... Same/same.  1BTC = 1BTC.  Only the fees and security model will change.  Coffee?  Let's use the lightning network!  Groceries?  Maybe Liquid.  Lambo?  Let's use the base chain.  Oh and while we are at it, I don't suppose we will want to buy our new Lambo with a web wallet.

But you get the point, right?

water flows downhill
we need ways to send value
tech will find a way  

It blows up all our models.  Digital gold cannot be transactional?  I beg your pardon?  People can stop saying things like:  "Since the Bitcoin community has chosen the path of Digital Gold, Bitcoin will never be able to ______" because Bitcoin is not limited by the models we use to describe it!  Bitcoin is NOT digital gold.  Or even peer to peer electronic cash (may Satoshi shine his wisdom upon us).  At least not all the time.  It can change form at the touch of a finger.  (I was going to say "click of a mouse" but even that 'idea pattern' is starting to get a little old).

Things change.  Money is changing.  And the patterns we used yesterday to understand how it works are breaking down. And new ones are emerging faster than we poor pattern recognition machines can really understand.

Honey Badger don't care.  And tech will find a way.  A better way than we had before.  Better in ways we can only begin to imagine.

CCMF!

[shahzadafzal]

I have special needs 

“Speciol” needs?

https://youtube.com/shorts/MvLKI9p7_4o

[strawbs]

Although if you want a quickie number, having Infofront update the poll of this thread for such would give you a pretty quick result to see if there is division or a clear leaning in one direction or another...

First step might be just to see if there are any objections. For anyone unfamiliar, Chartbuddy would post 3D depth charts once an hour. To get an idea, you can go back about 4 years and see.

No objections here. The nostalgia alone would be sufficient reason to bring back Chartbuddy.

[Richy_T]

No objections here. The nostalgia alone would be sufficient reason to bring back Chartbuddy.

Now would also be a good time for feature/improvement suggestions.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

I am definitely up for a ChartBuddy return.

Make it happen Richy!

[sirazimuth]

I’m not getting the vax and I don’t buy the variants story..
Too convenient of an excuse to control..

It’s all too Orwellian for me, givin all the crazy shit going on in the world from the last us election to all the latest blatant pushing of propaganda including the normalizing of incredible degeneracy and the attempts to destroy western culture/people’s..

Nope I don’t trust a damn think any sort of media or authority says or wants me to do..


All in Bitcoin HODL..
Has quite nice advantages for things such as, say, disappearing somewhere else across the globe once the west becomes completely uninhabitable for someone like me..

I don’t have much confidence in the USA anymore, in the continuance of freedom and liberty there or just about anywhere else in the west..
If things keep going like this it’s gonna be abandon ship..

Dude, you of all people should know in the land of libertarian bitcoin everything is Orwellian, everything is deep state propaganda, everything is authoritative, no freedom, no liberty yada yada yada......
My advice?...
Build your bunker, stock up on AK 47'S, M-16'S (before big brother bans the lot of them like all those other insane countries) and plenty of Top Ramon and the like, you'll be good.
Me? I'll be dead before all that Armageddon stuff happens, so I really DGAF...

Burp...oh phuck...I'm outta beers again....

[cAPSLOCK]

Although if you want a quickie number, having Infofront update the poll of this thread for such would give you a pretty quick result to see if there is division or a clear leaning in one direction or another...

First step might be just to see if there are any objections. For anyone unfamiliar, Chartbuddy would post 3D depth charts once an hour. To get an idea, you can go back about 4 years and see.

If you are talking about Chartbuddy coming back then I feel like just about no one would object.  Well before I ever posted on this particular thread I used to drop in just to see CB's latest 3D graph.

As to what has changed since then?  Man there are LOTS of new metrics...  new parts of the protocol.  I am certain there could be some "upgrades".