Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[El duderino_]

[rolling]

Exactly, the higher the taxes, the more avoidance. Also, a wealth taxes is outright confiscation and is against everything free democratic societies stand for. I don't know where you live but I'm guessing there are not a lot of rich people there.

Welcome to The Netherlands

It has it's benefits though: if your investment goes from almost nothing to a lot in a short amount of time, you barely pay any taxes on those gains.
But if it's the other way around, you still pay taxes.

The Netherlands has been f*cked over for decades, I used to live there.

The same car I bought in the UK in 2016 new for £28,000 would have cost €90,000 at the time. BPM, emission tax, whatever else nonsense they could come up with and there is the road taxation based on car weight. They literally sold 4 of those cars. No idea how that foreign brand can stay afloat doing business with its small operation in The Netherlands.

When I saw pictures of an imbecile dancing on a table because of a gain in the election whilst businesses are still forced to close DuE tO A dAnGeRoUs pAnDeMiC and the no confidence stuff of trying to get rid of Pinocchio Mark Rutte straight after an election, debating till 2am whilst there is curfew for ordinary citizens but he just stays in the end anyway I almost had to vomit.

Also the tax system is incredibly complex with its mortgage subtraction stuff.

People are insane to constantly vote for the same 50% tax supporting imbeciles.

The country and its people are lovely but I cannot afford to live there with the lifestyle and freedom of car transport (have owned 2-3 cars at various times, nicely kept - garaged and used on different days) that I can have in the UK.

Taxes are higher here yes, but in return we have a much better infrastructure than the UK, it is a good deal to me.

Energy transition is not a free lunch.

We have one of the best tapwater that also cost money which i believe is also a good deal.

There are more but my point is all those higher taxes invested results that our country is ranked high at global indexes in tems of happiness, infrastucture, healthcare, education, children, quality of life.

Moral of the story; the grass is not always greener on the other side.

The only way any of that is possible is because The Netherlands is one of the biggest tax havens in the world for mega corporations. Your country skims a little off the top of the taxes that would otherwise be due in every other country in the world. If The Netherlands had to stand on it's own with your tax policies, it would look like soviet era eastern Europe.

[El duderino_]

Enough with the dump, let's pump it again! It's Friday, pleb!  #Bitcoin

https://twitter.com/ICOffender/status/1385546233448701952?s=20

My mufasa getting used on crypto twitter lol

[Biodom]

Definitely think this (hopefully temporary) dip has highlighted the somewhat overzealous predictions of late. Some of the alt predictions that were thrown around especially were crazy. Some of those alts have literally dropped right back down to lower than they were 3 years ago.  

With regards to king Bitcoin, I can definitely see a 75K and hopefully a 100K bitcoin later this year. Maybe more.
But 288K or 500K within the year? I doubt it. The 50K and 60K markers just seemed to have been too much of a struggle to quickly get over for something like that I think.

Obviously the long term trend is going up but we are literally at mid Feb prices again and that is with 2 months of quite bullish news.

I hope we continue to follow the Stock 2 flow Plan B model but honestly I'd just be happy if we can reach the likes of 250K-500K by say 2028-2029.
I think eventually his model will fail as it seems too good to be true.

If Saylor and Musk hadn't come along that model would probably already be out of the window by now. That's not to say Bitcoin doesn't go up and the longterm isn't bullish, it's just I think there are several coincidences that sometimes make it appear why a specific model works.

I hope I'm wrong though.

for me look like very long and not so probable in a bullrun cycle. With your hypothese, it means that :



Plan C: a spring-early summer dip (not lower than 40K), slight upward starting in Aug, bull restarting in Sept, accelerating into NOv ETF approval.
Bull culmination in Dec 2021-march 2022 at $150-300K

- We are side way since end of february
- Going really down from April till july
- slow small recovery in august
- Go up again from september

So like 6 months side ways and down in a bullrun before going really up? hmm...  

The nominal high was in April, remember? Hence, you need to start counting from there.
Same is 2013-high in April ($250), local bottom in July ($65 or so). Check bitcoincharts.com
And yes, it was a small bear within a larger bull (double-hump).
Since we did not do a very high move in Jan-April, the bottom should also be milder, but still higher than Jan 1.

[Biodom]

Re taxation: we don't get any improved services upon higher taxation in US-this is just a matter of fact and possibly a difference from Canada and EU.
Houston collects enormous RE taxes and has NOTHING to show for it as far as services are concerned.
They do spend money on endlessly re-building the roads, then tearing them again and rebuilding again.
I swear-I have seen the same darned road being re-done twice within a few years (they made some kind of mistake the first time).
Ever seen the "Falling down" movie-an exact same thing.
Upon every re-build the traffic does not improve as a rule.
Plus, they are also taking several YEARS to rebuilt a HY intersection while the traffic is being congested there (on one lane).

[Richy_T]

In the case of the government, they will probably give it away.

To millionaires and billionaires, just to be clear. The poor it's claimed to be taken for usually only see a small fraction of it.

[Richy_T]

Fair enough lots of new ones on the block, that have grown big in the last year like you said. But they said great things about those other ones too 3-4 years ago. Many promises that never came to fruition.
Most of the new ones will fall on their asses I think too and will probably not be able to hold the heights they may reach this cycle over a 4 year period.

As I said to my friend, many of these new coins, even if they have good ideas behind them (which most don't) have only small teams and will struggle to grow and survive. Like in a forest where the tall trees overshadow and prevent new growth. Maybe one will eventually prevail but that's a gamble with very poor odds.

[gallianooo]

Definitely think this (hopefully temporary) dip has highlighted the somewhat overzealous predictions of late. Some of the alt predictions that were thrown around especially were crazy. Some of those alts have literally dropped right back down to lower than they were 3 years ago.  

With regards to king Bitcoin, I can definitely see a 75K and hopefully a 100K bitcoin later this year. Maybe more.
But 288K or 500K within the year? I doubt it. The 50K and 60K markers just seemed to have been too much of a struggle to quickly get over for something like that I think.

Obviously the long term trend is going up but we are literally at mid Feb prices again and that is with 2 months of quite bullish news.

I hope we continue to follow the Stock 2 flow Plan B model but honestly I'd just be happy if we can reach the likes of 250K-500K by say 2028-2029.
I think eventually his model will fail as it seems too good to be true.

If Saylor and Musk hadn't come along that model would probably already be out of the window by now. That's not to say Bitcoin doesn't go up and the longterm isn't bullish, it's just I think there are several coincidences that sometimes make it appear why a specific model works.

I hope I'm wrong though.

for me look like very long and not so probable in a bullrun cycle. With your hypothese, it means that :



Plan C: a spring-early summer dip (not lower than 40K), slight upward starting in Aug, bull restarting in Sept, accelerating into NOv ETF approval.
Bull culmination in Dec 2021-march 2022 at $150-300K

- We are side way since end of february
- Going really down from April till july
- slow small recovery in august
- Go up again from september

So like 6 months side ways and down in a bullrun before going really up? hmm...  

The nominal high was in April, remember? Hence, you need to start counting from there.
Same is 2013-high in April ($250), local bottom in July ($65 or so). Check bitcoincharts.com
And yes, it was a small bear within a larger bull (double-hump).
Since we did not do a very high move in Jan-April, the bottom should also be milder, but still higher than Jan 1.

Still not really agree.

1/ yes the top was in april. But for me it is still a kind of side ways / range (as it is even less of 15% increasing between the top of february and the current ATH of april). So we can reasonably consider from february not april.

2/ How you can compare with 2013 price range ? We were at 13$ beginning of 2013 with a local top of 250$ so x20.  We were almost at 30K$ beginning of january 2021... so only bit more than x2 since... for our current ATH.

[Biodom]

Definitely think this (hopefully temporary) dip has highlighted the somewhat overzealous predictions of late. Some of the alt predictions that were thrown around especially were crazy. Some of those alts have literally dropped right back down to lower than they were 3 years ago.  

With regards to king Bitcoin, I can definitely see a 75K and hopefully a 100K bitcoin later this year. Maybe more.
But 288K or 500K within the year? I doubt it. The 50K and 60K markers just seemed to have been too much of a struggle to quickly get over for something like that I think.

Obviously the long term trend is going up but we are literally at mid Feb prices again and that is with 2 months of quite bullish news.

I hope we continue to follow the Stock 2 flow Plan B model but honestly I'd just be happy if we can reach the likes of 250K-500K by say 2028-2029.
I think eventually his model will fail as it seems too good to be true.

If Saylor and Musk hadn't come along that model would probably already be out of the window by now. That's not to say Bitcoin doesn't go up and the longterm isn't bullish, it's just I think there are several coincidences that sometimes make it appear why a specific model works.

I hope I'm wrong though.

for me look like very long and not so probable in a bullrun cycle. With your hypothese, it means that :



Plan C: a spring-early summer dip (not lower than 40K), slight upward starting in Aug, bull restarting in Sept, accelerating into NOv ETF approval.
Bull culmination in Dec 2021-march 2022 at $150-300K

- We are side way since end of february
- Going really down from April till july
- slow small recovery in august
- Go up again from september

So like 6 months side ways and down in a bullrun before going really up? hmm...  

The nominal high was in April, remember? Hence, you need to start counting from there.
Same is 2013-high in April ($250), local bottom in July ($65 or so). Check bitcoincharts.com
And yes, it was a small bear within a larger bull (double-hump).
Since we did not do a very high move in Jan-April, the bottom should also be milder, but still higher than Jan 1.

Still not really agree.

1/ yes the top was in april. But for me it is still a kind of side ways / range (as it is even less of 15% increasing between the top of february and the current ATH of april). So we can reasonably consider from february not april.

2/ How you can compare with 2013 price range ? We were at 13$ beginning of 2013 with a local top of 250$ so x20.  We were almost at 30K$ beginning of january 2021... so only bit more than x2 since... for our current ATH.

Well, the scenario would either happen or not happen.
So far, almost every time I uttered something in 2021-it more or less happened (not to toot my own horn-it was just a random accident): the correction timings, the proverbial flat/stall, etc.
Albeit, I could be wrong and we take off from here.
If so, I would be among the happiest as I don't time the market and I don't sell bitcoin, apart from when I need to pay for something, but in this case, I immediately replace.

[gallianooo]

Definitely think this (hopefully temporary) dip has highlighted the somewhat overzealous predictions of late. Some of the alt predictions that were thrown around especially were crazy. Some of those alts have literally dropped right back down to lower than they were 3 years ago.  

With regards to king Bitcoin, I can definitely see a 75K and hopefully a 100K bitcoin later this year. Maybe more.
But 288K or 500K within the year? I doubt it. The 50K and 60K markers just seemed to have been too much of a struggle to quickly get over for something like that I think.

Obviously the long term trend is going up but we are literally at mid Feb prices again and that is with 2 months of quite bullish news.

I hope we continue to follow the Stock 2 flow Plan B model but honestly I'd just be happy if we can reach the likes of 250K-500K by say 2028-2029.
I think eventually his model will fail as it seems too good to be true.

If Saylor and Musk hadn't come along that model would probably already be out of the window by now. That's not to say Bitcoin doesn't go up and the longterm isn't bullish, it's just I think there are several coincidences that sometimes make it appear why a specific model works.

I hope I'm wrong though.

for me look like very long and not so probable in a bullrun cycle. With your hypothese, it means that :



Plan C: a spring-early summer dip (not lower than 40K), slight upward starting in Aug, bull restarting in Sept, accelerating into NOv ETF approval.
Bull culmination in Dec 2021-march 2022 at $150-300K

- We are side way since end of february
- Going really down from April till july
- slow small recovery in august
- Go up again from september

So like 6 months side ways and down in a bullrun before going really up? hmm...  

The nominal high was in April, remember? Hence, you need to start counting from there.
Same is 2013-high in April ($250), local bottom in July ($65 or so). Check bitcoincharts.com
And yes, it was a small bear within a larger bull (double-hump).
Since we did not do a very high move in Jan-April, the bottom should also be milder, but still higher than Jan 1.

Still not really agree.

1/ yes the top was in april. But for me it is still a kind of side ways / range (as it is even less of 15% increasing between the top of february and the current ATH of april). So we can reasonably consider from february not april.

2/ How you can compare with 2013 price range ? We were at 13$ beginning of 2013 with a local top of 250$ so x20.  We were almost at 30K$ beginning of january 2021... so only bit more than x2 since... for our current ATH.

Well, the scenario would either happen or not happen.
So far, almost every time I uttered something in 2021-it more or less happened (not to toot my own horn-it was just a random accident): the correction timings, the proverbial flat/stall, etc.
Albeit, I could be wrong and we take off from here.
If so, I would be among the happiest as I don't time the market and I don't sell bitcoin, apart from when I need to pay for something, but in this case, I immediately replace.

I didn't say that we cannot go lower before going again up. The range 40-43K is probably on the table now.. Even if we can recover from our current level.

I just said it's look very bearish and probably to long in a bull market cycle to sideway + down for 6 months..

Then we will see, just my opinion 

[Sayeds56]

Fair enough lots of new ones on the block, that have grown big in the last year like you said. But they said great things about those other ones too 3-4 years ago. Many promises that never came to fruition.
Most of the new ones will fall on their asses I think too and will probably not be able to hold the heights they may reach this cycle over a 4 year period.

As I said to my friend, many of these new coins, even if they have good ideas behind them (which most don't) have only small teams and will struggle to grow and survive. Like in a forest where the tall trees overshadow and prevent new growth. Maybe one will eventually prevail but that's a gamble with very poor odds.

In deed, Bitcoin is the Mega Tree of crypto Forest overshadowing all small trees but I found this DEFI   https://v1.btcst.finance/#/  very interesting and invested in it because it pays Rewards in BTC satoshis.  Please advise your expert comments. Thanks

[Dabs]

In deed, Bitcoin is the Mega Tree of crypto Forest overshadowing all small trees but I found this DEFI   https://v1.btcst.finance/#/  very interesting and invested in it because it pays Rewards in BTC satoshis.  Please advise your expert comments. Thanks

What's that do? I tried going to website, but it doesn't do anything.

[Sayeds56]

In deed, Bitcoin is the Mega Tree of crypto Forest overshadowing all small trees but I found this DEFI   https://v1.btcst.finance/#/  very interesting and invested in it because it pays Rewards in BTC satoshis.  Please advise your expert comments. Thanks

What's that do? I tried going to website, but it doesn't do anything.

https://www.1-b.tc/static/BTCST_Whitepaper.pdf

[BobLawblaw]

To those who thinks that $1mil is a lot: it sounds like  lot, but...

This is the crux of my issue. As someone sitting on a pile of coin, and retired, why the fuck would I have any incentive to sell corn under those absolutely retarded proposed tax rates?

TBH, and I don't want to sound like a total dick-bag or anything, but every time I sell, $1M is the bare minimum I dump at any time, and cruise on it until I need more. I'm fucking stupid that way. Sue me.

I hope you can appreciate why this proposed increase twists my panties up a little bit. I mean, if this means I just need to sell <$1M USD per year, then so be it, but it's just ridiculous, in that it promotes hodling by us hardcore folk.

Having said that, I'm sure the time will come in the next 5 years, where I decide to buy up the parcel of 100 acres next to us, and erect a proper Citadel, complete with a goddamn lava-filled moat, fed via drilling into the recesses of our mantle, in a rather impressive engineering feat for Bumfuck, TX.

Hopefully Biden is out of office by then, and whatever retarded tax "reforms" he may ram-jam through get repealed.

[shahzadafzal]

Just hold it is the new just do it!

[OutOfMemory]

To those who thinks that $1mil is a lot: it sounds like  lot, but...

This is the crux of my issue. As someone sitting on a pile of coin, and retired, why the fuck would I have any incentive to sell corn under those absolutely retarded proposed tax rates?

TBH, and I don't want to sound like a total dick-bag or anything, but every time I sell, $1M is the bare minimum I dump at any time, and cruise on it until I need more. I'm fucking stupid that way. Sue me.

I hope you can appreciate why this proposed increase twists my panties up a little bit. I mean, if this means I just need to sell <$1M USD per year, then so be it, but it's just ridiculous, in that it promotes hodling by us hardcore folk.

Having said that, I'm sure the time will come in the next 5 years, where I decide to buy up the parcel of 100 acres next to us, and erect a proper Citadel, complete with a goddamn lava-filled moat, fed via drilling into the recesses of our mantle, in a rather impressive engineering feat for Bumfuck, TX.

Hopefully Biden is out of office by then, and whatever retarded tax "reforms" he may ram-jam through get repealed.

This tax maneuver is going to be discussed. Unfortunately, left wing politics are really after richie rich's gains, while the generated taxes are just a tip of the tip of an iceberg of "projected justice". It's populism, they kinda try to signal "hey poor people, hey middle class, hey workers! we gonna give them richies what they deserve, so it makes you feel you're kinda important to us.", or if you put it that way:

Your enemy is our enemy.

This is just cheap, and also distracting from the real problems of economy that constantly makes the poor get even more poor.
Populism at it's best. This time it's not the Trump way, but the other way round  
Same old shit.

[lightfoot]

Keep it in perspective.....

[JimboToronto]

In the case of the government, they will probably give it away.

To millionaires and billionaires, just to be clear. The poor it's claimed to be taken for usually only see a small fraction of it.

Rob from the rich and give to the bureaucrats.

Oh wait. We're the rich.  

Fuck the bureaucrats (and the Bureaupublicans).  

[xhomerx10]

Keep it in perspective.....

 Oh yeah!  Keepin' it real.

[machasm]

I did something my self recently where I sold a portion of BTC into an unnamed alt. Took advantage of my CGT allowance, held the shitcoin for 30 days then bought my original BTC back (actually made a little more due to said shitcoin going up more than BTC)
This then resets the CGT counter back to zero so I will only have to pay CGT at current rate on the BTC I bought back at the price I bought it at AFTER the 30 days.

Ok, but question: Does this do anything for you tax-wise? For example if you bought at 60 and sold at 60k then you owe 20% CGT on 59,940. You pay that when you shift into the altcoin. If you buy BTC back at 60k 30 days later then you still have to pay CGT again if you sell it in the future, but at (future price-60,000) which means the tax hit is the same.

Only reason might be because CGT is taxed at your current rate up to 20%, so if your sale+what you make as a wage slave is under 200k or so you pay less taxes as you're in a lower tax bracket than 20%.

Well in the UK if your income is less than £50K then you pay CGT at 10%. If your income is above £50K you pay 20% CGT.
You also have a CGT allowance of £12,500 tax free
SO it makes sense to do this juggling if you stay within these boundaries.
If you are married you may gift your spouse as much as you like (tax free) and he/she can take advantage of the same allowances.
If you are looking at cashing more than this then it becomes a moot point due to the reasons you have specified although you could still take advantage of the annual tax free allowance.